Rampage has everything and needs tradeoffs/nerfs

[FyzE.3472]

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:Take away the boulder.

Why me

[Ferus.3165]

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@"AngelsShadow.7360" said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:Rampage is fine and easily countered.Tempest perspective.

Magnetic Auras / Immobilize / chill / Weakness and cripple spam combined with a tiny bit of kiting, easy done.

I swear ya'll complain about anything...

You give up node though. Your perspective is limited.

For like 5s, big woop lolWarrior blows rampage, rampage gets kited and warrior dies. At most he might have made a decap in the process.I can shut down a rampage with earth overload, 1 simple skill and that one simple skill can be used mid kite on a warrior slightly off point, of which then I get a decap or recap.I can and could facetank the damage on point too with weakness and protection/regen uptime but that's unnecessary when soft CC does the trick easily.This is coming from a Tempest point of view, you know that class that everyone says is trash? Yea, even trash can handle it fine.

Don't tell someone they have limited perspective when yours is way less, it doesnt work that way.

it's far easier to cry out for nerfs on the forum than to get better at the game. Thx for your insight.

[Caedmon.6798]

@Crab Fear.1624 said:Take away the boulder.

Reflect the boulder ;)

[Balsa.3951]

Rampage should be slower moving that would at least give more kite potential. Let’s say shuffles mystery box a 25% movement speed reduction.

Keep the dmg keep the cc keep the substain but let me be able to get some distance to it

[melandru.3876]

@Balsa.3951 said:Rampage should be slower moving that would at least give more kite potential. Let’s say shuffles mystery box a 25% movement speed reduction.

Keep the dmg keep the cc keep the substain but let me be able to get some distance to it

then what is the point?

rampage -25% speedwarriors sprint +25% speed

so nothing changes lol

[Balsa.3951]

@melandru.3876 said:

@Balsa.3951 said:Rampage should be slower moving that would at least give more kite potential. Let’s say shuffles mystery box a 25% movement speed reduction.

Keep the dmg keep the cc keep the substain but let me be able to get some distance to it

then what is the point?

rampage -25% speedwarriors sprint +25% speed

so nothing changes lol

I just want be able to run away and out sit the rampage or at least range the warrior in rampage.

For me as a DH main now in pvp it’s really depressing seeing the warrior using his I win button and force me to get my f3 skill up to start than the fight as baseform warrior with a nice advantage

[shadowpass.4236]

I'm not a warrior main but I think rampage is fine. There are a lot of ways to counter it.

[Asuran.5469]

Rampage only feels strong now in power meta. In a condi meta it gets punished.

[melandru.3876]

@Balsa.3951 said:

@melandru.3876 said:

@Balsa.3951 said:Rampage should be slower moving that would at least give more kite potential. Let’s say shuffles mystery box a 25% movement speed reduction.

Keep the dmg keep the cc keep the substain but let me be able to get some distance to it

then what is the point?

rampage -25% speedwarriors sprint +25% speed

so nothing changes lol

I just want be able to run away and out sit the rampage or at least range the warrior in rampage.

For me as a DH main now in pvp it’s really depressing seeing the warrior using his I win button and force me to get my f3 skill up to start than the fight as baseform warrior with a nice advantage

lol? so if you can just walk away from rampage, isn't rampage useless then?with the amounts of stab/aegis good guards bring rampage should be no issue

and, it's not like guards have no mobility right?

-leap on greatsword-blink on sword-judge intervention that goes through walls-leap on f2 can be used twice if u reset your fskills with elite (if taken)

i also heard blind counters rampage pretty well

if u say dh i assume the longbow + sword/shield build, all others are inferior

• blind on longbow 3

• blind on sword 2

• blind on heal trap

• aegis on f3

• aegis on shield 4

rampage boulder is an issue?

• sword 3
• shield 5
• longbow 3

warrior burst is an issue?

