The Ultimate Pistol/Pistol Discussion Thread

[Turk.5460]

@Jana.6831 said:I don't see how this is high risk and high reward. You can always use bound to stealth, you can dodge and you can use shadowstep. If the enemies don't have blocks or reflects there's little they can do.

DE cannot bound. As for Shadowstep, thats a core ability that pretty much every Thief uses. Are you saying that every single Core Thief, Daredevil, and Deadeye build inherently never has any risk involved?

[Jana.6831]

@Turk.5460 said:DE cannot bound. As for Shadowstep, thats a core ability that pretty much every Thief uses. Are you saying that every single Core Thief, Daredevil, and Deadeye build inherently never has any risk involved?Then use Blinding Powder for some extra blast.So you think that your P/P is high risk because you're using shadowstep?No, you can easily get away as can D/P and every thief who uses DrD - D/D not so much.You don't have 'only one chance and if it fails..' you have plenty.

[babazhook.6805]

@Cameryn.5310 said:Glad to have found this thread. I get looks from people when I go P/P but I love it. As a deadeye running dual pistols for close combat and rifle for range, my character is the ultimate gunslinger... add in some handy stealth tools and I've been able to down groups of mobs without breaking a sweat. :) I only play PVE though, not PVP.

Here's my current build... I use a build heavy on power, toughness & vitality to stay alive. The only downside is that there's no clear AoE option:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZEQNAqaUnsMBtFj1FDWOBUGjFaCjPYWMbmbVgLQFSLAMhmNA-jxxFABXoHwE1GoR53ZaCAQJ4gqyQ/+DAA-e

I am not replying to your build in general but just making a general observation when it comes to AOE and its lacking in a PVE perspective (or for that matter if fighting groups in WvW) when using p/p and rifle.

People who desire it in a build should look into hybrids , and or leveraging the might stacking available to DE and p/p in general so as to use the new stolen skills as AOE. I was testing this at range against clusters of those raptors in Pve just to see how effective it was and if traited for it you can lay down a lot of condition AOE at range in short order.What I have not been able to determine is whether the application of said conditions against clusters of enemies varies in duration depending on which is marked and which is not. Logic seems to suggest that the mark would get the added durations based on malice stacks while those caught in the AOE effect would not.

[Shirlias.8104]

I still cry and hate em for that.

[Turk.5460]

@Jana.6831 said:

@Turk.5460 said:DE cannot bound. As for Shadowstep, thats a core ability that pretty much every Thief uses. Are you saying that every single Core Thief, Daredevil, and Deadeye build inherently never has any risk involved?Then use Blinding Powder for some extra blast.So you think that your P/P is high risk because you're using shadowstep?No, you can easily get away as can D/P and every thief who uses DrD - D/D not so much.You don't have 'only one chance and if it fails..' you have plenty.

Your reply is all over the place, and doesn't much relate to the comment you quoted, so I'm not sure what you're looking for here. D/D can just as easily get away. Shadowstep and blinding powder. Or CnD an ambient creature or supply hut. Or shortbow. D/D has plenty of "chances" - whatever that means to you. Please stay on the topic of P/P from here, as that is what the discussion is about.

[Aomine.5012]

I'm gladly trading ricochet for our current top tier range dps p /p on deadeye.The old p p dps is just terrible and only have fun factor when it bounces.

[Aomine.5012]

@Sir Vincent III.1286 said:

@Drawing Guy.3701 said:Unload never had big damage that was nerfed - I've had a thief since 2012. I don't think you remember how little it did - full glass cannon (max modifier traits and full zerker with food) would be lucky to break 8k if everything crit. You'd be lucky to get a 1k crit with Vital Shot (P1). Just watch videos of people running P/P pre-2015.

Keep in mind, the items back in 2012 are not as tanky as they are now, 8k was about 75% of anyone's health bar -- now 8k is about 50%. It takes 2 Unload to kill anyone. Also back then, Body Shot applies 5 stacks of Vuln at the cost of 3 init and lasts 6s -- which is plenty of time to Unload 2x. What made Unload devastating is not just its massive damage, rather its ability to continually CC everyone in range which has dominated in a lot of team fights. If I remember correctly, Richochet was proc-ing AoE sigils too. I remember doing a Body Shot -> Unload -> Steal combo (Mug used to deal a lot of damage and it can crit) to kill anyone.

