A nerf to overall damage can be good for classes with lots of toughness.

I was thinking about that video from members of ANET discussing during a PVP match, and i think that nerf could be great for necros, as anything with tons of toughness shouldn't be able to be cut down like they have paper mache armor.

Now I know this also means reaper gets nerfed probably in spvp, and that's fine too, i think this could also benefit classes like warrior who probably have a ton of toughness and guards.

What's worst though? Light arms such as mesmer who can range bomb with zerker amulet or warriors/holo with demolisher amulet with 25 might stacks?

They are both pretty bad for the game actually, both have their pros and cons.

Warrs tended to have lots of sustain plus burst and before the zerker nerf they had hard cc and burst which is nutsA mesmer with that amulet and the right build with PU mesmer invis insta kill bombing.

Which is why anet has its work cut out.

I also predict thief will have a lot of redesigns ahead. Not sure if steal will get nerfed, but it might as it does do a lot of stuff.

@Axl.8924 said:They are both pretty bad for the game actually, both have their pros and cons.

Warrs tended to have lots of sustain plus burst and before the zerker nerf they had hard cc and burst which is nutsA mesmer with that amulet and the right build with PU mesmer invis insta kill bombing.

Which is why anet has its work cut out.

I also predict thief will have a lot of redesigns ahead. Not sure if steal will get nerfed, but it might as it does do a lot of stuff.

That's wrong about steal, it just ports on a 30 sec CD.

Only when you slap in 8 or 9 traits it becomes loaded with stuff

@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:

@Axl.8924 said:They are both pretty bad for the game actually, both have their pros and cons.

Warrs tended to have lots of sustain plus burst and before the zerker nerf they had hard cc and burst which is nutsA mesmer with that amulet and the right build with PU mesmer invis insta kill bombing.

Which is why anet has its work cut out.

I also predict thief will have a lot of redesigns ahead. Not sure if steal will get nerfed, but it might as it does do a lot of stuff.

I'm not saying its op but it does a lot of stuff and ANET did nerf zerker.

You can do some pretty nuts things, hopefully, they just nerf the traits a little, instead of gutting.

Maybe also now we can have other classes with the kinda mobility thieves have also cut back a little with their stealth and teleports. I really hope teleports get nerfed as its a bit crazy along with stealth being cut back a bit too.

We need mostly a general elite spec nerf, elite specs should not have advantages like extra skills or something else, they should be the same trade off be as normal specs.

As an example, as a soulbeast I am be able to use my pet and it skills, than I can melt with it, using 3 more different skills, demelt and be able to use the pet again.

In the worst case its a gazelle or the smoke thing and I have skilled spot = 2 spots, 1 with pet f2, 1 with worldly impact (yeah they have separated cool downs) and a dominant dps and lockdowns too.

My solution for that would be, the soulbeast is not able to demelt with the pet but can change the skills with a 25 sec cool down, and shared skills should have shared cool down.

@Avatar.3568 said:We need mostly a general elite spec nerf, elite specs should not have advantages like extra skills or something else, they should be the same trade off be as normal specs.

As an example, as a soulbeast I am be able to use my pet and it skills, than I can melt with it, using 3 more different skills, demelt and be able to use the pet again.

In the worst case its a gazelle or the smoke thing and I have skilled spot = 2 spots, 1 with pet f2, 1 with worldly impact (yeah they have separated cool downs) and a dominant dps and lockdowns too.

My solution for that would be, the soulbeast is not able to demelt with the pet but can change the skills with a 25 sec cool down, and shared skills should have shared cool down.

At the same time avatar don't you also hope they improve some of the less used pets too? I really think some of them should be seriously looked at.

Maybe that would already "improve" pets because, who would ever take 2 pets with mostly similar skills when they have shared cooldown

So do you want to see sustain nerfed as well for soulbeast avatar? i know you guys recently got nerfed as well in greatsword, so im not sure what direction it should go thats a pretty interesting topic in itself.

@Axl.8924 said:I was thinking about that video from members of ANET discussing during a PVP match, and i think that nerf could be great for necros, as anything with tons of toughness shouldn't be able to be cut down like they have paper mache armor.

Now I know this also means reaper gets nerfed probably in spvp, and that's fine too, i think this could also benefit classes like warrior who probably have a ton of toughness and guards.

