I play powerweaver PvE, my damages are very bad

[Choco.4960]

I have a big problem with my powerweaver. Before anything : I use snowcrows guide, and I cancel swordspells with attunement change as they do in the video. I try to do exactly what's in the video.  On a burst with weaveself I reach max 30k against golem (modified 25% vulnerability, and me with all buffs). The bench is 42k so I am meant to be 5k under : 37k.

This morning while doing my fractals CM I lost control feeling so much like a burden for my teams. There was another powerweaver in the team and the comparison just pulverised my heart, I had 11k, they had 24k. My eyes were red blood, flowing alone, so was my nose, was horrible to feel, real mental pain. I ended my fractal runs in a pitiful state. Last time I've been like that was years ago.

After such a weeping fit, I admit I consider leaving the game for a while. Any advice to improve ?

[sonnie.2810]

4 hours ago, Choco.4960 said:

On a burst with weaveself I reach max 30k against golem (modified 25% vulnerability, and me with all buffs).

If this is the case you'll probably do more dps with the fire elemental elite than Weave Self.

4 hours ago, Choco.4960 said:

I cancel swordspells with attunement change as they do in the video

This is not true. Attunement switch does not cancel any skill casts.

As for improvements, do you know what skill queuing is? 30k at the golem with Weave Self sounds like you're just slow at executing the rotation. Queuing your skills property will result in faster rotation and therefore better dps.

Fractals are different story due to much shorter phases and the (relatively frequent) Exposed debuff. In general you want to use as many high dps skills as you can during Exposed. But this is hard to do in a pug group.

[soulknight.9620]

18 hours ago, Choco.4960 said:

On a burst with weaveself I reach max 30k against golem (modified 25% vulnerability, and me with all buffs). The bench is 42k so I am meant to be 5k under : 37k.

A few general advices from a player that plays ele for 9 years now:

First: stop looking at golem for efficiency. 

If you learn the meta golem rotation and try to execute it in fractals you will fail 90% of the time if you are not experienced enough with how your skills work. 

Get yourself an easy version of the build you are running (i recommend some of Mr Mystic buttonmash builds, most of them end up around 38-40k dps). You will loose some dps potential, but that is ok for learning purposes. Then just learn to execute skills according to the situation: if you need cc - learn timing and swap accordingly to get it right, if you need surviving - learn to use defensive combos like water2 into earth 2 followed by a few other blast combos, and only then focus on dps. Important part of weaver rotation is being able to timely "reset" the rotation to the starting position for burn phase. Remember that pressured/dead dps does 0 dps. When you will get comfortable with easy version of that build - then try the "meta" one. 

Another thing, weave self is a "noob trap". Its a powerfull skill in experienced hands to further increase your dps. But if you struggle with core rotation and basic weaver mechanics it will only worsen your experience. Try elemental elite for starters. When you feel confident enough with basic stuff - then change it back to weave self. 

18 hours ago, Choco.4960 said:

This morning while doing my fractals CM I lost control feeling so much like a burden for my teams. There was another powerweaver in the team and the comparison just pulverised my heart, I had 11k, they had 24k.

You need to find an issue here. Were you pressured by fractal mechanics that you couldnt do dps? And what boss was it? As a weaver you need to know how and when to execute your burst combo since we lack range to constantly pump up dps. Some of the bosses are really hard to do with melee weaver. 

18 hours ago, Choco.4960 said:

I ended my fractal runs in a pitiful state.

Define a problem, analise it, improve. Thats the core pattern you need to take. Your post doesnt provide enough info for us to give you a meaningfull advice. 

[DaKillaOfHell.5907]

On 12/6/2023 at 6:03 PM, Choco.4960 said:

I have a big problem with my powerweaver. Before anything : I use snowcrows guide, and I cancel swordspells with attunement change as they do in the video. I try to do exactly what's in the video.  On a burst with weaveself I reach max 30k against golem (modified 25% vulnerability, and me with all buffs). The bench is 42k so I am meant to be 5k under : 37k.

 

First of all:

You just saw a snowcrows video.

You probably didn't see the 99 trys until it worked out like that.

 

Secondly: Forget the benchmarks. They mean nothing in a real situation. It is the same what me and many other more experienced players (though I am nowhere being good to be honest) already critisize for a long time, that this is no benchmarks for bosses where you have a lot of movement, mechanics, you name it...

