Scepter

[Kodama.6453]

17 minutes ago, ZolracAtrox.2908 said:

Ah yes, the tipical elementalist victimhood video "only bad when ele..." . Don't worry; for me all that you've mentioned should be nerf; along with catalyst's scepter sinergy.

Funny that he also consistently complains about how underpowered poor little ele has been etc.

Even before the scepter buffs, ele has been really kitten good. Tempest and catalyst are wrecking.

[Jski.6180]

18 minutes ago, Kodama.6453 said:

Funny that he also consistently complains about how underpowered poor little ele has been etc.

Even before the scepter buffs, ele has been really kitten good. Tempest and catalyst are wrecking.

Its ok to hate the ele class but to think its in a good spot just because scpter now fill a real dps roll is kind of silly. The class still an super glass canon missing most major things and simple more dmg not going to fix it. Weaver dose more dmg with scpter then tempest and catalyst (the other tempest and catalyst have more then just dmg giving them an seen leg up over the weaver for scpter use).

Something like dragon tooth tracking is kind of something ele needs to fill that ranged attk mages class. A small aoe grond target was mostly a joke of an effect and even before that out side of LOS tricking (somthing we see on other classes) the old target DT was comply worthless. We may need to see more skills like Dragon tooth where the skill tracks during the delay of the hit. If you can move out of an delayed aoe before it even triggers the effect then the delay become less of an skill game play check and more of an "do you have enofe MS" it is far better to get ppl to dodge with an grond tell then getting ppl to dodge with an more then likely culled animations that could be impossible to see due to infusion OR size of the hero.

Thinking on it a bit skills like Comet should act the same way (all i can think of off hand).

Edited January 2, 2023 by Jski.6180

[Kodama.6453]

4 minutes ago, Jski.6180 said:

Its ok to hate the ele class but to think its in a good spot just because scpter now fill a real dps roll is kind of silly. The class still an super glass canon missing most major things and simple more dmg not going to fix it. Weaver dose more dmg with scpter then tempest and catalyst (the other tempest and catalyst have more then just dmg giving them an seen leg up over the weaver for scpter use).

Ele was already in a really strong spot before scepter got to fill that dps role. Support tempest is a great PvP build. Hammer catalyst is as well. Pretending that ele is in any form weak right now is ridiculous.

[Jski.6180]

1 minute ago, Kodama.6453 said:

Ele was already in a really strong spot before scepter got to fill that dps role. Support tempest is a great PvP build. Hammer catalyst is as well. Pretending that ele is in any form weak right now is ridiculous.

It was only in a strong spot for pve and it was getting nerfed every update for dps. Support tempest was only strong when they nerfed scraper (losing out of the med kit healing that still not nerfed and heals for as much as aura healing with a 1 skills). I still dont get hammer truth be told it seems like it dose less dmg in wvw then it should i find dagger over all better. After the aura nerf for catalyes its very hard to stack needed buffs for hammer and realy all of the non dagger cataylest.

Keep in mind ele was also nerfed at the same time scpter was buffed. Very rarely do you see pure buffs for the ele class in an given update. At best ele has been in an avage place for a very long time and being beat out by every class whom can specialized in an given roll (yet ele was missing much needed effects to hold that avage roll). Ele will always be in a weak ish or naturly weak due to low hp/def and high skill cap.

[solemn.9670]

>ele is weak compared to every other spec, has one fire weaver roamer build and a glass ganker fa build

>Pretty much no one thinks ele is op at this point if they play at any competitive level, excluding fire weaver

>Catalyst is added to the game, scepter gets buffed

>Suddenly ele is op and has always been OP

That's cool where can I get an alternate reality device like the ones you guys are using? What else is different in your reality over there?

