Should we have Tattoos separate from Armor

[jason.1083]

So, we have Norn that can get some from character creation, and we have a few armor skins that include them. But really wouldn't it be great if Tattoos could be their own separate thing and have their own skins in the game? 

There's so many things in the game that can be made into tattoos as well, if you play Asura you could have a tattoo of the college you're part of. Same with Norns and their Spirits or Charr and their Legions, or profession related tattoos. Just some simple examples ofc, we could also have just generic tattoos like the ones the current armors provide, and ofc since we have guild armor, imagine a guild tattoo... . I think it's both a good way to improve fashion whilst also be a good moneymaker for Anet(Trying to think from their side of the spectrum), because they could sell tattoos in bundles on the gemstore and maybe add some as rare rewards from metas or achievements. 

I imagine we'd have 1-2 slots(maybe 1 for upper body and one for lower body tattoos to avoid overlaps) that would just have a default "clear skin" that could be changed into any of the obtainable tattoos in the game. 

I know people might come up with reasons why this could be a horrible idea, but it's just a suggestion. 

Edited July 28, 2023 by jason.1083

[Danikat.8537]

I'd like the option.

Elder Scrolls Online does this and I think all my characters have some type of body marking (although I'd argue that the khajiit and argonians don't really count since it's their fur/scale pattern). I have one character where getting a tattoo that would be perfect for her is what convinced me to finally make the character. I don't change them often, mainly for my own immersion (it's weird for tattoos to keep changing) but I like being able to pick one for each character.

My main GW2 character is human and one version of a character I use in most western RPGs and she usually has a tattoo if the option is available but of course doesn't in this game. The actual design is different in each game (partially because the options are different, partially because it relates to her backstory and that changes too) and I'm not sure what I'd want for GW2 but I'm sure I could find something that fits.

[Omega.6801]

I'd rather have resources be spent on something else.

[walkingstick.7319]

Similarly, I'd love to see freckles as an option in chargen, like Norn tattoos and Asura skin patterns.

[jason.1083]

8 minutes ago, walkingstick.7319 said:

Similarly, I'd love to see freckles as an option in chargen, like Norn tattoos and Asura skin patterns.

Yeah, it would be nice to have more character customization as well, it helps with immersion and I think that when you can create a character exactly the way you want to you'd be discouraged from just ending up wearing a full plate tin can covering everything or stack 50 infusions and becoming a supernova with legs. I specifically don't do either of these because, well, I like my characters. 

[Mic.1897]

Can't wait to have over the top glowing tattoos with wings 

[jason.1083]

1 hour ago, Mic.1897 said:

Can't wait to have over the top glowing tattoos with wings 

If they would actually do that I hope they would be subtle at least, kind of like sylvari glow in the night. 

[starlinvf.1358]

On 7/29/2023 at 7:12 AM, Mic.1897 said:

Can't wait to have over the top glowing tattoos with wings 

That fire angels when you auto attack, and summons a god when you use Skill 5.

[Astralporing.1957]

On 7/28/2023 at 12:11 PM, jason.1083 said:

So, we have Norn that can get some from character creation, and we have a few armor skins that include them. But really wouldn't it be great if Tattoos could be their own separate thing and have their own skins in the game?

Next expansion: tattoo gear added to the game. Stats from armor split off to tattoo gear. Legendary gear owners will get partial progress towards corresponding tattoo gear.

...no, thanks.

That saying, i wouldn't be opposed to expanding character creation options and adding more stuff there (including tattoos for non-norn and more tattoo options).

[jason.1083]

4 hours ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

Next expansion: tattoo gear added to the game. Stats from armor split off to tattoo gear. Legendary gear owners will get partial progress towards corresponding tattoo gear.

...no, thanks.

That saying, i wouldn't be opposed to expanding character creation options and adding more stuff there (including tattoos for non-norn and more tattoo options).

Oh come on, drop that already, I'm talking about a cosmetic option purchased via the gemstore, not a gear addition.

Besides it wouldn't make sense to force a cosmetic on you just for a stat upgrade. Especially a tattoo... 

Character creation doesn't add that freedom wardrobe does where you can have hundreds of choices, character creation can't get too complex with this kind of selections. 

Edited August 1, 2023 by jason.1083

[Astralporing.1957]

2 hours ago, jason.1083 said:

Oh come on, drop that already, I'm talking about a cosmetic option purchased via the gemstore, not a gear addition.

Besides it wouldn't make sense to force a cosmetic on you just for a stat upgrade. Especially a tattoo... 