 

Third: As soulknight said, try a LI build first, something more simple and not as sophisticated as this build even though you don't do the 42k benchmark.

 

[soulknight.9620]

7 hours ago, soulknight.9620 said:

i recommend some of Mr Mystic buttonmash builds, most of them end up around 38-40k dps

This build works fine for starters. 

[ExtliQuani.4063]

Can second what Soulknight said (was searching for the exact same video, it is what I use when I do power Weaver). Even for condi Weaver I use a Mr Mystic Build.

[Azume.3274]

Yeah, i'm running power weaver too sword+dagger and my burst with weaver self i got 34k idk what i'm doing wrong.
In the other hand, my condi build got higher numbers, like 37k

[the krytan assassin.9235]

I'd say its mainly due to not swapping attunements fast enough or not chaining your weapon skills resulting in alot of interrupts. (At least on golem)

Also i normally prefer to take offhand dagger and fresh air over warhorn and Bolt to the heart for most actual fights. It gives overall alot more versatility and usually has higher overall output in mechanic heavy fights

Edited December 9, 2023 by the krytan assassin.9235

[Choco.4960]

I have asked an experienced weaver to show me the 42k rotation. It seems it works for them. They told me "you're just slow". So I guess I am slow. I can't be any faster, and I don't feel I am slow while playing weaver, because I already press a lot of keys. It's always a real pain for me to see I am behind the others. Sometimes your best is not enough. This is the life. Thanks for sharing your tips.

[zeyeti.8347]

My two cents about it : you should try the catalyst sword/warhorn , because:

-You are used to the sword gameplay

-catalyst with sword/warhorn is way easier to play than weaver 

-you are more tanky , catalyst has a natural tankiness with elemental empowerment stacks who give you +1% to each stats per stacks (1.5 now with the rework, work on viatlity and thougness and if you have a jade bot it further give you vitality)

-even if you are not top notch damage you contribute to the group trough boons , catalyst can add a very large variety of boons to the group and it's not lost on a fight like 100 or 99 cm cause the boss has so many split phase the boons are lacking (especially might)

You took the weaver , as many other ppl said you falled in the "meta snowcrow trap" weaver is maybe the hardest class to master of the game , you have the lowest armor and the lowest hp (for no obvious reason to my thoughts) and the rotation is sweaty as hell and need a fair high time off training , this class is also very dependent of your support and group , your target need to be under the effect of "weakness" the whole time for Superior Elements to work or else you are at 85% crit. chance who is really bad for a power build and you cannot upkeep weakness on your own.

Train your rotation in open world on more forgiven mobs , or use the catalyst version of your build (you will still train the sword and get the hang of it), but be assured you ll need a lot of training to get to the high results , ppl like Fennec , my blasts are awesome , etc from the snowcrow community etc needed a lot of trainings to have those results, i franckly gave up on the ele , i found many other class doing the same with more ease and efficiency today , but i encourage you to persevere on ele !

16 minutes ago, Choco.4960 said:

"you're just slow"

yeah ... feeling quick with an ele is not the same , it's another kind of quickness 😆, pretty near lightspeed.

[Bleikopf.2491]

6 hours ago, Choco.4960 said:

I have asked an experienced weaver to show me the 42k rotation. It seems it works for them. They told me "you're just slow". So I guess I am slow. I can't be any faster, and I don't feel I am slow while playing weaver, because I already press a lot of keys. It's always a real pain for me to see I am behind the others. Sometimes your best is not enough. This is the life. Thanks for sharing your tips.

Maybe it's less about how fast you are and more about how you press your buttons. 

You can chain 1 skill. 

You can swap attunements while casting a skill without canceling it. 

Also, do you have customized your key bindings? F1-4 are, imo, horrible for elementalist because you're constantly pressing them. If you haven't changed your key bindings yet, I'd highly recommend to do so. Personally, I have my attunement swaps on shift+1-4, and my weapon skills on 1-4. This way I never need to move my hand position (much). 

[Choco.4960]

22 minutes ago, Bleikopf.2491 said:

Also, do you have customized your key bindings?

You don't know who you talk to haha. I was playing WoW before as priest (27 keys), so I'm used to move with S-E-F instead of A-W-D to have even more keys reachable. At this point this is pathetic lmao ; such a nolife trick. It's dismissive. I know. Still I definitely have no problem with keybinding.