Edited January 3, 2023 by solemn.9670
Removed condescending remarks

[ZolracAtrox.2908]

1 hour ago, solemn.9670 said:

>ele is weak compared to every other spec, has one fire weaver roamer build and a glass ganker fa build

>Pretty much no one thinks ele is op at this point if they have two braincells to rub together

>Catalyst is added to the game, scepter gets buffed

>Suddenly ele is op and has always been OP

That's cool where can I get an alternate reality device like the ones you guys are using? What else is different in your reality over there? I wish I was delusional sounds fun

>Ele is top at PvP  in 3 builds (tempest, cata scepter and cata hammer) and with a huge difference.

> Catalyst added, such a good class at PvE; no problem in there. Scepter gets buffed, no problem in there. The problem is Scepter on cata at PvP. No Core ele, no PvE Cata and no Weaver (at the moment; sword Weaver need a huge buff)

> Suddenly ele is Op; yea he is. In PvP. Always has been Op? it depends; he was such a good class at HoT meta (in 3 game modes). Half PoF META he was such a good class at 3 game modes again. Sadly Anet overnerfed him. Yeah he def needed a nerf (mostly PvP), but not as the level that Anet did. I even started legendary light armor 'cause staff Weaver is funny asf (be a ranged glassy mage that deals lots of damage, but can be killed easily).

 

Does ele need a nerf in WvW/PvE? Nope. He also need to be buffed in WvW (both, Tempest and Weaver).

 

 

 

[solemn.9670]

1 minute ago, ZolracAtrox.2908 said:

>Ele is top at PvP  in 3 builds (tempest, cata scepter and cata hammer) and with a huge difference.

> Catalyst added, such a good class at PvE; no problem in there. Scepter gets buffed, no problem in there. The problem is Scepter on cata at PvP. No Core ele, no PvE Cata and no Weaver (at the moment; sword Weaver need a huge buff)

> Suddenly ele is Op; yea he is. In PvP. Always has been Op? it depends; he was such a good class at HoT meta (in 3 game modes). Half PoF META he was such a good class at 3 game modes again. Sadly Anet overnerfed him. Yeah he def needed a nerf (mostly PvP), but not as the level that Anet did. I even started legendary light armor 'cause staff Weaver is funny asf (be a ranged glassy mage that deals lots of damage, but can be killed easily).

 

Does ele need a nerf in WvW/PvE? Nope. He also need to be buffed in WvW (both, Tempest and Weaver).

 

 

 

But you completely skipped over the whole "before catalyst nobody cared". Yeah it's meta in pvp now..for the first time in what 5 years? It's only a problem when ele does it.

[ZolracAtrox.2908]

22 minutes ago, solemn.9670 said:

But you completely skipped over the whole "before catalyst nobody cared". Yeah it's meta in pvp now..for the first time in what 5 years? It's only a problem when ele does it.

Is when I realize that you haven't played enough nor read my comment. 5 years LoL.

HoT > Tempest; Half PoF > Weaver (and then sadly overnerfed; but that's like 2.5 years, not 5; and Weaver still good,  maybe not at core classes nor reaper, scrapper, dragonhunter, etc. level xD); Most EoD > Cata. Cata has been meta even before scepter changes, what are you talking about. Maybe he was not the most broken class (yo Bladesworn, im talking about you) but after some balances, he's in a nice place even before scepter.  I  emphasize: PvP Meta. PvE and WvW Catas are ok (and maybe needs some improvements)

Edited January 3, 2023 by ZolracAtrox.2908

[Edu.6984]

On 1/1/2023 at 5:31 PM, Jski.6180 said:

For wvw no one realy talking about the 11k leaps of faith from gurds hehe. 

 

I took a 9k leap of faith a few days ago on my catalist running about 2.8k armor

Edited January 3, 2023 by Edu.6984

[Jski.6180]

3 hours ago, Edu.6984 said:

 

I took a 9k leap of faith a few days ago on my catalist running about 2.8k armor

That is more of an ele thing then gurd! But ya there are different standers ppl put to classes its ok for a gurd to hit as hard vs mid to high armor classes but if an ele hits an thf lower armor or lower def for 6k all hell brakes lose. The gw2 forms are getting the same anet point of views only the favorite classes are allowed to preform if any thing out side of that favorite classes then ppl get up in arms.

