Bring Back 5 Man Ranked Que - Needs To Happen At This Point - Solo/Duo Failed

[Faux Play.6104]

@Exedore.6320 said:

@Faux Play.6104 said:

@ReaverKane.7598 said:PvP has only gone downhill since season 5, and it's been only getting worse.

If you think getting rid of the pip system destroyed PvP, I can't really take your opinion seriously. Everyone shouldn't be legendary just because they played a lot of matches. There should be some skill component factored into it.Removal of 1-5 party queue in ranked happened in season5 as well. He's referring to that change.

Seasons 1-4 were hands down the worst 4 seasons of the league. The only thing they had going for them were more interest in PvP because the pro league wasn't quite dead yet.

[Faux Play.6104]

@ReaverKane.7598 said:1) The system was there when PvP was at it's healthiest, and with the highest population. That simple fact denies everything you said. But i'll rebate it none the less.:

What are your benchmark to say GW2 PvP was going strong 2 years ago? In terms of views it was irrelevant on both twitch and ESL rated content. All the money from any league comes from advertising money. All the advertising money is going to games that bring in viewers. GW2 views were a factor of 100 less than other games. The causation for ending ESL was the contract was up, and after quite a bit of effort and resources spent on it, viewership for the ESL matches and GW2 in general was irrelevant compared to other games.

Separating peoples rating from the reward pips was the best thing they have done. Matchmaking in the diamond and legendary division was truly awful seasons 1-4 because people couldn't lose rating. The only reason the population was higher was the game wasn't as old as it is now (6 years in august), and ESL was still hanging on by a thread.

@ReaverKane.7598 said:Oh boy... Are you serious... I'm having a hard time being polite here....That quote you copy pasted is for the current system without team queues. When there were team queues the algorithm was different, obviously, TO ACCOUNT FOR PREMADES!!!Here's an actual citation of how it used to work from Season 2 patch notes: ....

In case you forgot what you typed:

@ReaverKane.7598 said:You can't smurf or be carried in GW2 ranked since they made it so that your team's rank is the same as the highest player (plus probably an extra for team factor). Get your facts straight.The fact that your arguments are these, just means you're arguing from ignorance, and don't really know what you're talking about and should be given no credence, pretty much.

That statement is pretty clear you thought that it isn't possible to smurf now. Both unranked and ranked currently allow more than one player to team together. They use the average rating. If you queue with people rated lower than you, you end up with better odds of the other team being less skilled than you. This can easily be abused by having a skilled friend with a low rated alt. If you are going to keep making things up that fit your version of reality nothing productive is going to come out of this. It just bothers me when people spew out misinformation like it is factual.

[Drafigo.4690]

Honestly would be happy if you could queue with 3 instead of only 2 this next season. When it was 5 you had teams grouping up and hitting Legendary fast, this last season if took awhile for players to reach legendary status and it felt real. I would say stay away from 5 man queueing up in ranked but there should be a 5 man team queue somewhere tho maybe separate. But I really would like to group up in 3 man for this next season. Stay Frosty!

[ezd.6359]

To make everyone happy we need separate queue for 5 man and those talented individuals who like to play solo vs organized groups. I personally don't want to see things like these in ranked. Not any more!https://i.imgur.com/nLdQeaG.jpg

[ReaverKane.7598]

@Faux Play.6104 said:

@ReaverKane.7598 said:1) The system was there when PvP was at it's healthiest, and with the highest population. That simple fact denies everything you said. But i'll rebate it none the less.:

What are your benchmark to say GW2 PvP was going strong 2 years ago? In terms of views it was irrelevant on both twitch and ESL rated content. All the money from any league comes from advertising money. All the advertising money is going to games that bring in viewers. GW2 views were a factor of 100 less than other games. The causation for ending ESL was the contract was up, and after quite a bit of effort and resources spent on it, viewership for the ESL matches and GW2 in general was irrelevant compared to other games.

Playing it. The fact that before HoT, CJ stated a few times that PvP was at the all time highest population. I don't have that quote in hand it was 5 years ago, sue me.It's not hard to see by playing it. Also, yeah Pro competitions were a thing, aren't anymore. The contract was up, and wasn't renewed why? Because the game was crap, there was no new blood coming in because there was no ranked play for teams.

