Make Gift of Battle avaliable in PvE

[Sawyer.4127]

1 minute ago, TheNecrosanct.4028 said:

Also, you should stop asking people why they think WvW should be required. That question is better aimed at ANet, since they created this process in the first place. The PvE players who do participate in WvW for GoB's are simply the ones who have decided for themselves that the reward is worth the time and effort spent. Clearly you're leaning in the opposite direction. That doesn't mean we are the problem, though, as much as you want to make it seem that way.

Actually no, this is a community thread discussing this, so the point is actually literally talking about this with other players. You're backing up the choice anet made, which means you agree with the design choice. Or if you don't agree with it and are still somehow defending the concept that makes even less sense. 

3 minutes ago, Biziut.3594 said:

If someone get said reward for putting less effort than me, (Becouse boo hoo I don't like the content) than sorry, but you do not deserve it in my opinion. Becouse it will trivilize the effort I have put into getting where I am. Especially that, once again, it is by all means not required for you to play any of the game content. It is not restricting you from anything. It is only a vanity item.

You confuse me. 

Example: You enjoy WvW/PvP and you spend 5 hours getting GoB.

Someone enjoys PvE and they spend 5 hours getting GoB from a PvE related collection. 

Here you decided you put in more effort because you played WvW/PvP? Or is the effort related to whether or not you like the content you're playing because in that case that's never a metric that'll make sense. 

So how is someone putting in less effort than you?

10 minutes ago, Biziut.3594 said:

There are many points of view. Just becouse you do not agree with them, it does not make them less valid. Ascended items are equal to the Legendary ones stat wise. There is no content in game that requires You to have legendary equipment. You can get Ascended by playing a single gamemode.

I never said legendaries were necessary.

And of course people can have any viewpoint they would like. Asking them to elaborate or explain does not equate devalueing their opinion. 

Merely saying no with no reasoning, however, does not constitute a viewpoint. If you think that letting others have legendaries in the same time spent but without making them swear at their monitor for hours on end somehow takes away from your experience with legendaries, that's fair. I don't understand it, but that's not your issue.

I don't personally understand how keeping the current methods the way they are, while adding equal alternate methods in terms of time and effort takes away from anything, except allowing more people that want to take part in the legendary crafting process to do so.

I'd understand if anyone was asking for things for free or easy. But that isn't the case. 

2 minutes ago, Fueki.4753 said:

Even if your price was multiplied by 20, it'd not be enough to pay for their sheer unwillingness to play a bit of WvW.

With every comment you make, your point becomes more clear. You are the kind of person that just wants people to do things they don't enjoy just because you seem to think that's entertaining.

[TheNecrosanct.4028]

26 minutes ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

Actually no, this is a community thread discussing this, so the point is actually literally talking about this with other players. You're backing up the choice anet made, which means you agree with the design choice. Or if you don't agree with it and are still somehow defending the concept that makes even less sense.

I'm accepting the choice ANet made and I understand the reasoning behind it. I don't defend things I don't agree with so it's time for you to stop assuming or suggesting such things now.

Nobody wants people to do things they don't enjoy so you can stop claiming that as well. Once again the question: why do you so desperately need legendary gear? If the acquisition method is such a pain to you I really don't understand why you feel forced to do it, especially because legendary gear adds nothing to stats and is far from necessary for anything. They're luxury item, QoL features, so to speak.

28 minutes ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

I never said legendaries were necessary.

Yes, you did. According to you one of the biggest end game systems forces you to. Which end game system is that? How does it force you? If you're forced to have legendaries for said end game content, doesn't that mean legendaries are necessary? 

[Dayra.7405]

38 minutes ago, Fueki.4753 said:

20, it'd not be enough to pay for their sheer unwillingness to play a bit of WvW.

They pay for their inflexibility  and stay away from WvW , what can I want more 😀😎

[Fueki.4753]

Imagine you had simply played a bit of WvW, instead of spending time "arguing" for nothing.

You would have gotten your GoB by now.

6 minutes ago, Dayra.7405 said:

what can I want more

You can (and should) want them to pay even more.

If it ever was available from PvE, it should be exponentially more "involved" to get it, so that the WvW track will remain the far FAR more attractive option to get it.

