Math to back up why Maguuma should go it alone next relink.

[ArchonWing.9480]

Current meta is karma train, or having several 15-25 person "fight" guilds take turns wiping instead of working together. And then finally calling the pugs/scouts when they realize they need them, but the pugs/scouts all kittened off due to the toxic behavior and don't want to be convenient on demand fodder.

I mean, I don't get why people don't just swallow their pride and stop bringing like dueling builds to a zerg fight or pve builds to WvW. Certainly nothing takes precedence over beating the enemy you all hate so much? Even just once? What would be more fun than that? But you can't, because ego.

Just everyone get a useful group build and take back your keep or something to prove a point that you aren't just zombies being fed to the machine and log off so you can sleep in peace instead of getting spawn camped in your nightmares too.
 

Because as we speak, not even the forum KDR is very good. Then again why  am I speaking to people who still get pulled off walls by the minute?

 I remember back many years ago in Street Fighter II: Whatever edition as a kid and the other kids would just show off how many fancy moves they could pull. And all I did was just keep throwing them or leg sweeping after they land. Obviously they were pretty salty about me having no skill and being cheap, but I always asked them why they still kept falling for the incredibly obvious thing over and over again. A lot of people complaining are basically that, minus the skill, of course.

It doesn't matter how many essays people write about how I'm unskilled, after all. I freely admit to being garbage. In fact I could post "gregreherherhjnearohnerhoerhner" and nothing would change, besides the same salty people being salty and getting bagged.

Edited January 12, 2023 by ArchonWing.9480

[Xenesis.6389]

43 minutes ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

My current guild jokes me when I drive and say breaking rule #1, which is never leave from the front gate. Developed that when people used to use the tactic on ABL to leave a blocking force at spawn to try and force attackers off the map.

Good rule, I never leave through a gate unless I'm absolutely sure it's clear as in I peeked over while on my mount, but most times I'll take myself up to the wall to leave an objective. Even going to north camp I tend to ride off to the side not through the gate.

[Xenesis.6389]

edit: double post forums acting wonky...

Edited January 12, 2023 by Xenesis.6389

[ArchonWing.9480]

18 minutes ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

Good rule, I never leave through a gate unless I'm absolutely sure it's clear as in I peeked over while on my mount, but most times I'll take myself up to the wall to leave an objective. Even going to north camp I tend to ride off to the side not through the gate.

Well Grimm is like made of paper so they need to use their brain a bit, while they could just be like me and equip like 2 blinks and cele gear and blame my team for not coming out with me. Anet just sure loves that braindead meta, which I follow.

But yes walls usually have a better approach. Portals have a blind spot where enemies can actually position against the portal with their back facing it and hit you as you come out. So it's almost never a good idea except in funny occasions where the enemy punts you back into the Keep (thanks?)

It is always nice to have some tanky class on a mount play minesweeper to clear the entrance though.

Edited January 12, 2023 by ArchonWing.9480

[Chaba.5410]

25 minutes ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

why  am I speaking to people who still get pulled off walls by the minute?

Or move in a predictable way to a tower/keep portal to get CC'd and bombed and die right there instead of side-stepping the bomb?

Some people never learn...

Edited January 12, 2023 by Chaba.5410

[ArchonWing.9480]

7 minutes ago, Chaba.5410 said:

Or move in a predictable way to a tower/keep portal to get CC'd and bombed and die right there instead of side-stepping the bomb?

Some people never learn...

The best are the people with a ranged weapon just standing there shooting even as the enemy moves on top  of them and do what you described. I mean, why?

My problem with all of the above is not the fact they died. Everyone dies. Everyone makes mistakes. Some people learn slow. I get that.

But it's more that what were they trying to accomplish? Even in the optimal scenario, what could they do even if they landed their damage and did not get mowed down? There would be no way to finish the enemy.

I feel like if you did something risky and it had a chance to succeed, then it might be fine. It's when people do something that is bound to fail even in the best of situation that's the problem. That's no longer a risk. That's just dumb.

The former will learn eventually. The later well.... posts silly things on the forums.

Edited January 12, 2023 by ArchonWing.9480

[Phelan.2014]

24 minutes ago, exeggcuter.8394 said:

I guess I should point out the obvious: skill of course does matter. A lot! But when the advantage in numbers gets to a certain point, it stop mattering. How many more players need to move to mag before the mag players admit they have an advantage? Do twice as many people need to move to that server? Ten times as many? A Thousand? Surely there IS a point where you can't deny that's the only reason.