[Arheundel.6451]

On 1/2/2023 at 5:46 PM, Kodama.6453 said:

Ele was already in a really strong spot before scepter got to fill that dps role. Support tempest is a great PvP build. Hammer catalyst is as well. Pretending that ele is in any form weak right now is ridiculous.

Before catalyst,  ele was almost nowhere to be seen, weaver had been nerfed to oblivion with the removal of stability on stance and dmg/sustain nerfs plus the inability to remain on target to do any dmg...there were no ele roamers or dps in wvw. All eles had was a weakish support tempest which got relevance the more nerfs guardian and scrapper were getting. Basically ele was kitten to play for 4 years and many had swapped class...indeed  many of those who swapped have return like roaches

[solemn.9670]

21 hours ago, ZolracAtrox.2908 said:

Is when I realize that you haven't played enough nor read my comment. 5 years LoL.

HoT > Tempest; Half PoF > Weaver (and then sadly overnerfed; but that's like 2.5 years, not 5; and Weaver still good,  maybe not at core classes nor reaper, scrapper, dragonhunter, etc. level xD); Most EoD > Cata. Cata has been meta even before scepter changes, what are you talking about. Maybe he was not the most broken class (yo Bladesworn, im talking about you) but after some balances, he's in a nice place even before scepter.  I  emphasize: PvP Meta. PvE and WvW Catas are ok (and maybe needs some improvements)

I'm aware that cata was meta before scepter changes...do you have any idea what you're talking about? I'm assuming you don't since youve magically come to a conclusion that I never made.

Ele having good specs is not the same as it dominating a meta LOL/ROFL. Are you serious? What timeline of reality are you living in where ele has dominated the meta for years. It's been viable at best and a few players made it look a lot better than it was (although this can still be said about how it is now, even though catalyst is much easier and has a lower skill floor).

To be fair, Ive been a WvW main all this time so I know the roaming beta a lot better than pvps, but at no point in recent memory other than right now do I recall there being teams of 3+ eles solo queueing in because they had became so common. Again, viable /=/ meta, and if you're going to discredit me based on your own ignorance, I suppose I should now discredit you based on yours.

What was your name again anyway?

Edited January 4, 2023 by solemn.9670

[ZolracAtrox.2908]

6 hours ago, solemn.9670 said:

I'm aware that cata was meta before scepter changes...do you have any idea what you're talking about? I'm assuming you don't since youve magically come to a conclusion that I never made.

Ele having good specs is not the same as it dominating a meta LOL/ROFL. Are you serious? What timeline of reality are you living in where ele has dominated the meta for years. It's been viable at best and a few players made it look a lot better than it was (although this can still be said about how it is now, even though catalyst is much easier and has a lower skill floor).

To be fair, Ive been a WvW main all this time so I know the roaming beta a lot better than pvps, but at no point in recent memory other than right now do I recall there being teams of 3+ eles solo queueing in because they had became so common. Again, viable /=/ meta, and if you're going to discredit me based on your own ignorance, I suppose I should now discredit you based on yours.

What was your name again anyway?

What a lack of reading well. These are my last words for you.

> youve magically come to a conclusion that I never made. Your words?  "But you completely skipped over the whole "before catalyst nobody cared". Yeah it's meta in pvp now..for the first time in what 5 years?"

>Ele having good specs is not the same as it dominating a meta. Meanwhile

PvE

HoT Raids LFG 1 Chrono Tank,  1Heal Druid, 1 BS and Tempest DPS;

Half PoF Raids LFG: 1 Alac, HB, 1 BS and Power Weaver.

EoD: Catalyst one of the highest DPS (not a problem for me, I even would give him improvements, I only mention it due to elementalist victimhood.) only below to DeadEye, but DeadEye has no cleave. And untamed. for me Cata should be over untamed, as well as for me, core condi engi should be above cata 'cause is even harder.