I don't agree because toughness is a stat and stats all come from the amulet you use. Vitality, I could have maybe seen your argument because classes do have different levels of health, but toughness is the same. It's true that warrior are hard to kill, but that's because of the traits they take to mitigate damage. And I'd say scrapper is the biggest example of that. Scrappers take such a tiny fraction of the damage I would do to a necromancer. But most, or every, class has ways to mitigate or avoid damage. I think anet has done a good job of making it pretty equal, but in different ways. There are some extremes that need to be looked at like DD thieves having unlimited dodge, scrappers having way too much damage mitigation, and necromancers seemingly not having enough. But for the most part, I like that defense/damage mitigation/evasion is fairly balanced, but in different ways.

I would not say directly that gs has gotta get a nerf, the gs4 block is now extremely strong, so I do not really care about the auto dodge of gs1.

But yeah in my opinion needs pretty much Every elite spec a nerf (not literally all, druid as an example does not maybe need a nerf when everything else is nerfed)

But yeah we do not need only a overall power creep nerf, every elite spec should not have more advantages than disadvantages.

Why would someone go core ele, when there is tempest and weaver, both do things better than the core variant.That's mostly with every class

Well, a nerf to the overall damage isn't necessarily the proper answer to the issue.

I partially agree with:

@"Avatar.3568" said:We need mostly a general elite spec nerf, elite specs should not have advantages like extra skills or something else, they should be the same trade off be as normal specs.

It's true that the extra of the elite specs need some shave off but they ain't the decisive factor that necessarily need to be addressed to improve PvP.

The main issue is often the powercreep on might generation and it started way before HoT. The simple way to address this issue is simply to add ICD on some might traits. The better way would be to reduce drastically the base might duration (to 1s for example) on most might source and make might duration scale on concentration like condition damage scale on condition damage (the stat). Ideally they would do that for all boons and conditions making concentration and expertise elements needed for boon gen.

That done, they could take a look at the amulet stat, in such a way that they become a bit more "specialized". 4 different stats on a single amulet is also one of the reason the balance is in a shamble.

@Hot Boy.7138 said:

@Axl.8924 said:I was thinking about that video from members of ANET discussing during a PVP match, and i think that nerf could be great for necros, as anything with tons of toughness shouldn't be able to be cut down like they have paper mache armor.

Now I know this also means reaper gets nerfed probably in spvp, and that's fine too, i think this could also benefit classes like warrior who probably have a ton of toughness and guards.

Warrior is strong becouse of traits you say?They go Strenght -> damageDiscipline -> utility + damageSpb -> everything, mostly damage.They go full damage and get this level of survival.

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Hot Boy.7138 said:

@Axl.8924 said:I was thinking about that video from members of ANET discussing during a PVP match, and i think that nerf could be great for necros, as anything with tons of toughness shouldn't be able to be cut down like they have paper mache armor.

Now I know this also means reaper gets nerfed probably in spvp, and that's fine too, i think this could also benefit classes like warrior who probably have a ton of toughness and guards.

What about mesmer traits? one mesmer admitted that the reason they were so strong was a ton of different passive ones interacting with damage.

Necro has those too, and effects damage as well. 8-15k soul spirals are normal and fairly easy

@Axl.8924 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Hot Boy.7138 said:

@Axl.8924 said:I was thinking about that video from members of ANET discussing during a PVP match, and i think that nerf could be great for necros, as anything with tons of toughness shouldn't be able to be cut down like they have paper mache armor.

Now I know this also means reaper gets nerfed probably in spvp, and that's fine too, i think this could also benefit classes like warrior who probably have a ton of toughness and guards.

ever class has dmg boosts.not every class can go 3 damage traitlines and still be tanky as FUCK .as for damage modifiers, we have shitty, unreliable ones.https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mental_Anguish is badhttps://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Egotism 5% dmg only when winning, other classes have 5-10% perma boosts like revs 9% perma or necros 10% becouse you are close, or 10% becouse I entered or left shroud.The entire thing with 1shot mesmer is a farce, the fact that you take glass cannon build and land 6 abilities and can still fail to 1shot squishy classes if unlucky is just mindboggling, other classes go tanky and deal same dmg with 2-3hits. Just not out of stealth so nobody complains as much.

There's alot of reasons behind what's going on with the game right now but the main one is that players get cool stuff like self-healing, high-duration boons and conditions, etc. with minimal investments in stats, so even though stat builds are better, they're not required.

Traits just make this even worse, sometimes you can even completely forego certain stats . I realise that for most of the game's run this was kind of the point, to allow most of your power to come from your build instead of your gear, but it came to the point where it was much more about your build than your gear by an exponential factor, and that makes it too easy to counter most, if not all weaknesses.

In PvP, this should be even less possible since amulets are more limited than PvE/WvW gear, but it's not.

What you refer to as "Toughness classes", is actually classes with %damage resistance from traits, Protection, signets, etc. The Toughness stat itself has little effect on anything other than power builds that lack good critical damage.