Separating peoples rating from the reward pips was the best thing they have done. Matchmaking in the diamond and legendary division was truly awful seasons 1-4 because people couldn't lose rating. The only reason the population was higher was the game wasn't as old as it is now (6 years in august), and ESL was still hanging on by a thread.

You could lose rating! wtf are you tanking about? Do you even know what you're talking about?

@ReaverKane.7598 said:Oh boy... Are you serious... I'm having a hard time being polite here....That quote you copy pasted is for the current system without team queues. When there were team queues the algorithm was different, obviously, TO ACCOUNT FOR PREMADES!!!Here's an actual citation of how it used to work from Season 2 patch notes: ....

In case you forgot what you typed:

@ReaverKane.7598 said:You can't smurf or be carried in GW2 ranked since they made it so that your team's rank is the same as the highest player (plus probably an extra for team factor). Get your facts straight.The fact that your arguments are these, just means you're arguing from ignorance, and don't really know what you're talking about and should be given no credence, pretty much.

That statement is pretty clear you thought that it isn't possible to smurf now. Both unranked and ranked

currently

allow more than one player to team together. They use the average rating. If you queue with people rated lower than you, you end up with better odds of the other team being less skilled than you. This can easily be abused by having a skilled friend with a low rated alt. If you are going to keep making things up that fit your version of reality nothing productive is going to come out of this. It just bothers me when people spew out misinformation like it is factual.

Ok, i should have meant "you

couldn't

". I think it doesn't take a stretch of imagination to understand that i was talking about smurfing with teams, since that's what you were talking about. I guess i shouldn't overestimate people's ability to read and follow a text.

Currently you can queue with people lower ranked people because:1) they removed that algorithm that was in place for ranked teams, because they removed ranked teams. And that algorithm prevented using lower queued team mates to get lower ranking.2) The population for PvP is so low matchmaker has to match people with lower rank or make us wait for 10+ minutes.

@"ezd.6359" said:To make everyone happy we need separate queue for 5 man and those talented individuals who like to play solo vs organized groups. I personally don't want to see things like these in ranked. Not any more!https://i.imgur.com/nLdQeaG.jpg

Show us your current match history, and prove to us that current system doesn't provide runaway scores equal or greater than that... Because i could probably show you the reverse, a 5 man premade guild team losing to a 3+1+1 team in ranked, by similar scores. Because i've been there lots of times, both as the 5 man premade and the randos team that beat them.Not to mention that picture doesn't prove anything. Because after season 2, or maybe even season 1, you had a button at the end of the match that allowed you to party up with your previous team, and play again with them as a premade.It would show up as a premade, but it could be essentially a full five man solo queuers that simply grouped up to play together a second time, without voice coms.

[choovanski.5462]

consider this: when a person advocates for solo queue, they are speaking for one person. however someone advocating for team queue is speaking for five.

if you want to grow population in a multiplayer game, i wouldn’t suggest catering to people with no friends who play alone. those who are social & want to play with others are going to bring more new blood into the game, & create a community that increases retention (ie people like to play w their friends/guidies so they stick around). people who want to play with others are also far more likely to recommend the game to people, & to teach them how to play (very important for retention).

catering to people who just play alone & care only about their leaderboard position is going to create a toxic antisocial community rife with leaderboard exploitation. which is basically what we have now.

keeping the game solo queue is just going to be continuing the current trajectory, nosedive. things wont get better without change.

because honestly, when you’re competing with DotA, Overwatch & Fortnite- having “can’t play with friends” as a feature is going to drive away so many players.

(as an example i was considering getting this game for my girlfriend, but not being able to play ranked together is a deal breaker. like why would i get her a game that we couldn’t play together???? so no buy from me)

so sticking w solo is a poor plan for both the current & prospective community.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

So, this thread dropped clear off page #1 right after the Mesmer SS+ tier patch "which caught the new wave of conversation." That's too bad because the community really should be harping on this topic and keeping the fire lit.