Though I'm pretty curious to know how you can press shift and 1 at the same time, because my fingers can't do it. (too short)

Off topic. I will try to reach 40k dps. Some advice were to learn rotation with a paper on skill bars to hide it. So I'm gonna try like this. And if I fail I think I'll just uninstall, GW2 is too hard for me. My dps prevents me to do many things, like CMs, raid, and I'm tired to be left behind, kicked out of PUGs and guilds, because I'm not efficient enough.

About Fresh air build + elemental, I've tried, got 27k dmg, so... far away from the ongoing 40k of the video. So well it's not a build problem. 

[ExtliQuani.4063]

Hi have you tried condi weaver? Its easier imo cause you do not need to stay in complete meele range?

And please do not forget that golem damage is not everything, I can do 33k dps on the golem (as condi weaver ) and tried the power build Soulknight posted and did 31k (with 0 Training on it or anything just cycling between fire and air and spam everything on CD, I do not play Powerweaver that often).

In most encounters I do sth between 20k and 30k as full dps (depending on which fight and how experienced I am with the mechanics) and this dmg is sufficient most of the time. 

The only time PUGs kicked me were when I kittened up mechanics more then once(which is ok imo, as long it is not a training run), but never because of my DPS.

PS: As you see I am nowhere near the snowcrow benchmark and still manage to go raid (even a few CMs) because its enough dmg, knowing the encounter and not dying to avoidable stuff is worth way more. 

Edit: Tested my Golem DPS

Edited December 10, 2023 by ExtliQuani.4063

[AliamRationem.5172]

1 hour ago, ExtliQuani.4063 said:

Hi have you tried condi weaver? Its easier imo cause you do not need to stay in complete meele range?

And please do not forget that golem damage is not everything, I can do 33k dps on the golem (as condi weaver ) and tried the power build Soulknight posted and did 31k (with 0 Training on it or anything just cycling between fire and air and spam everything on CD, I do not play Powerweaver that often).

In most encounters I do sth between 20k and 30k as full dps (depending on which fight and how experienced I am with the mechanics) and this dmg is sufficient most of the time. 

The only time PUGs kicked me were when I kittened up mechanics more then once(which is ok imo, as long it is not a training run), but never because of my DPS.

PS: As you see I am nowhere near the snowcrow benchmark and still manage to go raid (even a few CMs) because its enough dmg, knowing the encounter and not dying to avoidable stuff is worth way more. 

Edit: Tested my Golem DPS

I second this advice.  Condi scepter is the easiest weaver build and its benchmark is nearly as good as power sword.  It occurs to me that you can't be doing less than half the damage of other weavers due to rotation issues alone. 

You're probably unfamiliar with the flow of the encounters and you're out of position, which kills your DPS on melee builds.  A ranged build will be more forgiving.  Scepter also has no AA chain to deal with.

 

[Nephalem.8921]

Power weaver without weave self is one of the easiest builds in the game. Just take fgs and cast 5 and throw it away. You can even precast it on bosses. Try to not interrupt autos while going from air to fire and back. The base rotation is very simple.

When you have the simple rotation down you can try weave self but you should not degrade into mr mystic builds. If you can do cm fractals then you can press 5 buttons in order too.

Also golem dps matters because it shows that you know the rotation. 95% bench requires some effort but 90% is fairly free most of the time. Posters here writing that 30k are totally fine are the reason why groups have to raise kp amounts constantly. Thats fairly below boondps. Dont get outdamaged by supports but even in 25k ufe groups i get leechers nowadays.

You can do it. Dont listen to people here telling you that you should not even try and tell you to use a toddler build instead.

Check the arc log on golem and compare it with the bench log outside of weave self. there is a simple rotation section on dps report. Try to mimic the number of auto chains before skills and try to minimize aa bleeds. That means interrupted aas or only 1st skill in chain before a skill use. Thats usually the issue. 4aa chains on air, 2 on fire.

 

Edited December 11, 2023 by Nephalem.8921

[ExtliQuani.4063]

5 hours ago, Nephalem.8921 said:

Power weaver without weave self is one of the easiest builds in the game. Just take fgs and cast 5 and throw it away. You can even precast it on bosses. Try to not interrupt autos while going from air to fire and back. The base rotation is very simple.

