What happened to respecting the customer's time?

[yoni.7015]

4 minutes ago, Moradorin.6217 said:

Long and short is fine. 2 hours long with a 70-80% chance it fails is NOT fine. Its a serious problem even in a vacuum, but add to it the other issues like class balance, wvw alliance, no guild mission overhauls, no levendary armor skin fix, etc, etc. Then its a really serious problem!

According to Anet the success rate is at least 60%. So where did you get the 70-80% from?

what do you mean with legendary armor fix? What do they need to fix? 
They are working on WvW alliances and there will be a balance patch at the end of this month. 

Edited June 5, 2022 by yoni.7015

[Sobx.1758]

12 hours ago, Erise.5614 said:

It doesn't need to be successful but you must fight Soo Won.

And how exactly is this "integrated into personal story"? It's a 1 AP ""achievement"" that's more of a wink to the player than anything else. It does nothing to the story itself, how is this somehow an issue for you or anyone else?

4 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

According to Anet the success rate is at least 60%. So where did you get the 70-80% from?

From that place, where he can make up any statistic he wants to prove his own opinion about stuff. 😄

Edited June 5, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[Moradorin.6217]

5 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

According to Anet the success rate is at least 60%. So where did you get the 70-80% from?

what do you mean with legendary armor fix? What do they need to fix? 
They are working on WvW alliances and there will be a balance patch at the end of this month. 

from myself and the other current thread poster who says they have a 1:4 rate overall so far. I have done the meta 6 or 8 times and all failed (I randomly login and join a meta once in a while its the only time I still play gw2 other than getting login reward each day) IMO Im being generious on the win rate. I dont get access to Anets data so I can only say its not verifiable so its not factual.

Edited June 5, 2022 by Moradorin.6217

[yoni.7015]

2 minutes ago, Moradorin.6217 said:

from myself and the other current thread poster who says they have a 1:4 rate overall so far. I have done the meta 6 or 8 times and all failed (I randomly login and join a meta once in a while its the only time I still play gw2 other than getting login reward each day) IMO Im being generious on the win rate.

ah alright. So we have an official number from Anet and then we have you. Hard to tell who to believe
Tonight I will have my 50th successful meta run in a row, or maybe even more. I stopped counting. 

Edited June 5, 2022 by yoni.7015

[Moradorin.6217]

Just now, yoni.7015 said:

Tonight I will have my 50th successful meta run in a row 🤷‍♂️

Right but doesnt change the fact that it takes 2 hours and can look solid sill the last 5 minutes with your typical map so if you are like me and just login and play. Your win rate is NOT better than 50/50 its more like 25% chance.

[Moradorin.6217]

I have wasted enough time on this game well over 12k hr played. The meta would be cool to see won, but I am not interested enough in playing anymore. Too many issues I have that go unaddressed to keep spending time on it and this meta is a HUGE time sink so, yeah. what ever.

[yoni.7015]

2 minutes ago, Moradorin.6217 said:

Right but doesnt change the fact that it takes 2 hours and can look solid sill the last 5 minutes with your typical map so if you are like me and just login and play. Your win rate is NOT better than 50/50 its more like 25% chance.

The commanders that run the meta regularly have a very high success rate and most of them advertise in LFG. Just join one of them and you are good to go. 

[Moradorin.6217]

Anet has been going on the wrong direction ever since CMC moved to take over balance in 2019 IMO. its that simple.

[Moradorin.6217]

they are destroying what was a nice game

[yoni.7015]

7 minutes ago, Moradorin.6217 said:

they are destroying what was a nice game

It still is a very nice game. But they can’t please everyone. What you may not like others do like 

[Crono.4197]

1 hour ago, yoni.7015 said:

ah alright. So we have an official number from Anet and then we have you. Hard to tell who to believe
Tonight I will have my 50th successful meta run in a row, or maybe even more. I stopped counting. 

"Official". Saying 60% success rate without saying the full story, is not really something we can trust. Is it 60% of the people that are currently doing DE or is it 60%, including the people that were doing DE before and were failing it?

What if, let's say 50.000 people were doing DE and the success rate was 10% and now only 15.000 are doing it and the success rate is 60%? It's easy to say that the success rate went up to 60% without looking at all the participants when it failed more VS all the participants now when it succeeds more. THIS is the kind of answer we need.

