Ranger Pet and WvW

[MonsterTruck.9816]

I was super excited about the changes to druid for WvW, but there is one MAJOR issue with ranger that will always cause problems.  Pets and stealth.  As of right now, it's almost impossible to use stealth in combat with a pet out.  Either it's dead and can't be stealthed OR it eats up applications and blasts. 

Now this wouldn't be an issue IF you could join WvW without a pet.  As of right now, I can delete my template on my druid, remake it and not pick a pet.  I can go into open world and play without a pet, I might miss my doggy (arf arf), but they are not there to give away my position in WvW.  BUT... the second I enter WvW, the game auto selects a pet for me.  😡

So right now, the only way to play without a pet in WvW and not have it mess with stealth is to enter WvW, delete my template, remake it and not select a pet.  Ohh yeah, if I leave and re-enter WvW, I gotta do it again!  There is no reason for this and I hope it can be addressed.

[anduriell.6280]

It's being suggested for many many years to have the stow button to permanently stow the pet until you call it back in. 

I guess until the mechanists don't complain about their marionette it won't happen. Ah right they do have the perma-stow mechanical skill or sorts of. 

[Gotejjeken.1267]

Interesting bug I never thought of with the template thing.  

I'd suggest either playing as soulbeast or learning to live with your pet in WvW though if you want to stay alive very long.  

[MonsterTruck.9816]

5 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

Interesting bug I never thought of with the template thing.  

I'd suggest either playing as soulbeast or learning to live with your pet in WvW though if you want to stay alive very long.  

The bug is the game forcing me to have a pet.  I specifically do NOT want a pet in WvW.  There isn't much point in using stealth if your pet isn't invisible and just following you around.  Tells the enemy exactly where you are.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

37 minutes ago, MonsterTruck.9816 said:

The bug is the game forcing me to have a pet.  I specifically do NOT want a pet in WvW.  There isn't much point in using stealth if your pet isn't invisible and just following you around.  Tells the enemy exactly where you are.

 

If you don't want a pet then run Soulbeast.  You can even swap pets while merged now and get all the benefits.

Pet will stealth with you on most applications, such as smoke field blast, exiting celestial avatar when traited with celestial shadow, etc.

The actual bug in anets eyes would be the template thing, I'm not sure if posting that here is a great idea because then anet may fix it and you won't have your workaround....just my thoughts.  

[MonsterTruck.9816]

I know you didn't read the patch notes, but they buffed druid for WvW.  The whole point is to play druid.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

59 minutes ago, MonsterTruck.9816 said:

I know you didn't read the patch notes, but they buffed druid for WvW.  The whole point is to play druid.

 

...They did? I mean if you call nerfing Druidic Clarity from 13 to 3 among other controversial changes to things like the elite then sure, they buffed it.

What they really did was massively, massively buff Soulbeast with the pet swap, but that doesn't fit the narrative here.  

You can play Druid just fine with pets anyway and would be a huge disservice if you do your template bug because you are giving up a ton of CC opportunities.  They also as I mentioned easily stealth with Celestial Shadow and blasting smoke field from Smokescale, so you will have no problems roaming.

What you will have problems with is getting rid of them entirely, especially in WvW.  Ranger is not a zerg class, and should not be part of any zerg comp.  It is a havoc roamer (10 people or less), and as such you need the pet to create opportunities for you (even as Soulbeast).  I'm sure as you play more WvW you'll find this out--and if you ever step into sPvP you will definitely find this out.  

[MonsterTruck.9816]

28 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

 

...They did? I mean if you call nerfing Druidic Clarity from 13 to 3 among other controversial changes to things like the elite then sure, they buffed it.

What they really did was massively, massively buff Soulbeast with the pet swap, but that doesn't fit the narrative here.  

You can play Druid just fine with pets anyway and would be a huge disservice if you do your template bug because you are giving up a ton of CC opportunities.  They also as I mentioned easily stealth with Celestial Shadow and blasting smoke field from Smokescale, so you will have no problems roaming.

What you will have problems with is getting rid of them entirely, especially in WvW.  Ranger is not a zerg class, and should not be part of any zerg comp.  It is a havoc roamer (10 people or less), and as such you need the pet to create opportunities for you (even as Soulbeast).  I'm sure as you play more WvW you'll find this out--and if you ever step into sPvP you will definitely find this out.  

So what you're saying is that I should play a different class and that to NOT use stealth in combat while playing.  Got it.  I appreciate you trying to convince me of something that I'm not talking about.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

3 hours ago, MonsterTruck.9816 said:

So what you're saying is that I should play a different class and that to NOT use stealth in combat while playing.  Got it.  I appreciate you trying to convince me of something that I'm not talking about.

 

Sure, I suggest Dragon Hunter.

[Zyreva.1078]

Out of combat you can stow the pet and in combat you can send the pet to any random target and it won't give away your position/movement.

[Beddo.1907]

7 minutes ago, UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

Out of combat you can stow the pet and in combat you can send the pet to any random target and it won't give away your position/movement.

And what about dead pet in combat?

[Zyreva.1078]

1 minute ago, Beddo.1907 said:

And what about dead pet in combat?

That's the real problem with pets in WvW - regardless of stealth being involved or not.

[MonsterTruck.9816]

7 hours ago, UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

That's the real problem with pets in WvW - regardless of stealth being involved or not.

That's what I want addressed.  It's a silly mechanic that has been an issue for far too long.

[Zyreva.1078]

7 hours ago, MonsterTruck.9816 said:

That's what I want addressed.  It's a silly mechanic that has been an issue for far too long.