As I've already mentioned, the slow shots of Unload were balanced then because of all the other things you can do when using P/P. Today, Unload might look good compared to the old with all the things that come with it, but just like the Unload then, it is now also balanced, albeit pigeon-holed. Now I can't even kill anyone even when I've dealt 15k total with 2 Unloads in addition to a lot of anti-projectile counterplays.

You're overestimating pistol back then.The dps is so bad that no-one actually uses them in any serious contents, and it's mostly for funzy cuz the initiative/ damage ratio is just terrible.

[Sir Vincent III.1286]

@Aomine.5012 said:

@Sir Vincent III.1286 said:

@"Drawing Guy.3701" said:Unload never had big damage that was nerfed - I've had a thief since 2012. I don't think you remember how little it did - full glass cannon (max modifier traits and full zerker with food) would be lucky to break 8k if everything crit. You'd be lucky to get a 1k crit with Vital Shot (P1). Just watch videos of people running P/P pre-2015.

Keep in mind, the items back in 2012 are not as tanky as they are now, 8k was about 75% of anyone's health bar -- now 8k is about 50%. It takes 2 Unload to kill anyone. Also back then, Body Shot applies 5 stacks of Vuln at the cost of 3 init and lasts 6s -- which is plenty of time to Unload 2x. What made Unload devastating is not just its massive damage, rather its ability to continually CC everyone in range which has dominated in a lot of team fights. If I remember correctly, Richochet was proc-ing AoE sigils too. I remember doing a Body Shot -> Unload -> Steal combo (Mug used to deal a lot of damage and it can crit) to kill anyone.

As I've already mentioned, the slow shots of Unload were balanced then because of all the other things you can do when using P/P. Today, Unload might look good compared to the old with all the things that come with it, but just like the Unload then, it is now also balanced, albeit pigeon-holed. Now I can't even kill anyone even when I've dealt 15k total with 2 Unloads in addition to a lot of anti-projectile counterplays.

You're overestimating pistol back then.The dps is so bad that no-one actually uses them in any serious contents, and it's mostly for funzy cuz the initiative/ damage ratio is just terrible.

If what you say is true, then why did they nerfed it by removing Ricochet and nerfing Ankle Shot? Not to mention the nerf on Body Shot and Black Powder. Also reducing the range from 1200 to 900.

That's a lot of nerfs for something that I'm "overestimating."

[Aomine.5012]

@Sir Vincent III.1286 said:

@Drawing Guy.3701 said:Unload never had big damage that was nerfed - I've had a thief since 2012. I don't think you remember how little it did - full glass cannon (max modifier traits and full zerker with food) would be lucky to break 8k if everything crit. You'd be lucky to get a 1k crit with Vital Shot (P1). Just watch videos of people running P/P pre-2015.

Keep in mind, the items back in 2012 are not as tanky as they are now, 8k was about 75% of anyone's health bar -- now 8k is about 50%. It takes 2 Unload to kill anyone. Also back then, Body Shot applies 5 stacks of Vuln at the cost of 3 init and lasts 6s -- which is plenty of time to Unload 2x. What made Unload devastating is not just its massive damage, rather its ability to continually CC everyone in range which has dominated in a lot of team fights. If I remember correctly, Richochet was proc-ing AoE sigils too. I remember doing a Body Shot -> Unload -> Steal combo (Mug used to deal a lot of damage and it can crit) to kill anyone.

As I've already mentioned, the slow shots of Unload were balanced then because of all the other things you can do when using P/P. Today, Unload might look good compared to the old with all the things that come with it, but just like the Unload then, it is now also balanced, albeit pigeon-holed. Now I can't even kill anyone even when I've dealt 15k total with 2 Unloads in addition to a lot of anti-projectile counterplays.