• f3 3 secs block, all you have to do is face the warrior and you block every hit (minus unblockbale obviously) can be reset with elite skill that's 6/15 seconds now add in all from above

guardians are like the least affected by rampage, because they have a tool for every situation. firebrands more then dragonhunter, but dragonhunter still more then others

you even have sigil of annulment on longbow, annulment procs before the hit lands so if you use longbow 3(which is traited to cc) you will remove the stability from rampage with the sigil, then cc the rampageing warrior who can't even use a stunbreak because he is locked out of utiltiies for 15 seconds/untill he leaves rampage

doing so, even gives you stability which is another direct counter (with aegis and blind) to rampage...

maybe you need to player warrior once and see howmany classes will make rampage obsolete

[Ralkuth.1456]

when you manage to attach tether right before and you know your opponent is definitely cucked because it's out of stunbreaks. Zeorymer was the most broken thing in SRW J.

By the way, I'm all for nerfs to Rampage if it means Warrior gets stuff in Arms or Tactics or other utilities so they can stop relying on it/compensate for not being able to rely on it. Plus, it's not like it doesn't have obvious counterplay (dodge rock and try to outrange).

[Math.5123]

@melandru.3876 said:

lol? so if you can just walk away from rampage, isn't rampage useless then?with the amounts of stab/aegis good guards bring rampage should be no issue

Guardians does not have a lot of Aegis. They have 1 passive of F3 every 30 seconds and 1 active on F3 every 38.25 seconds when traited. DH has a bit more from traits.

and, it's not like guards have no mobility right?

-leap on greatsword-blink on sword-judge intervention that goes through walls-leap on f2 can be used twice if u reset your fskills with elite (if taken)

Guardians can only have 2 weapon sets equipped. DH does not use Greatsword. Sword 2 requires a target to be able to use as a disengage, making it situational at best. Same with Judge's Intervention. F2, sure unless you get stunned during the animation.

i also heard blind counters rampage pretty well

Yeah, DH has 2 blinds. (Using the heal for blind will get you killed) Lets just hope you didn't weapon swap already so you have access to both of them. Guardian has access to 3, (F1 GS 3 and Sword 2).

if u say dh i assume the longbow + sword/shield build, all others are inferior

• blind on longbow 3
• blind on sword 2
• blind on heal trap
• aegis on f3
• aegis on shield 4rampage boulder is an issue?
• sword 3
• shield 5
• longbow 3

If you have every single cooldown up when fighting a Strength Spellbreaker as a DH, you have already won the fight.

warrior burst is an issue?

• f3 3 secs block, all you have to do is face the warrior and you block every hit (minus unblockbale obviously) can be reset with elite skill that's 6/15 seconds now add in all from above

Rampage has a lower cooldown than Renewed Focus. You can also Seismic Leap behind the guardian in order to hit it through F3. Also, this is all operating under the assumption that you have not used F3 to stunbreak Tether, Bulls Charge or Shield 4.

guardians are like the least affected by rampage, because they have a tool for every situation. firebrands more then dragonhunter, but dragonhunter still more then othersGuardians are actually one of the few classes that has a really hard time against rampage due to it's very limited mobility. While you can handle it if you have all your cooldowns up, it's not something that will happen in actual games.

you even have sigil of annulment on longbow, annulment procs before the hit lands so if you use longbow 3(which is traited to cc) you will remove the stability from rampage with the sigil, then cc the rampageing warrior who can't even use a stunbreak because he is locked out of utiltiies for 15 seconds/untill he leaves rampage

You actually run Sigil of Annulment on Sword / Shield. You need Agility and Intelligence to actually be able to do some amount of damage with Bow.

doing so, even gives you stability which is another direct counter (with aegis and blind) to rampage...

maybe you need to player warrior once and see howmany classes will make rampage obsolete

Let's entertain the thought that you actually run Annulment on bow, and manage to rip exactly Stability and not Might / Swiftness / any other boon that might have been applied from runes / teammates. You do get one stack of stability. However, it only procs on actual knockbacks. Not on LB 3 hitting.