Bumping this one more time before saying goodbye to all of you! I've quit Guild Wars 2 as of about 2 weeks ago. GG boys, enjoy what's left of this game's lifespan.

[EthanLightheart.9168]

No, teamsearch would be too long for those that aren't in a pvp guild. Very bad idea.

[mrauls.6519]

Bads get carried by 5 man teams. It happened in the old system. There used to be 5 man teams allowed in ranked pvp and it was terrible. A coordinated team versus pugs is not even... Go take your 5 man to ATs

[JTGuevara.9018]

OP, I wholeheartedly agree. Last time I checked, conquest is a team game. People fail to realize that win-trading is not because of queues, it's because of ANet's lack of action. Bring back 5v5.

Also, another topic that I see lost in this conversation is rating. If pvp had a team rating instead of an individual rating, it would encourage more teamwork. Players wouldn't worry so much about their rating and would play less selfishly in matches. A collective team rating is also more stable and would force better matches. Individual skill ratings give a false idea of the skill of the team. Looking back, taking away 5v5 was a bad move. I think we can all see that now.

Sometimes, I think people don't want to change. They come up with all sorts of excuses to keep from changing (lack of population, MMO pvp doesn't 'work'). Honestly, does it even matter at this point? pvp is just a farm. Balance is obviously not good either with all the elite spec dps powercreep.

[Lucentfir.7430]

@JTGuevara.9018 said:OP, I wholeheartedly agree. Last time I checked, conquest is a team game. People fail to realize that win-trading is not because of queues, it's because of ANet's lack of action. Bring back 5v5.

Also, another topic that I see lost in this conversation is rating. If pvp had a team rating instead of an individual rating, it would encourage more teamwork. Players wouldn't worry so much about their rating and would play less selfishly in matches. A collective team rating is also more stable and would force better matches. Individual skill ratings give a false idea of the skill of the team. Looking back, taking away 5v5 was a bad move. I think we can all see that now.

Sometimes, I think people don't want to change. They come up with all sorts of excuses to keep from changing (lack of population, MMO pvp doesn't 'work'). Honestly, does it even matter at this point? pvp is just a farm. Balance is obviously not good either with all the elite spec dps powercreep.

Then by all means if you want it done with team rating system only , make ranked exclusively premade 5v5s or ,duo, trio, five man mixed queue, and just remove the option to ever queue solo considering people vouching for the return of full premade and making it a mixed ranked queue are pulling out the stops to get premades back into ranked, like comments saying people don't have friends and want to play alone in some sort of isolation bubble. Not really the case, people have friends, but in a competative area(Despite conquest not having any competative integrity or worth nowadays), people don't take their friends that they know aren't really good or understand fully what conquest is about, they take the ones that know their stuff, and know how to play. Another thing too is mockery of caring about personal rating (you know who you are), that jab is a double edge sword because why even propose return of 5 man premades because of win traders (which really only happens at the top end) if you didn't care about rating/placement in the first place? Win trading is rampant because Anet refuses to do anything of actual worth to offenders, and top portion of players who engage in shady practices want to take shortcuts for titles and to see their name on the boards, for maximum meme epeen bragging.

We can't meet with a happy solution for both sides of players (team and solo) in this thread, having a mixed ranked queue option(1-5 premade) separate from current ranked queue option (Solo/duo) with their own respective leaderboards and MMR, because someone is going to say the population is too small to support an additional queue(most likely vouching for the return of 5 man instead) And people who like to roll solo that don't like the idea into running into a 5 man with pugs(pug RNG vs a team with decent composition planned before even queuing) will protest against it. Options should be there for both player types, but there's no coming to a agreement because people think it should be one or the other, and frankly going with just either one is going to do nothing about the downward spiral of Spvp.

[Crab Fear.1624]

At first I was against it. But the balance patches have changed my mind. Let teams even face randos

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

AT participation has been high lately. I saw 20 teams teams enter mid-day eastern time, yesterday. Can we consider bringing back 5 man que for ranked?

You know... if players were to receive more gold per match, depending on how many players they were in a party with... everyone would make 5 man teams for the 5 man team game of conquest. I mean, it's not a bad idea. This is worth Arenanet's consideration.