Writing the Gods and Elder Dragons

This is something that has been kind of bothering me for years since GW2 released.It first bothered me that the Gods - especially Kormir - would completely abandon Tyria. Not just from a lore perspective but even personally, as a player who invested themselves in GW1's lore and killed Abaddon alongside them. While Kormir was human she made sacrifices and pushed on until she had done all she could possibly do. It doesn't make any sense that 6 of the most powerful things in the universe cannot come up with a plan to at the very least, protect Tyria from the dragons, not necessarily kill them, which would cause cataclysmic destruction to Tyria...

Except you and your raid party are just killing dragons left and right anyway, and the asura can just come up with machines that "manipulate dragon energy". If the mortals can do this then what excuse is there that the gods can't at least help them? I understand ANet retconned Balthazar into a power-hungry maniac, but the gods returning to Tyria to help at least the humans would not necessarily mean world-shattering battles taking place. At the very least Kormir could come.

Speaking of Balthazar, wow, RIP.

@"coffeemancer.2450" said:Except you and your raid party are just killing dragons left and right anyway, and the asura can just come up with machines that "manipulate dragon energy". If the mortals can do this then what excuse is there that the gods can't at least help them?The rest I agree with you on, but this part does make sense to me. These have all been examples of us making matters worse- instead of looking at extinction in a few hundred years, like we were at the start of the game, by the start of PoF we'd moved things up to complete global annihilation within a month. It stands to reason that if the gods knew that those efforts could only amount to digging our own grave, they wouldn't do anything to encourage us... although it would've been really nice if they'd given us a warning or two somewhere.I understand ANet retconned Balthazar into a power-hungry maniac, but the gods returning to Tyria to help at least the humans would not necessarily mean world-shattering battles taking place. At the very least Kormir could come.I think what they were going for here is that if the gods were present in Tyria, the dragons would seek them out and force that battle, although I admit that it's very unclear. There's fairly good reason to believe that the gods are exempt from being corrupted, but even then, if just one dragon killed one god and consumed their energy- or, worse, learned too late that it couldn't consume god energy- then from what the end of Nightfall told us, that's game over for Tyria. Even if countermeasures could be taken to hide the gods or have them keep their distance, that's still a massive risk if anything goes wrong, and for what? If defeating the dragons isn't an option, what could the gods offer as a physical presence that they couldn't more safely accomplish through intermediaries?

Which, of course, is where the whole thing falls apart. The absence of the gods makes an acceptable amount of sense, and jibes well with what we know about them- it was the status quo in GW1, after all. The silence of the gods does not- we have an entire game of them using intermediaries to interact with the world and provide support without imperiling their followers, and nothing we know about the Elder Dragons suggests there's a reason that system can't work now. Even something as simple as sending an avatar to say 'hey, we see your Pact's having a lot more success than anyone could've guessed, so it's a good time for you to know that the world needs at least four to hold together, but you can get some wiggle-room there if you help this grim fella named Vlast replace one of them,' could've changed our course for the better in a massive way. And if they'd tossed on 'by the way, here's the Forgotten's homework on dragon weaknesses, in case you need to cheat off it'?

And then abandoning their realms, and the souls of their faithful... the only explanation that seems to hold together for me is that humanity has just never been a priority for the gods the way they've thought they've been, which is something both Balthazar and Kormir have hinted at. That's not going to be a satisfying answer, though, at least not until we have at least a vague sense of what those priorities actually are and why they rule out even low-effort methods of being helpful right now.

@"coffeemancer.2450" said:This is something that has been kind of bothering me for years since GW2 released.It first bothered me that the Gods - especially Kormir - would completely abandon Tyria. Not just from a lore perspective but even personally, as a player who invested themselves in GW1's lore and killed Abaddon alongside them. While Kormir was human she made sacrifices and pushed on until she had done all she could possibly do. It doesn't make any sense that 6 of the most powerful things in the universe cannot come up with a plan to at the very least, protect Tyria from the dragons, not necessarily kill them, which would cause cataclysmic destruction to Tyria...

