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Stap! Every class has an OP build.

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Arheundel.6451

Arheundel.6451

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@Psycoprophet.8107 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...

I'll agree burst specs should rely on high mobility and evades but a burst spec should also have burst like stated in the description of burst spec. If u compare a power dp burst to almost every other class ull in fact notice that most classes including bunker specs can do 5k bursts in multiple ways matching the burst of the so called high mobility/evasive burst spec.Balanced.... gw2 community lol.Listening to the majority of these players is part of the reason this game is a clown fest. U can't balance a game dependent on annoyance rather than actual over performance no matter how hard the community tries.

Blame Anet and not the community...you won't find any game out there whose community accept any implementation of stealth, it has been a griefing mechanic since the dawn of MMO

Random player request on reddit....

Looking for an MMO with a stealth mechanic to ruthlessly gank / troll players on.Listen lads. I need a good game where I can grief and troll other people with game mechanics.

No, not calling out someone for being a girl gamer or whatever, but something like Vanilla WoW where I can stealth a low level quest zone as a rogue and gank players all day, >or Rust where I can kill without armor on with a bolty from a tower.

Currently playing Will to Live Online but it only has like 70 people playing on the US server so there's not really anyone to gank and take their gear.

Anyone got a decent recommendation of what to play that has a decent sized player base for ganking / annoying? I'd prefer if it had a class with a stealth mechanic but it >doesn't have to have one.

Do you see what stealth in a MMO normally entices? You can't blame people for hating any implementation of stealth in a MMO, it will always end being a griefing mechanic

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Psycoprophet.8107

Psycoprophet.8107

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@Arheundel.6451 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...

I'll agree burst specs should rely on high mobility and evades but a burst spec should also have burst like stated in the description of burst spec. If u compare a power dp burst to almost every other class ull in fact notice that most classes including bunker specs can do 5k bursts in multiple ways matching the burst of the so called high mobility/evasive burst spec.Balanced.... gw2 community lol.Listening to the majority of these players is part of the reason this game is a clown fest. U can't balance a game dependent on annoyance rather than actual over performance no matter how hard the community tries.

Blame Anet and not the community...you won't find any game out there whose community accept any implementation of stealth, it has been a griefing mechanic since the dawn of MMO

Random player request on reddit....

Looking for an MMO with a stealth mechanic to ruthlessly gank / troll players on.Listen lads. I need a good game where I can grief and troll other people with game mechanics.

No, not calling out someone for being a girl gamer or whatever, but something like Vanilla WoW where I can stealth a low level quest zone as a rogue and gank players all day, >or Rust where I can kill without armor on with a bolty from a tower.

Currently playing Will to Live Online but it only has like 70 people playing on the US server so there's not really anyone to gank and take their gear.

Anyone got a decent recommendation of what to play that has a decent sized player base for ganking / annoying? I'd prefer if it had a class with a stealth mechanic but it >doesn't have to have one.

Do you see what stealth in a MMO normally entices? You can't blame people for hating any implementation of stealth in a MMO, it will always end being a griefing mechanic

True I am incorrect in blaming the community for anet listening to their balance changes based off annoyance rather than actual overperfornance as it's on anets team to be knowledgeable to determine the difference, they've been so good at it this far lol.I understand people grievances with stealth and the have all the same complaints in all mmo's that have it which is most. There's a reason why it exists though. When creating a rogue archetype which is a popular archetype in mmo's and hated they all follow the same high mobility, highly evasive low hp/armor and usually have top burst potential which also creates a lot of q's. How would u create a class that has far lower hp/armor without giving it a mechanic like stealth to help being downed quickly in every engagements? Would u give it a huge number of evades/dodges to spam, not just 2 or 3 and some evades in select skillsAccess to a blind on almost every skill, or maybe enough burst that just evading a few attacks and hitting the opponent only a few times would quickly down even tankier classes since its risky to fight?How would u do the squishy burst class making it viable to fight and not just get deleted on first sign of counter pressure?

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Killthehealersffs.8940

Killthehealersffs.8940

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@Psycoprophet.8107 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...

I'll agree burst specs should rely on high mobility and evades but a burst spec should also have burst like stated in the description of burst spec. If u compare a power dp burst to almost every other class ull in fact notice that most classes including bunker specs can do 5k bursts in multiple ways matching the burst of the so called high mobility/evasive burst spec.Balanced.... gw2 community lol.Listening to the majority of these players is part of the reason this game is a clown fest. U can't balance a game dependent on annoyance rather than actual over performance no matter how hard the community tries.

Blame Anet and not the community...you won't find any game out there whose community accept any implementation of stealth, it has been a griefing mechanic since the dawn of MMO

Random player request on reddit....

Looking for an MMO with a stealth mechanic to ruthlessly gank / troll players on.Listen lads. I need a good game where I can grief and troll other people with game mechanics.

No, not calling out someone for being a girl gamer or whatever, but something like Vanilla WoW where I can stealth a low level quest zone as a rogue and gank players all day, >or Rust where I can kill without armor on with a bolty from a tower.

Currently playing Will to Live Online but it only has like 70 people playing on the US server so there's not really anyone to gank and take their gear.

Anyone got a decent recommendation of what to play that has a decent sized player base for ganking / annoying? I'd prefer if it had a class with a stealth mechanic but it >doesn't have to have one.

Do you see what stealth in a MMO normally entices? You can't blame people for hating any implementation of stealth in a MMO, it will always end being a griefing mechanic

True I am incorrect in blaming the community for anet listening to their balance changes based off annoyance rather than actual overperfornance as it's on anets team to be knowledgeable to determine the difference, they've been so good at it this far lol.I understand people grievances with stealth and the have all the same complaints in all mmo's that have it which is most. There's a reason why it exists though. When creating a rogue archetype which is a popular archetype in mmo's and hated they all follow the same high mobility, highly evasive low hp/armor and usually have top burst potential which also creates a lot of q's. How would u create a class that has far lower hp/armor without giving it a mechanic like stealth to help being downed quickly in every engagements? Would u give it a huge number of evades/dodges to spam, not just 2 or 3 and some evades in select skillsAccess to a blind on almost every skill, or maybe enough burst that just evading a few attacks and hitting the opponent only a few times would quickly down even tankier classes since its risky to fight?How would u do the squishy burst class making it viable to fight and not just get deleted on first sign of counter pressure?

You where the one to cry about every single class and then you masked yourself saying : ''i am Mesmer main and i agree with those nerfs , etc''You are a part of your problem too , for the company listening to you

You said it :You have high mobilityhighly evasivehigh amount of stealthThey are classified as active defencesThat makes you a Rogue ...a Thief.... not an Assasin

Assasin is classified where a class have limited survibility like a Berseker Longbow + 2handed sword and offncive traitsAssasin must do TRUE MAX DAMAGE

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Arheundel.6451

Arheundel.6451

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@Psycoprophet.8107 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...

I'll agree burst specs should rely on high mobility and evades but a burst spec should also have burst like stated in the description of burst spec. If u compare a power dp burst to almost every other class ull in fact notice that most classes including bunker specs can do 5k bursts in multiple ways matching the burst of the so called high mobility/evasive burst spec.Balanced.... gw2 community lol.Listening to the majority of these players is part of the reason this game is a clown fest. U can't balance a game dependent on annoyance rather than actual over performance no matter how hard the community tries.

