LFG is the opposite of Living World

[Cuks.8241]

Well I would do the opposite. I would enhance the LFG. The UI, the accessibility and utility it brings.

For example I am sure there are 5 new players out there lvling their first character, stumbling upon dungeon and think how do I try this one out. And since they dont find the solution (other players) on the spot they go on. Now LFG should be the tool introduced to players early, naturally and clearly enough that they would find each other.  I dont mean a queue system like LFD, LFR in wow. More a general tool for communication across instances and organisation that can apply for dungeons and other instances but also for story missions, open world events... Like now but enhanced.

I dont have the ultimate solution but the current system is really basic in foremost hidden to players. How about if this would be a clear button on UI that would bring up listings for the current zone or activity you are doing. Maybe a game could suggest LFG at certain points during gameplay and maybe encourage listing your own group, call for help when you fail a story mission, have generic listings for such events... Another accessibility QOL function; you should be able to enter an instance from anywhere through LFG or teleport to other players on lfg  (maybe only within a map). 

[Erise.5614]

9 minutes ago, Cuks.8241 said:

Well I would do the opposite. I would enhance the LFG. The UI, the accessibility and utility it brings.

For example I am sure there are 5 new players out there lvling their first character, stumbling upon dungeon and think how do I try this one out. And since they dont find the solution (other players) on the spot they go on. Now LFG should be the tool introduced to players early, naturally and clearly enough that they would find each other.  I dont mean a queue system like LFD, LFR in wow. More a general tool for communication across instances and organisation that can apply for dungeons and other instances but also for story missions, open world events... Like now but enhanced.

I dont have the ultimate solution but the current system is really basic in foremost hidden to players. How about if this would be a clear button on UI that would bring up listings for the current zone or activity you are doing. Maybe a game could suggest LFG at certain points during gameplay and maybe encourage listing your own group, call for help when you fail a story mission, have generic listings for such events... Another accessibility QOL function; you should be able to enter an instance from anywhere through LFG or teleport to other players on lfg  (maybe only within a map). 

Why have an open world at all then? Why not instance everything? Why not go back to GW1s system? Apologies for these questions. I know they are hyperbole. 

My point is, LFG and open world ad-hoc don't have to be mutually exclusive. LFG improvements and better introduction to it could be helpful! You do raise valid points! There's a lot of issues regarding the messy "holy quinternity" GW2 is going for instead of the traditional "holy trinity" as well as population sizes for different content. But all of that sounds like it's besides the point. A worthy thread on its own! 

But the game really benefitted from a strong emphasis on open world and spontaneous cooperation outside of LFG. And that should not be neglected either. It shouldn't dominate the game and its systems. LFG and other systems are good. But the game shouldn't focus on that style of gameplay exclusively. Even primarily focusing on LFG is probably not the best path forward for open world content. 

Edited April 10, 2022 by Erise.5614

[jaif.3518]

To those advocating more LFG, please realize there are players with very different approaches and tastes.  Some people are very objective orient, and LFG serves that well.  Some are less caring about objectives, and more interested in feeling like they live in a virtual world, with stuff happening and a bunch of us in the neighborhood responding without wikis or strong organization.

(and many people enjoy both, as well)

I'm not saying "ban LFG".  I think it makes people happy.  I'm saying "something's off in EoD, the maps are empty and I almost never run into organic content anymore, and I think LFG is somehow in the way."

 

-Jeff

[Cuks.8241]

24 minutes ago, Erise.5614 said:

Why have an open world at all then? Why not instance everything? Why not go back to GW1s system? Apologies for these questions. I know they are hyperbole. 

Everything is instanced! And that's the issue.

If I could go to Dalaran (wow reference) and type in /map "LFM 5 people for x activity" and knew everyone possible on the whole server that is looking for this activity is reading my msg this would not be an issue. If this would be open world I could stand in front of Arah and /say who wants to do some dungeon exploring and I would have a better picture if anyone is interested. Now I have no clue without LFG because there are 2 more instances open. Maybe in another instance there are more players looking for the same thing and I have no way of knowing.

There is no way to naturally meet certain people in "open world" if they arent in your instance. Even hubs are instanced.

Edited April 10, 2022 by Cuks.8241

[Erise.5614]

4 minutes ago, Cuks.8241 said:

Everything is instanced! And that's the issue.

If I could go to Dalaran (wow reference) and type in /map "LFM 5 people for x activity" and knew everyone possible on the whole server that is looking for this activity is reading my msg this would not be an issue. If this would be open world I could stand in front of Arah and /say who wants to do some dungeon exploring and I would have a better picture if anyone is interested. Now I have no clue without LFG because there are 2 more instances open. Maybe in another instance there are more players looking for the same thing and I have no way of knowing.

There is no way to naturally meet certain people in "open world" if they arent in your instance. 

Isn't that cherry picking the case where LFG is useful? 

Like, sure. All of that is true. Again, just to be absolutely clear. LFG should not be removed. 

But why does that necessitate that EoD open world maps have to be designed to be more lonely and more reliant on LFG?