Except you and your raid party are just killing dragons left and right anyway, and the asura can just come up with machines that "manipulate dragon energy". If the mortals can do this then what excuse is there that the gods can't at least help them? I understand ANet retconned Balthazar into a power-hungry maniac, but the gods returning to Tyria to help at least the humans would not necessarily mean world-shattering battles taking place. At the very least Kormir could come.

Speaking of Balthazar, wow, RIP.

I think you highlighted exactly the weak points in the "gods" story: They stated they cannot defeat (are no match for) the dragons. And still we (the mortals) killed two. That means one of the following two:

• if TRUE, they are weaker than the mortals (2 mortals are now gods by defeating one of the older gods: Grenth and Kormir). Another one is dead by the hands of Commander.
• If FALSE, that means they want to hide us something. The statement is from Kormir. If she wants to lie us, then what is with the "Goddess of True" thing?

@"Aaron Ansari.1604" said:

And then abandoning their realms, and the souls of their faithful... the only explanation that seems to hold together for me is that humanity has just never been a priority for the gods the way they've thought they've been, which is something both Balthazar and Kormir have hinted at. That's not going to be a satisfying answer, though, at least not until we have at least a vague sense of what those priorities actually are and why they rule out even low-effort methods of being helpful right now.

I completely agree with this. We can extend this to: humanity Tyria (or the mortals) has just never been a priority for the gods. Look what happened before. The Dragons destroyed the 5 ancient races. The "gods" acted as now: watching how the Dragons destroyed everything.

I keep my opinion: The "gods" are only named gods by the humans. They have nothing "goddish" (except that "divinity - a very unclear thing, the newest explanation for what makes the gods to be gods. This remembers me of the "divine organ" from Star Trek making a common alien civilization to be real Gods - the Greek Gods).

So, the gods are useless. We should hunt them to grab that "divinity" - maybe us the mortals can use it in a better way.

@"Cristalyan.5728" said:

So, the gods are useless. We should hunt them to grab that "divinity" - maybe us the mortals can use it in a better way.

Kormir is right there with em and doing the same stuff the others do.

@"Cristalyan.5728" said:I think you highlighted exactly the weak points in the "gods" story: They stated they cannot defeat (are no match for) the dragons.That's not what Kormir said. She said that there is no victory in a battle with the Elder Dragons. And this is because if they kill the Elder Dragons, as we've found out in Season 3 just before talking to Kormir, killing the Elder Dragons to save the world, ends the world anyways.Kormir: We, the gods, saw there could be no victory in our inevitable conflict with the Elder Dragons.Kormir: Waging war with them could only lead to the destruction of Tyria—and we, the Six, would be the match that would start the blaze.It is a VERY big difference.

I keep my opinion: The "gods" are only named gods by the humans.

And the Dwarves, and the Forgotten, and the Charr, and the Norn, and the Asura...

So, the gods are useless. We should hunt them to grab that "divinity" - maybe us the mortals can use it in a better way.

What nonsense.

The story is a rather weak part of the game to me. I mean, there's still a lot of good lore, but the main story is just weird, messy and distasteful to me.I mean, the devs can come up with whatever they want, it's fiction. However this is where good and bad story writing comes into place.

-Uff, dragons woke up and reshaped the whole world with a gigantic tidal wave!-Uff, lets kill them!-Yeah - oh, actually, killing them is bad for us.-We should ask the gods!-The gods have abandoned our world!-Well, let's go anyway.-Oh, look, its Kormir.-Now she's gone too.-Guess we go back to kill Balthi?-Sure, he turned bad.-Good, now let's see, .. oh yeh, the dragon's are still here.-Hm, I don't know what to do.-Me neither.-What about Joko?-Oh yes! We could get rid of him too.-How? He's immortal.-Meh, somehow we will do it.-Aurene! You killed Joko!-How did she...?-Who cares?-Lol we just kill everything.