You're overestimating pistol back then.The dps is so bad that no-one barely uses them in any real contents, and it's mostly for funzy cuz the initiative/ damage ratio is just terrible.> @Sir Vincent III.1286 said:

@Aomine.5012 said:

@Sir Vincent III.1286 said:

@Drawing Guy.3701 said:Unload never had big damage that was nerfed - I've had a thief since 2012. I don't think you remember how little it did - full glass cannon (max modifier traits and full zerker with food) would be lucky to break 8k if everything crit. You'd be lucky to get a 1k crit with Vital Shot (P1). Just watch videos of people running P/P pre-2015.

Keep in mind, the items back in 2012 are not as tanky as they are now, 8k was about 75% of anyone's health bar -- now 8k is about 50%. It takes 2 Unload to kill anyone. Also back then, Body Shot applies 5 stacks of Vuln at the cost of 3 init and lasts 6s -- which is plenty of time to Unload 2x. What made Unload devastating is not just its massive damage, rather its ability to continually CC everyone in range which has dominated in a lot of team fights. If I remember correctly, Richochet was proc-ing AoE sigils too. I remember doing a Body Shot -> Unload -> Steal combo (Mug used to deal a lot of damage and it can crit) to kill anyone.

As I've already mentioned, the slow shots of Unload were balanced then because of all the other things you can do when using P/P. Today, Unload might look good compared to the old with all the things that come with it, but just like the Unload then, it is now also balanced, albeit pigeon-holed. Now I can't even kill anyone even when I've dealt 15k total with 2 Unloads in addition to a lot of anti-projectile counterplays.

You're overestimating pistol back then.The dps is so bad that no-one actually uses them in any serious contents, and it's mostly for funzy cuz the initiative/ damage ratio is just terrible.

If what you say is true, then why did they nerfed it by removing Ricochet and nerfing Ankle Shot? Not to mention the nerf on Body Shot and Black Powder. Also reducing the range from 1200 to 900.

That's a lot of nerfs for something that I'm "overestimating."

And instead now initiative cost is 3, grant stacking mights, which make it a realistic weapon set to bring compare to before.Just tested on raid golem p/p + p/p deadeye-> 25.2k dps.

For reference, Ranger LB dps is around 16.5k at 1000 range, only hit one target too. (Predator Onslaught)If you bring piercing trait on LB, then dps drop to 14.5k. If you hit target below 500 range, dps drops to 12.5k.

[Sir Vincent III.1286]

@Aomine.5012 said:

And instead now initiative cost is 3, grant stacking mights, which make it a realistic weapon set to bring compare to before.Just tested on raid golem p/p + p/p deadeye-> 25.2k dps.

For reference, Ranger LB dps is around 16.5k at 1000 range, only hit one target too. (Predator Onslaught)If you bring piercing trait on LB, then dps drop to 14.5k. If you hit target below 500 range, dps drops to 12.5k.

Might stacking in a raid or any group scenario is not a plus because someone else in the raid or group can apply that buff with longer duration, thus it is not an advantage over the first iteration of P/P. The first iteration of P/P benefited more from might stack in a group setting and can deal damage to multiple targets, not just one. Even with the Initiative refund that Unload has now, the cost of Unload is still high because it is a single target skill. The first iteration having Ricochet can damage multiple targets and deal more than 25k total damage for the cost of a single Unload. It's a difference between "buy one half-off" and "buy one get 3 for free."

[Aomine.5012]

@Sir Vincent III.1286 said:

@Aomine.5012 said:

And instead now initiative cost is 3, grant stacking mights, which make it a realistic weapon set to bring compare to before.Just tested on raid golem p/p + p/p deadeye-> 25.2k dps.

For reference, Ranger LB dps is around 16.5k at 1000 range, only hit one target too. (Predator Onslaught)If you bring piercing trait on LB, then dps drop to 14.5k. If you hit target below 500 range, dps drops to 12.5k.