PvP

Almost all HoT META: Tempest Bunker; Almost all PoF META: Sword Weaver. Almost all EoD META Catalyst.

WvW (again, not a problem for me, my problem is against PvP Cata ONLY)

All HoT Meta: Staff Ele 

Almost Half PoF Meta: Staff Weaver. Sadly after this Ele became underperforming at WvW almost until EoD whithout any doubt.

EoD Meta:

Support Tempest

I would buff Staff and Hammer damage (only in WvW, not in PvP) to made Weaver and Cata meta as well. 

 

And no dude; in sPvP Ele is not viable; it  is OP (Strong AoE spam; bugged dragon tooth, Blocks, Stun Auras, unblockable spike damage, lots of blind and burning, lots of condi cleanse and autohealing, mobility, stab, blocks, invulnerability, etc.). And no dude, is not bad 'cause ele, it is bad 'cause OPness as well as gn Holo, Untamed, etc are. And PvP one is not "a piano glass cannon class", that's the PvE one; deal with it. 

Edited January 4, 2023 by ZolracAtrox.2908

[Jski.6180]

15 hours ago, ZolracAtrox.2908 said:

What a lack of reading well. These are my last words for you.

> youve magically come to a conclusion that I never made. Your words?  "But you completely skipped over the whole "before catalyst nobody cared". Yeah it's meta in pvp now..for the first time in what 5 years?"

>Ele having good specs is not the same as it dominating a meta. Meanwhile

PvE

HoT Raids LFG 1 Chrono Tank,  1Heal Druid, 1 BS and Tempest DPS;

Half PoF Raids LFG: 1 Alac, HB, 1 BS and Power Weaver.

EoD: Catalyst one of the highest DPS (not a problem for me, I even would give him improvements, I only mention it due to elementalist victimhood.) only below to DeadEye, but DeadEye has no cleave. And untamed. for me Cata should be over untamed, as well as for me, core condi engi should be above cata 'cause is even harder.

PvP

Almost all HoT META: Tempest Bunker; Almost all PoF META: Sword Weaver. Almost all EoD META Catalyst.

WvW (again, not a problem for me, my problem is against PvP Cata ONLY)

All HoT Meta: Staff Ele 

Almost Half PoF Meta: Staff Weaver. Sadly after this Ele became underperforming at WvW almost until EoD whithout any doubt.

EoD Meta:

Support Tempest

I would buff Staff and Hammer damage (only in WvW, not in PvP) to made Weaver and Cata meta as well. 

 

And no dude; in sPvP Ele is not viable; it  is OP (Strong AoE spam; bugged dragon tooth, Blocks, Stun Auras, unblockable spike damage, lots of blind and burning, lots of condi cleanse and autohealing, mobility, stab, blocks, invulnerability, etc.). And no dude, is not bad 'cause ele, it is bad 'cause OPness as well as gn Holo, Untamed, etc are. And PvP one is not "a piano glass cannon class", that's the PvE one; deal with it. 

You just sound like you dislike the fact catalyes can make there skills unblockable for a time more then any thing else. As every thing your saying has been something ele been doing from the start. Unblockable is the only new thing and realy a lot of other classes have had this for some time. Maybe you dislike unblockables over all? 

[ScottBroChill.3254]

If ele is so OP we will know when everyone makes the switch from guard/necro/engi. But until then I'll have to assume the majority of players can't play ele to these "OP" standards so in reality it isn't OP, only in theory. It's unreachable potential outside the best .02% of the games population. Compare that to Firebrand and Mech who are OP without effort.

[Kodama.6453]

6 hours ago, ScottBroChill.3254 said:

If ele is so OP we will know when everyone makes the switch from guard/necro/engi. But until then I'll have to assume the majority of players can't play ele to these "OP" standards so in reality it isn't OP, only in theory. It's unreachable potential outside the best .02% of the games population. Compare that to Firebrand and Mech who are OP without effort.