 

The problem with your math is that you chose poor data points. I'm assuming you are not currently matched against Maguuma, otherwise it would be obvious. Warscore is inflated because no one wants to contest Maguuma.

 

-Maguuma has been steadily breaking the morale of the other T1 servers for some time now.

 

-It has finally come to a head and t1 WvW is a ghost town most of the time.

 

-Maguuma opened because there are less fights, so Maguuma veterans aren't playing as much.

 

-Since opening, we've had a stronger OCX/SEA presence, and now the guilds who do PvD  in off hours have been chased off.

 

-Uncle OBS holding it down NA early morning through late NA morning.

 

So long story short, Maguuma does have numerical superiority. But the reason is that the other servers aren't playing, not that we somehow manage to cram more people into a map than are allowed. That's not a Maguuma problem, and it's a problem that feeds itself.

 

If the other servers continue to boycott, Maguuma will have less play hours and will open again. This genius plan to #boycottmaguuma backfired and made Maguuma stronger, while poaching players from the very servers who actually need them.

[moutzaheadin.4029]

6 minutes ago, Phelan.2014 said:

 

The problem with your math is that you chose poor data points. I'm assuming you are not currently matched against Maguuma, otherwise it would be obvious. Warscore is inflated because no one wants to contest Maguuma.

 

-Maguuma has been steadily breaking the morale of the other T1 servers for some time now.

 

-It has finally come to a head and t1 WvW is a ghost town most of the time.

 

-Maguuma opened because there are less fights, so Maguuma veterans aren't playing as much.

 

-Since opening, we've had a stronger OCX/SEA presence, and now the guilds who do PvD  in off hours have been chased off.

 

-Uncle OBS holding it down NA early morning through late NA morning.

 

So long story short, Maguuma does have numerical superiority. But the reason is that the other servers aren't playing, not that we somehow manage to cram more people into a map than are allowed. That's not a Maguuma problem, and it's a problem that feeds itself.

 

If the other servers continue to boycott, Maguuma will have less play hours and will open again. This genius plan to #boycottmaguuma backfired and made Maguuma stronger, while poaching players from the very servers who actually need them.

This is a solid take and one that should echo through here so everyone can understand.

 

has nothing to do with that shoutout. But thank you anyways. 🫡

 

the take on what’s happening is spot on. We have had more than a few Q’s during sea time during the week. Which in the past was unheard of on MAG. Clearly your into something.

 

~obs

[moutzaheadin.4029]

1 hour ago, Chaba.5410 said:

Sure, but no one really believes you would give a sincere perspective in good faith on the subject because it always sounds like ironic trolling.

 

I’m trying to be blunt and honest, but this topic is getting old. It’s not as easy as it looks to reply to the same thing over and over in different ways till people actually grasp the reality of what, why and how they are losing.

~obs

Edited January 12, 2023 by moutzaheadin.4029

[Nikola.3841]

8 hours ago, Kirevey.5079 said:

There is also a lot of talk about how Mag pugs are better than other server pugs, but like any other server, is a mix of everything. The only skill that I would say Mag is better at is playing of each other. How many times have I inted into a fight and then the cloud would push with me, even if we all die lmao. How many times I'm about to go down and a random fellow pug would cover me with some reflects/resistance/stab, etc., just to deny the kill to the other server, because if we go down, the other server gets points, and we don't want to feed. 

 

I play mostly off hours, and the amount of people I see for other servers is most of the time more than us, but they are all just waiting while defending a tower, or for the time zone commander/guild that would let them become a blob and just rush cap everything they can. Ppl say we rush small groups with numbers, but forget to say they do the same when they can. And is not a thing of 'Mag did it first, so we do it to them', its been happening in the game for years. 

 

 

 

I call BS on most of it...just barely gathered 10 people in BG to attack our home tower in GBL, mag responded with 40...did you guys waited for 4:1 odds just to be sure, or you have zerg handy at all times? Mind you, those 10 BG were all that is online atm, cause noone really care about wvw this week. If by "off hours" you mean EU times, BG rarely has 20 people, so how it is possible that " I see for other servers is most of the time more than us"?
 

Instead of "get better, use other routes, take camps...whatever", we all used more logical approach and went to PVE

Enjoy

Edited January 12, 2023 by Nikola.3841

[exeggcuter.8394]

Can we all just take a moment to appreciate obs just noted that MAG has more SEA and other off hours "which is unheard of on MAG"? That is further evidence that mag has more people than previously.