Might stacking in a raid or any group scenario is not a plus because someone else in the raid or group can apply that buff with longer duration, thus it is not an advantage over the first iteration of P/P. The first iteration of P/P benefited more from might stack in a group setting and can deal damage to multiple targets, not just one. Even with the Initiative refund that Unload has now, the cost of Unload is still high because it is a single target skill. The first iteration having Ricochet can damage multiple targets and deal more than 25k total damage for the cost of a single Unload. It's a difference between "buy one half-off" and "buy one get 3 for free."

If you gonna take aoe into consideration for builds, then some classes' benchmark reachs 250k already lolz..Clearly no-one does that cuz realistically when you need dps check, it'd be a single boss. Other trash mobs tend to have less hp.If you care about aoe so much, just go play a staff DD and hit 5 targets.Ricochet is not going to change any of that.

If they have to nerf pistol back to its original form for Ricochet to return, I'd never want it to return honestly.The dps is so bad cuz of 5 initiative cost, so you can't keep of pistol 3 spam indefinitely like now, so the consistent dps is gonna be lower than 10k for sure.

[Jana.6831]

@Turk.5460 said:Your reply is all over the place, and doesn't much relate to the comment you quoted, so I'm not sure what you're looking for here. D/D can just as easily get away. Shadowstep and blinding powder. Or CnD an ambient creature or supply hut. Or shortbow. D/D has plenty of "chances" - whatever that means to you. Please stay on the topic of P/P from here, as that is what the discussion is about.

D/D has got not ports on their set. In a kitten situation they have less options to get away.My point is: Don't claim anything is 'high risk, high reward' if you've got plenty of opportunites to get away - which you have when attacking at range, if you have shadowstep and if you have means to stealth. I think D/D signet might have been the only set that really was 'high risk' because if they screwed up their burst they were toast because all of their utility was offensive.It's okay if you like your playstyle and everything but I'd love people to admit that no one in GW2 needs any skill anymore because everybody has got plenty of possibilities to screw up and still get away. It's no use when people claim they've got oh so much skill and this and that is oh so hard.

ETA: And my reply seems 'all over the place' for you because you didn't expect an answer like mine. In reality it isn't.

[rogerwilko.6895]

PvE wise, what solutions do the P/P builds offer for AoE situations?
Sword has 3 targets. That's not enough in many cases.SB and Cluster bomb?
So far I've played staff Daredevil and once I unlocked DE I toyed with P/D condi and P/P power. Both do great in single target, but single target is but a fraction of what happens to me ...

[LazerusKI.7485]

@rogerwilko.6895 said:PvE wise, what solutions do the P/P builds offer for AoE situations?

Sword has 3 targets. That's not enough in many cases.SB and Cluster bomb?

So far I've played staff Daredevil and once I unlocked DE I toyed with P/D condi and P/P power. Both do great in single target, but single target is but a fraction of what happens to me ...

with P/P Deadeye i didnt need aoe so far...mark target, spam unload, atleast one enemy dies or is close to death after just one press of the button.if it was your target, mark the next, get quickness and another fancy stolen effect

[Turk.5460]

@Jana.6831 said:

@Turk.5460 said:Your reply is all over the place, and doesn't much relate to the comment you quoted, so I'm not sure what you're looking for here. D/D can just as easily get away. Shadowstep and blinding powder. Or CnD an ambient creature or supply hut. Or shortbow. D/D has plenty of "chances" - whatever that means to you. Please stay on the topic of P/P from here, as that is what the discussion is about.

D/D has got not ports on their set. In a kitten situation they have less options to get away.My point is: Don't claim anything is 'high risk, high reward' if you've got plenty of opportunites to get away - which you have when attacking at range, if you have shadowstep and if you have means to stealth. I think D/D signet might have been the only set that really was 'high risk' because if they screwed up their burst they were toast because all of their utility was offensive.It's okay if you like your playstyle and everything but I'd love people to admit that no one in GW2 needs any skill anymore because everybody has got plenty of possibilities to screw up and still get away. It's no use when people claim they've got oh so much skill and this and that is oh so hard.

ETA: And my reply seems 'all over the place' for you because you didn't expect an answer like mine. In reality it isn't.