Blame Anet and not the community...you won't find any game out there whose community accept any implementation of stealth, it has been a griefing mechanic since the dawn of MMO

Random player request on reddit....

Looking for an MMO with a stealth mechanic to ruthlessly gank / troll players on.Listen lads. I need a good game where I can grief and troll other people with game mechanics.

No, not calling out someone for being a girl gamer or whatever, but something like Vanilla WoW where I can stealth a low level quest zone as a rogue and gank players all day, >or Rust where I can kill without armor on with a bolty from a tower.

Currently playing Will to Live Online but it only has like 70 people playing on the US server so there's not really anyone to gank and take their gear.

Anyone got a decent recommendation of what to play that has a decent sized player base for ganking / annoying? I'd prefer if it had a class with a stealth mechanic but it >doesn't have to have one.

Do you see what stealth in a MMO normally entices? You can't blame people for hating any implementation of stealth in a MMO, it will always end being a griefing mechanic

True I am incorrect in blaming the community for anet listening to their balance changes based off annoyance rather than actual overperfornance as it's on anets team to be knowledgeable to determine the difference, they've been so good at it this far lol.I understand people grievances with stealth and the have all the same complaints in all mmo's that have it which is most. There's a reason why it exists though. When creating a rogue archetype which is a popular archetype in mmo's and hated they all follow the same high mobility, highly evasive low hp/armor and usually have top burst potential which also creates a lot of q's. How would u create a class that has far lower hp/armor without giving it a mechanic like stealth to help being downed quickly in every engagements? Would u give it a huge number of evades/dodges to spam, not just 2 or 3 and some evades in select skillsAccess to a blind on almost every skill, or maybe enough burst that just evading a few attacks and hitting the opponent only a few times would quickly down even tankier classes since its risky to fight?How would u do the squishy burst class making it viable to fight and not just get deleted on first sign of counter pressure?

Shadow stepping worked fine for assassins in GW1 and if really they'd need stealth, they could make so that stealth becomes an engaging/disengaging mechanic...not a reset button.

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UNOwen.7132

UNOwen.7132

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@Arheundel.6451 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Sure, but burst spec = High burst. Something notably absent from thief.

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...not super duellist role, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

Actually burst specs would be great for dueling. They can just burst the enemy down. But that requires them to have burst. Thief currently has worse burst than even some of the "tank" specs. Not an ideal situation, is it?

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

Stealth has no relevance here. "Resetting and disengaging" is something both warriors and rangers excel at, and theyve got high sustain. Hell even Ele is decent at it, and they got high sustain too. So no, thief would be able to keep it. They would lose some of the mobility, but not much. Or alternatively they get the burst they need to be burst specs.

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...it's just pointless at this point to keep asking for that, the community will never accept that idea of super mobile insta burst brawler from stealth..it's simply absurd

Are thieves asking for that? Right now thief burst isnt "huge burst twoshot". Its frankly rather pathetic. Thieves ask either for that burst, or for sustain. Currently they have neither.

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UNOwen.7132

UNOwen.7132

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@Arheundel.6451 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...

I'll agree burst specs should rely on high mobility and evades but a burst spec should also have burst like stated in the description of burst spec. If u compare a power dp burst to almost every other class ull in fact notice that most classes including bunker specs can do 5k bursts in multiple ways matching the burst of the so called high mobility/evasive burst spec.Balanced.... gw2 community lol.Listening to the majority of these players is part of the reason this game is a clown fest. U can't balance a game dependent on annoyance rather than actual over performance no matter how hard the community tries.

Blame Anet and not the community...you won't find any game out there whose community accept any implementation of stealth, it has been a griefing mechanic since the dawn of MMO

Except for the many games that have stealth where its fine.

Random player request on reddit....

Looking for an MMO with a stealth mechanic to ruthlessly gank / troll players on.Listen lads. I need a good game where I can grief and troll other people with game mechanics.

No, not calling out someone for being a girl gamer or whatever, but something like Vanilla WoW where I can stealth a low level quest zone as a rogue and gank players all day, >or Rust where I can kill without armor on with a bolty from a tower.

Currently playing Will to Live Online but it only has like 70 people playing on the US server so there's not really anyone to gank and take their gear.

Anyone got a decent recommendation of what to play that has a decent sized player base for ganking / annoying? I'd prefer if it had a class with a stealth mechanic but it >doesn't have to have one.

Do you see what stealth in a MMO normally entices? You can't blame people for hating any implementation of stealth in a MMO, it will always end being a griefing mechanic

Thats out of combat permastealth. You will find most thieves are also not particularly happy they have to rely on that. Make stealth out of combat worse, stealth in-combat better, and everyone is happy.

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UNOwen.7132

UNOwen.7132

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@Arheundel.6451 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...

I'll agree burst specs should rely on high mobility and evades but a burst spec should also have burst like stated in the description of burst spec. If u compare a power dp burst to almost every other class ull in fact notice that most classes including bunker specs can do 5k bursts in multiple ways matching the burst of the so called high mobility/evasive burst spec.Balanced.... gw2 community lol.Listening to the majority of these players is part of the reason this game is a clown fest. U can't balance a game dependent on annoyance rather than actual over performance no matter how hard the community tries.

Blame Anet and not the community...you won't find any game out there whose community accept any implementation of stealth, it has been a griefing mechanic since the dawn of MMO

Random player request on reddit....

Looking for an MMO with a stealth mechanic to ruthlessly gank / troll players on.Listen lads. I need a good game where I can grief and troll other people with game mechanics.

No, not calling out someone for being a girl gamer or whatever, but something like Vanilla WoW where I can stealth a low level quest zone as a rogue and gank players all day, >or Rust where I can kill without armor on with a bolty from a tower.

Currently playing Will to Live Online but it only has like 70 people playing on the US server so there's not really anyone to gank and take their gear.

Anyone got a decent recommendation of what to play that has a decent sized player base for ganking / annoying? I'd prefer if it had a class with a stealth mechanic but it >doesn't have to have one.

Do you see what stealth in a MMO normally entices? You can't blame people for hating any implementation of stealth in a MMO, it will always end being a griefing mechanic

True I am incorrect in blaming the community for anet listening to their balance changes based off annoyance rather than actual overperfornance as it's on anets team to be knowledgeable to determine the difference, they've been so good at it this far lol.I understand people grievances with stealth and the have all the same complaints in all mmo's that have it which is most. There's a reason why it exists though. When creating a rogue archetype which is a popular archetype in mmo's and hated they all follow the same high mobility, highly evasive low hp/armor and usually have top burst potential which also creates a lot of q's. How would u create a class that has far lower hp/armor without giving it a mechanic like stealth to help being downed quickly in every engagements? Would u give it a huge number of evades/dodges to spam, not just 2 or 3 and some evades in select skillsAccess to a blind on almost every skill, or maybe enough burst that just evading a few attacks and hitting the opponent only a few times would quickly down even tankier classes since its risky to fight?How would u do the squishy burst class making it viable to fight and not just get deleted on first sign of counter pressure?

Shadow stepping worked fine for assassins in GW1 and if really they'd need stealth, they could make so that stealth becomes an engaging/disengaging mechanic...not a reset button.