1 hour ago, moutzaheadin.4029 said:

the take on what’s happening is spot on. We have had more than a few Q’s during sea time during the week. Which in the past was unheard of on MAG. Clearly your into something.

Why do you bother on arguing against this, when you just admitted it's true? Or it's satire. I can never quite tell with this person.

[Chaba.5410]

1 hour ago, Nikola.3841 said:

 

I call BS on most of it...just barely gathered 10 people in BG to attack our home tower in GBL, mag responded with 40...did you guys waited for 4:1 odds just to be sure, or you have zerg handy at all times? Mind you, those 10 BG were all that is online atm, cause noone really care about wvw this week. If by "off hours" you mean EU times, BG rarely has 20 people, so how it is possible that " I see for other servers is most of the time more than us"?
 

Instead of "get better, use other routes, take camps...whatever", we all used more logical approach and went to PVE

Enjoy

The best part about your post is that it's BG and BG deserves it.  Most stacked server in the history of the game and all the rest of us heard during that time was about how we needed to get better and improve our server communities.

Edited January 12, 2023 by Chaba.5410

[Phelan.2014]

1 hour ago, Nikola.3841 said:

 

I call BS on most of it...just barely gathered 10 people in BG to attack our home tower in GBL, mag responded with 40...did you guys waited for 4:1 odds just to be sure, or you have zerg handy at all times? Mind you, those 10 BG were all that is online atm, cause noone really care about wvw this week. If by "off hours" you mean EU times, BG rarely has 20 people, so how it is possible that " I see for other servers is most of the time more than us"?
 

Instead of "get better, use other routes, take camps...whatever", we all used more logical approach and went to PVE

Enjoy

 

This is what happens when both of the other servers aren't playing.

 

We probably had about 25-30 (I was there when you came) hungry people spread across the four maps, you showed up and hit GBL SET, you got scouted and everyone jumped on it because there aren't many fights elsewhere.

 

If the rest of your server were playing, pushing other towers on other maps, you wouldn't have seen such a disproportionate response.

 

There's very little in the way of organization to our response; no commander dragged a zerg to that tower to fight you. It's just a bunch of randos looking for action with the exception of WaR who scouted you.

 

Props for actually trying though. I'm sorry the rest of your server(s) left you twisting in the wind.

[Phelan.2014]

54 minutes ago, exeggcuter.8394 said:

Can we all just take a moment to appreciate obs just noted that MAG has more SEA and other off hours "which is unheard of on MAG"? That is further evidence that mag has more people than previously.

Why do you bother on arguing against this, when you just admitted it's true? Or it's satire. I can never quite tell with this person.

 

We do now. This is a new phenomenon that started about two weeks ago, coincidentally around the time Maguuma opened. All spring, summer, and fall it was just me and 5-10 other people trying to slow down the 50+ OCX/SEA blobs after NA midnight.

 

And why did Maguuma open? Because the t1 servers are refusing to play, which leads to less play time on Maguuma.

 

You guys did this to yourself. 2am CST to noon CST used to be the Maguuma safety zone. Not anymore though.

[neven.3785]

Mag opened up before the mass boycott of the last two weeks happened, and wasn't open for long.  Prior to this, Maguuma mostly stuck to EBG, and wouldn't leave it due to the queue regardless of the call out.  Only in NA prime when there is overflow players who aren't currently in EBG, or when the queue goes away would some people respond to call outs.  Most activity outside of EBG is either CTH running a few days a week in NA prime, or Guilds from the link.  Home BL has a small guild (WAR) who were purchased by the magswag guild  (the ebg folks) to maintain PPT so the server stays in tier 1, however they cant hold their own without help and inflate call outs quite a bit due to this.

With this boycott happening to make it look like there's a population imbalance vs what it actually is, a mismatched linking, the EBG folks have nothing to do and are flooding the BLs trying to cloud around every spawn camps main gate.   Its a waste of time running a group of 20-30 in proper wvw with this ghost town, so while this stupidity ensues our raid times have become much shorter or spent in EOTM/PVEland so the guild atleast does something together.  As a Maguuma player since the head start days, i can't wait for them to turn on the alliance beta for good and let the balancing algorithms do their work. The Maguuma identity has long ago died,  from those old days there's only a handful of names recognized in the cloud, but the majority of the voices claiming to be of Maguuma are just transfers trying too hard.