So now you are referencing a specific build that you think is high risk? And everything other than that build that you deem risky is simply...not? Sorry, this doesn't work out in your favor. My DE P/P build does not use shadowstep nor stealth - which seem to be the only two factors in what you consider high risk. So what are my plenty of possibilities to screw up and still get away? Please enlighten me. Though if all you have is "equip shadowstep or a stealth utility" - please bear in mind that you could also do the same with your "high risk" build.

[babazhook.6805]

@rogerwilko.6895 said:PvE wise, what solutions do the P/P builds offer for AoE situations?

Sword has 3 targets. That's not enough in many cases.SB and Cluster bomb?

So far I've played staff Daredevil and once I unlocked DE I toyed with P/D condi and P/P power. Both do great in single target, but single target is but a fraction of what happens to me ...

Again if in a condi or hybrid build trait up improv linked with mercy and use the stolen item for Condition AOE.

With power it much more difficult if you want to stick to P/P. I have taken to p/p used with s/p putting a Sigil of Severance on the s/p set. Might stack at range single target as the enemy closes. In PvE you get the chain off rather easily with the full chain hitting meaning you get some good INI. When the cluster closes weapon swap and pistolwhip. That sigil of severance, while having only 4 seconds duration with a 1sec icd can usually get off two interrupts which procs that 250 precision and ferocity twice giving a rel nice boost to power and damage.

[Sir Vincent III.1286]

@Aomine.5012 said:

@Sir Vincent III.1286 said:

@Aomine.5012 said:

And instead now initiative cost is 3, grant stacking mights, which make it a realistic weapon set to bring compare to before.Just tested on raid golem p/p + p/p deadeye-> 25.2k dps.

For reference, Ranger LB dps is around 16.5k at 1000 range, only hit one target too. (Predator Onslaught)If you bring piercing trait on LB, then dps drop to 14.5k. If you hit target below 500 range, dps drops to 12.5k.

Might stacking in a raid or any group scenario is not a plus because someone else in the raid or group can apply that buff with longer duration, thus it is not an advantage over the first iteration of P/P. The first iteration of P/P benefited more from might stack in a group setting and can deal damage to multiple targets, not just one. Even with the Initiative refund that Unload has now, the cost of Unload is still high because it is a single target skill. The first iteration having Ricochet can damage multiple targets and deal more than 25k total damage for the cost of a single Unload. It's a difference between "buy one half-off" and "buy one get 3 for free."

If you gonna take aoe into consideration for builds, then some classes' benchmark reachs 250k already lolz..

But we're not talking about "other classes" and it always been the case that whatever that the Thief can do, other professions can do better, but that is not the topic of the discussion.

Clearly no-one does that cuz realistically when you need dps check, it'd be a single boss. Other trash mobs tend to have less hp.If you care about aoe so much, just go play a staff DD and hit 5 targets.

If you care about single target, just play Rifle DE and have a higher DPS than P/P.

Ricochet is not going to change any of that.

Well, I disagree.

If they have to nerf pistol back to its original form for Ricochet to return, I'd never want it to return honestly.The dps is so bad cuz of 5 initiative cost, so you can't keep of pistol 3 spam indefinitely like now, so the consistent dps is gonna be lower than 10k for sure.

To be honest, they can nerf P/P if they want as long as I get Ricochet because for a single target and non-mobile fight, I rather use Rifle.

[nastyjman.8207]

Anyone can critique my PvP build?

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQNAqaVn0MB9OhFPBOGDUGjFYCTLBEAyAefh4QbgPZGNB

This is a PP and SB build. Utilities are stunbreaks to compensate for DD dodges. SB is for Skill 5 to cap far and be mobile. SB is also to help in teamfights, and PP to focus fire. Mug is to add a little healing, and Mercy to instantly refresh for another Mug, all the while stunlocking target.

Weakness would be Spellbreaker and Retaliations.