Character creation doesn't add that freedom wardrobe does where you can have hundreds of choices, character creation can't get too complex with this kind of selections. 

You are asking about adding new gear slots. You might want them to be cosmetic only, but i really doubt they'd stay that way.

[jason.1083]

31 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

You are asking about adding new gear slots. You might want them to be cosmetic only, but i really doubt they'd stay that way.

You really have no faith on the devs do you? 

Edited August 1, 2023 by jason.1083

[Astralporing.1957]

8 minutes ago, jason.1083 said:

You really have no fate on the devs do you? 

Faith that Anet will do good job on their own and do not need to be watched  in case they might get some funny ideas? Nearly 11 years of observing their work has succesfully cured me from that.

[jason.1083]

8 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

Faith that Anet will do good job on their own and do not need to be watched  in case they might get some funny ideas? Nearly 11 years of observing their work has succesfully cured me from that.

It's not that bad, some things I can agree have been a little weird but I don't think an idea like this would turn into a power creep mechanic. I mostly image it being like a couple of sub slots in the already existing wardrobe with just place holder skins, not actual gar with stats or effects.  So they wouldn't even be present in the equipment tab.

Edited August 1, 2023 by jason.1083

[jason.1083]

Fine, you can worry all you want, being pessimistic is not helping anyone though. 

At least I hope people think it's a good idea, excluding any possibility of Anet doing something else with it other than just pure cosmetics. 

[Zebulous.2934]

If you want more tattoos then characters are going to have to show more skin.  As it is, the tattoo armor we have is a compromise.  You will notice that the "skin" on the tattoo armor doesn't allow Norn tattoos to show under the armor's inked design.  
I speculate that Anet is skirting some kind of age rating in one or more countries.  Zodiac armor sets, the starborn outfit, the tattoo armors.  If Anet supplies a skin substitute as part of the clothing, I think it satisfies some entertainment regulatory commission somewhere.  
What is confusing is that most of the old light armor pieces, and the savage scale armor, seem to be an exception.
I really don't know why else Anet would insist on covering up character biceps and thighs, only to add different tattoos.  A number of players did request a version of tattoo armor that didn't have the inked designs. 

I do wish you luck in your campaign for tattoo and tattoo equivalents for Gw2 characters, as well as more clothing that will actually show those tattoos.

[jason.1083]

2 hours ago, Zebulous.2934 said:

If you want more tattoos then characters are going to have to show more skin.  As it is, the tattoo armor we have is a compromise.  You will notice that the "skin" on the tattoo armor doesn't allow Norn tattoos to show under the armor's inked design.  
I speculate that Anet is skirting some kind of age rating in one or more countries.  Zodiac armor sets, the starborn outfit, the tattoo armors.  If Anet supplies a skin substitute as part of the clothing, I think it satisfies some entertainment regulatory commission somewhere.  
What is confusing is that most of the old light armor pieces, and the savage scale armor, seem to be an exception.
I really don't know why else Anet would insist on covering up character biceps and thighs, only to add different tattoos.  A number of players did request a version of tattoo armor that didn't have the inked designs. 

I do wish you luck in your campaign for tattoo and tattoo equivalents for Gw2 characters, as well as more clothing that will actually show those tattoos.

I'm thinking that having something like that would discourage the use of either full plate armor with full coverage or extreme use of infusions to the point that they cover everything about the character. Which will emphasize that fashion is not really about just being the brightest supernova in the game. 

And about the tattoo armors we already got, I seriously don't understand why they all need to come with raged clothes, it's like why does only Conan the barbarian get to have tattoos? What if I want to have a more modern aesthetic, why should that lock someone out of that option? 

Thanks for your comment though I really do hope we can get something at least remotely close to this. 

[Meridian.4983]

This would be a fun option, many of my characters would get tattoos right away, hopefully the guild emblems would be included as there are on guild weapons.

 That said, I’m also hoping for more tattoo packs

[SpyderArachnid.5619]

On 8/1/2023 at 1:22 AM, jason.1083 said:

You really have no faith on the devs do you? 

These are the same devs that got rid of our cosmetic only slots. And you're asking for them to bring it back?

We had this already. It was called Town Clothing. A full set of armor slots that we could mix and match that were only cosmetic. We had a lot of cosmetic armor pieces that we could equip in those slots and switch to whenever we wanted. It was a full cosmetic mix and match armor set we could customize how we wanted.