I'm pretty sure me and 2-3 people are not the only ones that haven't touched Dragon's End since the expansion launched. But sure, keep believing that elitists and people that want the game to be as hard as possible, are the majority.

Edited June 5, 2022 by Crono.4197
small typo

[Erise.5614]

21 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

...what? You pretty clearly are complaining  about some rewards being bound to the meta. Even in the last post all you've done was link to an image with the turtle (after trying to compare it to the gliding in relation to HoT, which -again- is clearly different for what these things do in the game, as well as complaining that it's acquired through meta -or even just participation in the last map of the expansion- and it shouldn't be because.... I guess because it was used in an ad?), how is this suddenly not complaining about exactly that?

You and others keep suggesting that DE is optional hardcore content. That it can easily be avoided and is therefore more like instanced content. "Don't like, don't play."

Which is a bad point to make for two reasons.

As I keep explaining, it's not designed to be optional content. Several critical paths lead straight into it. Several of which being non high performance players. Different than in the past, very much including the critical path of the personal story. 

And also different than in the past it requires a higher DPS benchmark of the map.

The combination of leading more different players into the map and ramping up is what's bad about it. The turtle attached to it.

The acquisition for the turtle, the story and all the other stuff is not a problem if the event is easy. If it can be completed reasonably and consistently be beaten within two attempts or so.

And a hard meta is not a problem if none of those things factor in. If it's just rewarding a more mats per hour than you can get elsewhere too. But having no exclusive features locked behind it and having no achievements from other areas of gameplay tied to it. Nor should achievement hunting have any impact on the meta, if the map offers any.

[yoni.7015]

4 minutes ago, Erise.5614 said:

You and others keep suggesting that DE is optional hardcore content. That it can easily be avoided and is therefore more like instanced content. "Don't like, don't play."

Which is a bad point to make for two reasons.

As I keep explaining, it's not designed to be optional content. Several critical paths lead straight into it. Several of which being non high performance players. Different than in the past, very much including the critical path of the personal story. 

And also different than in the past it requires a higher DPS benchmark of the map.

The combination of leading more different players into the map and ramping up is what's bad about it. The turtle attached to it.

The acquisition for the turtle, the story and all the other stuff is not a problem if the event is easy. If it can be completed reasonably and consistently be beaten within two attempts or so.

And a hard meta is not a problem if none of those things factor in. If it's just rewarding a more mats per hour than you can get elsewhere too. But having no exclusive features locked behind it and having no achievements from other areas of gameplay tied to it. Nor should achievement hunting have any impact on the meta, if the map offers any.

 But isn’t there only one story achievement tied to it, and you don’t even have to be successful? You don’t have to do the meta for the turtle. 
“don’t like, don’t play” seems very accurate. 

Edited June 5, 2022 by yoni.7015

[Moradorin.6217]

5 minutes ago, Erise.5614 said:

You and others keep suggesting that DE is optional hardcore content. That it can easily be avoided and is therefore more like instanced content. "Don't like, don't play."

Which is a bad point to make for two reasons.

As I keep explaining, it's not designed to be optional content. Several critical paths lead straight into it. Several of which being non high performance players. Different than in the past, very much including the critical path of the personal story. 

And also different than in the past it requires a higher DPS benchmark of the map.

The combination of leading more different players into the map and ramping up is what's bad about it. The turtle attached to it.

The acquisition for the turtle, the story and all the other stuff is not a problem if the event is easy. If it can be completed reasonably and consistently be beaten within two attempts or so.

And a hard meta is not a problem if none of those things factor in. If it's just rewarding a more mats per hour than you can get elsewhere too. But having no exclusive features locked behind it and having no achievements from other areas of gameplay tied to it. Nor should achievement hunting have any impact on the meta, if the map offers any.

Agreed. Like Serpents Ire meta was hard and took 4 tags when PoF was new but the story line didnt literally end at SI meta so no one cared. DE is not the same.

 

And I used to do the SI meta and it was fun but failure just meant a loss a loot and time sink was getting a coordinated map not a 2 hr long meta.

Edited June 5, 2022 by Moradorin.6217

[Moradorin.6217]

1 hour ago, yoni.7015 said:

 But isn’t there only one story achievement tied to it, and you don’t even have to be successful? You don’t have to do the meta for the turtle. 
“don’t like, don’t play” seems very accurate. 