As for the alliances, I'd be ecstatic if they tightened player limits further to 250 per alliance.  It isn't hard to kick an inactive player and leave them a message that they are welcome back when they return.  The more pieces the better for balancing.

Edited January 12, 2023 by neven.3785

[ViperWire.4261]

MATHFACTS

[exeggcuter.8394]

20 minutes ago, Phelan.2014 said:

You guys did this to yourself.

Correct. I moved to maguuma. I spent real world money to make a problem I don't like worse.

 

:þ

 

You imply this is some kind of victim / criminal type situation with this phrasing. You are also victim blaming by that same logic. I was busy playing Factorio like crazy when this happened. How the heck is that anyone's fault but the people who moved?

[exeggcuter.8394]

@neven.3785 Thank you for being a voice of reason here. Don't really have much to add to what you said, but it's nice to see people who have wisdom.

[Phelan.2014]

1 hour ago, exeggcuter.8394 said:

Correct. I moved to maguuma. I spent real world money to make a problem I don't like worse.

 

:þ

 

You imply this is some kind of victim / criminal type situation with this phrasing. You are also victim blaming by that same logic. I was busy playing Factorio like crazy when this happened. How the heck is that anyone's fault but the people who moved?

 

It's the fault of the people who choose not to play. When people don't come to fight, Maguuma doesn't play as much. When Maguuma didn't play as much, it opened and more people joined, making Maguuma stronger.

[Chaba.5410]

2 minutes ago, Phelan.2014 said:

 

It's the fault of the people who choose not to play. When people don't come to fight, Maguuma doesn't play as much. When Maguuma didn't play as much, it opened and more people joined, making Maguuma stronger.

Or it was a plot by those who chose not to play to get Mag to open so they could transfer there.  Ooooo spoooky....

[exeggcuter.8394]

12 minutes ago, Phelan.2014 said:

It's the fault

Again, your word choice is amazing. I'm just soaking it in. Don't mind me lol.

[Xenesis.6389]

4 hours ago, Nikola.3841 said:

I call BS on most of it...just barely gathered 10 people in BG to attack our home tower in GBL, mag responded with 40...did you guys waited for 4:1 odds just to be sure, or you have zerg handy at all times? Mind you, those 10 BG were all that is online atm, cause noone really care about wvw this week. If by "off hours" you mean EU times, BG rarely has 20 people, so how it is possible that " I see for other servers is most of the time more than us"?
 

Instead of "get better, use other routes, take camps...whatever", we all used more logical approach and went to PVE

Enjoy

Was that 40 organized from one guild or 40 randoms?

Because the way it works is, when you make a scout call, any numbers of randoms can respond, anyone who's free runs for that fight, especially for mag players, double especially if you're not keeping them busy on other maps, and guess what, it works this way on every other server, even BG has done this. Only difference is mag probably doesn't also ask 20 questions on who's there, what's there, what they doing, what color they are, what guild they are, what siege is there, blah blah blah.

[Chaba.5410]

5 minutes ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

Only difference is mag probably doesn't also ask 20 questions on who's there, what's there, what they doing, what color they are, what guild they are, what siege is there, blah blah blah.

Probably because they don't care about 40 showing up for 5 guys or their scouts are better at providing relevant information (basic who, what, where info) instead of just pinging a POI.

[exeggcuter.8394]

 

Can any pro-mander please provide some advice to a newbie like me? I've read most of the posts on this thread, and some of them suggest I git gud. I want to git gud. I already do my best while scouting, know most of the cheese siege spots, and have builds that can kill almost anything, 1v1 at least. I want to absorb as much knowledge from seasoned veterans such as your good selves on these forums. That way I can ponder and apply it next time I'm outnumbered 70 to 1.

[Sleepwalker.1398]

1 hour ago, exeggcuter.8394 said:

 

Can any pro-mander please provide some advice to a newbie like me? I've read most of the posts on this thread, and some of them suggest I git gud. I want to git gud. I already do my best while scouting, know most of the cheese siege spots, and have builds that can kill almost anything, 1v1 at least. I want to absorb as much knowledge from seasoned veterans such as your good selves on these forums. That way I can ponder and apply it next time I'm outnumbered 70 to 1.

Just play solo a double rifle DE and be aware of your surroundings, specially those pesky pew pew 1 shot rangers.