Except stealth as an engaging mechanic is the only problem with stealth. "Stealth as a reset button" doesnt exist, because its incredibly unsafe, and just a lot worse than swapping to shortbow and shortbow 5ing out of there. The problem with stealth is that sometimes you get hit by a target you never saw. No counterplay. In-combat stealth has the opposite problem. It has too much counterplay. To the point that its frankly worthless.

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Killthehealersffs.8940

Killthehealersffs.8940

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@UNOwen.7132 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Sure, but burst spec = High burst. Something notably absent from thief.

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

Actually burst specs would be great for dueling. They can just burst the enemy down. But that requires them to have burst. Thief currently has worse burst than even some of the "tank" specs. Not an ideal situation, is it?

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

Stealth has no relevance here. "Resetting and disengaging" is something both warriors and rangers
excel
at, and theyve got high sustain. Hell even Ele is decent at it, and they got high sustain too. So no, thief would be able to keep it. They would lose some of the mobility, but not much. Or alternatively they get the burst they need to be
burst
specs.

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...it's just pointless at this point to keep asking for that,
the community will never accept that idea of super mobile insta burst brawler from stealth
..it's simply absurd

Are thieves asking for that? Right now thief burst isnt "huge burst twoshot". Its frankly rather pathetic. Thieves ask
either
for that burst, or for sustain. Currently they have
neither
.

So we must copy the stealth of other games .Should we copy from WoW /Ender scroll /Rift where it breaks on damage or getting dots ? or from shouts ?

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Killthehealersffs.8940

Killthehealersffs.8940

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@UNOwen.7132 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...

I'll agree burst specs should rely on high mobility and evades but a burst spec should also have burst like stated in the description of burst spec. If u compare a power dp burst to almost every other class ull in fact notice that most classes including bunker specs can do 5k bursts in multiple ways matching the burst of the so called high mobility/evasive burst spec.Balanced.... gw2 community lol.Listening to the majority of these players is part of the reason this game is a clown fest. U can't balance a game dependent on annoyance rather than actual over performance no matter how hard the community tries.

Blame Anet and not the community...you won't find any game out there whose community accept any implementation of stealth, it has been a griefing mechanic since the dawn of MMO

Random player request on reddit....

Looking for an MMO with a stealth mechanic to ruthlessly gank / troll players on.Listen lads. I need a good game where I can grief and troll other people with game mechanics.

No, not calling out someone for being a girl gamer or whatever, but something like Vanilla WoW where I can stealth a low level quest zone as a rogue and gank players all day, >or Rust where I can kill without armor on with a bolty from a tower.

Currently playing Will to Live Online but it only has like 70 people playing on the US server so there's not really anyone to gank and take their gear.

Anyone got a decent recommendation of what to play that has a decent sized player base for ganking / annoying? I'd prefer if it had a class with a stealth mechanic but it >doesn't have to have one.

Do you see what stealth in a MMO normally entices? You can't blame people for hating any implementation of stealth in a MMO, it will always end being a griefing mechanic

True I am incorrect in blaming the community for anet listening to their balance changes based off annoyance rather than actual overperfornance as it's on anets team to be knowledgeable to determine the difference, they've been so good at it this far lol.I understand people grievances with stealth and the have all the same complaints in all mmo's that have it which is most. There's a reason why it exists though. When creating a rogue archetype which is a popular archetype in mmo's and hated they all follow the same high mobility, highly evasive low hp/armor and usually have top burst potential which also creates a lot of q's. How would u create a class that has far lower hp/armor without giving it a mechanic like stealth to help being downed quickly in every engagements? Would u give it a huge number of evades/dodges to spam, not just 2 or 3 and some evades in select skillsAccess to a blind on almost every skill, or maybe enough burst that just evading a few attacks and hitting the opponent only a few times would quickly down even tankier classes since its risky to fight?How would u do the squishy burst class making it viable to fight and not just get deleted on first sign of counter pressure?

Shadow stepping worked fine for assassins in GW1 and if really they'd need stealth, they could make so that stealth becomes an engaging/disengaging mechanic...not a reset button.

Except stealth as an engaging mechanic is the
only
problem with stealth. "Stealth as a reset button" doesnt exist, because its incredibly unsafe, and just a lot worse than swapping to shortbow and shortbow 5ing out of there. The problem with stealth is that sometimes you get hit by a target you never saw. No counterplay. In-combat stealth has the opposite problem. It has too much counterplay. To the point that its frankly worthless.

See the video of the VallunWhere stealth + 450 leap dodge can help youescape/survive most of the situations

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UNOwen.7132

UNOwen.7132

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@Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Sure, but burst spec = High burst. Something notably absent from thief.

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

Actually burst specs would be great for dueling. They can just burst the enemy down. But that requires them to have burst. Thief currently has worse burst than even some of the "tank" specs. Not an ideal situation, is it?

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

Stealth has no relevance here. "Resetting and disengaging" is something both warriors and rangers
excel
at, and theyve got high sustain. Hell even Ele is decent at it, and they got high sustain too. So no, thief would be able to keep it. They would lose some of the mobility, but not much. Or alternatively they get the burst they need to be
burst
specs.

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...it's just pointless at this point to keep asking for that,
the community will never accept that idea of super mobile insta burst brawler from stealth
..it's simply absurd

Are thieves asking for that? Right now thief burst isnt "huge burst twoshot". Its frankly rather pathetic. Thieves ask
either
for that burst, or for sustain. Currently they have
neither
.

So we must copy the stealth of other games .Should we copy from WoW /Ender scroll /Rift where it breaks on damage or getting dots ? or from shouts ?

Sure. Lets also add the burst and CC rogues have in those games. You will be fine with every Thief engaging out of stealth on you and oneshotting you without you having any chance to react, right? Or perhaps, just perhaps, is that the issue with stealth, and thats why the WoW model is not being used anymore? And why GW2s general system is more popular? But Ive already explained all of this to you. You simply refused to learn. As you will now.

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Killthehealersffs.8940

Killthehealersffs.8940

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Posted

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Sure, but burst spec = High burst. Something notably absent from thief.

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

Actually burst specs would be great for dueling. They can just burst the enemy down. But that requires them to have burst. Thief currently has worse burst than even some of the "tank" specs. Not an ideal situation, is it?

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

Stealth has no relevance here. "Resetting and disengaging" is something both warriors and rangers
excel
at, and theyve got high sustain. Hell even Ele is decent at it, and they got high sustain too. So no, thief would be able to keep it. They would lose some of the mobility, but not much. Or alternatively they get the burst they need to be
burst
specs.

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...it's just pointless at this point to keep asking for that,
the community will never accept that idea of super mobile insta burst brawler from stealth
..it's simply absurd

Are thieves asking for that? Right now thief burst isnt "huge burst twoshot". Its frankly rather pathetic. Thieves ask
either
for that burst, or for sustain. Currently they have
neither
.

So we must copy the stealth of other games .Should we copy from WoW /Ender scroll /Rift where it breaks on damage or getting dots ? or from shouts ?

Sure. Lets also add the burst and CC rogues have in those games. You will be fine with every Thief engaging out of stealth on you and oneshotting you without you having any chance to react, right? Or perhaps, just perhaps, is that the issue with stealth, and thats why the WoW model is not being used anymore? And why GW2s general system is more popular? But Ive already explained all of this to you. You simply refused to learn. As you will now.