Then Anet got rid of it completely and changed everything over to the outfit system. Now we only get one full outfit as a cosmetic set. No more mix and matching to customize it the way we want, it is just one full outfit. All our town clothing got switched over to the new system and turned into outfits. We lost all that cosmetic customization that we used to have.

You wonder why people don't have faith in the devs to give us cosmetic slots for this kind of stuff? That's why. The devs regret the armor system as it is, because it is difficult to make new armor sets compared to outfits. This is why we barely get any new armor sets each expansion and get flooded with new outfits all the time. Armor sets are just "too much work" for them. You think they are really going to add more into the armor system and give us more customization options with it, when they are not fans of the system in the first place?

 

Tattoos would be better placed in a new revamped character creation system. This way they are part of the character's body customizations and won't be affected by armors or outfits and will always show regardless of what you wear. Having them as an extra armor slot would just overcomplicate a simple character creation feature.

[jason.1083]

59 minutes ago, SpyderArachnid.5619 said:

These are the same devs that got rid of our cosmetic only slots. And you're asking for them to bring it back?

We had this already. It was called Town Clothing. A full set of armor slots that we could mix and match that were only cosmetic. We had a lot of cosmetic armor pieces that we could equip in those slots and switch to whenever we wanted. It was a full cosmetic mix and match armor set we could customize how we wanted.

Then Anet got rid of it completely and changed everything over to the outfit system. Now we only get one full outfit as a cosmetic set. No more mix and matching to customize it the way we want, it is just one full outfit. All our town clothing got switched over to the new system and turned into outfits. We lost all that cosmetic customization that we used to have.

You wonder why people don't have faith in the devs to give us cosmetic slots for this kind of stuff? That's why. The devs regret the armor system as it is, because it is difficult to make new armor sets compared to outfits. This is why we barely get any new armor sets each expansion and get flooded with new outfits all the time. Armor sets are just "too much work" for them. You think they are really going to add more into the armor system and give us more customization options with it, when they are not fans of the system in the first place?

 

Tattoos would be better placed in a new revamped character creation system. This way they are part of the character's body customizations and won't be affected by armors or outfits and will always show regardless of what you wear. Having them as an extra armor slot would just overcomplicate a simple character creation feature.

A few points here, what I'm asking here is not extra armor slots, neither cosmetic armor, it's a way to have tattoos without needing to dedicate armor slots to them, as well as more tattoo options. 

When I said you guys have no faith on the devs I meant it about the whole "making those cosmetic slots into a P2W feature by adding combat stats to them". 

I understand the point of adding this to an overhauled character creation system, but, that would take away from being able to easily switch/add/remove them, and it's in Anets best interest to sell these as cosmetics rather than implementing them into the character creation. If you really think about it, it's better for both sides, since a player that will often switch them around won't need to pay for a total make over every time, and if they are sold in bulk on the gemstore with the ability to switch them for free, more people will be eager to buy them(rather than a system where you need the makeover kit every time). 

[SpyderArachnid.5619]

1 minute ago, jason.1083 said:

A few points here, what I'm asking here is not extra armor slots, neither cosmetic armor, it's a way to have tattoos without needing to dedicate armor slots to them, as well as more tattoo options. 

When I said you guys have no faith on the devs I meant it about the whole "making those cosmetic slots into a P2W feature by adding combat stats to them". 

I understand the point of adding this to an overhauled character creation system, but, that would take away from being able to easily switch/add/remove them, and it's in Anets best interest to sell these as cosmetics rather than implementing them into the character creation. If you really think about it, it's better for both sides, since a player that will often switch them around won't need to pay for a total make over every time, and if they are sold in bulk on the gemstore with the ability to switch them for free, more people will be eager to buy them(rather than a system where you need the makeover kit every time). 

Then you're not really asking for tattoos, you just want some form of warpaint/decorative ink.

It takes away from the character if you're able to just change tattoos on the fly whenever you want by equipping a different one. What you seem to want is more along the lines of warpaint that you can wash off and replace with something new whenever you feel like it. That's not really how tattoos work lol.

Tattoos are a commitment, and should be treated as such. It should be a character creation thing, not just some bauble you equip and change out whenever you want. Just like changing your facial/body features, eye colors or hair color/style, it should require a makeover kit. It's not like armor or clothing, it's a change to your body. And all body changes require a makeover kit.

[jason.1083]

14 minutes ago, SpyderArachnid.5619 said:

Then you're not really asking for tattoos, you just want some form of warpaint/decorative ink.