Edited September 20, 2023 by Fueki.4753

[soul.9651]

1 hour ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

I wish any of you would make an actual argument for why you think it should be this way instead of just going "If you don't want to play WvW, don't have a legendary".

Just by seeing how many people are against this dont you think if anet did things with GoB your way all of those people would be rioting on forums and reddit against the change? Plus like we are seeing with open world lege armors people who asked for it are still complaining that they need to put the effort to get it, if anet madeGoB and put it behind some obnoxious grind (and believe me they would 100% as they always do with lege stuff) you think OW people would stop complaining about it too or as usual more complaints would come..?  You need to look at the bigger picture not just your experiences. Its just waste of time and resources for the extra complaits from people who disagrees with you..

Also thinking about changes like this.. i always said anet should start making in game polls like osrs does, where before making a change like this it would need to pass 75% people agreeing with it.. but again ONLY in game polls, forums for such things would be terrible idea since most people who play dont even visit this place

Edited September 20, 2023 by soul.9651

[IndigoSundown.5419]

The reality of ANet's choice to require participation in WvW to obtain one (of many) necessary components for a legendary weapon likely comes down to number-crunching and statistics.  It seems clear that ANet's goal is to entice players who are leery of/dislike/etc. WvW to have to spend some time there if they want that GoB.  Why?  Perhaps they think that such players might actually enjoy themselves and return to WvW. Perhaps their goal was to (gasp) grow a game mode which has been variously described as one of the pinnacles of GW2's endgame.  Perhaps enough people do return to WvW to counterbalance (or more than counterbalance) those who grit their teeth, endure it once and then complain about it.  Perhaps it's not about "forcing" people to do something they dislike, and instead is about cold, hard numbers which pushed ANet's goals for WvW.

So, by all means, ask for a change.  That is your right.  But do not be surprised if ANet's response to this request is the same as it has been to all of the other requests for PvE access to the GoB.  It may be that there are too few upset to warrant the change, especially if ANet metrics suggest that enough new entrants to WvW stay to warrant keeping the enticement.

[TheNecrosanct.4028]

5 minutes ago, Fueki.4753 said:

Imagine you had simply played a bit of WvW, instead of spending time "arguing" for nothing.

You would have gotten your GoB by now.

You can (and should) want them to pay even more.

If it ever was available from PvE, it should be exponentially more "involved" to get it, so that the WvW track will remain the far FAR more attractive option to get it.

If ANet ever decides to implement a PvE way to obtain GoB's I hope they will tie it to Dungeons/Fractals/Raids/Strike Missions. Instanced content that is focused on boss battles. It is a Gift of Battle, after all. That, or killing 100,000 of a certain enemy (50,000 would be okay too, but certainly not less). The problem is, people don't just want the GoB available through PvE, they want it available through their preferred ways in PvE. Just like people now are complaining about having to do so many rift events to obtain the OW legendary armor. They wanted OW armor. They're getting it. But it's still not to their liking. Imagine the forums if GW2 had vertical progression instead of horizontal, with every expansion introducing more grind to keep your top tier armor. It's like people have lost their perspective of GW2's place among MMO's. It's the most casual friendly, least grindy MMO I know of. And it's still not good enough for some.

You can never satisfy everyone. And ANet should definitely not bend over backwards to try and please everyone, unless they want to create precedents and drive themselves into a corner.

[Sawyer.4127]

1 minute ago, TheNecrosanct.4028 said:

Yes, you did. According to you one of the biggest end game systems forces you to. Which end game system is that? How does it force you? If you're forced to have legendaries for said end game content, doesn't that mean legendaries are necessary?

Legendary crafting is inarguably one of the biggest end-game systems in the game. That is the system that is forcing people to play those game modes. I never stated legendaries are forced or needed to do anything else in the game.

And if you want to be pedantic about the word force, that's fine. Yes, I could just not do it. And yes, I'm sure plenty of people do.

It does however not change the fact that I think it's a detrimental factor to content a lot of people otherwise enjoy (Collecting weapons and skins, as well as the added bonus of convenience and easily trying out new builds and professions).