No skill should be able to do as much as rampage does.

[melandru.3876]

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@"melandru.3876" said:

lol? so if you can just walk away from rampage, isn't rampage useless then?with the amounts of stab/aegis good guards bring rampage should be no issue

Guardians does not have a lot of Aegis. They have 1 passive of F3 every 30 seconds and 1 active on F3 every 38.25 seconds when traited. DH has a bit more from traits.

and, it's not like guards have no mobility right?

-leap on greatsword-blink on sword-judge intervention that goes through walls-leap on f2 can be used twice if u reset your fskills with elite (if taken)

Guardians can only have 2 weapon sets equipped. DH does not use Greatsword. Sword 2 requires a target to be able to use as a disengage, making it situational at best. Same with Judge's Intervention. F2, sure unless you get stunned during the animation.

i also heard blind counters rampage pretty well

Yeah, DH has 2 blinds. (Using the heal for blind will get you killed) Lets just hope you didn't weapon swap already so you have access to both of them. Guardian has access to 3, (F1 GS 3 and Sword 2).

if u say dh i assume the longbow + sword/shield build, all others are inferior

• blind on longbow 3
• blind on sword 2
• blind on heal trap
• aegis on f3
• aegis on shield 4rampage boulder is an issue?
• sword 3
• shield 5
• longbow 3

If you have every single cooldown up when fighting a Strength Spellbreaker as a DH, you have already won the fight.

warrior burst is an issue?

• f3 3 secs block, all you have to do is face the warrior and you block every hit (minus unblockbale obviously) can be reset with elite skill that's 6/15 seconds now add in all from above

Rampage has a lower cooldown than Renewed Focus. You can also Seismic Leap behind the guardian in order to hit it through F3. Also, this is all operating under the assumption that you have not used F3 to stunbreak Tether, Bulls Charge or Shield 4.

guardians are like the least affected by rampage, because they have a tool for every situation. firebrands more then dragonhunter, but dragonhunter still more then othersGuardians are actually one of the few classes that has a really hard time against rampage due to it's very limited mobility. While you can handle it if you have all your cooldowns up, it's not something that will happen in actual games.

you even have sigil of annulment on longbow, annulment procs before the hit lands so if you use longbow 3(which is traited to cc) you will remove the stability from rampage with the sigil, then cc the rampageing warrior who can't even use a stunbreak because he is locked out of utiltiies for 15 seconds/untill he leaves rampage

You actually run Sigil of Annulment on Sword / Shield. You need Agility and Intelligence to actually be able to do some amount of damage with Bow.

doing so, even gives you stability which is another direct counter (with aegis and blind) to rampage...

maybe you need to player warrior once and see howmany classes will make rampage obsolete

Let's entertain the thought that you actually run Annulment on bow, and manage to rip exactly Stability and not Might / Swiftness / any other boon that might have been applied from runes / teammates. You do get one stack of stability. However, it only procs on actual knockbacks. Not on LB 3 hitting.

No skill should be able to do as much as rampage does.

https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Dragonhunter_-_Meditrapperthen feel free to log in, and change the build esp the sigils

[Math.5123]

@melandru.3876 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@melandru.3876 said:

lol? so if you can just walk away from rampage, isn't rampage useless then?with the amounts of stab/aegis good guards bring rampage should be no issue

Guardians does not have a lot of Aegis. They have 1 passive of F3 every 30 seconds and 1 active on F3 every 38.25 seconds when traited. DH has a bit more from traits.

and, it's not like guards have no mobility right?