I would have liked to see the Elder Dragons be the actual cyclic forces of nature they were sold to be a long time ago, not just the big problem that leads to a bigger problem. It is really strange to see their brains getting popped by mesmers or being shot down by an airship. Like really you purify a well and now Zhaitan is too weak to resist canon fire?

Also: Balthazar a raid boss, AND he dies, before we even get to see what Menzies looks like?

@"ThatOddOne.4387" said:

I keep my opinion: The "gods" are only named gods by the humans.

And the centaurs.

@coffeemancer.2450 said:I would have liked to see the Elder Dragons be the actual cyclic forces of nature they were sold to be a long time ago, not just the big problem that leads to a bigger problem. It is really strange to see their brains getting popped by mesmers or being shot down by an airship. Like really you purify a well and now Zhaitan is too weak to resist canon fire?

Well, I mean, we also purified the five temples that held massive amounts of magic from the gods, as well as killed specialized minions (Eyes and Mouths) that it depended on, and we were told afterwards that the gods had drained Zhaitan of magic while it slept so it was left weak from the get go.

But yeah, I really wish they waited for at least the second plot to kill an Elder Dragon. The initial game should have left the Elder Dragons as a distant force that's a threat only some recognize. Zhaitan shouldn't have been at Orr, but as close to Tyrians as Jormag and Kralkatorrik.

Thanks everyone for the discussion, sometimes I feel like an old ghost wandering a world that left me behind, or I left it behind.Tyria is more than 10 years old now and will always have a special place in my heart even if I'm not there anymore.Konig I remember reading your posts on the original forums, good memories, keep up the good work.

@"Cristalyan.5728" said:

I completely agree with this. We can extend this to: humanity Tyria (or the mortals) has just never been a priority for the gods. Look what happened before. The Dragons destroyed the 5 ancient races. The "gods" acted as now: watching how the Dragons destroyed everything.

Isn't it that Human gods weren't in Tyria yet when Dragons destroyed ancient races? They came with Humans as a leaders, helped in wars against other races, then went to their dimensions to help Humans with their powers, not presence. With gods help humans conquered Kryta from Centaurs and Ascalon from Charrs, and when gods got bored with helping with their full potential, and becouse human nations started to fight against each another, and gods didn't wanted to prioritize any nation... We all know how it ended.

@"ThatOddOne.4387" said:

I keep my opinion: The "gods" are only named gods by the humans.

They are gods only for Humans. In Legions, charr can be even punished for using term of "god". They can call them "Human gods", but not overall gods. For other races, they are just powerfull beings. Flame legion had their own gods - Titans. Norns have Spirits of the Nature, Dwarves believed in Great Dwarf, Asuras have their "Ethernal Alhemy" (kind of Confucianism, rather philosophy than religion, but it's replace religion in some way).And we have to understand that when most of the races use term "god", they mean "really powerful beings", not gods in religious aspects. Humans are the only race worshiping the Six, because the Six wanted to be religious gods only for Humans. We can't tell why. It's unclear if Humans gods are creators of Humans, or they just "adopted" them and then just brought Humans to Tyria. Only thing what we know is that Humans and the Six are from other dimension in The Mists and they came together around 786 BE (Before Exodus - moment, when The Six left tyria). Now, in Lore, we have 1131 AE (After Exodus). Elder Dragons were the last time awake in... 10,000 BE. So, there is no chance for human gods to watch other races fall ^^

Sources:

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Timelinehttps://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Religion

@"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

But yeah, I really wish they waited for at least the second plot to kill an Elder Dragon. The initial game should have left the Elder Dragons as a distant force that's a threat only some recognize. Zhaitan shouldn't have been at Orr, but as close to Tyrians as Jormag and Kralkatorrik.

thats a big Thing here.. a lot of People had a really hard time digesting the end of zhaitan. the Dragons were discribed as unrivaled enemys who cause catatstrophys by Default and.... well that firework cannons sure werent satisying. but neither was the damage the Dragon dealt to the world.