3 minutes ago, TheNecrosanct.4028 said:

If ANet ever decides to implement a PvE way to obtain GoB's I hope they will tie it to Dungeons/Fractals/Raids/Strike Missions. Instanced content that is focused on boss battles. It is a Gift of Battle, after all. That, or killing 100,000 of a certain enemy (50,000 would be okay too, but certainly not less).

This is literally all I want - It can be 200,000 for all I care. I would still rather do that than enter into PvP modes.

6 minutes ago, TheNecrosanct.4028 said:

The problem is, people don't just want the GoB available through PvE, they want it available through their preferred ways in PvE. Just like people now are complaining about having to do so many rift events to obtain the OW legendary armor. They wanted OW armor. They're getting it. But it's still not to their liking. Imagine the forums if GW2 had vertical progression instead of horizontal, with every expansion introducing more grind to keep your top tier armor. It's like people have lost their perspective of GW2's place among MMO's. It's the most casual friendly, least grindy MMO I know of. And it's still not good enough for some.

This is a fact, but it's not what I was arguing for. I'm all for earning it through massive grind if necessary. I'm happy about the new armor as well. My only complaint would be that the rift system is boooooring, but hey it is what it is.

11 minutes ago, IndigoSundown.5419 said:

The reality of ANet's choice to require participation in WvW to obtain one (of many) necessary components for a legendary weapon likely comes down to number-crunching and statistics.  It seems clear that ANet's goal is to entice players who are leery of/dislike/etc. WvW to have to spend some time there if they want that GoB.  Why?  Perhaps they think that such players might actually enjoy themselves and return to WvW. Perhaps their goal was to (gasp) grow a game mode which has been variously described as one of the pinnacles of GW2's endgame.  Perhaps enough people do return to WvW to counterbalance (or more than counterbalance) those who grit their teeth, endure it once and then complain about it.  Perhaps it's not about "forcing" people to do something they dislike, and instead is about cold, hard numbers which pushed ANet's goals for WvW.

So, by all means, ask for a change.  That is your right.  But do not be surprised if ANet's response to this request is the same as it has been to all of the other requests for PvE access to the GoB.  It may be that there are too few upset to warrant the change, especially if ANet metrics suggest that enough new entrants to WvW stay to warrant keeping the enticement.

You do make a good point and it's probably the actual reasoning behind it. And honestly I'm completely fine with sending people into these game modes to have them "try them out" and see if they like them and maybe they'll eventually return. It just feels awful as someone who did try it and didn't enjoy it, to realize that every single legendary you want to make after that, you have to do the exact same over again.

Just now, Fueki.4753 said:

Imagine you had simply played a bit of WvW, instead of spending time "arguing" for nothing.

You would have gotten your GoB by now.

 

If you'd actually paid attention to anything going on in the thread instead of trolling, you'd know I've done this multiple times already (Doesn't mean I enjoy it or particularly want to keep doing it (Even though I do want more legendaries)).

[quake.9023]

yup agree

[Jianyu.7065]

I dont even have legendaries, and I really want one...or, some - all of them! And I definitely believe spending just a few hours in WvW is very little to ask in order to get a GoB. 

[Fueki.4753]

25 minutes ago, TheNecrosanct.4028 said:

If ANet ever decides to implement a PvE way to obtain GoB's I hope they will tie it to Dungeons/Fractals/Raids/Strike Missions. Instanced content that is focused on boss battles. It is a Gift of Battle, after all. That, or killing 100,000 of a certain enemy (50,000 would be okay too, but certainly not less).

If they introduced the GoB as a PvE rewards, it needs a major pain of the bacon to acquire.

If it was tied to instanced group PvE, anything less than hundreds (if not thousands) of raid challenge mote boss kills is not enough, to reward a GoB and still keep the WvW option far FAR more attractive.

 

Edited September 20, 2023 by Fueki.4753

[Sawyer.4127]

1 minute ago, Fueki.4753 said:

If they introduced the GoB as a PvE rewards, it needs a major pain of the bacon to acquire.

If it was tied to instanced group PvE, anything less than hundreds (if not thousands) of raid challenge mote boss kills is not enough, to reward a GoB and still keep the WvW option far FAR more attractive.