[Jana.6831]

@Turk.5460 said:

So now you are referencing a specific build that you think is high risk? And everything other than that build that you deem risky is simply...not? Sorry, this doesn't work out in your favor. My DE P/P build does not use shadowstep nor stealth - which seem to be the only two factors in what you consider high risk. So what are my plenty of possibilities to screw up and still get away? Please enlighten me. Though if all you have is "equip shadowstep or a stealth utility" - please bear in mind that you could also do the same with your "high risk" build.

I explained to you what high risk means as you obviously don't know.Attacking at range with multiple skills to get you out of a tricky situation is low risk.

ETA: Damn you guys in the thief forums really piss me off every time.You obviously have no idea of the signet D/D thief as well - I already said it but you obviously didn't read it: they had to burn all their utility in order to have that burst - they CANT equip shadowstep get it now? (build isn't possible anymore)

ETA²: The one time I didn't type kitten. My 4 letter words stay, just so that anet see what they have to revert into fluffy kittens ;)

ETA³: And just to carify why this is important to me: The players need to realize that they don't need skill for this game anymore. Be it D/P, probably S/D or anything else. And even if you find a class and or spec that does need skill you still can't do anything about the facerollers out there - no matter how skillful you are. So by claiming that something which is low risk is high risk you guys are deceiving yourselves.Granted: It's unlikely that anet will ever bring it back on track - too much time has passed, to much has been destroyed - they would have to redo it from scratch and probably lose a lot of players. Still, don't kitten yourself into thinking that anything in this game is high risk (high reward) - it's facerolling.

[Cameryn.5310]

Having now played a deadeye for the past few weeks I can honestly say that pistol/pistol is the best thing about it. Rifle is the worst. (I'm a PVE player exclusively.)

Not that I'm against the rifle, per se... I just find that it honestly doesn't have as many useful niches to fill. Rifle is great when you are doing things like the matriarch in Verdant Brink, where you can telegraph areas the boss won't spawn its sickly yellow fire. The trouble with the rifle is that to get the maximum use out of it, you have to become stationary, and there are very few instances in PVE play where staying put is acceptable. Certainly not for solo play.

The deadeye trait line is fantastic for dual pistols though. My playstyle is to run deadeye p/p with several stealth generators for OMG moments. The ability to mark a brand new target with malice every time you kill a mob means you really don't need to worry about AOE damage... you're mobile enough to be able to single-target each mob in a group with relative ease. I've actually had no issues with going up against a veteran and three normal mobs. Elites and champions are much tougher, obviously. Using the Thieves Guild elite skill basically becomes a Win-Button for fights that go against elites/champs or multiple veterans.

With the initiative generation utility, Unload is almost always available to me, too.

I'm curious to see if anyone else has found dual pistols to be suddenly a MUCH better PVE option besides myself? The damage I'm doing combined with my survivability has been a refreshing change. I'll keep rifle holstered for those single-target distant mobs, but run pistols the rest of the time.

[redcomyn.4651]

Me also. I run with p/p with rifle as secondary, but I am usually on p/p. But there is an occasional time where it was appropriate for the rifle. Today, I ran across some of those golems that had the reflect ability. I obviously couldn't use my pistols, but I found that at a far enough distance, the golems didn't turn on their reflect ability and I was able to take them out with the rifle pretty easily. So it is working for me, so far at least.

[Cole.3824]

P/P my favorite setup right now for sure. I also use shortbow mainly for mobility/escape and some AOE if I really need it. I really just don't like rifle at all. It feels so clunky and the damage it offers doesn't even get close to offsetting it imo. I liked the idea of a "sniper thief", but until they work on the rifle a bit I'm not interested.

[Turk.5460]

@Jana.6831 said:

@Turk.5460 said:

So now you are referencing a

specific

build that you think is high risk? And everything

other

than

that

build that

you

deem risky is simply...not? Sorry, this doesn't work out in your favor. My DE P/P build does not use shadowstep nor stealth - which seem to be the only two factors in what you consider high risk. So what are my plenty of possibilities to screw up and still get away? Please enlighten me. Though if all you have is "equip shadowstep or a stealth utility" - please bear in mind that you could also do the same with

your

"high risk" build.