ofcourse that changes a bit if u read the books cuz specially see of sorrows gives some insight into that but ingame ist "only" the typical undead swarming the shores wich isnt that terrifying for rpg Player cuz thats "just how it usually is"

thats why at least for me i REALLY liked how HoT started. the allmighty pact shredded apart. the fleet wich were THE top of the top masterpiece of intercultural Technologies destroyed in a single attack the dschungle swarming with really hard enemys. the fight against mordremoth himself.. was better than vs zhaitan at least in Dragons stand. the mind Version.. well mordremoth was just a green moving woodpile. the fight had some nice elements so im still in the -arenanet did improve a lot on that one- faction while it still could be better.

but lets be honest it is really HARD to make those masterpiece epic fights even Possible in a game that we got in our mind when we heard/ read the first discription of an elder Dragon.

so as Long as the Story beforehand is giving good vibes and the endboss battle is better than sitting down in a static Canon and launching fireworks, im satisfied :)

@"Aracz.4702" said:

They are gods only for Humans... because the Six wanted to be religious gods only for Humans.

Not entirely. The Forgotten, as a race, were even more fervent followers of the Six than the humans. In other places, while we don't know how widespread their worship was in their respective cultures, we do find a fair number of dwarves, a centaur, a naga, a djinn, and arguably a tribe of grawl worshiping either Dwayna or Balthazar. According to one source, there was also a number of races that worshiped Abaddon exclusively before the other gods struck him from history, and there's also the possibility of harpies once serving Dwayna. There's also a... much less reliable source claiming the jotun were once favored by the gods. The humans are just the ones who owe their existence in this particular world to the Six, and who've held on to that worship for the longest (barring any possible enclaves of Forgotten still in the Mists).

@Aaron Ansari.1604Good point, and thanks for sources. It's quite interesting. But in most cases, it seems as personal choice to worship those gods, still, it's nice to know that The Six isn't against worshippers from other races.The most interesting part is about Forgottens and Harpies, I knew about Forgottens, but not about that they are really closly connected with The Six.And about the Jotun, Thrulnn tells about "since before the gods put limits on magic". The limit of magic is remind of creating the Bloodstone, which was done by Seers. Maybe he remind moment, when gods have taken Bloodstone to Arah?But the most weird part is: "In the beginning, humans lived like grawl. The gods had not yet noticed them. Their magic was primitive: fire, earth, air and water. My jotun ancestors helped them survive."I wonder if Thrulnn use term of "God" for wider group of beings, or if those humans arrived from Cantha without The Six knowledge.

The trick to remember with the jotun is that they don't have access to their own history anymore. They can't even read their own language. All they have is a nearly extinct oral tradition, and "(t)heir lore is scattered, and much of it lost; any religion, higher learning, or secrets of invention that they once mastered have been eradicated, and only the remnants of their once-great society remain."

It might be that things went down the way Thruln says, and it's somehow everyone else who has it wrong. Or it might be that's it's a warped remembering of the Bloodstone incident, as you suggest. Or it might be that the gods never gave the jotun a second thought, but somewhere along the line a jotun chieftain decided he liked the idea of being their favorites and forced his storyteller to add that 'fact' to the tales. Or it may be that Thruln heard a human talking about the gods once, and decided to work that into his presentation in Hoelbrak to encourage the norn to listen to the parts he truly wanted remembered. Without corroborating information, it's impossible to tell for sure what the truth is.

Here's some more questions I found:

1) Could there be other gods out there in the mist that didn't care about the sunwell on Tyria or didn't notice it like our gods did?2) Did Balthazar kill his own father?3) Who's grenth's father?

@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

Well, I mean, we also purified the five temples that held massive amounts of magic from the gods, as well as killed specialized minions (Eyes and Mouths) that it depended on, and we were told afterwards that the gods had drained Zhaitan of magic while it slept so it was left weak from the get go.

