Why couldn't SoO give off-hand Axe for Thief too?

[Crey.5263]

(Full disclosure, i'm not a thief player, but I like things to make sense.  So if i'm missing something about the game play, I won't take offense if you correct me....)  With Guardian receiving MH + OH pistol, Rangers getting MH + OH mace, and Necromancers getting MH +OH Sword...Why don't thieves also get the OH Axe in addition to their MH?

I understand it would likely require some development of dual skills, but right now this class only has two options for OH weapon and this could introduce a lot of versatility and it seems like the perfect expansion to do it.  To my knowledge, thief doesn't have a HUGE weapon pool it's not like they're going to run out of options before the warrior does...

[Doggie.3184]

You already know the reason, they just actually don't want to design more dual attacks~ they've actively avoided doing so for 3 Elite Specs. Specter got our first new 1hander but it's a main-hand and they basically didn't give us a 2nd dual attack with Pistol cuz they won't fix it's clunkyness. People also wanted a Focus to go with it so we could dual two magic weapons. The work ethic/passion just isn't strong enough here.

Guardian I gaurantee will not only get MH+OH Pistol but it'll likely be god tier compared to our Dual Pistols with outlandish amounts of AoE including the Ricocheting bullets that were stolen from us and already given to Necromancer. While we sadly don't even get a new Dual Weapon set as the Dual Wielding class nor ever receive Pistol Buffs or get "Deadly Aim" fixed; (which is either a highly bugged trait, a design accident or just a massively bad idea) as it's been broken for like 8 years, and the person who made it probably isn't even an employee anymore. Someone needs to finally doublecheck his work or prepare an in depth design philosophy around it's current design since they never did that back then, they just gutted Pistols in silence.

[Tails.9372]

Imagine making a class where dual wielding is an actual class mechanic but not giving them a matching main and offhand set.

That being said I really hope that the Axe is going to be a mid ranged power weapon as a good power mid range option is along with a pure condi MH close range option, which wouldn't really fit here, (and some OH options) the main thing the class is currently still missing.

[The Boz.2038]

Dual attacks. 
Consider: Everyone gets at least 5 skills. You get a main and off-hand as guardian? 5 skills. You get a mainhand as elementalist? 22 skills (remember Weaver). Thief? 6 skills (even though it is five, yes, ANet still for some inexplicable reason makes the single-mainhand-no-offhand skill its own skill, separate from the rest).

An off-hand axe would increase the skills added to the class to something like 12.

TBH I hoped for mace, for mugging people in dark alleys with a sap, but eh.

Edited June 29, 2023 by The Boz.2038

[TheThief.8475]

Because they designed the dual wield as a class mechanic and then decided that we can't have any new dual wield skill ever.

Edited June 29, 2023 by TheThief.8475
Typo

[senftube.6081]

I want offhand sword

[Crey.5263]

 

On 6/29/2023 at 8:16 AM, The Boz.2038 said:

Dual attacks. 
Consider: Everyone gets at least 5 skills. You get a main and off-hand as guardian? 5 skills. You get a mainhand as elementalist? 22 skills (remember Weaver). Thief? 6 skills (even though it is five, yes, ANet still for some inexplicable reason makes the single-mainhand-no-offhand skill its own skill, separate from the rest).

An off-hand axe would increase the skills added to the class to something like 12.

TBH I hoped for mace, for mugging people in dark alleys with a sap, but eh.

I think the moment they gave Elementalist a 2H weapon (that's 20 new skills for them) or when they inexplicably gave the the warrior MH +OH dagger at the same time (every other spec only got one weapon, and spellbreaker still would have thematically worked if it had been either) any arguments of  "giving the classes equal amounts of new skills" went out the door.

On 6/29/2023 at 10:42 AM, senftube.6081 said:

I want offhand sword

I like Axe for thief because gw1 axe was about critting, but off hand sword would have been nice too.

[LyraOrpheo.8450]

You're asking for a Warrior or a Ranger if you want to dual wield axes... that's extremely not very thief like

[TheThief.8475]

27 minutes ago, LyraOrpheo.8450 said:

You're asking for a Warrior or a Ranger if you want to dual wield axes... that's extremely not very thief like

well I'd prefer sword, but between no off-hand and axe off-hand i'll take the axe off-hand lol

[Doggie.3184]

2 hours ago, LyraOrpheo.8450 said:

You're asking for a Warrior or a Ranger if you want to dual wield axes... that's extremely not very thief like

People say this all the time but Thief is the Assassin/Ninja class, improvise in combat, and do not care about honor or fairness, they just get the job done and use whatever they find along the way. There actually isn't a weapon that isn't Thief-like. We already Steal and use Axes from Warriors (which does a ton of damage), as well as Scepters, Maces, Cannons, Staves, etc. Many Ninja weapons were farm tools or evolved from them so an Axe wouldn't be unusual by those standards either.

GW1 Assassins had their skill that made them a Master of any weapon they picked up and do increased crit with them but for some reason that died out when transitioning to GW2. Then there's Ninja weapons that would qualify as Axes in GW2 they could add more of like Kama/Scythes and Kusarigama. It would actually be cool if they gave us (AoE) attacks that swing the Axe by a Chain. Still very much Thief/Assassin/Ninja themed if they do it right.