I think the point is is thing progress toward DE then doing the DE meta is required or thing dont feel right. I wanted the turtle when EoD was new but after the meta a few times + unpopulated maps + no new guild Missions or anything and I just sorta decided I didnt want to keep investing time in gw2 tbh.

It was the straw that broke the camels back, as they say.

Edited June 5, 2022 by Moradorin.6217

[yoni.7015]

Just now, Moradorin.6217 said:

I think the point is is thing progress toward DE then doing the DE meta is required or thing dont feel right. I wanted the turtle when EoD was new but after the meta a few times + unpopulated maps + new new guild Missions or anything and I just sorta decided I didnt want to keep investing time in gw2 tbh.

It was the straw that broke the camels back, as they say.

Cool story. But you want to keep investing time complaining on the forums? 

[Moradorin.6217]

3 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

Cool story. But you want to keep investing time complaining on the forums? 

Once in a while I look on the forums and maybe post over the last 2 mo or so. I also login each day to keep getting the chests and to see who is on, but its been kinda quiet so I just log and do other stuff.

 

When I played I would spend hours a day playing and also post. So yeah. Think about it. over 12k hours on main act.

 

I also logged in a few days ago with a friend and we did the meta via LFG which failed. It was I think the 6th meta I have joined. I do try to give it a chance but so far gw2 is falling flat on its face.

Edited June 5, 2022 by Moradorin.6217

[Astralporing.1957]

28 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

ah alright. So we have an official number from Anet and then we have you. Hard to tell who to believe
Tonight I will have my 50th successful meta run in a row, or maybe even more. I stopped counting. 

Lol, you haven't even noticed what you said, did you?

Hint: your 50th win streak is definitely NOT a 60% win chance. For the chance to be 60% overall, someone else had to run the meta 50 times and win only 10 of those (20% win chance). So, you basically supported @Moradorin.6217's data, you just didn't see it.

[yoni.7015]

16 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

Lol, you haven't even noticed what you said, did you?

Hint: your 50th win streak is definitely NOT a 60% win chance. For the chance to be 60% overall, someone else had to run the meta 50 times and win only 10 of those (20% win chance). So, you basically supported @Moradorin.6217's data, you just didn't see it.

Where did I write that my win streak means a 60% success rate? I didn’t. 
 I wanted to show that experiences can be very different and your personal experience doesn’t make it a fact.

Edited June 5, 2022 by yoni.7015

[Sobx.1758]

28 minutes ago, Erise.5614 said:

You and others keep suggesting that DE is optional hardcore content.

Not sure I called it "hardcore" anywhere, but it is optional.

Quote

That it can easily be avoided and is therefore more like instanced content. "Don't like, don't play."

Which is a bad point to make for two reasons.

As I keep explaining, it's not designed to be optional content. Several critical paths lead straight into it. Several of which being non high performance players. Different than in the past, very much including the critical path of the personal story. 

It can be easly avoided. Turtle isn't needed for anything despite your repeated desperate efforts to compare it to the gliding that's literally needed to progress. Next you were trying to complain that... it's somehow "tied to the story" because... um... there's a 1 AP achievement that tells you to slap a boss before you start the last story step? Is that 1 AP somehow crucial to the story itself? Does that 1 AP make it hard to avoid participating in the meta? All you're doing is producing any irreleavnt complaint you can with the hopes something will stick.

Quote

And also different than in the past it requires a higher DPS benchmark of the map.

How is this relevant to anything said here? That's just another strawman after you've started backing out from the "turtle acquisition from last map/meta bad because it was used in ad!" and "it's tied to the story content, because there's a 1  AP achievement".

Quote

The acquisition for the turtle, the story and all the other stuff is not a problem if the event is easy. If it can be completed reasonably and consistently be beaten within two attempts or so.

And a hard meta is not a problem if none of those things factor in. If it's just rewarding a more mats per hour than you can get elsewhere too. But having no exclusive features locked behind it and having no achievements from other areas of gameplay tied to it. Nor should achievement hunting have any impact on the meta, if the map offers any.

Why exactly is that? Because you've randomly decided so? Even moreso, you don't need to complete the event for any of these. But even if you did, you've just made a random rule by yourself and claim it's a fact. But it's not. You literally made it up for yourself and based it on nothing other than your wishful thinking, didn't you?