But yeah, I really wish they waited for at least the second plot to kill an Elder Dragon. The initial game should have left the Elder Dragons as a distant force that's a threat only some recognize. Zhaitan shouldn't have been at Orr, but as close to Tyrians as Jormag and Kralkatorrik.

This ^^^^ ..Though at times I do wonder if the Zhaitan we killed was really him or just a shell he used as a storage battery. After all we do learn that he used Minions to see and eat with, So why couldn't he of had a extra corpse shell for last line of defense ? Since he was said to of been weakened by the gods.

@starhunter.6015 said:

@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

Well, I mean, we also purified the five temples that held massive amounts of magic from the gods, as well as killed specialized minions (Eyes and Mouths) that it depended on, and we were told afterwards that the gods had drained Zhaitan of magic while it slept so it was left weak from the get go.

But yeah, I really wish they waited for at least the second plot to kill an Elder Dragon. The initial game should have left the Elder Dragons as a distant force that's a threat only some recognize. Zhaitan shouldn't have been at Orr, but as close to Tyrians as Jormag and Kralkatorrik.

Given that his magic has been distributed to the other EDs we know hes dead, on top of that Tequatl in lore was absorbing his now free magic and until we killed that Tequatl she was slowly changing into the next Zhaitan(if i remember that portion of Tequatl correctly).

@coffeemancer.2450 said:Here's some more questions I found:

1) Could there be other gods out there in the mist that didn't care about the sunwell on Tyria or didn't notice it like our gods did?We haven't seen any solid evidence, but it can't be ruled out. We just don't know enough about the Six to say whether they're alone.2) Did Balthazar kill his own father?Extremely unclear. All we know is that the Orrian records say that Balthazar came to Tyria carrying his father's head. You don't usually carry around the head of someone you were fond of, but there are exceptions, so...3) Who's grenth's father?All evidence points to Malchor, to the point that the devs even changed the one bit of counter-evidence that'd made it into the game. Originally, the Statue of Grenth in DR had a quote by Malchor, the same as the other Five, which wouldn't have worked with the timeline if he'd been Grenth's father; the devs swapped it out for a quote from Desmina, instead. It's hard to think of any other reason why they would've gone to the trouble.

@"Aracz.4702" said:They are gods only for Humans. In Legions, charr can be even punished for using term of "god". They can call them "Human gods", but not overall gods. For other races, they are just powerfull beings. Flame legion had their own gods - Titans. Norns have Spirits of the Nature, Dwarves believed in Great Dwarf, Asuras have their "Ethernal Alhemy" (kind of Confucianism, rather philosophy than religion, but it's replace religion in some way).

Hmmm, not really.

Firstly, there were dwarves who worshiped Dwayna and Grenth specifically. To name the obvious cases:

• https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Acolyte_Rockhammer
• https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Abbot_Silverbeard
• https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Caroler_of_Dwayna
• https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Caroler_of_GrenthThe dwarves were a sizable chunk of the Churches of Grenth and Dwayna. King Jalis even uses Grenth in an exclamation, rather than the Great Dwarf as would be expected and typical of one who solely revered the Great Dwarf, in the Thunderhead Keep mission, suggesting that even the king of dwarves revered Grenth to some extent. Curiously, it's only Grenth and Dwayna the dwarves have shown reverence for of the Six Gods.

Secondly, charr do believe the Six are gods. They even have a myth that Melandru creating Tyria. It's just that they view gods as not beings to worship but beings to fight - though this isn't universal, even outside of the Flame Legion, though the top brass doesn't trust religious charr and treats them all as Flame Legion anyways.

Norn may have the Spirits of the Wild, but they acknowledge the existence and power of the Six Gods. So do the asura, who think that the Six are just large parts of the Eternal Alchemy, not non-existent or excluded from.

And it should be obvious about the Forgotten, given Nightfall.

Harpies are claimed to be former servants of Dwayna, and there's some centaurs who revere/worship Balthazar. There is even a naga named for Dwayna.