Every game you need resources to to build up and stun . And even then you can breakstun and DOT him and not let him restealth ..Even blizzard, because they cannot change the DOTA stealth that its rooted for how long , in their newer game Heroes of the Stormed , changed stealth to be visible from your radius

Lets have a 2 hour peactime and we will continue till the morningYou like to talk ...andwe have both myopia for our classes

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UNOwen.7132

UNOwen.7132

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'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...

I'll agree burst specs should rely on high mobility and evades but a burst spec should also have burst like stated in the description of burst spec. If u compare a power dp burst to almost every other class ull in fact notice that most classes including bunker specs can do 5k bursts in multiple ways matching the burst of the so called high mobility/evasive burst spec.Balanced.... gw2 community lol.Listening to the majority of these players is part of the reason this game is a clown fest. U can't balance a game dependent on annoyance rather than actual over performance no matter how hard the community tries.

Blame Anet and not the community...you won't find any game out there whose community accept any implementation of stealth, it has been a griefing mechanic since the dawn of MMO

Random player request on reddit....

Looking for an MMO with a stealth mechanic to ruthlessly gank / troll players on.Listen lads. I need a good game where I can grief and troll other people with game mechanics.

No, not calling out someone for being a girl gamer or whatever, but something like Vanilla WoW where I can stealth a low level quest zone as a rogue and gank players all day, >or Rust where I can kill without armor on with a bolty from a tower.

Currently playing Will to Live Online but it only has like 70 people playing on the US server so there's not really anyone to gank and take their gear.

Anyone got a decent recommendation of what to play that has a decent sized player base for ganking / annoying? I'd prefer if it had a class with a stealth mechanic but it >doesn't have to have one.

Do you see what stealth in a MMO normally entices? You can't blame people for hating any implementation of stealth in a MMO, it will always end being a griefing mechanic

True I am incorrect in blaming the community for anet listening to their balance changes based off annoyance rather than actual overperfornance as it's on anets team to be knowledgeable to determine the difference, they've been so good at it this far lol.I understand people grievances with stealth and the have all the same complaints in all mmo's that have it which is most. There's a reason why it exists though. When creating a rogue archetype which is a popular archetype in mmo's and hated they all follow the same high mobility, highly evasive low hp/armor and usually have top burst potential which also creates a lot of q's. How would u create a class that has far lower hp/armor without giving it a mechanic like stealth to help being downed quickly in every engagements? Would u give it a huge number of evades/dodges to spam, not just 2 or 3 and some evades in select skillsAccess to a blind on almost every skill, or maybe enough burst that just evading a few attacks and hitting the opponent only a few times would quickly down even tankier classes since its risky to fight?How would u do the squishy burst class making it viable to fight and not just get deleted on first sign of counter pressure?

Shadow stepping worked fine for assassins in GW1 and if really they'd need stealth, they could make so that stealth becomes an engaging/disengaging mechanic...not a reset button.

Except stealth as an engaging mechanic is the
only
problem with stealth. "Stealth as a reset button" doesnt exist, because its incredibly unsafe, and just a lot worse than swapping to shortbow and shortbow 5ing out of there. The problem with stealth is that sometimes you get hit by a target you never saw. No counterplay. In-combat stealth has the opposite problem. It has too much counterplay. To the point that its frankly worthless.

See the video of the VallunWhere stealth + 450 leap dodge can help youescape/survive most of the situations

You mean the video where the only time he did that, he immediately got killed by a Necro because he did it? And where every time he wanted to run, he did what any decent thief would do, and swapped to shortbow to port out? You can clearly also see that he never uses stealth in-combat (other than that one time that lead to his death), but instead uses shadowshot. And its even againts worse players, as he points out himself.

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UNOwen.7132

UNOwen.7132

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@Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Sure, but burst spec = High burst. Something notably absent from thief.

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

Actually burst specs would be great for dueling. They can just burst the enemy down. But that requires them to have burst. Thief currently has worse burst than even some of the "tank" specs. Not an ideal situation, is it?

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

Stealth has no relevance here. "Resetting and disengaging" is something both warriors and rangers
excel
at, and theyve got high sustain. Hell even Ele is decent at it, and they got high sustain too. So no, thief would be able to keep it. They would lose some of the mobility, but not much. Or alternatively they get the burst they need to be
burst
specs.

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...it's just pointless at this point to keep asking for that,
the community will never accept that idea of super mobile insta burst brawler from stealth
..it's simply absurd

Are thieves asking for that? Right now thief burst isnt "huge burst twoshot". Its frankly rather pathetic. Thieves ask
either
for that burst, or for sustain. Currently they have
neither
.

So we must copy the stealth of other games .Should we copy from WoW /Ender scroll /Rift where it breaks on damage or getting dots ? or from shouts ?

Sure. Lets also add the burst and CC rogues have in those games. You will be fine with every Thief engaging out of stealth on you and oneshotting you without you having any chance to react, right? Or perhaps, just perhaps, is that the issue with stealth, and thats why the WoW model is not being used anymore? And why GW2s general system is more popular? But Ive already explained all of this to you. You simply refused to learn. As you will now.

Every game you need resources to to build up and stun . And even then you can breakstun and DOT him and not let him restealth ..Even blizzard, because they cannot change the DOTA stealth that its rooted for how long , in their newer game Heroes of the Stormed , changed stealth to be visible from your radius

Well, time to add "Other MMOs and MOBAs" on the list of things you dont know anything about. Boy what a long list that is becoming. Maybe we should try and make a list of things you do know instead, it oughta be shorter. A lot shorter.

Lets have a 2 hour peactime and we will continue till the morningYou like to talk ...andwe have both myopia for our classes

No, I just hate people like you. People who talk about things they dont understand, refuse to learn, and just let their bias speak for themselves. Take my advice, if you dont want to look like the fool you are, just stop talking about things you dont know anything about. In this case, it means stop talking about GW2 alltogether.

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Psycoprophet.8107

Psycoprophet.8107

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@Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Sure, but burst spec = High burst. Something notably absent from thief.

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

Actually burst specs would be great for dueling. They can just burst the enemy down. But that requires them to have burst. Thief currently has worse burst than even some of the "tank" specs. Not an ideal situation, is it?

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

Stealth has no relevance here. "Resetting and disengaging" is something both warriors and rangers
excel
at, and theyve got high sustain. Hell even Ele is decent at it, and they got high sustain too. So no, thief would be able to keep it. They would lose some of the mobility, but not much. Or alternatively they get the burst they need to be
burst
specs.

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...it's just pointless at this point to keep asking for that,
the community will never accept that idea of super mobile insta burst brawler from stealth
..it's simply absurd

Are thieves asking for that? Right now thief burst isnt "huge burst twoshot". Its frankly rather pathetic. Thieves ask
either
for that burst, or for sustain. Currently they have
neither
.

So we must copy the stealth of other games .Should we copy from WoW /Ender scroll /Rift where it breaks on damage or getting dots ? or from shouts ?

A burst spec needs the actual burst that's in the name, right now tanks frequently out burst thieves, that is poor balancing as a burst hit and run playstyle is set up where the burst is significant enough to severely damage the opponent if burst is successful and the run part is there because to deal that high burst it would be unbalanced to have the sustain to stay in the fight also providing sustained dps which is why high mobility evasiveness is added for a way to avoid being insta downed if ur burst fails.I do agree that ALL melee damage should reveal thief, aoe and dots being exception due to gw2 prevalent aoe condi spamming as that would make stealth useless in most matches.