Mech..... op in PvP?

Please tell me you are joking. That spec is just bad in competitive.

[ScottBroChill.3254]

13 hours ago, Kodama.6453 said:

Mech..... op in PvP?

Please tell me you are joking. That spec is just bad in competitive.

I never specified game mode 😏

[Kodama.6453]

1 hour ago, ScottBroChill.3254 said:

I never specified game mode 😏

This thread is specifically talking about ele overperforming in PvP/WvW tho. I don't think anyone thinks that scepter overperforms in PvE. So bringing up PvE balance of mechanist is kinda pointless in this discussion here.

[Jski.6180]

58 minutes ago, Kodama.6453 said:

This thread is specifically talking about ele overperforming in PvP/WvW tho. I don't think anyone thinks that scepter overperforms in PvE. So bringing up PvE balance of mechanist is kinda pointless in this discussion here.

This thread was to talk about scepter update but was hijacked by ppl complaining about it in spvp and just spvp.

[Kodama.6453]

1 hour ago, Jski.6180 said:

This thread was to talk about scepter update but was hijacked by ppl complaining about it in spvp and just spvp.

It's not hijacking. People discussed the state of the scepter update by pointing out that the buffs overshot for PvP. Talking about the update being too strong in PvP is still on topic about the scepter update.

And they made the statement that calling scepter OP (which was mentioned in the PvP context) makes no sense since "mech is so effortlessly OP". Bringing up mecha in a threat unrelated to it was hijacking it, calling out scepter to be op in PvP is not.

[ScottBroChill.3254]

On 1/7/2023 at 12:35 PM, Kodama.6453 said:

It's not hijacking. People discussed the state of the scepter update by pointing out that the buffs overshot for PvP. Talking about the update being too strong in PvP is still on topic about the scepter update.

And they made the statement that calling scepter OP (which was mentioned in the PvP context) makes no sense since "mech is so effortlessly OP". Bringing up mecha in a threat unrelated to it was hijacking it, calling out scepter to be op in PvP is not.

Tbf it's more about the comparison of the nature of the OP'ness. Mech and Firebrand basically play themeselves in their respective game modes and everyone and their mothers plays them. How many people are playing this so obviously OP ele? just be cool and let scepter be good for a second

Edited January 9, 2023 by ScottBroChill.3254

[ZolracAtrox.2908]

15 hours ago, ScottBroChill.3254 said:

Tbf it's more about the comparison of the nature of the OP'ness. Mech and Firebrand basically play themeselves in their respective game modes and everyone and their mothers plays them. How many people are playing this so obviously OP ele? just be cool and let scepter be good for a second

Not gonna talk about FB and Mech 'cause they are weak at sPvP

Let scepter be good forever. But nerf catalyst spec; remove it's blocks and auras. (sPvP)

If we keep the "let a class be op for a second" then we never gonna have a healthy meta, 'cause always there will be a OP class breaking the game.

Edited January 9, 2023 by ZolracAtrox.2908

[The Raven.1320]

45 minutes ago, ZolracAtrox.2908 said:

If we keep the "let a class be op for a second" then we never gonna have a healthy meta, 'cause always there will be a OP class breaking the game.

Healthy Meta

SPvP

 

Pick one. 

[ZolracAtrox.2908]

8 hours ago, The Raven.1320 said:

Healthy Meta

SPvP

 

Pick one. 

'Cause they still letting OP classes be OP by months. Even if the OPness source is a bug (like Bladesworn time ago).

That's why Healthy and Meta is an Oxymoron in this game.

Edited January 10, 2023 by ZolracAtrox.2908

[Jski.6180]

I think its better to look at by class what you see in spvp in the mid ranges of player skill is a far better way to work out what unbalanced or not. BUT spvp is the smallest part of gw2 dont let that game type alone control the pvp balancing. WvW balancing is way more important and scpter even hammer in wvw are the highest risk weapons and often do less dps then say an staff or even an dagger/sword for the ele class.