 

This man confuses me so much - Do you reaaaaally want people to play WvW? What's going on here LOL

[Shadow Chaser.1948]

On 9/19/2023 at 5:21 AM, Biziut.3594 said:

There are. Two of them to be honest. Gen 1 and Gen 3. You can buy them off tp. Getting gold from any game mode you want. The diffrence in price one can explain as fee for GoB or other gifts.

I have over 100 GOB sitting in my bank and I sell leggy sometime when I get to do map exploration. I am NOT against pve player getting GOB from any other means but playing WvW. It will hurt my financial plan.

Same here, sitting on over 100 GOB. But, I am just wondering why some people here wants people to get GOB only through WvW. What do they gain from it? Why do they even want pve player to play WvW when they clearly don't want to play that mode.

Edited September 20, 2023 by Shadow Chaser.1948

[TheNecrosanct.4028]

2 hours ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

3. Because one of the biggest end game systems currently forces you to. It's fairly normal I would say to want to take part in the best gear in the game, but that doesn't mean I can't have problems with the process.

Yes. You should definitely let go of the word "force". There is no such thing. Playing any game is a choice. There is no forcing involved whatsoever, except for what you do yourself. Also, if you want the best gear, why not go for ascended? Same stats, same effect in combat. And that's what the gear is for, after all: combat. The QoL features of legendaries don't change their function or effects. The benefit (read: convenience) is only for you.

So making legendaries is one of the biggest end game systems? That is what you're saying? All these level 80 people I see running around in game do their stuff so they can make legendaries? And here I thought they were playing the game for the fun of it. However, I understand you didn't take this into account because apparently you aren't playing the game for the fun of it.

It's great that you are willing to grind your kitten off in challenging PvE content. Many won't be. Trust me, there will be another you posting a similar thread if that ever happens. No matter what ANet does, the entitlement will remain. Based on that fact alone it's best ANet leaves things as they are. They've made many concessions over the years, but there is a limit to that, as it should be.

[IAmNotMatthew.1058]

2 hours ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

I wish any of you would make an actual argument for why you think it should be this way instead of just going "If you don't want to play WvW, don't have a legendary".

Again, please clarify to me why you think that should be a thing?

People who only play PvP need to dip into WvW and PvE to get all the items needed for Legendaries.
People who only play WvW need to dip into PvE to get all the items needed for Legendaries.

It's only reasonable that people who play PvE only dip into WvW for a single item needed for their Legendary.

[Shadow Chaser.1948]

5 minutes ago, IAmNotMatthew.1058 said:

People who only play PvP need to dip into WvW and PvE to get all the items needed for Legendaries.
People who only play WvW need to dip into PvE to get all the items needed for Legendaries.

It's only reasonable that people who play PvE only dip into WvW for a single item needed for their Legendary.

people who play only pvp and WvW should be demanding items available through their choice of game mode. But, expecting pve players to dip into other game mode, so you can have your easy kill?

I just don't understand this logic. It sounds like, If I can't have it, you shouldn't either.

Edited September 20, 2023 by Shadow Chaser.1948

[Sawyer.4127]

2 minutes ago, TheNecrosanct.4028 said:

Yes. You should definitely let go of the word "force". There is no such thing. Playing any game is a choice. There is no forcing involved whatsoever, except for what you do yourself. Also, if you want the best gear, why not go for ascended? Same stats, same effect in combat. And that's what the gear is for, after all: combat. The QoL features of legendaries don't change their function or effects. The benefit (read: convenience) is only for you.

So making legendaries is one of the biggest end game systems? That is what you're saying? All these level 80 people I see running around in game do their stuff so they can make legendaries? And here I thought they were playing the game for the fun of it. However, I understand you didn't take this into account because apparently you aren't playing the game for the fun of it.

It's great that you are willing to grind your kitten off in challenging PvE content. Many won't be. Trust me, there will be another you posting a similar thread if that ever happens. No matter what ANet does, the entitlement will remain. Based on that fact alone it's best ANet leaves things as they are. They've made many concessions over the years, but there is a limit to that, as it should be.

You're a strange jaded person to me, but I guess that's what comes with being on these forums for a long time?

If I'm not to assume your opinions, I don't think you should keep assuming mine. I absolutely enjoy creating legendaries, a whole 80-90% of the process most of the time. In your logic, I should stop doing something I enjoy and want the end result of because the last 10-20% are in a game mode that I don't like playing?