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Psycoprophet.8107

Psycoprophet.8107

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@Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Sure, but burst spec = High burst. Something notably absent from thief.

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

Actually burst specs would be great for dueling. They can just burst the enemy down. But that requires them to have burst. Thief currently has worse burst than even some of the "tank" specs. Not an ideal situation, is it?

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

Stealth has no relevance here. "Resetting and disengaging" is something both warriors and rangers
excel
at, and theyve got high sustain. Hell even Ele is decent at it, and they got high sustain too. So no, thief would be able to keep it. They would lose some of the mobility, but not much. Or alternatively they get the burst they need to be
burst
specs.

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...it's just pointless at this point to keep asking for that,
the community will never accept that idea of super mobile insta burst brawler from stealth
..it's simply absurd

Are thieves asking for that? Right now thief burst isnt "huge burst twoshot". Its frankly rather pathetic. Thieves ask
either
for that burst, or for sustain. Currently they have
neither
.

So we must copy the stealth of other games .Should we copy from WoW /Ender scroll /Rift where it breaks on damage or getting dots ? or from shouts ?

I'll take eso stealth anyday just remember to hit a button every 2 sec for perma stealth lol be way easier and less annoying to stay invisible lol

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Raiden The Beast.3016

Raiden The Beast.3016

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@EremiteAngel.9765 said:I would recommend that more of us watch top streamers play in their Plat 3 / Legendary streams so we wouldn’t be too biased when calling for nerfs based on our own low leveled limited experiences.

When you have watched enough, you will realise that every class can perform at the highest levels.

People say nerf Ranger pets!But i watched a Necro fight on equal grounds with Boyce’s ranger. And the Necro arguably won by a whisker, forcing Boyce to retreat. Boyce! One of EU’s strongest! Forced to retreat by a Necro!

Okay then people say nerf Necro!I watched Naru, one of NA’s strongest, on his Reaper double team a holosmith in a 2 vs 1. The Holo tanked both Naru and his teammate, kited Naru’s Lich burst, and practically 1 vs 2 Naru and his teammate for Long durations. Immortal Holo!

Then people say nerf Immortal Holo!I watched Shadowfall on his ranger, out-noding an immortal Holo, forcing decaps frequently and even succeed in bursting and killing the Holo after a long fight.

Then people say nerf rev!I watched Ajax on his warrior stream, 1 vs 2 a ranger and revenant, and almost killed the rev. Forced multiple decaps against both condi/power revs. But I don’t think anyone ever calls to nerf warrior.

Then people say nerf condi mirage!I watched a power rev kill a top 10 ranked Mirage on stream even though the Mirage later got revenge on the rev too.

What I’m trying to say is that every class used at the highest levels has viable builds and roles.

And from what I’ve watched, there are no extremely over performing class that is an outlier.

Watch more of those high level games and you’ll learn that even those classes that you think are OP, can be countered and beaten in some way.

B U F F Teef

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Killthehealersffs.8940

Killthehealersffs.8940

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@Psycoprophet.8107 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Sure, but burst spec = High burst. Something notably absent from thief.

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

Actually burst specs would be great for dueling. They can just burst the enemy down. But that requires them to have burst. Thief currently has worse burst than even some of the "tank" specs. Not an ideal situation, is it?

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

Stealth has no relevance here. "Resetting and disengaging" is something both warriors and rangers
excel
at, and theyve got high sustain. Hell even Ele is decent at it, and they got high sustain too. So no, thief would be able to keep it. They would lose some of the mobility, but not much. Or alternatively they get the burst they need to be
burst
specs.

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...it's just pointless at this point to keep asking for that,
the community will never accept that idea of super mobile insta burst brawler from stealth
..it's simply absurd

Are thieves asking for that? Right now thief burst isnt "huge burst twoshot". Its frankly rather pathetic. Thieves ask
either
for that burst, or for sustain. Currently they have
neither
.

So we must copy the stealth of other games .Should we copy from WoW /Ender scroll /Rift where it breaks on damage or getting dots ? or from shouts ?

A burst spec needs the actual burst that's in the name, right now tanks frequently out burst thieves, that is poor balancing as a burst hit and run playstyle is set up where the burst is significant enough to severely damage the opponent if burst is successful and the run part is there because to deal that high burst it would be unbalanced to have the sustain to stay in the fight also providing sustained dps which is why high mobility evasiveness is added for a way to avoid being insta downed if ur burst fails.I do agree that ALL melee damage should reveal thief, aoe and dots being exception due to gw2 prevalent aoe condi spamming as that would make stealth useless in most matches.

Thief is Thief not an AssasinAt launch ppl used the D/D one shot spec (assasin)At 2013-2014 when the the sword 3 , was split from one huge chain attack (evade spec)Or when HoT was luanced at semptember of 2015 , and at january ppl used the Headshot+Pi spec (disturb spec)Or 7 months after the Hot launcehd ppl found out the Stuff/Stuff build (evade spec)3 months later than than the D/D conditional spec in WvWVw showned up (condition)

All of these specs is differnt that the original description of the class , and the community found and usedd them

(dont be rude to new players...)

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Killthehealersffs.8940

Killthehealersffs.8940

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'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...

I'll agree burst specs should rely on high mobility and evades but a burst spec should also have burst like stated in the description of burst spec. If u compare a power dp burst to almost every other class ull in fact notice that most classes including bunker specs can do 5k bursts in multiple ways matching the burst of the so called high mobility/evasive burst spec.Balanced.... gw2 community lol.Listening to the majority of these players is part of the reason this game is a clown fest. U can't balance a game dependent on annoyance rather than actual over performance no matter how hard the community tries.

Blame Anet and not the community...you won't find any game out there whose community accept any implementation of stealth, it has been a griefing mechanic since the dawn of MMO

Random player request on reddit....

Looking for an MMO with a stealth mechanic to ruthlessly gank / troll players on.Listen lads. I need a good game where I can grief and troll other people with game mechanics.

No, not calling out someone for being a girl gamer or whatever, but something like Vanilla WoW where I can stealth a low level quest zone as a rogue and gank players all day, >or Rust where I can kill without armor on with a bolty from a tower.

Currently playing Will to Live Online but it only has like 70 people playing on the US server so there's not really anyone to gank and take their gear.

Anyone got a decent recommendation of what to play that has a decent sized player base for ganking / annoying? I'd prefer if it had a class with a stealth mechanic but it >doesn't have to have one.

Do you see what stealth in a MMO normally entices? You can't blame people for hating any implementation of stealth in a MMO, it will always end being a griefing mechanic

True I am incorrect in blaming the community for anet listening to their balance changes based off annoyance rather than actual overperfornance as it's on anets team to be knowledgeable to determine the difference, they've been so good at it this far lol.I understand people grievances with stealth and the have all the same complaints in all mmo's that have it which is most. There's a reason why it exists though. When creating a rogue archetype which is a popular archetype in mmo's and hated they all follow the same high mobility, highly evasive low hp/armor and usually have top burst potential which also creates a lot of q's. How would u create a class that has far lower hp/armor without giving it a mechanic like stealth to help being downed quickly in every engagements? Would u give it a huge number of evades/dodges to spam, not just 2 or 3 and some evades in select skillsAccess to a blind on almost every skill, or maybe enough burst that just evading a few attacks and hitting the opponent only a few times would quickly down even tankier classes since its risky to fight?How would u do the squishy burst class making it viable to fight and not just get deleted on first sign of counter pressure?