We need those Weapon Master roots back though, we're ambidexterous and should be able to learn how to use an Axe in both hands after picking one up. Same with Sword though too, that should have happened on release 10+ years ago. Save that for the next Xpan I guess.

[TheThief.8475]

15 hours ago, Doggie.3184 said:

We need those Weapon Master roots back though, we're ambidexterous and should be able to learn how to use an Axe in both hands after picking one up. Same with Sword though too, that should have happened on release 10+ years ago. Save that for the next Xpan I guess.

Don't delude me pls. They are giving us axe because they want to butcher Thief, our time has come, gw2 will never have the assassin fantasy.

DoomGa

Despairge

☹️

[Terian.8359]

How do you think, axe skills will be melee or ranged?

[Tails.9372]

3 hours ago, Terian.8359 said:

How do you think, axe skills will be melee or ranged?

Well if their "we want to fill the missing roles" is anything to go by then it would be a toss up between power mid range and condi close range as these are the only two options left. Personally I find the former more fitting for axe and for the later one there would still be mace.

[Felices Bladewing.3914]

2 hours ago, Tails.9372 said:

Well if their "we want to fill the missing roles" is anything to go by then it would be a toss up between power mid range and condi close range as these are the only two options left. Personally I find the former more fitting for axe and for the later one there would still be mace.

yeah tomahawk style would be cool, i like that idea

[TheThief.8475]

3 hours ago, Tails.9372 said:

Well if their "we want to fill the missing roles" is anything to go by then it would be a toss up between power mid range and condi close range as these are the only two options left. Personally I find the former more fitting for axe and for the later one there would still be mace.

Condi close range already exists (d/d daredevil)

I'd rather take a build that is interesting and fun to play instead of a build created to fill a checklist.

[Tails.9372]

22 minutes ago, TheThief.8475 said:

Condi close range already exists (d/d daredevil)

That's just a condi build using a hybrid MH close range weapon in the same vein how P/D is also condi build using a hybrid MH mid range weapon while the actual condi MH mid range weapon is scepter.

Edited July 6, 2023 by Tails.9372

[TheThief.8475]

2 hours ago, Tails.9372 said:

That's just a condi build using a hybrid MH close range weapon in the same vein how P/D is also condi build using a hybrid MH mid range weapon while the actual condi MH mid range weapon is scepter.

The Condi melee role is already filled. You didn't talk about weapons but roles. Not that weapons being hybrid impact the build being Condi or Power anyways

6 hours ago, Tails.9372 said:

Well if their "we want to fill the missing roles" is anything to go by then it would be a toss up between power mid range and condi close range as these are the only two options left. Personally I find the former more fitting for axe and for the later one there would still be mace.

 

[draxynnic.3719]

Cynical answer to the OP: Because making an offhand would mean having to make four additional dual skills (pistol, dagger, sword, scepter) while making a mainhand only requires dual skills with pistol and dagger.

Of course, that problem is going to compound the more MH weapons get added.

Being less cynical, though, the thought did strike me that they might specifically be looking to solve the 'scepter is the only weapon that really works with specter' problem. A specter-themed magic axe that inflicts torment in a similar way to mirage axe would probably go a long way toward making specter more fun to play.

[Felices Bladewing.3914]

54 minutes ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

A specter-themed magic axe that inflicts torment in a similar way to mirage axe would probably go a long way toward making specter more fun to play.

oh please no. specter is already the least „thief-ish“ elite spec. i really hope the is no focus around that besides fixing and tuning whats already there.

If a new weapon get introduced i rather have a „new“ playstyle instead of a better version of x or y

[draxynnic.3719]

22 hours ago, Felices Bladewing.3914 said:

oh please no. specter is already the least „thief-ish“ elite spec. i really hope the is no focus around that besides fixing and tuning whats already there.

If a new weapon get introduced i rather have a „new“ playstyle instead of a better version of x or y

I'd disagree on the basis that specter being able to switch to another weapon rather than being locked to scepter might help it to feel a bit more like thief to begin with. It would also be a new playstyle for thief in general, all that theory really requires is that it dishes out some torment.

[ArcanistSeven.8720]

my doomer viewe is: nobody on the balance team plays thief and doesnt know what to do with it so they wont give themselves more work by giving it offhand

my copium view: im hoping they change it and make axe a main and off hand weapon or even switch it for offhand sword

[Doggie.3184]

44 minutes ago, ArcanistSeven.8720 said:

my doomer viewe is: nobody on the balance team plays thief and doesnt know what to do with it so they wont give themselves more work by giving it offhand

my copium view: im hoping they change it and make axe a main and off hand weapon or even switch it for offhand sword

They really should just hire someone already. A Thief specialist.

[SoftPup.3048]

I tried applying for the job but I mentioned bringing back Ricochet and they immediately had security escort me out of the building.

[DeceiverX.8361]

7 hours ago, Doggie.3184 said:

They really should just hire someone already. A Thief specialist.

They did.  DoubleTap is a DE main.

[Felices Bladewing.3914]

7 hours ago, Doggie.3184 said:

They really should just hire someone already. A Thief specialist.

every class needs someone in the balance team who is actually familiar with that profession to a specific depth, in the best case also within multiple game modes.

And those guys needs to be visible at the forums and communicate openly, or at least their ideas needs to be openly discussed by someone from the balance team like roy cmc or even grouch so that we know our concerns are taken in by someone who can rely on our issues