If you don't think creating gear and items is part of the game play, then I don't know what to tell you.

2 minutes ago, Shadow Chaser.1948 said:

people who play only pvp and WvW should be demanding items available through their choice of game mode. But, expecting pve players to dip into other game mode, so you can have your easy kill?

This is my exact point, more concisely and well put.

[IAmNotMatthew.1058]

1 minute ago, Shadow Chaser.1948 said:

people who play only pvp and WvW should be demanding items available through their choice of game mode. But, expecting pve players to dip into other game mode, so you can have your easy kill?

I just don't understand this logic. It sounds like, If I can't have it, you shouldn't either.

Exactly, if WvW/PvP players have to play PvE, because certain rewards/items are only obtainable there, PvE players should also have to swap over to WvW, you seem to understand it perfectly.

People have been explaining how you can get a GoB by pure PvE methods in WvW, but, I guess you are not paying attention to that. 
I literally got a GoB last week in less than 5 hours and only fought other people once, but throwing 2 AoEs at 4 defenders in a group of 20+ isn't exactly "fighting". 

[Shadow Chaser.1948]

19 minutes ago, IAmNotMatthew.1058 said:

Exactly, if WvW/PvP players have to play PvE, because certain rewards/items are only obtainable there, PvE players should also have to swap over to WvW, you seem to understand it perfectly.

People have been explaining how you can get a GoB by pure PvE methods in WvW, but, I guess you are not paying attention to that. 
I literally got a GoB last week in less than 5 hours and only fought other people once, but throwing 2 AoEs at 4 defenders in a group of 20+ isn't exactly "fighting". 

hmm, Don't think there is much to discuss with you. We have different way to see things. Some people just enjoys others having miserable times.

Edited September 20, 2023 by Shadow Chaser.1948

[IAmNotMatthew.1058]

2 minutes ago, Shadow Chaser.1948 said:

hmm, Don't think there is much to discuss with you. We have different way to see things. Some people just enjoys others having miserable times.

Indeed. And some people like to draw conclusions. 

[Lucy.3728]

17 hours ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

And you somehow want to tell me that there's nothing wrong with forcing me to do something I don't want to do for hours on end, in order to achieve the most prestigious items in the game?

Yeah, there's nothing wrong.
The compulsion is in your head.
Since you can reach everything with ascended gear, no?

Edited September 20, 2023 by Lucy.3728

[BadHealer.3608]

2 hours ago, Sawyer.4127 said:

Example: You enjoy WvW/PvP and you spend 5 hours getting GoB.

Someone enjoys PvE and they spend 5 hours getting GoB from a PvE related collection. 

Not the whole calculation.

People enjoy WvW/PvP and spend 5 hours getting GoB and 995 hours playing PvE that they dislike, but play to get the legendary weapon.

Other people enjoy PvE and 5 hours getting GoB and 995 hours playing PvE that they love to get the legendary weapon.

Why should the ones that like WvW/PvP spend 199 more time in PvE than in WvW/PvP. Is their time only 1.95% worth the time of a PvE player?

[Dayra.7405]

BTW. Gen1 & 3 are available via PvE only: Farm the gold and buy them in the TP.

[Hsanrb.1570]

All I can see them do is add it to Wizards Vault... I would have figured these things would have been easier with PvP and WvW tasks in Wizards Vault but they really aren't unless you really prefer this type of content.

[Luthan.5236]

3 hours ago, Fueki.4753 said:

Imagine you had simply played a bit of WvW, instead of spending time "arguing" for nothing.

You would have gotten your GoB by now.

Funny thing though is - since a sure effective way is to recap just a camp every 10 minutes to keep participation up (in between you wait at the spawn): People could actually write in the forums as a fun and entertaining way to spend time ... while waiting for the next camp recap. Alt-tabbing out is not a big deal. 😄 So ... they can get a GoB while talking here in the forums.

I would recommend do to this. And announce in that that you are playing that way. Might get fun reactions from people that try to defend WvW as a "good" (when it is the worst) game mode. And if they get angy it would be even more fun to tell them: But people like you told me to play WvW - why so angry?

WvW ... ist just PvE (vs. the camp supervisor) with other players around that also can be damaged.