Shadow stepping worked fine for assassins in GW1 and if really they'd need stealth, they could make so that stealth becomes an engaging/disengaging mechanic...not a reset button.

Except stealth as an engaging mechanic is the
only
problem with stealth. "Stealth as a reset button" doesnt exist, because its incredibly unsafe, and just a lot worse than swapping to shortbow and shortbow 5ing out of there. The problem with stealth is that sometimes you get hit by a target you never saw. No counterplay. In-combat stealth has the opposite problem. It has too much counterplay. To the point that its frankly worthless.

See the video of the VallunWhere stealth + 450 leap dodge can help youescape/survive most of the situations

You mean the video where the only time he did that, he immediately got killed by a Necro because he did it? And where every time he wanted to run, he did what any decent thief would do, and swapped to shortbow to port out? You can clearly also see that he never uses stealth in-combat (other than that one time that lead to his death), but instead uses shadowshot. And its even againts worse players, as he points out himself.

Theother 3 istances near the base , where is a huge amount of newly create obstructs and he run out of the necro and the other dudeWhen used the same atctic when the P/P was doing the unload

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Killthehealersffs.8940

Killthehealersffs.8940

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Posted

@UNOwen.7132 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Sure, but burst spec = High burst. Something notably absent from thief.

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

Actually burst specs would be great for dueling. They can just burst the enemy down. But that requires them to have burst. Thief currently has worse burst than even some of the "tank" specs. Not an ideal situation, is it?

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

Stealth has no relevance here. "Resetting and disengaging" is something both warriors and rangers
excel
at, and theyve got high sustain. Hell even Ele is decent at it, and they got high sustain too. So no, thief would be able to keep it. They would lose some of the mobility, but not much. Or alternatively they get the burst they need to be
burst
specs.

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...it's just pointless at this point to keep asking for that,
the community will never accept that idea of super mobile insta burst brawler from stealth
..it's simply absurd

Are thieves asking for that? Right now thief burst isnt "huge burst twoshot". Its frankly rather pathetic. Thieves ask
either
for that burst, or for sustain. Currently they have
neither
.

So we must copy the stealth of other games .Should we copy from WoW /Ender scroll /Rift where it breaks on damage or getting dots ? or from shouts ?

Sure. Lets also add the burst and CC rogues have in those games. You will be fine with every Thief engaging out of stealth on you and oneshotting you without you having any chance to react, right? Or perhaps, just perhaps, is that the issue with stealth, and thats why the WoW model is not being used anymore? And why GW2s general system is more popular? But Ive already explained all of this to you. You simply refused to learn. As you will now.

Every game you need resources to to build up and stun . And even then you can breakstun and DOT him and not let him restealth ..Even blizzard, because they cannot change the DOTA stealth that its rooted for how long , in their newer game Heroes of the Stormed , changed stealth to be visible from your radius

Well, time to add "Other MMOs and MOBAs" on the list of things you dont know anything about. Boy what a long list that is becoming. Maybe we should try and make a list of things you do know instead, it oughta be shorter. A lot shorter.

Lets have a 2 hour peactime and we will continue till the morningYou like to talk ...andwe have both myopia for our classes

No, I just hate people like you. People who talk about things they dont understand, refuse to learn, and just let their bias speak for themselves. Take my advice, if you dont want to look like the fool you are, just stop talking about things you dont know anything about. In this case, it means stop talking about GW2 alltogether.

Ok tell me the MMO , because the majority have weaknessYou are the one saying that the majority of the mmo dont have a weaknessGo on , lets have a chat forthem

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Killthehealersffs.8940

Killthehealersffs.8940

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Posted

@Psycoprophet.8107 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Sure, but burst spec = High burst. Something notably absent from thief.

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

Actually burst specs would be great for dueling. They can just burst the enemy down. But that requires them to have burst. Thief currently has worse burst than even some of the "tank" specs. Not an ideal situation, is it?

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

Stealth has no relevance here. "Resetting and disengaging" is something both warriors and rangers
excel
at, and theyve got high sustain. Hell even Ele is decent at it, and they got high sustain too. So no, thief would be able to keep it. They would lose some of the mobility, but not much. Or alternatively they get the burst they need to be
burst
specs.

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...it's just pointless at this point to keep asking for that,
the community will never accept that idea of super mobile insta burst brawler from stealth
..it's simply absurd

Are thieves asking for that? Right now thief burst isnt "huge burst twoshot". Its frankly rather pathetic. Thieves ask
either
for that burst, or for sustain. Currently they have
neither
.

So we must copy the stealth of other games .Should we copy from WoW /Ender scroll /Rift where it breaks on damage or getting dots ? or from shouts ?

I'll take eso stealth anyday just remember to hit a button every 2 sec for perma stealth lol be way easier and less annoying to stay invisible lol

In eso , if you close you will block the next attackAnd you need 1,5 sec before you are moved to a semi transparent state to fully stealth .If you get or dot , you get destealth

Lets copy it to GW2

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Psycoprophet.8107

Psycoprophet.8107

Posted
Posted

@Killthehealersffs.8940 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Sure, but burst spec = High burst. Something notably absent from thief.

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

Actually burst specs would be great for dueling. They can just burst the enemy down. But that requires them to have burst. Thief currently has worse burst than even some of the "tank" specs. Not an ideal situation, is it?

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

Stealth has no relevance here. "Resetting and disengaging" is something both warriors and rangers
excel
at, and theyve got high sustain. Hell even Ele is decent at it, and they got high sustain too. So no, thief would be able to keep it. They would lose some of the mobility, but not much. Or alternatively they get the burst they need to be
burst
specs.

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...it's just pointless at this point to keep asking for that,
the community will never accept that idea of super mobile insta burst brawler from stealth
..it's simply absurd

Are thieves asking for that? Right now thief burst isnt "huge burst twoshot". Its frankly rather pathetic. Thieves ask
either
for that burst, or for sustain. Currently they have
neither
.

So we must copy the stealth of other games .Should we copy from WoW /Ender scroll /Rift where it breaks on damage or getting dots ? or from shouts ?

A burst spec needs the actual burst that's in the name, right now tanks frequently out burst thieves, that is poor balancing as a burst hit and run playstyle is set up where the burst is significant enough to severely damage the opponent if burst is successful and the run part is there because to deal that high burst it would be unbalanced to have the sustain to stay in the fight also providing sustained dps which is why high mobility evasiveness is added for a way to avoid being insta downed if ur burst fails.I do agree that ALL melee damage should reveal thief, aoe and dots being exception due to gw2 prevalent aoe condi spamming as that would make stealth useless in most matches.

Thief is Thief not an AssasinAt launch ppl used the D/D one shot spec (assasin)At 2013-2014 when the the sword 3 , was split from one huge chain attack (evade spec)Or when HoT was luanced at semptember of 2015 , and at january ppl used the Headshot+Pi spec (disturb spec)Or 7 months after the Hot launcehd ppl found out the Stuff/Stuff build (evade spec)3 months later than than the D/D conditional spec in WvWVw showned up (condition)

All of these specs is differnt that the original description of the class , and the community found and usedd them

(dont be rude to new players...)