Edited April 10, 2022 by Erise.5614

[Hesione.9412]

What would also help is if the map closing due to insufficient players would put me into a populated map. I went through four maps yesterday in Kaineng, after the meta was finished - so yes, I would expect that map to be closing. But the next map closed, and then the next, then the next. 

 

I understand multiple instances of a map when there is a high player population wanting to do that map. I don't understand multiple instances of a map when there appear to be multiple maps with low player counts.

 

Maybe there would be less call for some LFGs if Anet managed low population maps better than they apparently do at the moment.

[Linken.6345]

9 minutes ago, Erise.5614 said:

Isn't that cherry picking the case where LFG is useful? 

Like, sure. All of that is true. Again, just to be absolutely clear. LFG should not be removed. 

But why does that necessitate that EoD open world maps have to be designed to be more lonely and more reliant on LFG?

I think it is more that EoD is a half finished rushed out expansion is the reason rather then the whole expansion catering to lfg.

[Erise.5614]

5 minutes ago, Linken.6345 said:

I think it is more that EoD is a half finished rushed out expansion is the reason rather then the whole expansion catering to lfg.

Just to clarify that too. I'm not saying ANet built EoD with the intention to make LFG borderline mandatory. 

It is what the expansion resulted in though. Regardless for the reasons that happened, I hope ANet looks at this and tries to go the other way in future maps and expansions. Keeping LFG as the great tool it is but also valuing the possibility of stumbling upon others doing stuff. 

[Cuks.8241]

13 minutes ago, Erise.5614 said:

Isn't that cherry picking the case where LFG is useful? 

Like, sure. All of that is true. Again, just to be absolutely clear. LFG should not be removed. 

But why does that necessitate that EoD open world maps have to be designed to be more lonely and more reliant on LFG?

Cherry picking? The base architecture of the game not enabling players to communicate across instances without overarching tool. I would not call that cherry picking. Emphasise again, hubs are also instanced.

Besides I dont really see much difference to other maps before EOD. The player cap should be increased though, this I agree. Btw I did all EOD metas for the first time just by happenstance while still exploring maps. But if you want to do a group activity in open world, LFG is your surest way. Or are you people standing in front of legendary bounty posting just waiting for it to naturally happen?

[Vayne.8563]

9 hours ago, standardFoe.2983 said:

@Vayne.8563 You do not get it and I really do not appreciate the patronizing tone. I've been MMO-ing since 2003 and am pretty good figuring out to how to have fun in games. I'm in a couple of guilds that I can do instanced content with I just do not want to, I ENJOY the random casualness of open world. Great so you helped someone I help people all the time just not on EoD crap like a mount that mostly exists to sell skins in the gem store.

 

@Blood Red Arachnid.2493 I have a comm tag and use it a lot to pull randoms together for brief open world events and then I move on, b/c I am disabled and cannot keep up with players that have a lot more energy than me.

 

@Linken.6345 You are not actually contributing to this discussion so.....go back to your T4's and Cm's. Open world is not a walk in the park. Learning how metas evolve and farming routes through large maps is not for people who want easy mode constantly.

Although I do self-describe as a casual since I don't want to be associated with players that think gaming is only fun when it's punishing.

I wasn't being patronizing, I was trying to be helpful. If you see that as patronizing that's on you. 
Beyond that, however, I get what you're saying because I also enjoy random wandering around the world and just coming on things.  And those things still exist in this game, but they don't really exists for organized content.

Anet has two choices.  They can make everything so simple that anyone can do it just be wandering around and running into it, or they can make some of the game more simple and some of the game more complex that requires a group and organization.

There's a ton of things you can wander into in the open world and do, even in EOD. Mini dungeons. Mini hidden chest hunts. Little collections you get from NPCs.  By the same token, the most popular meta events in this game require coordation and they're on a timer.  When an expansion is new, there are more people roaming around it, hence more maps, and not everyone on every map will be doing a meta, which is why LFG exists in the first place.

I get what you want. I don't find what you want reasonable. Because the only way to attain it is to make sure that there's only one map doing something (or a couple) and you're on one of those maps. And I've wandered into maps doing the meta in the new expansion and gotten them done anyway.

 

Having nothing to do with what you personally want, I just don't find a valid criticism here. I see a preference and if Anet made the game to make it more for you, then it would be less interesting for me.

[Arziki.8129]

12 hours ago, jaif.3518 said:

Я говорю: «Что-то не так в EoD, карты пусты, и я почти никогда больше не сталкиваюсь с органическим контентом, и я думаю, что LFG как-то мешает».

 

-Джефф

Oh. The answer is pretty simple. There is nothing to do.

1) You make a meta for a unique recipe 18-16 times so that you don’t buy it for favor (very expensive)

2) do all the achievements \ skin collections

3) and forget about the map.

 

The smartest thing to do would be to close these maps in the first month after release. In the future, the number of people backed by rationality will leave. They will be followed by those who do not care about progress and those who will stumble over failed metas. Those who are afraid of the void, then leechers. And poof! maps is dead. No, seriously, wasting 20-30 minutes on meta for the sake of 1 amalgam? Very funny.