That's not what your original post says. You just want the pets gone there, i want them to be functional.

[Sansar.1302]

Pet should be optional, don't think pet on ranger is any good and should be removed or reworked 

 

[anduriell.6280]

7 hours ago, UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

That's not what your original post says. You just want the pets gone there, i want them to be functional.

Functional and WvW don’t belong ont he same sentence. 
mechanically is impossible to make pets survive a Zerg while being balance in small scale. 
just add the perma stow button as I suggested in another thread (not mine idea thou). you then decide if using pet skills is actually worth the risk. 
 

[MonsterTruck.9816]

2 hours ago, anduriell.6280 said:

Functional and WvW don’t belong ont he same sentence. 
mechanically is impossible to make pets survive a Zerg while being balance in small scale. 
just add the perma stow button as I suggested in another thread (not mine idea thou). you then decide if using pet skills is actually worth the risk. 
 

For real.  Trying to play at somewhat of a higher level just feels bad right now on druid.  Pets really need an update.

[Beddo.1907]

2 hours ago, anduriell.6280 said:

mechanically is impossible to make pets survive a Zerg while being balance in small scale. 

Technically it's possible to apply a stacking DR buff to pet, based on the number of players within a certain range.
This way it can survive in zerg for long enough if used correctly and small scale shouldn't be affected too much.

[PrinceValentine.9320]

Just click stow when you are stacked with the commander. 

[PrinceValentine.9320]

On 10/4/2022 at 10:15 PM, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

 

...They did? I mean if you call nerfing Druidic Clarity from 13 to 3 among other controversial changes to things like the elite then sure, they buffed it.

What they really did was massively, massively buff Soulbeast with the pet swap, but that doesn't fit the narrative here.  

You can play Druid just fine with pets anyway and would be a huge disservice if you do your template bug because you are giving up a ton of CC opportunities.  They also as I mentioned easily stealth with Celestial Shadow and blasting smoke field from Smokescale, so you will have no problems roaming.

What you will have problems with is getting rid of them entirely, especially in WvW.  Ranger is not a zerg class, and should not be part of any zerg comp.  It is a havoc roamer (10 people or less), and as such you need the pet to create opportunities for you (even as Soulbeast).  I'm sure as you play more WvW you'll find this out--and if you ever step into sPvP you will definitely find this out.  

Weirdly, I was praised yesterday while playing Druid with a squad. The heal and cleanse are crazy. Don't put ranger down that hard. Some squads are slowly recognizing recognizing its use. 

[Zyreva.1078]

5 hours ago, Beddo.1907 said:

Technically it's possible to apply a stacking DR buff to pet, based on the number of players within a certain range.
This way it can survive in zerg for long enough if used correctly and small scale shouldn't be affected too much.

Dmg reduction is problematic because of target caps. Pets should not provide free dmg mitigation for zergs. I'd like pets to be invulnerable (and untargetable) as long they are passive. Gives ranger control over their survivability with proper micromanagement, but still allows for counterplay as soon the pet does something.

Edited October 6, 2022 by UmbraNoctis.1907

[tykel.6073]

50 minutes ago, UmbraNoctis.1907 said:

Dmg reduction is problematic because of target caps. Pets should not provide free dmg mitigation for zergs. I'd like pets to be invulnerable (and untargetable) as long they are passive. Gives ranger control over their survivability with proper micromanagement, but still allows for counterplay as soon the pet does something.

Unless the whole squad is rangers (or mostly rangers) this wouldn’t matter much as pets cannot dodge and most big spikes are avoided by dodging. Additionally, it’s not like spamming untamed with bear pets for their invuln has become a common damage mitigation tactic. Typically, you either dodge the bomb or die to it if it is coordinated well enough. Pets cannot dodge anything and mostly just stand around or run to their death. If the bomb was coordinated so poorly that no one died or was downed even though your squad failed to avoid it or dodge through it then the pet soaking some damage wouldn’t have mattered anyway. What matters more is which side either strips more boons or has a bigger bomb in the absence of avoiding the skills. 
 

obviously if the DR was too high then yeah that could become a problem at some point. However it’s not like necros are just running with a full bar of minions to soak up damage.

Edited October 7, 2022 by tykel.6073

[MonsterTruck.9816]

10 hours ago, PrinceValentine.9320 said:

Just click stow when you are stacked with the commander. 

And the moment I get in combat the pet is back.  The whole issue is using stealth in combat.

 

[Zyreva.1078]

7 hours ago, tykel.6073 said:

obviously if the DR was too high then yeah that could become a problem at some point. However it’s not like necros are just running with a full bar of minions to soak up damage.

Let's not pretend target caps aren't relevant. Rise and Golemancer runes got nerfed for a reason and in general, those caps carry zergs hard and allow them to facetank a lot, especially vs lower numbers. Not something that should be reinforced.

And if the DR wouldn't be high, then it would be useless in zergs because as you said - pets can't dodge or avoid anything so either they can facetank and survive the enemy bomb - which would require them to absorb a lot of dmg, that might have hit someone else otherwise - or they can't, then nothing changes.

Edited October 7, 2022 by UmbraNoctis.1907

[Mell.4873]

16 hours ago, anduriell.6280 said:

Functional and WvW don’t belong ont he same sentence. 
mechanically is impossible to make pets survive a Zerg while being balance in small scale. 
just add the perma stow button as I suggested in another thread (not mine idea thou). you then decide if using pet skills is actually worth the risk. 
 

A good middle ground could be that stow your pet untill you need it, normally I just leave mine dead in a Zerg clash then pull a pet swap later to use its skills.