Thief not a assassin? That statement itself is a good time to end the convo with one response.Thief has so much of gw1 assassin intertwined into it that a assassin spec being given to thief in new cantha expac would basically be redundant. Look at every skill regarding how thief evades and disengages and thier utilities and playstyle, doesnt get more assassin. Poison,venoms,smoke bombs and screens,caltrops,throwing daggers. Hell even 90% of their traits depict shinobi as well as most trait names lending to the assassin theme. U either know very little about thief and shouldn't be arguing anything regarding the class or are just arguing for sake of arguement and either way going any further is pointless on my part. Unowen I suggest u do the same.

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UNOwen.7132

UNOwen.7132

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Posted

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...

I'll agree burst specs should rely on high mobility and evades but a burst spec should also have burst like stated in the description of burst spec. If u compare a power dp burst to almost every other class ull in fact notice that most classes including bunker specs can do 5k bursts in multiple ways matching the burst of the so called high mobility/evasive burst spec.Balanced.... gw2 community lol.Listening to the majority of these players is part of the reason this game is a clown fest. U can't balance a game dependent on annoyance rather than actual over performance no matter how hard the community tries.

Blame Anet and not the community...you won't find any game out there whose community accept any implementation of stealth, it has been a griefing mechanic since the dawn of MMO

Random player request on reddit....

Looking for an MMO with a stealth mechanic to ruthlessly gank / troll players on.Listen lads. I need a good game where I can grief and troll other people with game mechanics.

No, not calling out someone for being a girl gamer or whatever, but something like Vanilla WoW where I can stealth a low level quest zone as a rogue and gank players all day, >or Rust where I can kill without armor on with a bolty from a tower.

Currently playing Will to Live Online but it only has like 70 people playing on the US server so there's not really anyone to gank and take their gear.

Anyone got a decent recommendation of what to play that has a decent sized player base for ganking / annoying? I'd prefer if it had a class with a stealth mechanic but it >doesn't have to have one.

Do you see what stealth in a MMO normally entices? You can't blame people for hating any implementation of stealth in a MMO, it will always end being a griefing mechanic

True I am incorrect in blaming the community for anet listening to their balance changes based off annoyance rather than actual overperfornance as it's on anets team to be knowledgeable to determine the difference, they've been so good at it this far lol.I understand people grievances with stealth and the have all the same complaints in all mmo's that have it which is most. There's a reason why it exists though. When creating a rogue archetype which is a popular archetype in mmo's and hated they all follow the same high mobility, highly evasive low hp/armor and usually have top burst potential which also creates a lot of q's. How would u create a class that has far lower hp/armor without giving it a mechanic like stealth to help being downed quickly in every engagements? Would u give it a huge number of evades/dodges to spam, not just 2 or 3 and some evades in select skillsAccess to a blind on almost every skill, or maybe enough burst that just evading a few attacks and hitting the opponent only a few times would quickly down even tankier classes since its risky to fight?How would u do the squishy burst class making it viable to fight and not just get deleted on first sign of counter pressure?

Shadow stepping worked fine for assassins in GW1 and if really they'd need stealth, they could make so that stealth becomes an engaging/disengaging mechanic...not a reset button.

Except stealth as an engaging mechanic is the
only
problem with stealth. "Stealth as a reset button" doesnt exist, because its incredibly unsafe, and just a lot worse than swapping to shortbow and shortbow 5ing out of there. The problem with stealth is that sometimes you get hit by a target you never saw. No counterplay. In-combat stealth has the opposite problem. It has too much counterplay. To the point that its frankly worthless.

See the video of the VallunWhere stealth + 450 leap dodge can help youescape/survive most of the situations

You mean the video where the only time he did that, he immediately got killed by a Necro because he did it? And where every time he wanted to run, he did what any decent thief would do, and swapped to shortbow to port out? You can clearly also see that he never uses stealth in-combat (other than that one time that lead to his death), but instead uses shadowshot. And its even againts worse players, as he points out himself.

Theother 3 istances near the base , where is a huge amount of newly create obstructs and he run out of the necro and the other dudeWhen used the same atctic when the P/P was doing the unload

There was only one other instance. When he was killing a Necro alongside 3 other people. And the Necro obviously couldnt punish him. The only other times he got out of combat.

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UNOwen.7132

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Posted

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Sure, but burst spec = High burst. Something notably absent from thief.

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

Actually burst specs would be great for dueling. They can just burst the enemy down. But that requires them to have burst. Thief currently has worse burst than even some of the "tank" specs. Not an ideal situation, is it?

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

Stealth has no relevance here. "Resetting and disengaging" is something both warriors and rangers
excel
at, and theyve got high sustain. Hell even Ele is decent at it, and they got high sustain too. So no, thief would be able to keep it. They would lose some of the mobility, but not much. Or alternatively they get the burst they need to be
burst
specs.

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...it's just pointless at this point to keep asking for that,
the community will never accept that idea of super mobile insta burst brawler from stealth
..it's simply absurd

Are thieves asking for that? Right now thief burst isnt "huge burst twoshot". Its frankly rather pathetic. Thieves ask
either
for that burst, or for sustain. Currently they have
neither
.

So we must copy the stealth of other games .Should we copy from WoW /Ender scroll /Rift where it breaks on damage or getting dots ? or from shouts ?

Sure. Lets also add the burst and CC rogues have in those games. You will be fine with every Thief engaging out of stealth on you and oneshotting you without you having any chance to react, right? Or perhaps, just perhaps, is that the issue with stealth, and thats why the WoW model is not being used anymore? And why GW2s general system is more popular? But Ive already explained all of this to you. You simply refused to learn. As you will now.

Every game you need resources to to build up and stun . And even then you can breakstun and DOT him and not let him restealth ..Even blizzard, because they cannot change the DOTA stealth that its rooted for how long , in their newer game Heroes of the Stormed , changed stealth to be visible from your radius

Well, time to add "Other MMOs and MOBAs" on the list of things you dont know anything about. Boy what a long list that is becoming. Maybe we should try and make a list of things you do know instead, it oughta be shorter. A lot shorter.

Lets have a 2 hour peactime and we will continue till the morningYou like to talk ...andwe have both myopia for our classes

No, I just hate people like you. People who talk about things they dont understand, refuse to learn, and just let their bias speak for themselves. Take my advice, if you dont want to look like the fool you are, just stop talking about things you dont know anything about. In this case, it means stop talking about GW2 alltogether.

Ok tell me the MMO , because the majority have weaknessYou are the one saying that the majority of the mmo dont have a weaknessGo on , lets have a chat forthem

What are you talking about? What I said is that the majority of pvp multiplayer games do not use WoWs system anymore because its really, really bad. So what the hell are you talking about with "weaknesses"? Probably just the same clueless nonsense as always. Let me repeat. If you want WoWs system, you want Thief to be able to oneshot you out of stealth with you being unable to do anything. I dont think thats a good idea, but if you so desperately want it, sure, lets copy it. Hopefully the thieves will hunt you down as much as possible so you can see what a STUPID idea it was.