-leap on greatsword-blink on sword-judge intervention that goes through walls-leap on f2 can be used twice if u reset your fskills with elite (if taken)

Guardians can only have 2 weapon sets equipped. DH does not use Greatsword. Sword 2 requires a target to be able to use as a disengage, making it situational at best. Same with Judge's Intervention. F2, sure unless you get stunned during the animation.

i also heard blind counters rampage pretty well

Yeah, DH has 2 blinds. (Using the heal for blind will get you killed) Lets just hope you didn't weapon swap already so you have access to both of them. Guardian has access to 3, (F1 GS 3 and Sword 2).

if u say dh i assume the longbow + sword/shield build, all others are inferior

• blind on longbow 3
• blind on sword 2
• blind on heal trap
• aegis on f3
• aegis on shield 4rampage boulder is an issue?
• sword 3
• shield 5
• longbow 3

If you have every single cooldown up when fighting a Strength Spellbreaker as a DH, you have already won the fight.

warrior burst is an issue?

• f3 3 secs block, all you have to do is face the warrior and you block every hit (minus unblockbale obviously) can be reset with elite skill that's 6/15 seconds now add in all from above

Rampage has a lower cooldown than Renewed Focus. You can also Seismic Leap behind the guardian in order to hit it through F3. Also, this is all operating under the assumption that you have not used F3 to stunbreak Tether, Bulls Charge or Shield 4.

guardians are like the least affected by rampage, because they have a tool for every situation. firebrands more then dragonhunter, but dragonhunter still more then othersGuardians are actually one of the few classes that has a really hard time against rampage due to it's very limited mobility. While you can handle it if you have all your cooldowns up, it's not something that will happen in actual games.

you even have sigil of annulment on longbow, annulment procs before the hit lands so if you use longbow 3(which is traited to cc) you will remove the stability from rampage with the sigil, then cc the rampageing warrior who can't even use a stunbreak because he is locked out of utiltiies for 15 seconds/untill he leaves rampage

You actually run Sigil of Annulment on Sword / Shield. You need Agility and Intelligence to actually be able to do some amount of damage with Bow.

doing so, even gives you stability which is another direct counter (with aegis and blind) to rampage...

maybe you need to player warrior once and see howmany classes will make rampage obsolete

Let's entertain the thought that you actually run Annulment on bow, and manage to rip exactly Stability and not Might / Swiftness / any other boon that might have been applied from runes / teammates. You do get one stack of stability. However, it only procs on actual knockbacks. Not on LB 3 hitting.

No skill should be able to do as much as rampage does.

https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Dragonhunter_-_Meditrapper

then feel free to log in, and change the build esp the sigils

I mean, ofc I can log onto DH. But why would I change my sigils to be at a disadvantage towards literally everything except 1 skill? Also, DH doesn't have enough damage to kill anything currently in the meta. It's kind of a moot point to argue.Just like I could live against Rampage as a Pistol / Shield core engi with Toolkit, but it's so far out of the meta that it doesn't matter.

[melandru.3876]

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@melandru.3876 said:

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@melandru.3876 said:

lol? so if you can just walk away from rampage, isn't rampage useless then?with the amounts of stab/aegis good guards bring rampage should be no issue

Guardians does not have a lot of Aegis. They have 1 passive of F3 every 30 seconds and 1 active on F3 every 38.25 seconds when traited. DH has a bit more from traits.

and, it's not like guards have no mobility right?

-leap on greatsword-blink on sword-judge intervention that goes through walls-leap on f2 can be used twice if u reset your fskills with elite (if taken)

Guardians can only have 2 weapon sets equipped. DH does not use Greatsword. Sword 2 requires a target to be able to use as a disengage, making it situational at best. Same with Judge's Intervention. F2, sure unless you get stunned during the animation.

i also heard blind counters rampage pretty well

Yeah, DH has 2 blinds. (Using the heal for blind will get you killed) Lets just hope you didn't weapon swap already so you have access to both of them. Guardian has access to 3, (F1 GS 3 and Sword 2).

if u say dh i assume the longbow + sword/shield build, all others are inferior

• blind on longbow 3
• blind on sword 2
• blind on heal trap
• aegis on f3
• aegis on shield 4rampage boulder is an issue?
• sword 3
• shield 5
• longbow 3

If you have every single cooldown up when fighting a Strength Spellbreaker as a DH, you have already won the fight.

warrior burst is an issue?