@"Aracz.4702" said:And we have to understand that when most of the races use term "god", they mean "really powerful beings", not gods in religious aspects. Humans are the only race worshiping the Six, because the Six wanted to be religious gods only for Humans. We can't tell why. It's unclear if Humans gods are creators of Humans, or they just "adopted" them and then just brought Humans to Tyria. Only thing what we know is that Humans and the Six are from other dimension in The Mists and they came together around 786 BE (Before Exodus - moment, when The Six left tyria). Now, in Lore, we have 1131 AE (After Exodus). Elder Dragons were the last time awake in... 10,000 BE. So, there is no chance for human gods to watch other races fall ^^

Sources:

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Timelinehttps://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Religion

Again, wrong. The Gods are more than "really powerful beings"; though some "really powerful beings" have masqueraded as gods or treated as idols by some, the Six Gods, Koda, Zintl, Ameyalli, even Spirits of the Wild are all on another level of being. And even then, human tales proclaim the Six Gods are each "all powerful beings who are more powerful than the other all powerful beings in a particular facet" - of course, we know this to be a false definition, but that's how humans viewed the gods before Nightfall.

And nothing really defines why the humans ever began worshiping the Six, since we don't know of their connection in the previous world before entering Tyria.

That said, it's 1331 AE now (soon 1332 AE once 2019 hits), and while we have lore telling us 10,000 BE for the Elder Dragons' last line, we also have various lore telling us 3,000 years ago (circa 2,000-17,000 BE), and that latter one matches the time given to Forgotten arriving from the Mists, and they were sent by / came with the gods.

@"coffeemancer.2450" said:This is something that has been kind of bothering me for years since GW2 released.It first bothered me that the Gods - especially Kormir - would completely abandon Tyria. Not just from a lore perspective but even personally, as a player who invested themselves in GW1's lore and killed Abaddon alongside them. While Kormir was human she made sacrifices and pushed on until she had done all she could possibly do. It doesn't make any sense that 6 of the most powerful things in the universe cannot come up with a plan to at the very least, protect Tyria from the dragons, not necessarily kill them, which would cause cataclysmic destruction to Tyria...

Except you and your raid party are just killing dragons left and right anyway, and the asura can just come up with machines that "manipulate dragon energy". If the mortals can do this then what excuse is there that the gods can't at least help them? I understand ANet retconned Balthazar into a power-hungry maniac, but the gods returning to Tyria to help at least the humans would not necessarily mean world-shattering battles taking place. At the very least Kormir could come.

Speaking of Balthazar, wow, RIP.

You completely missed the rational reasons WHY the gods would leave...

! Kormir: We, the gods, saw there could be no victory in our inevitable conflict with the Elder Dragons.! Kormir: Waging war with them could only lead to the destruction of Tyria—and we, the Six, would be the match that would start the blaze.! Kormir: And so, we chose to withdraw from Tyria altogether, and spare this world further calamity... Or rather, most of us chose to.

@Aracz.4702 said:@Aaron Ansari.1604And about the Jotun, Thrulnn tells about "since before the gods put limits on magic". The limit of magic is remind of creating the Bloodstone, which was done by Seers. Maybe he remind moment, when gods have taken Bloodstone to Arah?But the most weird part is: "In the beginning, humans lived like grawl. The gods had not yet noticed them. Their magic was primitive: fire, earth, air and water. My jotun ancestors helped them survive."I wonder if Thrulnn use term of "God" for wider group of beings, or if those humans arrived from Cantha without The Six knowledge.

Thrulnn's account is full of unreliable narrator, as his claim for why the jotun fell is directly countered by his ancestor in the norn personal story.

@"coffeemancer.2450" said:Here's some more questions I found:

1) Could there be other gods out there in the mist that didn't care about the sunwell on Tyria or didn't notice it like our gods did?2) Did Balthazar kill his own father?3) Who's grenth's father?