Or alternatively, we could do the smart thing. We nerf out of combat stealth, making it impossible to just burst someone without them having any chance of knowing you were there, and buff the already weak in-combat stealth.

Then again, doesnt seem like you care much for doing the smart thing. Or the truth for that matter. Youre just blindly biased against thief and want thief to be completely 100% unplayable. While being so clueless, it makes me wonder if you hate thief because you managed to lose your fights against them just because you dont understand the first thing about the game.

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Killthehealersffs.8940

Killthehealersffs.8940

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Posted

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Sure, but burst spec = High burst. Something notably absent from thief.

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

Actually burst specs would be great for dueling. They can just burst the enemy down. But that requires them to have burst. Thief currently has worse burst than even some of the "tank" specs. Not an ideal situation, is it?

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

Stealth has no relevance here. "Resetting and disengaging" is something both warriors and rangers
excel
at, and theyve got high sustain. Hell even Ele is decent at it, and they got high sustain too. So no, thief would be able to keep it. They would lose some of the mobility, but not much. Or alternatively they get the burst they need to be
burst
specs.

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...it's just pointless at this point to keep asking for that,
the community will never accept that idea of super mobile insta burst brawler from stealth
..it's simply absurd

Are thieves asking for that? Right now thief burst isnt "huge burst twoshot". Its frankly rather pathetic. Thieves ask
either
for that burst, or for sustain. Currently they have
neither
.

So we must copy the stealth of other games .Should we copy from WoW /Ender scroll /Rift where it breaks on damage or getting dots ? or from shouts ?

Sure. Lets also add the burst and CC rogues have in those games. You will be fine with every Thief engaging out of stealth on you and oneshotting you without you having any chance to react, right? Or perhaps, just perhaps, is that the issue with stealth, and thats why the WoW model is not being used anymore? And why GW2s general system is more popular? But Ive already explained all of this to you. You simply refused to learn. As you will now.

Every game you need resources to to build up and stun . And even then you can breakstun and DOT him and not let him restealth ..Even blizzard, because they cannot change the DOTA stealth that its rooted for how long , in their newer game Heroes of the Stormed , changed stealth to be visible from your radius

Well, time to add "Other MMOs and MOBAs" on the list of things you dont know anything about. Boy what a long list that is becoming. Maybe we should try and make a list of things you do know instead, it oughta be shorter. A lot shorter.

Lets have a 2 hour peactime and we will continue till the morningYou like to talk ...andwe have both myopia for our classes

No, I just hate people like you. People who talk about things they dont understand, refuse to learn, and just let their bias speak for themselves. Take my advice, if you dont want to look like the fool you are, just stop talking about things you dont know anything about. In this case, it means stop talking about GW2 alltogether.

Ok tell me the MMO , because the majority have weaknessYou are the one saying that the majority of the mmo dont have a weaknessGo on , lets have a chat forthem

What are you
talking
about? What I said is that the majority of pvp multiplayer games do not use WoWs system anymore because its really,
really
bad. So what the hell are you talking about with "weaknesses"? Probably just the same clueless nonsense as always. Let me repeat. If you want WoWs system, you want Thief to be able to oneshot you out of stealth with you being unable to do anything. I dont think thats a good idea, but if you so desperately want it, sure, lets copy it. Hopefully the thieves will hunt you down as much as possible so you can see what a
STUPID
idea it was.

Or alternatively, we could do the smart thing. We nerf out of combat stealth, making it impossible to just burst someone without them having any chance of knowing you were there, and
buff
the already weak in-combat stealth.

Then again, doesnt seem like you care much for doing the smart thing. Or the truth for that matter. Youre just blindly biased against thief and want thief to be completely 100% unplayable. While being so clueless, it makes me wonder if you hate thief because you managed to lose your fights against them just because you dont understand the first thing about the game.

Tell me the MMo that dont follow the Wow models ?In WoW stealth has a drawback , which is called movement reduction. .Its my problem if i am stationary

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Arheundel.6451

Arheundel.6451

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Posted

@Psycoprophet.8107 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:What OP thief build?

'A match where I don't play too well on D/P Thief, and neither does my team, but I adapt to bad situations. Showing that you can get kills easily as a thief so long as you find the right situations.', Vallun

The last paragraph of his vid description doesnt describe a class in a good state. Shows u can still get easy kills with thief as long as u find the right situation. If ur rotating and picking off opponents in +1 that are low on hp that's the right situation and a class that requires such for kills especially a burst class is far from being in a healthy spot.

Burst spec = low sustainBrawler spec = mid sustainTank spec = high sustain

Sure, but burst spec = High burst. Something notably absent from thief.

Burst specs are married to high mobility and evasion to carry out their role, perfect for +1 situations...
not super duellist role
, this is something thief players still don't understand at all.....expecting to have the highest mobility, the burst and the sustain to go toe to toe with builds specced for tanking...and come on top after some time without any chance for the opponent to ever catch up the thief in mobility.

Actually burst specs would be great for dueling. They can just burst the enemy down. But that requires them to have burst. Thief currently has worse burst than even some of the "tank" specs. Not an ideal situation, is it?

You want to duel?...You can ask for the sustain to do so...but after doing that don't expect to keep the vast majority of that mobility, stealth resetting ability and disengage in general

Stealth has no relevance here. "Resetting and disengaging" is something both warriors and rangers
excel
at, and theyve got high sustain. Hell even Ele is decent at it, and they got high sustain too. So no, thief would be able to keep it. They would lose some of the mobility, but not much. Or alternatively they get the burst they need to be
burst
specs.

You simply can't have huge burst twoshot and sustain in the same spec...it's just pointless at this point to keep asking for that,
the community will never accept that idea of super mobile insta burst brawler from stealth
..it's simply absurd

Are thieves asking for that? Right now thief burst isnt "huge burst twoshot". Its frankly rather pathetic. Thieves ask
either
for that burst, or for sustain. Currently they have
neither
.

So we must copy the stealth of other games .Should we copy from WoW /Ender scroll /Rift where it breaks on damage or getting dots ? or from shouts ?

A burst spec needs the actual burst that's in the name, right now tanks frequently out burst thieves, that is poor balancing as a burst hit and run playstyle is set up where the burst is significant enough to severely damage the opponent if burst is successful and the run part is there because to deal that high burst it would be unbalanced to have the sustain to stay in the fight also providing sustained dps which is why high mobility evasiveness is added for a way to avoid being insta downed if ur burst fails.I do agree that ALL melee damage should reveal thief, aoe and dots being exception due to gw2 prevalent aoe condi spamming as that would make stealth useless in most matches.

No...I have stated that Burst spec is a +1 not a spec with massive opening dmg and retreat potential, right now thieves can fail and repeat the sequence till they succeed and that's my idea of "super duellist" and why people really hate thief in this game

Burst=low sustainLow sustain =/ running away and try again in few secs thx to ini

Low sustain means that you have failed and it's time to pay the price...you don't get to try again in few secs time while staying in combat, this is the major grievance with thieves : their ability to re-stealth while in combat. Stealth in general should be only to safely engage and disengage once out of combat...it should not be a free reset option for you to try and try again and make up for your failed burst at the beginning.

Remove entirely the ability to re-stealth while in combat and provide thieves with the tools to safely disengage out of combat and try again or deal with the enemy once the element of surprise is void

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