• f3 3 secs block, all you have to do is face the warrior and you block every hit (minus unblockbale obviously) can be reset with elite skill that's 6/15 seconds now add in all from above

Rampage has a lower cooldown than Renewed Focus. You can also Seismic Leap behind the guardian in order to hit it through F3. Also, this is all operating under the assumption that you have not used F3 to stunbreak Tether, Bulls Charge or Shield 4.

guardians are like the least affected by rampage, because they have a tool for every situation. firebrands more then dragonhunter, but dragonhunter still more then othersGuardians are actually one of the few classes that has a really hard time against rampage due to it's very limited mobility. While you can handle it if you have all your cooldowns up, it's not something that will happen in actual games.

you even have sigil of annulment on longbow, annulment procs before the hit lands so if you use longbow 3(which is traited to cc) you will remove the stability from rampage with the sigil, then cc the rampageing warrior who can't even use a stunbreak because he is locked out of utiltiies for 15 seconds/untill he leaves rampage

You actually run Sigil of Annulment on Sword / Shield. You need Agility and Intelligence to actually be able to do some amount of damage with Bow.

doing so, even gives you stability which is another direct counter (with aegis and blind) to rampage...

maybe you need to player warrior once and see howmany classes will make rampage obsolete

Let's entertain the thought that you actually run Annulment on bow, and manage to rip exactly Stability and not Might / Swiftness / any other boon that might have been applied from runes / teammates. You do get one stack of stability. However, it only procs on actual knockbacks. Not on LB 3 hitting.

No skill should be able to do as much as rampage does.

https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Dragonhunter_-_Meditrapper

then feel free to log in, and change the build esp the sigils

I mean, ofc I can log onto DH. But why would I change my sigils to be at a disadvantage towards literally everything except 1 skill? Also, DH doesn't have enough damage to kill anything currently in the meta. It's kind of a moot point to argue.Just like I could live against Rampage as a Pistol / Shield core engi with Toolkit, but it's so far out of the meta that it doesn't matter.

i know core guard is superior, and i assume you play core guard

however, the guy i respoçnded to (my first post) clearly said he played "For me as a DH main" hence my post entirely dedicated to dh vs rampage

it's not an impossible matchup and i didn't include in any rng like shards of faith, which is potential 3 additional aegis etc

[Thorstienn.1642]

Rampage is a core warrior elite, so have to try and seperate the issue from Spellbreaker specifically.I have no problem with it, prefer it to thief spin to win, but they are both core things and only need the smallest of changes if any.They are both countered quite easily: and the excuse of building to counter 1 thing applies to everything in the game; die to condi, get more cleanse, die to power, get resistance and boons, die to corruption, etc.In the end, dont you all have scourges in like every match like I do? Or at least a FB? Or your own Spellbreaker? Or a Soulbeast? Hell get a flamethrower on your engi kit, juggernaut it up and roast those mofos if it so prevalent.

[mortrialus.3062]

At this point you could nerf rampage back up to 180 second cooldown and it would still be run nearly 100% of the time by all core warriors and spellbreakers.

Peak Performance is too high of a modifier in PvP. It should be trimmed from 10% modifier down to 5%. Plenty of other modifiers in game that are 10% in PvE are split into 5% in PvP like Egoism. If Magebane Tether gets the nerfs it deserves and isn't ramping spellbreakers up to 25 might so easily Rampage will be less threatening. It'll be strong but you aren't going to see them 2 shot most meta builds any more. Rampage's problem is that for such a strong skill that can radically change the outcome of a fight it's cooldown is just too low. At 72 seconds for the cooldown you can expect rampage to be up every. single. 1v1. Every time.