Enthusiastic Players Stay Silent

[enigmatic.3576]

1 hour ago, Labjax.2465 said:

I will never understand people who are overjoyed to pay for something and want to make sure others feel shamed and bad for not wanting to do the same.

Like some rare gemstone discovery after so many years of encountering customer-antagonistic services, I now put some of my recreational time and money into a service I feel good about spending money on because the people who do the service encourage having expectations and try to meet them, and they aren't weighed down by investors telling them what to do. I am a fan of that service to a high degree, but I would not tell someone else they are mean and a bully if they dislike the service. Tastes differ and so do standards.

With this game, my experience last year was persistently the opposite of what OP describes: if I had a criticism about the game, I would get responses that were routinely mean, if not bordering on bullying. OTOH, as long as I stayed positive and had nice things to say, I don't recall people ever giving me trouble for that.  

Which is one of the reasons I left and only check in now and then out of a kind of morbid curiosity. Toxic positivity isn't going to sell anyone on this game in the long-term. It's ok to speak truthfully to a service you're paying money to. And if they don't want to hear that truth, well, I guess they don't like money and don't want to keep the business afloat. Some companies get away with it because of how dependent people are on their service. But an MMO? Naw. Anet, like so many other companies, has gotta lose the mindset that it knows better than the players what they want and that its personal vision is more important than what the players are willing to pay for. If you want to go the personal vision route, do a passion project. If you want to make a profit, you have to sincerely listen and act upon what you hear. There are only so many slots in which to fail upwards; for most people, they don't have that luxury and they have to look elsewhere for employment when the leadership damages yet another service with its sense of superiority in decision-making.

Of course, this is where some would say, "But they can't listen to everyone and everything." And that's factually true. But it's pretty apparent when a service is listening overall. And it's pretty apparent Anet only ever listens reactively when the outrage is too hard to control, not as a matter of sincere interest in listening.

So for those of you who are fed up and are facing down the sunk cost fallacy, I encourage you to believe that better is possible; but elsewhere, not here. Anet has had 10 years to get their act together and they got pulverized with layoffs in recent years instead. Have sympathy for the grunt work folks who put long hours into this game, but don't waste your feelings on Anet the corporation that shows an inability to mature past scattershot half-realized ideas, reactive halfway attempts to listen, and increasingly desperate monetization alongside flagging development resources. Treasure the memories you had and take heart that you got to have them, but don't keep yourself in pain if they keep failing you.

It's because so many people have dedicated so much of their life around some games, with some dedicating their entire free time to it, that they become blinded and take any criticism of a game as an assault on them.  They're the same ones that can receive subpar updates from a game and will brush off any concerns over a future update by saying "well we just don't know yet" or something along those lines despite a pattern indicating that there is justification to be concerned.  Maybe 'Fanaticism' is the best way to describe it and not to be confused with someone who is simply a fan of the game.

I looked at this more and part of the wikipedia article describes this fairly well.

Quote

Fanaticism is a result from multiple cultures interacting with one another. Fanaticism occurs most frequently when a leader makes minor variations on already existing beliefs, which then drives the followers into a frenzy. In this case, fanaticism is used as an adjective describing the nature of certain behaviors that people recognize as cult-like. Mead referred to the style of defense used when the followers are approached. The most consistent thing presented is the priming, or preexisting, conditions and mind state needed to induce fanatical behavior. Each behavior is obvious once it is pointed out; a closed mind, no interest in debating the subject of worship, and over reaction to people who do not believe.

In his book Crazy Talk, Stupid Talk, Neil Postman states that "the key to all fanatical beliefs is that they are self-confirming....(some beliefs are) fanatical not because they are 'false', but because they are expressed in such a way that they can never be shown to be false."

This isn't isolated to just games as you'll see it everywhere.  People just need to take a step back to see it.

Edited August 13, 2023 by enigmatic.3576

[mandala.8507]

1 hour ago, Labjax.2465 said:

I will never understand people who are overjoyed to pay for something and want to make sure others feel shamed and bad for not wanting to do the same.