When you have the simple rotation down you can try weave self but you should not degrade into mr mystic builds. If you can do cm fractals then you can press 5 buttons in order too.

Also golem dps matters because it shows that you know the rotation. 95% bench requires some effort but 90% is fairly free most of the time. Posters here writing that 30k are totally fine are the reason why groups have to raise kp amounts constantly. Thats fairly below boondps. Dont get outdamaged by supports but even in 25k ufe groups i get leechers nowadays.

You can do it. Dont listen to people here telling you that you should not even try and tell you to use a toddler build instead.

Check the arc log on golem and compare it with the bench log outside of weave self. there is a simple rotation section on dps report. Try to mimic the number of auto chains before skills and try to minimize aa bleeds. That means interrupted aas or only 1st skill in chain before a skill use. Thats usually the issue. 4aa chains on air, 2 on fire.

 

Hi I do not know in what groups you play cause with my DPS I get never out dpsed by a support build in the PUGs I have played. 

And I am aware that there are people better than me (probably a lot), but in my entire time playing GW2 I have seen people once doing the snowcrow benchmark on an encounter (in my case that was 2 Necros on Fractal CMs and to give them credit they did the Benchmark on every single one of them - the new 100 one (we did not do that)) and yeah that felt like getting hard carried (I was the alac DPS for them).

Also I did not say he should not try to improve, but I think it does not help to improve to just camp the Golem and try to get the rotation down in a vacuum cause doing it while moving and adjusting to the encounters phases (e.g. CC Phases) is different. 

All I wanted was to encourage him to keep playing and assure him that he can do (training) raids. Because in my humble opnion doing the rotation in a heated environment helps to get it on autopilot what should improve the golem numbers in the long run (atleast that was the case for me).

 

[Friend.2837]

On 12/10/2023 at 6:15 PM, Nephalem.8921 said:

Power weaver without weave self is one of the easiest builds in the game. Just take fgs and cast 5 and throw it away. You can even precast it on bosses. Try to not interrupt autos while going from air to fire and back. The base rotation is very simple.

When you have the simple rotation down you can try weave self but you should not degrade into mr mystic builds. If you can do cm fractals then you can press 5 buttons in order too.

Also golem dps matters because it shows that you know the rotation. 95% bench requires some effort but 90% is fairly free most of the time. Posters here writing that 30k are totally fine are the reason why groups have to raise kp amounts constantly. Thats fairly below boondps. Dont get outdamaged by supports but even in 25k ufe groups i get leechers nowadays.

You can do it. Dont listen to people here telling you that you should not even try and tell you to use a toddler build instead.

Check the arc log on golem and compare it with the bench log outside of weave self. there is a simple rotation section on dps report. Try to mimic the number of auto chains before skills and try to minimize aa bleeds. That means interrupted aas or only 1st skill in chain before a skill use. Thats usually the issue. 4aa chains on air, 2 on fire.

 

Harsh, but fair points. OP, there are a lot of veterans in the community who have a bad habit of pushing new players towards training wheels when they can manage perfectly fine without them.

Does power weaver have a somewhat steep learning curve? Yes, esp in CMs, mostly because of how squishy it is. Is the rotation itself hard? Not particularly.

Do not be discouraged by bad performance while you learn. Compare your golem logs with benchmark logs and see where you are losing time / messing up skill order. The people over on the Snowcrows discord are also a great resource if you ever want to ask more specific questions.

Good luck, you can do it!

[Friend.2837]

On 12/11/2023 at 12:48 AM, ExtliQuani.4063 said:

Hi I do not know in what groups you play cause with my DPS I get never out dpsed by a support build in the PUGs I have played. 

And I am aware that there are people better than me (probably a lot), but in my entire time playing GW2 I have seen people once doing the snowcrow benchmark on an encounter (in my case that was 2 Necros on Fractal CMs and to give them credit they did the Benchmark on every single one of them - the new 100 one (we did not do that)) and yeah that felt like getting hard carried (I was the alac DPS for them).

Also I did not say he should not try to improve, but I think it does not help to improve to just camp the Golem and try to get the rotation down in a vacuum cause doing it while moving and adjusting to the encounters phases (e.g. CC Phases) is different. 

All I wanted was to encourage him to keep playing and assure him that he can do (training) raids. Because in my humble opnion doing the rotation in a heated environment helps to get it on autopilot what should improve the golem numbers in the long run (atleast that was the case for me).

