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There should be tell of binding shadow (knockdown skill of DE) being cast under stealth


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For who don't know what this skill is,this is a skill that can knock you down for 3s + immob for 2s + apply 15 stacks of vul + remove 2 boons.In normal situation it has a very obvious tell, also it requires target being marked to knockdown, which make this skill easy to dodge.But this skill is absolutely broken when paired with rifle.

This is normally used by this combo: go stealth -> binding shadow -> mark (+ get quickness) -> DJ. The trick here is that the delay can allow the mark can be cast AFTER binding shadow is cast, that the knockdown can be effective. The delay of knockdown of this skill is almost perfectly line up with the DJ. For the poor opponent, all you can see before the DJ + binding shadow hit you together is the deadeye mark before the DJ under quickness hits you. There is only 0.33s for you to dodge this combo, which gives you death judgement, knockdown, immob, 15 vul (15% dmg increase) + 5 boons removed (if trickery is used) if you failed to dodge within this 0.33s. Also 3 round burst coming for you if you didn't die.

If you think you have stability, sorry 5 boons are removed under this combo. If you think one stunbreak is good enough to dodge the upcoming 3 round burst, sorry there is also 2s of immob.

This is a very very strong skill once you're hit by this when marked. It is a very strong reason for it to have tell even it is cast under stealth. I think the developer has thought of that so the knockdown effect is only done if you are marked so that the opponent can be aware. But the trick part is the skill can be cast BEFORE the mark is applied and this skill gives completely no tell under stealth.

There should be change to this skill. I am in plat and I can see too many people get one-shot by this combo which gives you only 0.33s to react.

One change should be the skill effect should be seen even the skill is cast under stealth.Second should be the DE mark has to be applied BEFORE binding shadow is cast for knockdown being effective.

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@babazhook.6805 said:It just might be nothing more than the timing on casts. Binding shadows is a 3/4 second cast. Deadeyes mark is 1/2 second. Lower Binding shadows to .5 seconds and its damage should force a reveal before the sequence outlined can be performed.

The cast time and the delay before knockdown is separate. After you cast the skill (.75s), a delay counts before it hits. However what I am not sure is whether the evade frame is in the end of the cast time of skill or the actual knockdown part. If the evade frame is in the end of cast time but not the actual skill part, it is so OP that you are impossible to dodge the whole combo unless you dodge randomly XD.

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@bennypig.6428 said:

@"RisenHowl.2419" said:


Your clip very well shows how broken this combo is. The only clue you can see before disaster is the 0.33s of DE marking. Anet please at least make binding shadow knockdown only if mark is applied before it.

marking the target before still wont give them more time to react, only to prepare.if you require the mark you can no longer do binding shadows -> mark -> dj combo, but you can still remain in stealth after mark and just cast it without animation. they still wont know when it does hit, they might be able to predict it but they wont have a much easier time reacting to it. (just minimal faster as you can react faster to things you do expect to happen)

i think it would be much better to make the animation visible regardless of the deadeyes visibility, but i am not sure that is technically possible without revealing the deadeye. there is no similar skill with an animation that is visible when cast from stealth.

another thing that i think often is overlooked: people look at deadeye skills that you can see when cast from stealth or not, but in a group fight any profession can be in stealth and many professions that do not have stealth by themselves, do not have any indication on their skills when cast from stealth. sure they wont be doing it as often as they wont easily enter stealth themselves, but that doesnt make it feel better on the receiving end.

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I don’t mind requiring mark to be applied before casting.

I rarely open with BS. I want them to use a dodge or two and waste a few skills before I knockdown and lay into them.

But I agree that there is no need to single out thief for CC from stealth when in theory anyone can do it.

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