If you don't want to buy SotO, that's awesome for you. Go get 'em, tiger. Best of luck in your future gaming adventures. ✌️

[Sugar Min.5834]

On 8/3/2023 at 2:14 AM, Alsandar.7420 said:

The GW2 community is significantly nicer than other mmo’s… It’s true…

And there are tens of thousands (if not hundreds of thousands) of players who are really hyped for Soto. Many loved EOD as well.

But these players often stay silent because the forums, Reddit, YouTube = full of angry, mean people, who insult and bully anyone who likes the game. 
 

So Anet, please know a lot of us are excited!! And we love what you do!! 

Reported for fake news.

[mandala.8507]

34 minutes ago, enigmatic.3576 said:

Maybe 'Fanaticism' is the best way to describe it and not to be confused with someone who is simply a fan of the game.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but "fan" is literally just a shortening of the word fanatic.

[mandala.8507]

I'm glad I'm learning all these valuable lessons about my relationship to the game, though. Let's see if I'm getting this right:

• If I don't like the game, say I'm going to quit the game, and then instead of doing that, haunt the forums and try to convince everyone else they should be quitting the game, I'm a well-adjusted and totally normal little lad.
• But if I think I'm enjoying the game's recent additions like EoD or am looking forward to experiencing future additions to the game like SotO, I'm actually just brainwashed.

Is that a good summary? 😅

[enigmatic.3576]

1 hour ago, mandala.8507 said:

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but "fan" is literally just a shortening of the word fanatic.

There's a significant degree of difference between the everyday usage of 'fan' and what I was speaking about.

[Dami.5046]

All I  can think about is all the trolls that DIDN'T want P.V.E legendary armour. 🤣

[IAmNotMatthew.1058]

3 hours ago, Dami.5046 said:

All I  can think about is all the trolls that DIDN'T want P.V.E legendary armour. 🤣

And we got that PvE Legendary armor like 5 years ago. 😉

[thorrand.6548]

On 8/2/2023 at 5:45 PM, Zephyrus.9680 said:

This is because you can't connect steam to your existing GW2 account. I don't have the game on steam either. So 0 hours, and yet I have 4000+ hours. If your conspiracy is that the reviews are that high because they are fake, I can't help you because there's nothing to argue. 

More than half of the steam reviews have less than 20 hours played. Glad the game's getting good reviews but seems to lack retention. 

[enigmatic.3576]

5 hours ago, Dami.5046 said:

All I  can think about is all the trolls that DIDN'T want P.V.E legendary armour. 🤣

Or all of the trolls that didn't understand that raids are PVE.

[solzuul.6294]

11 hours ago, mandala.8507 said:

I'm glad I'm learning all these valuable lessons about my relationship to the game, though. Let's see if I'm getting this right:

• If I don't like the game, say I'm going to quit the game, and then instead of doing that, haunt the forums and try to convince everyone else they should be quitting the game, I'm a well-adjusted and totally normal little lad.
• But if I think I'm enjoying the game's recent additions like EoD or am looking forward to experiencing future additions to the game like SotO, I'm actually just brainwashed.

Is that a good summary? 😅

Here's a summary I prefer:

People who are hyped and people who are concerned about the expansion both come to the forums and inevitably clash with each other. Neither wants to convince the other their opinion is wrong, but they do want to discuss where the hype/concerns come from. They want to discuss old trends and speculate on future releases.  

No need to attack/feel attacked. We are just in different places in our guild wars journey. 

[Luthan.5236]

It's not only "enthusiastic" players. In general the people on the forums (or other websites like Reddit) only make a part of the playerbase. Especially with the game being targeted more at casuals and "everyone"/family (not only hardcore players). There might also people that dislike the changes ... that don't post on the forums. (That maybe did not even to that much research and maybe even missed some of the news posts here on the official website - with just being focused on playing a bit every now and then.)

People with complaints usually are more inclined to voice (they want to get the company to make changes) their opinion than happy people (they don't need to put work into trying to change the stance of the devs/company).

[Forum Moderator.3419]

Hi Everyone,
I'm locking this thread as it's run its course.
Regards.