Along with Outnumbered how about....

[Xenesis.6389]

An effect opposite of it called Overwhelming to mark the side with the most players instead?

It activates at every 5 min ticks like outnumbered, it detects whichever side has the most players on the map, so it will always be on, but it will switch sides depending on how many on the map.

Or can make trigger only when they have a queue instead, if multiple sides have a queue on that map then it doesn't trigger.

The effect marks those players to be worth 2x-10x more ppk and wxp to their enemies. Maybe even capture points too.

The amount goes up every 5 players over, if a side had 5 more players than the other two sides then all their players are worth 2x more ppk/wxp, all the way to if they have 45 more players they are worth 10x ppk/wxp. Base wxp of course still fluctuates depending on how long they have been alive.

I would avoid adding more stats and leave this purely to points(I know useless), so I threw in the wxp but not sure if that should be included or maybe just do a flat 25% as outnumbered provides.

If players want to run around safely in boon balling 50 player squads, then they should be worth more. Picking off stragglers from those big zergs/blobs could be worthwhile for small focus groups.

Maybe this could promote 2v1 going against the strongest side instead of the weakest on the map.

Edited January 23, 2022 by Xenesis.6389

[Gorani.7205]

Well, it doesn't solve the problem that those people are still very hard to kill in their zerg and as long as enemies are on the map they can still go around flip things and keep up the participation with no need to leave the map.

7 hours ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

Picking off stragglers from those big zergs/blobs could be worthwhile for small focus groups.

How big are your chances to do that, without giving the blob a higher chance to feed on you?

 

I'd rather see e.g. an "Supplying the army" de-buff, that makes you lose 5 supply each tick and doubles the amount of supply spent on siege when you build something. The blob would have do re-supply runs more often (people would need to break up to get back to a camp) and could not feed on taken structures very long. Eventually they would have to leave the map, because they can't take enough supply to take stuff quickly.
This could also be combined with bloodlust, e.g. while you map has bloodlust during being outnumbered on this map, killing an enemy reduces all their supply to zero.
IMHO, blobs having unlimited supply due to map supremacy is what allows them to stay on the map an keep rotating. No supply stops that.

[Dawdler.8521]

But... the enemy to the outnumbered side is already worth infinitetly more PPK since the outnumbered are worth 0. 
I dont quite understand the reasoning for this. Even if they where worth even more it wouldnt make any difference whatsoever, PPT overshadows PPK by a factor of 10 or so. It's not like you're going to kill particularly much by going 3v50 anyway. At the point the outnumbered side has gotten enough randoms to not be outnumbered anymore, that 50 man will still just farm them for points.

Edited January 23, 2022 by Dawdler.8521

[GoldenPants.1870]

32 minutes ago, Gorani.7205 said:

How big are your chances to do that, without giving the blob a higher chance to feed on you?

Considering most zerglings cant survive if not quick enough and they get left behind ? pretty good.

[Gorani.7205]

7 hours ago, GoldenPants.1870 said:

Considering most zerglings cant survive if not quick enough and they get left behind ? pretty good.

So, the gameplay  for outnumbered maps you propse (and that benefits from OP's idea) is switching to a perma stealth type of profession and waiting for green players to leave the zerg for a sentry or dolly?
That doesn't really address the problem, does it?

[GoldenPants.1870]

15 hours ago, Gorani.7205 said:

is switching to a perma stealth type of profession

No, I never said that, any class can prey on the zerglings that get left behind, some are better than others sure, but all you need to do is know when and when not to strike, along with when to kite/run away.

 

Its worked out so far with no reward for it either.

 

15 hours ago, Gorani.7205 said:

waiting for green players to leave the zerg for a sentry or dolly?

You can pick on the zerg at any time, but the best times to do it is when they are distracted by something else.

[kamikharzeeh.8016]

@Xenesis.6389 that's even worse than anets nerfing policy lmfao.

 

u realize what u would create? every group would run extra supports then. sofar, the strongest groups run 15-20 people with firebrand, scrapper + 3 dps normally.

 

but if u encourage all the pvE and spvp players to come with rangers and theives to gank the dps modes of groups, u can be sure that the comps get more bulky and supportive to avoid these. with extra FB/scrappergroups u can outheal any glasscannon damage anyways then.

 

like, u don't really think we let these roleplay rambos snipe for days?

 

and you'd only mark the dps players - the supports barely get kill participation, it's like 80% less if u play scrapper/FB, compared to the active dps players who do the killing.

__

 

further, also making kills worth more if one server outnumbers doesn't matter? what gives if u have to suicide for 3 kills out of a 40ish group, that's basically useless

 

enhanced stat buffing is the BY FAR better solution.

 

the only points where i do agree, there could be the counterpart to the "outnumbered", kinda "outnumbering". it could suggest casual players mildly that they may want to look for other maps to play on.

 

-> it should lower things like participation, wxp gain and karma for the outnumbering faction, so that the players who do karmatrains get encourage to rather not do that.

(karmatrains are these blind blobs that only flip defenseless structures with massive overnumbers.)

 

another good point, while not sure if u meant it alike: those structures, like keeps etc that have been not flipped for very long should be generating WXP stocks with no caps, so that they'll get very high prestige flip targets. it partly is like that yet, just not the same way. (like, wxp stocks on long time not killed NPCs, but it think it is finite and therefore always not crazy high)

 

besides, it'd be nice if the maps would auto ping attacks. player scouts are not reliable at all anymore these days.

 

btw @GoldenPants.1870 [buff] your gremmerz

[GoldenPants.1870]

29 minutes ago, kamikharzeeh.8016 said:

btw @GoldenPants.1870 [buff] your gremmerz

You have literally spellt more things wrong than I have. 🤔

[kamikharzeeh.8016]

considering that i was referring to your signature, i kinda doubt that, as u have it in every post :9

[Junkpile.7439]

Maybe overhelming debuff could make players move 50% slower 🤯

[jahaan.1405]

As a player that's always on the outnumbered side, why don't you just make it a two sided event? I'm stuck with commanders who think they are military genius's because they have a tag. Other commanders that charge onto a map with their little retinue of followers and head for the nearest keep, bypassing everything else, usually only to fail. The zergs don't need any more bonuses or boons.

[coro.3176]

IIRC the devs have said in the past that they do not want to have mechanics that encourage intrateam fighting about who gets to participate.

"GTFO our map with your trash guild, you're giving us Overwhelming" in map chat is the sort of thing they want to avoid.

[joneirikb.7506]

What coro said, the "Care-bear-rule".

To the topic, the very same thing could be accomplished just increasing the bonuses on "outnumbered" without making a new mechanic for "overwhelming".

And imagine how many fair-weathers that would just log in, check if their side got "overwhelming" and if not just log out again. Simply because they value the feeling of safety of outnumbering to anything else (and just want to grind the reward track for GOB).

So since ANet is never going to attach anything "negative" to any single effect, means that the only real options is applying stuff to the "outnumbered". And I can't really imagine what kind of reward bonus would be good enough to get players to actually decide to play while outnumbered, if they didn't already do that anyways. And they can't really apply handicaps because it would bork the combat balance all over the map.

I guess there might still be a small gap between "handicap" and "rewards" that hasn't been explored. Example, mark every fight on the map even 1vs1 or wall taps, then remove that if outnumbered. Basically make the "not-outnumbered" (ANet speak for "overwhelming") become visible on the map.