Why rev disappeared from snowcrows benchmarks?

[gyravi.9632]

Title.

After the spear nerfs why even all the other condi variant disappeared from snowcrows benchmarks?

Dps is dropped that low that it's not even listed? Anyone knows?

[UncreativeGreen.2019]

They should have never posted them in the first place. It was obvious that they were outside of the devs current allotted power creep range of 43-46k. It was just more work for them to make all the guides and update all the pages. Now the authors have to put in more work to change it all and It usually takes them awhile to do so. Give it another week, it’ll be back up on the benchmark list. 
 

All of that said, if you really cared about the build you just go bench the old build after the nerfs and realize that the dps loss isn’t that big that it’s worth panicking about. In fact it’s within the top range of the current spread. However I’m sure you’ll need a website to tell you that before you believe it.

Edited Thursday at 01:22 PM by UncreativeGreen.2019

[gyravi.9632]

35 minutes ago, UncreativeGreen.2019 said:

However I’m sure you’ll need a website to tell you that before you believe it.

However I'm sure you are a kid.

I was just wondering and that's all.

[arazoth.7290]

3 hours ago, gyravi.9632 said:

However I'm sure you are a kid.

I was just wondering and that's all.

he's speaking facts because it's easy to test yourself and see the small difference instead of waiting on snowcrows

[Buran.3796]

4 hours ago, UncreativeGreen.2019 said:

They should have never posted them in the first place.

   ...If they wouldn't have posted how would ANet known about how much the spear was overperforming? 

   Is quite obvious that every new weapon or spec opens ways to min-max the new skills with older ones and any kind of gear, and is impossible for ANet to forecast every permutation, whereas inside Snow Crows probably there's a few amount of players specialized in a few classes, and usually they are the ones which showcase the peak numbers (never saw a developer uploading a record). In this game, is the famdom the main source of both knownledge (see the Wikia) and the state of the balance; ANet is just reactive beacuse oftenly they aren't even able to see what they have beyond their noses...   Showcasing videos of recods and bugs is a good thing, because pushes developers to do their work and fix problems.

[UncreativeGreen.2019]

32 minutes ago, Buran.3796 said:

 ...If they wouldn't have posted how would ANet known about how much the spear was overperforming? 

I mean, Anet has other ways to track metrics and build performances outside of a third party fan run website. I'm not saying they don't refer to that website when looking at a way a build is played by the community, but they're capable of basic math. If you did the old swapping back and forth from mace/axe to spear right after release, it was actually close to 45k. So the math was right if we just replaced short bow with spear. Anet just made the mistake of not thinking what would happen if you just camped the weapon. 

The thing I'm referring to is why go to the effort to make a guide and post a bench mark to a very public website when it's extremely obvious it'll get nerfed. Especially when, I don't know, lets say the price of tormenting sigils spiked the way they did. Weird that the 54k benchmark build came out on Aug. 24th, the video they used on the 21st. 300 of the sigils where bought on the 20th before really spiking on the 22nd and 23rd. and then all of them being re released into the market 12g higher on the 24th.... weird.

[Shagie.7612]

how would it have dropped "so low it's not even listed" when at worst it would have been back to what sb/mace+axe was before spear released

[Jobber.6348]

I see 3 right here: 

Condition Alacrity Renegade Build - Guild Wars 2 - Snow Crows
Condition Renegade Build - Guild Wars 2 - Snow Crows
Condition Quickness Herald Build - Guild Wars 2 - Snow Crows

Most likely they take down builds which they want to re-bench on and tailor a little more for better optimization. Snowcrows are run by humans afterall, they don't update at a snap. 

[Kulvar.1239]

I hope the meta will no longer use only spear but use mace/axe too.

[ArthurDent.9538]

Fun fact on benchmarks: we have reclaimed our title for having the lowest pdps benchmark of all classes. Every single class has a power dps build with better damage than power vindi except for rev.

[Kulvar.1239]

Condition Alacrity Renegade and Condition Quickness Herald have been added back on the Snow Crows benchmark.

 

13 hours ago, ArthurDent.9538 said:

Fun fact on benchmarks: we have reclaimed our title for having the lowest pdps benchmark of all classes. Every single class has a power dps build with better damage than power vindi except for rev.

Someone has to be the lowest, what matter is by how much it is behind.

Power Vindicator sits at a comfortable 42k on the benchmark.

If anything, the big issue is that the top is dominated by power builds when a training golem should favor condition builds, meaning many power builds are overtuned.