You're just shooting blanks in this points and hope something sticks, but nothing you said here is supported by its definition or somehow an inherent fact by itself.

Edited June 5, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[Moradorin.6217]

53 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

what do you mean with legendary armor fix? What do they need to fix?

If you take a careful look at Legendary armor sets. One set gets a new skin upgrade when you craft the final legendary armor. That set is the Envoy Armor Set, therefore, those skins are ONLY available as legendary upgrades like ALL other legendary items in the game. However, the PvP and WvW Legendary armor sets lack any unique skin. They retain the same skin the armor had before, either normal or mistforged either of which can be purchased in game without even crafting or obtaining ascended armor, let alone needing pay to upgrade anything to legendary. This was in place LONG before the armory and now with the armory its totally broken in that people who already have 3 full sets may have to make MORE skins which is not balanced in a basic monetary sense or in a skin procurement sense either.

I personally have full legendary gear (runes, sigils, the works) but the first 2 Legendary armor sets I obtained before the armory was an idea are both from PvP/WvW which means Im 100% locked out of getting the other 2 skin sets for the same cost that others can get them for just because of the way the skins of each set progress and are gotten.

Its very unfair at this point and fails to address a rather significant issue

52 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

They are working on WvW alliances and there will be a balance patch at the end of this month

Yeah hope it works out. I had made plans with guild and other guilds years ago in expectation of this but that has since all fallen out I guess cause of time. Ohh well. I hope it works out for people.

[yoni.7015]

11 minutes ago, Moradorin.6217 said:

If you take a careful look at Legendary armor sets. One set gets a new skin upgrade when you craft the final legendary armor. That set is the Envoy Armor Set, therefore, those skins are ONLY available as legendary upgrades like ALL other legendary items in the game. However, the PvP and WvW Legendary armor sets lack any unique skin. They retain the same skin the armor had before, either normal or mistforged either of which can be purchased in game without even crafting or obtaining ascended armor, let alone needing pay to upgrade anything to legendary. This was in place LONG before the armory and now with the armory its totally broken in that people who already have 3 full sets may have to make MORE skins which is not balanced in a basic monetary sense or in a skin procurement sense either.

I personally have full legendary gear (runes, sigils, the works) but the first 2 Legendary armor sets I obtained before the armory was an idea are both from PvP/WvW which means Im 100% locked out of getting the other 2 skin sets for the same cost that others can get them for just because of the way the skins of each set progress and are gotten.

Its very unfair at this point and fails to address a rather significant issue

Yeah hope it works out. I had made plans with guild and other guilds years ago in expectation of this but that has since all fallen out I guess cause of time. Ohh well. I hope it works out for people.

Ah okay I understand. I got my three legendary armor sets from PvP and WvW as well, a unique skin would be great. 
i too have high hopes for the alliance system 😉 

Edited June 5, 2022 by yoni.7015

[Astralporing.1957]

28 minutes ago, yoni.7015 said:

Where did I write that my win streak means a 60% success rate? I didn’t. 
 I wanted to show that experiences can be very different and your personal experience doesn’t make it a fact.

No, you were not believing @Moradorin.6217's claims of having 70% loss rate, because it conflicted with Anet's given 60% win rate, so it obviously had to be false. While at the same time mentioning that you now have 100% win rate and not seeing a conflict in those two statements.

Edited June 5, 2022 by Astralporing.1957

[yoni.7015]

14 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

No, you were not believing @Moradorin.6217's claims of having 70% loss rate, because it conflicted with Anet's given 60% win rate, so it obviously had to be false. While at the same time mentioning that you now have 100% win rate and not seeing a conflict in those two statements.

No, he didn’t write that he personally had a 70-80% fail rate or did he? The overall success rate is, according to the only factual number we have, 60%. I like sticking to facts, I don’t know about you. 

Edited June 5, 2022 by yoni.7015

[Moradorin.6217]

2 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

No, you were not believing @Moradorin.6217's claims of having 70% loss rate, because it conflicted with Anet's given 6% win rate, so it obviously had to be false. While at the same time mentioning that you now have 100% win rate and not seeing a conflict in those two statements.

and just for the record I was just spit balling a 70-80% win rate to assume my 100% fail rate after 6 attempts is a lower than avg win rate on the meta and the OP I think claimed a 25% (1:4) rate. So I just said that to try and be reasonable tbh and I dont accept Anets claims at face value.