1) Yes. In Tyria itself, we have five supposed gods: Koda, Zintl, Ameyalli, Mellaggan, and the Great Dwarf. There's various levels of questioning those gods' existence, mind you, but there's also no real evidence of their existence lacking. Even with the Great Dwarf, Anet devs have said along the lines that the "modern Great Dwarf" (e.g., its usage in EotN) about the collective mind of stone dwarves may-or-may-not be the same as the original understanding of the title/god.

On top of that, there's theories that the Six Gods are, effectively, another world's equivalent of the Elder Dragons - hence why there's six and six, but no true overlapping - that the other world's "six domains of powers" functioned slightly differently. In this theory, then in theory, every world has their own "Six Gods / Elder Dragons" group.

2) Unknown. Balthazar came to Tyria carrying his father's head, but that's all we know. It's not even clear why he was carrying the head. Ancient tradition? Battle just won and celebrating crude victory? Battle just lost and mourning? Personal and grim reminder of an old event? Was the head even with flesh or was it just a skull (thus making the scene a little less grim)? No context is given, so we cannot know.

3) Unconfirmed but heavy implyance that it was Malchor. In the PS, it's stated that Grenth's father was a "mortal sculptor", and the Orrian History Scrolls can read that Dwayna had some feelings for Malchor too (or that's how some folks interpret the lines "When it was done, he asked Dwayna if she favored the image, and weeping, Dwayna allowed him to touch her face, that he might know the precision with which—even blind—he had carved her image. But then, as she knew she must, the goddess Dwayna left and returned to Arah, leaving the sculptor alone.").

@"coffeemancer.2450" said:This is something that has been kind of bothering me for years since GW2 released.It first bothered me that the Gods - especially Kormir - would completely abandon Tyria. Not just from a lore perspective but even personally, as a player who invested themselves in GW1's lore and killed Abaddon alongside them. While Kormir was human she made sacrifices and pushed on until she had done all she could possibly do. It doesn't make any sense that 6 of the most powerful things in the universe cannot come up with a plan to at the very least, protect Tyria from the dragons, not necessarily kill them, which would cause cataclysmic destruction to Tyria...

Except you and your raid party are just killing dragons left and right anyway, and the asura can just come up with machines that "manipulate dragon energy". If the mortals can do this then what excuse is there that the gods can't at least help them? I understand ANet retconned Balthazar into a power-hungry maniac, but the gods returning to Tyria to help at least the humans would not necessarily mean world-shattering battles taking place. At the very least Kormir could come.

Speaking of Balthazar, wow, RIP.

If you look at the Daybreak Trailer, we have a slightly different speech from Kormir, which discuss what the gods thought the outcomes were.

Kormir: We, the gods, saw there could be no victory in our inevitable conflict with the Elder Dragons.

That conflict can only end in two ways; the ruin of the Six or the utter destruction of Tyria’s magical balance.

If we look back at Season 2 in the Drummond Priory, Ogden said this:

Ogden Stonehealer: The gods expound on how Tyria's health is tied directly to them. This portion is somewhat abstract, however.Ogden Stonehealer: There are varied theories on what it means, but I believe it refers to the natural balance of magic.Ogden Stonehealer: Too much magic, and the world spins out of control. Too little, and it crumbles into darkness.

Perhaps the gods couldn’t interfere that mich without causing more imbalance to Tyria.

I'd still prefer to think the Five were slowly but inevitably tainted by Zhaitan's corruption of Orr, having had such a deep magical connection to that land; and they all left except Kormir because she wasn't affected, having no direct history in Orr.

@Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

Secondly, charr do believe the Six are gods.

We should state how different races define gods (and how do we). And I wouldn't call it believe. They just know that they exist, it's undeniable fact (there is difference between faith and knowledge, but in terms of religion is a very/too philosophical topic + the myth is just the myth, in Western Culture we also have myths about Greece and Roman gods :S and it is part of our culture) . Also their power is undeniable, and it's for all the beings in tyria, for Elder Dragons too.As a something saint, a being to worship, and as a source of power, The Six are currently a gods for Humans and individuals/groups from other kinds.If it would be different, would they be on the side od Humans in every Human-Charr and Human-Centaur conflict?