[ArthurDent.9538]

1 hour ago, Kulvar.1239 said:

Condition Alacrity Renegade and Condition Quickness Herald have been added back on the Snow Crows benchmark.

 

Someone has to be the lowest, what matter is by how much it is behind.

Power Vindicator sits at a comfortable 42k on the benchmark.

If anything, the big issue is that the top is dominated by power builds when a training golem should favor condition builds, meaning many power builds are overtuned.

You aren't wrong that someone has to be lowest I just find it crazy how consistently rev occupies this position which was basically from the start of pof (necro occasionally dipped lower as power reaper was also quite bad for a long time) all the way up till a bit after EoD release (vindi was super undertuned damage wise at first but that didn't last too long).

As for power vs condi, I see ranged vs. melee as a bigger issue and there are a ton of super overtuned ranged weapons right now which is a purely advantageous feature. Condi builds tend to be bad in short bursty fights but do have the advantage in tough grueling encounters like Cerus CM and certain solo fights where they can build with more defenses without sacrificing as much dps as power builds (trailblazer stats are still decent dps where as for instance knight's stats are terrible damage).

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

14 hours ago, ArthurDent.9538 said:

You aren't wrong that someone has to be lowest I just find it crazy how consistently rev occupies this position which was basically from the start of pof (necro occasionally dipped lower as power reaper was also quite bad for a long time) all the way up till a bit after EoD release (vindi was super undertuned damage wise at first but that didn't last too long).

As for power vs condi, I see ranged vs. melee as a bigger issue and there are a ton of super overtuned ranged weapons right now which is a purely advantageous feature. Condi builds tend to be bad in short bursty fights but do have the advantage in tough grueling encounters like Cerus CM and certain solo fights where they can build with more defenses without sacrificing as much dps as power builds (trailblazer stats are still decent dps where as for instance knight's stats are terrible damage).

Just to further emphasize your point, Rev pDPS in HoT was pretty much non-existent as well. Only used for its Facet of Nature buff for a time (NEVER for its damage) then completely dropped til cRen in PoF. Rev has pretty much never had a pDPS option that was even close to solid until Vindicator with EoD and even that sucked for a while

[Jobber.6348]

4 hours ago, LucianTheAngelic.7054 said:

Just to further emphasize your point, Rev pDPS in HoT was pretty much non-existent as well. Only used for its Facet of Nature buff for a time (NEVER for its damage) then completely dropped til cRen in PoF. Rev has pretty much never had a pDPS option that was even close to solid until Vindicator with EoD and even that sucked for a while

Such is a class at the mercy of having Legend sets as a whole instead of individual utilities to mix and match with.

For the longest time only having Shiro as a power damage Legend is rather poor for their power damage resume. You similarly do not see Herald ever being played in the meta as Condi DPS back in HoT either because it's nothing to write home about with just Glint Mallyx, mind you old Mallyx was also alot different, having a rather weak EtD that mainly boosted your stats and their CTA was a leap that has the same expensive energy to leave a static field of Chill and Torment. Those did not do Mallyx any favors at all. 

Non Vindicator Power builds will forever lack because they lack Alliance. Archemorus does alot of heavy lifting for DPS in addition to Death Drop. Arguably Death Drop contributes alot more to the damage over time but having a 2nd Power damage Legend does help fill your damage resume. 

And no Jalis is not a Power Legend. It just does somewhat okay Power damage and non LI Quick Heralds opt to run Glint anyway because she deals more damage than Upkeep camperoni Jalis. 

[draxynnic.3719]

14 hours ago, Jobber.6348 said:

And no Jalis is not a Power Legend. It just does somewhat okay Power damage and non LI Quick Heralds opt to run Glint anyway because she deals more damage than Upkeep camperoni Jalis. 

I think the extra boon coverage offered by Glint is also a big part of that. When a quickherald wants stability, it's usually Shiro that gets traded for Jalis rather than Glint. Jalis does have lower DPS than Shiro but if that wasn't the case, Shiro would never be used.

[Jobber.6348]

1 hour ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

I think the extra boon coverage offered by Glint is also a big part of that. When a quickherald wants stability, it's usually Shiro that gets traded for Jalis rather than Glint. Jalis does have lower DPS than Shiro but if that wasn't the case, Shiro would never be used.

I've not really seen QuickDPS Herald be relegated to Stability duty but I guess there are always situations where you would need someone else to bring extra stab, in which yes, that's a rather valid case.