I explained to you what

high risk

means as you obviously don't know.Attacking at range with multiple skills to get you out of a tricky situation is low risk.

ETA: kitten you guys in the thief forums really kitten me off every time.You obviously have no idea of the signet D/D thief as well - I already said it but you obviously didn't read it:

they had to burn all their utility in order to have that burst - they CANT equip shadowstep

get it now? (build isn't possible anymore)

ETA²: The one time I didn't type kitten. My 4 letter words stay, just so that anet see what they have to revert into fluffy kittens ;)

ETA³: And just to carify why this is important to me: The players need to realize that they don't need skill for this game anymore. Be it D/P, probably S/D or anything else. And even if you find a class and or spec that does need skill you still can't do anything about the facerollers out there - no matter how skillful you are. So by claiming that something which is low risk is high risk you guys are deceiving yourselves.Granted: It's unlikely that anet will ever bring it back on track - too much time has passed, to much has been destroyed - they would have to redo it from scratch and probably lose a lot of players. Still, don't kitten yourself into thinking that anything in this game is high risk (high reward) - it's facerolling.

Don't kitten yourself, if you played that spec, you certainly didn't need any skill for it. Please refrain from complaining so much about the game as a whole based on your personal opinion of what qualifies for skill and/or risk. It's clear that many more players than you think differently. If you can't win any of your fights, please do not blame "facerolling," you just need practice, or perhaps take a break from the game to calm your nerves.

[Saraneth.6021]

@Turk.5460 said:

@Jana.6831 said:

@Turk.5460 said:

So now you are referencing a

specific

build that you think is high risk? And everything

other

than

that

build that

you

deem risky is simply...not? Sorry, this doesn't work out in your favor. My DE P/P build does not use shadowstep nor stealth - which seem to be the only two factors in what you consider high risk. So what are my plenty of possibilities to screw up and still get away? Please enlighten me. Though if all you have is "equip shadowstep or a stealth utility" - please bear in mind that you could also do the same with

your

"high risk" build.

I explained to you what

high risk

means as you obviously don't know.Attacking at range with multiple skills to get you out of a tricky situation is low risk.

ETA: kitten you guys in the thief forums really kitten me off every time.You obviously have no idea of the signet D/D thief as well - I already said it but you obviously didn't read it:

they had to burn all their utility in order to have that burst - they CANT equip shadowstep

get it now? (build isn't possible anymore)

ETA²: The one time I didn't type kitten. My 4 letter words stay, just so that anet see what they have to revert into fluffy kittens ;)

ETA³: And just to carify why this is important to me: The players need to realize that they don't need skill for this game anymore. Be it D/P, probably S/D or anything else. And even if you find a class and or spec that does need skill you still can't do anything about the facerollers out there - no matter how skillful you are. So by claiming that something which is low risk is high risk you guys are deceiving yourselves.Granted: It's unlikely that anet will ever bring it back on track - too much time has passed, to much has been destroyed - they would have to redo it from scratch and probably lose a lot of players. Still, don't kitten yourself into thinking that anything in this game is high risk (high reward) - it's facerolling.

Don't kitten yourself, if you played that spec, you certainly didn't need any skill for it. Please refrain from complaining so much about the game as a whole based on your personal opinion of what qualifies for skill and/or risk. It's clear that many more players than you think differently. If you can't win any of your fights, please do not blame "facerolling," you just need practice, or perhaps take a break from the game to calm your nerves.

Hmm. First you say "please refrain from complaining so much about the game as a whole based on your personal opinion" then go on to say "It's clear that many more players than you think differently".

So yours and other players personal opinions are fine but his/hers are not because you don't agree? W.T.F man?

[Mercurias.1826]

I'm currently digging P/P. It doesn't require a mountain of trait investments, it does what I need it to do, I like the interrupt, the range is solid, and skill 5 with a leap or burst is instant stealth. I think it has good synergy with Deadeye, also, and I find it easy to use. The Rifle seems a bit undertuned right now, unless I'm playing it wrong, but I swap around between it, P/P, and daggers.