Rifle will be a support weapon

[draxynnic.3719]

On 11/11/2023 at 5:57 PM, Micah.3789 said:

I think you've misunderstood me. My main point was that many commenters are misrepresenting mesmer as a spec that lacks raw healing and therefore needs a healing weapon. Many of the current issues are being addressed in the upcoming trait changes, but I identified in my original comment what I think the remaining weaknesses are that I hope rifle will address. While the spec doesn't need a healing weapon, I can understand why some would like the option; especially to avoid reliance on Restorative Mantras. I'm excited about the spec as is, and have no interest in using rifle. So I just hope that whatever they do with rifle, it doesn't lead to nerfing other parts of the mesmer's healing output.

My viewpoint here is that if rifle is a healing weapon and healmirage achieves the same alacrity and at least the same healing as staff/staff (or any other alachealmirage configuration), is this really a bad thing? Personally, I prefer builds that actually have different sets rather than swapping between the same weapons like alacmirage does.

I'd be really surprised if any nerfs lead to alacheal mirage being weaker than it currently is. While you've been fiercely advocating for it, the truth is that it's still not a generally accepted build - and ArenaNet probably isn't going to care about what it does until and unless it starts entering the general or speedclear meta. If it does end up a little overtuned when it enters the meta, then it's likely to be knocked down a bit but still left in a viable state while being more generally accepted than it is now, which is probably still a net win for the build.

Worst-case scenario is that heal chrono comes out overpowered, and the nerfs they make to heal chrono also end up knocking alacheal mirage down. If what you say is true, though*, I don't see a high chance of that happening without also giving alacheal mirage a shot at general acceptance in the process.

*Note: I'm not saying this to imply that you're lying, just acknowledging that I haven't tested it myself and therefore that I'm relying on your assessment for my own analysis.

Edited November 12, 2023 by draxynnic.3719

[Levetty.1279]

3 hours ago, Micah.3789 said:

Why is that even controversial?

Anytime Mesmer gets something that might bring them close to what other classes have people flood reddit and these forums crying and shitting themselves over it. Have done for nearly 10 years now. 

[Mevelios.4809]

@Micah.3789 Again, I don't care for conflict so to defuse something that's not worth fighting over, I won't make a full answer. Thank you however for bringing me to look again at alacrity's wiki page which I haven't checked for long - no idea when did I start mistaking its effect for a pure CD reduction.

I don't mind apologizing if you misread the intent; my comments are not meant to add to the pile of the "I know better" we're used to watching. My view is solely based on my experience running twice or thrice competitive activities a week, seizing sometimes the opportunity to test ideas. Besides how the LFG is generally used, my opinion is mine alone. Maybe the tone was misleading - one to one, next round. Whichever the case, again it wasn't the intent, just as the first line you quoted in this last message was a failed attempt at smoothing things out. "I disagree" does not mean "you're spouting nonsense". Merely "I disagree", while my ideas are not necessarily spot on - look at how I've been misreading alacrity since returning.

We're only moving away from the topic keeping that up though, so let's stick to private messages otherwise! Saw nothing in the news yesterday as a quick preview to the rifle; let's see how it goes in the coming week!

[draxynnic.3719]

They do seem to have decided that 'daily' doesn't mean the weekend... so it's going to be a long wait for whoever's last (five this week and then another weapon).

And the devs seem to be hyping mesmer rifle up, so I'd give it a greater than 1/6 chance that it will be last.

[Micah.3789]

12 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

I'd be really surprised if any nerfs lead to alacheal mirage being weaker than it currently is. While you've been fiercely advocating for it, the truth is that it's still not a generally accepted build - and ArenaNet probably isn't going to care about what it does until and unless it starts entering the general or speedclear meta. If it does end up a little overtuned when it enters the meta, then it's likely to be knocked down a bit but still left in a viable state while being more generally accepted than it is now, which is probably still a net win for the build.

Worst-case scenario is that heal chrono comes out overpowered, and the nerfs they make to heal chrono also end up knocking alacheal mirage down. If what you say is true, though*, I don't see a high chance of that happening without also giving alacheal mirage a shot at general acceptance in the process.

That's a good point; I was probably unnecessarily concerned for the future of heal mirage. Even if a healing focused rifle brings too much potency, it is pretty unlikely that the mantras or inspiration traits would be targeted for nerfs. That said, I'm well aware that heal mirage is in no way meta right now, but that's mostly due to the lack of prot/regen; plus it's very difficult to execute well. I am imagining it being completely viable in the upcoming patch, though almost certainly not meta defining.

[Heinel.6548]

TBH I don't think rifle needs to be any more potent in healing than staff currently can manage. It'll be nice to have a direct heal skill so you can heal when you can't summon. But the biggest problem with healing mesmer is always going to be the fact that you need a persistent enemy target to do anything. The open world event has only trash mobs? Sorry no boons for you. Your instanced PvE boss just phased? Sorry no boons for you. For as long as this handicap is in place mesmer support will remain second rate in PvE. 

My personal wishlist for rifle is for its clones to behave more like renegade spirits, you place them (and they could be kneeling and immobile) but you don't need a target and they just hit whatever close by from range, and shatter in place. While we're on this if ego restoration trait summons a clone that slaps the mesmers themselves and hence be persistent until shattered is also a welcome addition, and would do well to put mesmer on par with other support specs.