It takes away from the character if you're able to just change tattoos on the fly whenever you want by equipping a different one. What you seem to want is more along the lines of warpaint that you can wash off and replace with something new whenever you feel like it. That's not really how tattoos work lol.

Tattoos are a commitment, and should be treated as such. It should be a character creation thing, not just some bauble you equip and change out whenever you want. Just like changing your facial/body features, eye colors or hair color/style, it should require a makeover kit. It's not like armor or clothing, it's a change to your body. And all body changes require a makeover kit.

It's a game, if we were supposed to commit to a look as we do in real life then there shouldn't be a total makeover at all. Or if there was it should be renamed to plastic surgery and priced at 5 figures...

The difference between a tattoo and a warpaint here is what they represent. If I get my elite spec icon as a tattoo on my character for example, it symbolizes that "commitment" you're talking about (and you really can't call something like that a warpaint). Without ofcourse actually making you commit to it because again, it's a game. 

Also, most armor pieces in the game use presets that don't necessarily match your characters body, so you can end up with vastly different body shape results depending on the armor. 

Edited August 2, 2023 by jason.1083

[Drag You Down.2615]

Tattoo is wonderful, I was also thinking about piercings like ear rings, nose rings, lip rings, and even some... body piercings. I dont care about the amount of gems it may cost, but adding more options to our character appearance is always a way to attract players.

Anet has already started adding some skimpy armors for the game, we can take much more. Separate tattoo from armor can: 1. help Anet to create more profit. 2. Help players to have a wider range of appearance combinations. It's a win win. 

Edited August 10, 2023 by Drag You Down.2615

[Danikat.8537]

Not only can we already change tattoos on norn we can change things which are even more immutable in real life, like charr fur patterns and horns, or a sylvari's skin pattern. It's not realistic (or at least it's unrealistically easy to do it), but games don't always have to be realistic.

It's also unrealistic that most characters can't get tattoos at all, even though tattooing clearly exists in Tyria.

On 8/1/2023 at 10:14 AM, Zebulous.2934 said:

If you want more tattoos then characters are going to have to show more skin.  As it is, the tattoo armor we have is a compromise.  You will notice that the "skin" on the tattoo armor doesn't allow Norn tattoos to show under the armor's inked design. 

I finally got around to checking this today and you can see norn tattoos under the tattoo armour. Here's some examples, where you can see the tattoo armour in yellow and orange or in white, and the original tattoos in blue underneath. In the second one you can see his chest hair as well, which I doubt they'd include if it was some clever trick to hide their actual skin:
https://i.imgur.com/khFcvKA.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/KokjU2C.jpg

Also don't forget it is, and always has been, possible for any player at any time to strip a character down to their underwear. If for some reason they weren't allowed to show bare skin that wouldn't be an option. (I imagine they'd do something like an old RPG I played where if you stripped all your equipment off your character would be wearing a shirt and trousers.)

Edited August 9, 2023 by Danikat.8537

[jason.1083]

3 hours ago, Danikat.8537 said:

Not only can we already change tattoos on norn we can change things which are even more immutable in real life, like charr fur patterns and horns, or a sylvari's skin pattern. It's not realistic (or at least it's unrealistically easy to do it), but games don't always have to be realistic.

It's also unrealistic that most characters can't get tattoos at all, even though tattooing clearly exists in Tyria.

I finally got around to checking this today and you can see norn tattoos under the tattoo armour. Here's some examples, where you can see the tattoo armour in yellow and orange or in white, and the original tattoos in blue underneath. In the second one you can see his chest hair as well, which I doubt they'd include if it was some clever trick to hide their actual skin:
https://i.imgur.com/khFcvKA.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/KokjU2C.jpg

Also don't forget it is, and always has been, possible for any player at any time to strip a character down to their underwear. If for some reason they weren't allowed to show bare skin that wouldn't be an option. (I imagine they'd do something like an old RPG I played where if you stripped all your equipment off your character would be wearing a shirt and trousers.)

That's the point I was trying to get to, I'm not suggesting stand alone tattoos for realism sake, the game was never about that and having a limited selection of them for Norn only seems like lost potential. 

The screenshots are interesting, as I'm not a fan of clipping myself it doesn't look good imo, but it's nice to know since I haven't kept any Norn characters to test it myself. 

About the argument with the clothes, firstly, we do have a decent amount of clothes that do show enough skin for a tattoo to show underneath. And secondly I never said that getting a tattoo means that you have to show it at all times, even having it partially visible is an option, witch is actually good because it helps you not get bored of it.