 

It's indeed true that OP should feel no qualms going into training raids with a 60% benchmark, but real gameplay and golem benching aren't mutually exclusive.

Never have I found that practicing a golem rotation makes me perform worse in an actual encounter - in fact it helps me develop the muscle memory to recognize how I've deviated from my golem rotation (perhaps for CC, perhaps to squeeze in more burst during a phase) and how to "fix" it.

Personal opinion, the average pug vastly underperforms compared to the damage potential of their class. If one truly wants to improve (and it sounds like OP does), one does not want to compare themselves to pugs. A simple way to gauge your own performance is to see where you land on gw2wingman logs.

[Kuma.1503]

Here are some tips that might help you. 

1. Practice your rotation against the moving golem. 

If you can hit ~85% of the Snowcrows benchmark agaisnt the stationary golem, try the moving golem for extra challenge. You will eat a DPS loss on most builds because the golem moves out of AoE. This is fine. Being able to do your rotation properly while moving will help ease you into real content. 

2. Learn your class mechanics and skill priorities 

Learning your class mechanics tends to come naturally as you start optimizing for that last ~15% benchmark DPS. Look up guides, ask questions in SC discord, consult other players. 

Having a good grasp on your class and which buttons should be prioritized first will help you a ton when you have to pause your rotation and your cooldown timings get thrown off. This will help you to quickly adjust and get things back on track. 

3. Don't compare yourself to other players. 

This isn't an ego contest. It's just a game. Don't stress because you're not the highest number on the DPS chart. Just try to improve your gameplay so you're better than you were yesterday. 

 

[tiagotatico.6304]

On 12/7/2023 at 8:32 AM, soulknight.9620 said:

A few general advices from a player that plays ele for 9 years now:

First: stop looking at golem for efficiency. 

If you learn the meta golem rotation and try to execute it in fractals you will fail 90% of the time if you are not experienced enough with how your skills work. 

Get yourself an easy version of the build you are running (i recommend some of Mr Mystic buttonmash builds, most of them end up around 38-40k dps). You will loose some dps potential, but that is ok for learning purposes. Then just learn to execute skills according to the situation: if you need cc - learn timing and swap accordingly to get it right, if you need surviving - learn to use defensive combos like water2 into earth 2 followed by a few other blast combos, and only then focus on dps. Important part of weaver rotation is being able to timely "reset" the rotation to the starting position for burn phase. Remember that pressured/dead dps does 0 dps. When you will get comfortable with easy version of that build - then try the "meta" one. 

Another thing, weave self is a "noob trap". Its a powerfull skill in experienced hands to further increase your dps. But if you struggle with core rotation and basic weaver mechanics it will only worsen your experience. Try elemental elite for starters. When you feel confident enough with basic stuff - then change it back to weave self. 

You need to find an issue here. Were you pressured by fractal mechanics that you couldnt do dps? And what boss was it? As a weaver you need to know how and when to execute your burst combo since we lack range to constantly pump up dps. Some of the bosses are really hard to do with melee weaver. 

Define a problem, analise it, improve. Thats the core pattern you need to take. Your post doesnt provide enough info for us to give you a meaningfull advice. 

this is a horrible advice, first weave self is a must skill, specially for fractals, where you have to burst, for both condi and power, even outside fractals, weave self is great, while on weave self you gain damage reduction, you get stability by using sword fire/earth3 etc, mymystic runs his benchmarks with infusions and more important tesis, this inflates his benchmarks, specially on power builds due to how much multiplicative bonus they have, you can make the test and post the log here, no way you are getting 38k on pweaver by just button smashing, that is 0% of chance of this happening, you have to do a lot of stuff, for instance you want to cancel fire 2 with other skills because the horrible aftercast, also you have a horrible, dogshit burst, its really bad, you are going be from 11k to 12k, that is no such a thing as when execute your burst combo, you should always be rotating trough skills while damaging the boss, by executing your burst you meant the weave self that is ok, you need to know when to use after the first usage, because you dont want to waste it while the boss is invulnerable, lastly DO GO to the golem, you are not learning nothing by repeating the same mistakes, the idea is to train on the golem and try to do a much as close as possible on real fights, doing the oposite will cause a lot of frustation because you dont know the rotation in the first place.