[Levetty.1279]

On 11/13/2023 at 5:29 AM, Heinel.6548 said:

TBH I don't think rifle needs to be any more potent in healing than staff currently can manage. It'll be nice to have a direct heal skill so you can heal when you can't summon. But the biggest problem with healing mesmer is always going to be the fact that you need a persistent enemy target to do anything. The open world event has only trash mobs? Sorry no boons for you. Your instanced PvE boss just phased? Sorry no boons for you. For as long as this handicap is in place mesmer support will remain second rate in PvE. 

My personal wishlist for rifle is for its clones to behave more like renegade spirits, you place them (and they could be kneeling and immobile) but you don't need a target and they just hit whatever close by from range, and shatter in place. While we're on this if ego restoration trait summons a clone that slaps the mesmers themselves and hence be persistent until shattered is also a welcome addition, and would do well to put mesmer on par with other support specs.

Sorry instead you get the most niche skill in the game that less then 0.01% of the player base will ever have a use for. Imagine actually wanting Mesmer to compete with other classes! 🙃

[ZephidelGRS.9520]

Barrier is now a "niche skill in the game that less then 0.01% of the player base will ever have a use for"? 🤪 It also gives Resistance btw.

[Teknomancer.4895]

Rifle looks to be useless for solo play, and the teaser video is 19 seconds of nothing much, maintaining their apparent insistence on keeping everything as secretive and obscure as possible.

Personally I'll probably pass on using it. Hope others will enjoy it.

[Roadkizzle.2157]

34 minutes ago, Teknomancer.4895 said:

Rifle looks to be useless for solo play, and the teaser video is 19 seconds of nothing much, maintaining their apparent insistence on keeping everything as secretive and obscure as possible.

Personally I'll probably pass on using it. Hope others will enjoy it.

That's been my view since the trailer.

We still don't know the Auto Attack, Clone, and Phantasm skills though.

 

They may be good damage and all... But then it probably won't be a very good support weapon.

I'm excited about doing Fractals more as I've been wanting to play a Heal Chrono since I started playing GW2. So I'll check out the rifle but the teaser didn't give me confidence in it being a useful solo or damage weapon.

[Bunny.9834]

On 11/7/2023 at 1:31 PM, Roadkizzle.2157 said:

Because they didn't want to turn a bow into a harp to make a bard?

Literally prefer this over this Rifle shenanigan. 

[Roadkizzle.2157]

23 hours ago, Bunny.9834 said:

Literally prefer this over this Rifle shenanigan. 

I'm sure you would. My question was getting to my thought that it seems like everyone gets so upset that their own idea of what would be a good next spec doesn't come to fruition.

 

Yes I understand that lots of you really want a bow-harp bard spec for Mesmer... Hell I would like that too. I love the idea of bards in fantasy.

 

But I think it's clear that the developers at Arenanet don't have that vision for the class. So I don't think there's any reason to get upset when the idea that you and the other players got in your own head doesn't materialize.

[Varis.5467]

Please give us mace in the next round Anet, so we can finally dual wield The Moot. 

Edited November 20, 2023 by Varis.5467

[Mell.4873]

On 11/13/2023 at 3:24 AM, Levetty.1279 said:

Anytime Mesmer gets something that might bring them close to what other classes have people flood reddit and these forums crying and shitting themselves over it. Have done for nearly 10 years now. 

I don't think that is fair characterization, ever since they returned the second dodge to Mirage they have been slowly returning or improving most of Mesmer's mechanics. I mean look at the upcoming Axe Ambush changes; that should make it a lot easier to use.

I even jumped ship to Revenant recently but returned since the scepter is finally being looked at.

Edited November 22, 2023 by Mell.4873

[Mell.4873]

The one thing Mesmer is missing is a weapon that can directly healing or even a single heal. Rifle will most likely be a pure healing weapon.

At the very least we can weapon swap to it, so for solo settings it could be nice for NPC or Human Allies. Before this you had to give up utilities to provide any supportive heals.

[Roadkizzle.2157]

9 minutes ago, Mell.4873 said:

The one thing Mesmer is missing is a weapon that can directly healing or even a single heal. Rifle will most likely be a pure healing weapon.

At the very least we can weapon swap to it, so for solo settings it could be nice for NPC or Human Allies. Before this you had to give up utilities to provide any supportive heals.

Well we know more now from the teaser trailer.

We know skill 3 and 5.

 

Skill 3 has a heal but you can't provide the boons from that skill to use it.

The proposed changes to the Inspiration traitline though unless they add a Cooldown looks like they may heal every time you use a Shatter though. 

If they don't add the cooldown from Healing Prism to the shatter skill then healing will likely be higher by just shattering as much as possible instead of trying to use weapon heal skills or Mantras.

The clone and phantasm skills are not known but it looks to me like there is only ever one illusion in the video so I'm expecting the clone generation to not be as fast as Scepter.

 

[Geronmy.3298]

Can delete, don't wanna double post.

Edited November 27, 2023 by Geronmy.3298
Not the main post.