You NEED/MUST nerf the repeater flip skill for shadow strike on PD condi thief in PVP

[lare.5129]

I was try this p/d condi biuld. It useless and low powered .. Get win 6 time from 20 fights .. As for me it should be boosted 2-3x.They video is fake. Why ? - It maded by platinum skill player, who will can kill anyone whit any build.

[Tayga.3192]

@"Koen.1327" said:pretty much all mes use arcane thievery, or they should at least lolI know that Helseth uses it, idk who else. Even godsofpvp doesn't list Arcane Thievery, it isn't as good as you make it sound: https://www.godsofpvp.net/builds/mesmer

ironically the metabattle build, which is wrongly put, doesnt require arcane thievery. Its not useless thoughUNOwen said "core mes" so I was answering on that.

[Koen.1327]

@Tayga.3192 said:

@"Koen.1327" said:pretty much all mes use arcane thievery, or they should at least lolI know that Helseth uses it, idk who else. Even godsofpvp doesn't list Arcane Thievery, it isn't as good as you make it sound:

https://www.godsofpvp.net/builds/mesmer

ironically the metabattle build, which is wrongly put, doesnt require arcane thievery. Its not useless thoughUNOwen said "core mes" so I was answering on that.

all condi mirages? i'm surprised in a topic about condi thief, arcane thievery is deemed void - while it very much counters condi thief.completely mandatory if you ask me, unless you run inspiration variants but i don't see them as the better option anywaythe amount of mes players is kinda low, but i've seen pretty much all mes' using this while playing in high platthe guy behind godsofpvp isn't a mes player btw

[Tayga.3192]

@Koen.1327 said:all condi mirages? i'm surprised in a topic about condi thief, arcane thievery is deemed void - while it very much counters condi thief.completely mandatory if you ask me, unless you run inspiration variants but i don't see them as the better option anywaythe amount of mes players is kinda low, but i've seen pretty much all mes' using this while playing in high platthe guy behind godsofpvp isn't a mes player btw

Yeah he's engi main afaik.

I mean, Misha plays portal in ranked for some reason so I guess thievery is also OK. It's still the 2nd best choice as 3rd utility, just after the signet.

[UNOwen.7132]

@"Leonidrex.5649" said:For plasma debate, yes its broken, yes devs want it to be broken, no you cant interrupt it because its not worth it, they will cast it again couple of sec later and wasting CC + usually sword 3/blink or other skills is not worth it.

A thief wont be fighting that long, interrupting keeps them off of it long enough for them to just run before they would use it again.

People that think repeater or guild+venom share is the reason P/D is strong... just... no words for you people.The reason P/D is OP is due to no counterplay insane level of burst, instantly from stealth or long range, or both, all while having thief mobility ofc.

Venom Share and Repeater are the reason P/D is strong. The "burst" has the same counterplay any condi burst has, condi cleansing. For that matter, without venoms and Repeater, that burst does very little damage.

As for stealth, yes P/D has many ways to get it, and yes it will get it when it needs it, there is just too many ways for thief to NOT get stealth.any smoke field from ally, when heal used, from utility, from stealing to thief, from CND.Any pet,illusion is potential stealth.every team has thief so no probs to get bundle there ( unless you suck and miss steal lul )

Quite a lot wrong here, lets go through it. "Any Smoke Field", P/D does not have a leap finisher, and swapping to shortbow for a blast finisher isnt worth it if you want offensive stealth use. On healing skill, yes. Stealing on thief, sure, but thats too narrow to usually be used. CnD will not hit against any semi-competent player except summoner classes, but also is way too risky to use against them.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Koen.1327 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Koen.1327 said:

@Tayga.3192 said:

@"UNOwen.7132" said:Reaper has 100% uptime in shroud.I think this is different, like "let's make every skill a bit slower than it should be and give it optional quickness so it's countered by corrupts"

Mesmer could also get 10% uptime with Arcane Thievery while using Master of Manipulation (which is basically just core Mesmer).I don't think any build uses Arcane Thievery anymore. That core mesmer build in metabattle is useless.

pretty much all mes use arcane thievery, or they should at least lolironically the metabattle build, which is wrongly put, doesnt require arcane thievery. Its not useless though

whats the point of arcane thievery for mesmer?quickness is useless, condi swap is no longer important since EM and inspiration is run, and If I wanted to remove boons I would go domi with shatter traits/CC rip.

its just on inspiration builds that you'd bail on arcane thievery, otherwise whats bad about applying 4 condis and gaining 4 boonsnot sure why you would debate on this, pretty much all mes use it

I debate because almost no mesmer uses it, and I want to know why you think its used.Im not saying its a bad skill, its role is simply taken by other traits that cant be replace since other options are useless.I and others would value AT if it didnt bug and if quickness had any value for mesmer, expecially condi, and power needs other utilities. I just dont see a reason to take it over midnight/portal/IA/SOI/blink/dazemantra

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Koen.1327 said:

@Tayga.3192 said:

@Koen.1327 said:pretty much all mes use arcane thievery, or they should at least lolI know that Helseth uses it, idk who else. Even godsofpvp doesn't list Arcane Thievery, it isn't as good as you make it sound:

https://www.godsofpvp.net/builds/mesmer

ironically the metabattle build, which is wrongly put, doesnt require arcane thievery. Its not useless thoughUNOwen said "core mes" so I was answering on that.

all condi mirages? i'm surprised in a topic about condi thief, arcane thievery is deemed void - while it very much counters condi thief.completely mandatory if you ask me, unless you run inspiration variants but i don't see them as the better option anywaythe amount of mes players is kinda low, but i've seen pretty much all mes' using this while playing in high platthe guy behind godsofpvp isn't a mes player btw

AT counters bad thiefs, good thief will realize you run it and not allow you to land it, and you will melt to conditions due to trying to make it work.you see thief, go inspiration, grab midnight with 5 cleanse on it, and just use it every time they steal, and they cant hurt you when alone.

[Koen.1327]

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Koen.1327 said:

@Tayga.3192 said:

@Koen.1327 said:pretty much all mes use arcane thievery, or they should at least lolI know that Helseth uses it, idk who else. Even godsofpvp doesn't list Arcane Thievery, it isn't as good as you make it sound:

https://www.godsofpvp.net/builds/mesmer

ironically the metabattle build, which is wrongly put, doesnt require arcane thievery. Its not useless thoughUNOwen said "core mes" so I was answering on that.

all condi mirages? i'm surprised in a topic about condi thief, arcane thievery is deemed void - while it very much counters condi thief.completely mandatory if you ask me, unless you run inspiration variants but i don't see them as the better option anywaythe amount of mes players is kinda low, but i've seen pretty much all mes' using this while playing in high platthe guy behind godsofpvp isn't a mes player btw

AT counters bad thiefs, good thief will realize you run it and not allow you to land it, and you will melt to conditions due to trying to make it work.you see thief, go inspiration, grab midnight with 5 cleanse on it, and just use it every time they steal, and they cant hurt you when alone.

repeater is more than a sec, you should land arcane thievery 100% of the time vs condi thieves. it's the reverse here, good mes' will always land thisi already mentioned mes' in high plat use AT mostly, i mean, there really isn't anything to debate - if you don't see it in lower tiers it's their/your loss

[Tayga.3192]

@"Koen.1327" said:if you don't see it in lower tiers it's their/your loss

Most mesmer mains that have played the class for a long time dropped AT though, except Helseth.

ps I am not even "tier", ranked is so irrelevant I haven't even done my placements.

[CutesySylveon.8290]

@Crab Fear.1624 said:

@Eugchriss.2046 said:Make every weapon skill cost 8 initiatives. Period.

sure and every rev skill cost 35 energy period

We're getting there...give us a few months.

[CutesySylveon.8290]

Also hard pass on upping Initiative costs. I'm sick of this being used as a band aid nerf tactic for the two resource classes. Tone it down so it's not so oppressive to be hit with rather than being lazy and just upping the cost to use it. You want more skills to go the Choking Gas way?

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Koen.1327 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Koen.1327 said:

@Tayga.3192 said:

@Koen.1327 said:pretty much all mes use arcane thievery, or they should at least lolI know that Helseth uses it, idk who else. Even godsofpvp doesn't list Arcane Thievery, it isn't as good as you make it sound:

https://www.godsofpvp.net/builds/mesmer

ironically the metabattle build, which is wrongly put, doesnt require arcane thievery. Its not useless thoughUNOwen said "core mes" so I was answering on that.

all condi mirages? i'm surprised in a topic about condi thief, arcane thievery is deemed void - while it very much counters condi thief.completely mandatory if you ask me, unless you run inspiration variants but i don't see them as the better option anywaythe amount of mes players is kinda low, but i've seen pretty much all mes' using this while playing in high platthe guy behind godsofpvp isn't a mes player btw

AT counters bad thiefs, good thief will realize you run it and not allow you to land it, and you will melt to conditions due to trying to make it work.you see thief, go inspiration, grab midnight with 5 cleanse on it, and just use it every time they steal, and they cant hurt you when alone.

repeater is more than a sec, you should land arcane thievery 100% of the time vs condi thieves. it's the reverse here, good mes' will always land thisi already mentioned mes' in high plat use AT mostly, i mean, there really isn't anything to debate - if you don't see it in lower tiers it's their/your loss

From about 200games I played in plat1/plat2 I Dont think I have seen a single AT use. From all the mesmer streams that I have watch, helseth is the only one that used AT.If you go AT and not inspiration thief doesnt need to land repeater to kill you, or he can just dodge slightly after combo to deny you the AT, its mind game, thief vs mes. exept mesmer is on a rope poisoned to death and its mesmer that has to act not the thief.

[Koen.1327]

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Koen.1327 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Koen.1327 said:

@Tayga.3192 said:

@Koen.1327 said:pretty much all mes use arcane thievery, or they should at least lolI know that Helseth uses it, idk who else. Even godsofpvp doesn't list Arcane Thievery, it isn't as good as you make it sound:

https://www.godsofpvp.net/builds/mesmer

ironically the metabattle build, which is wrongly put, doesnt require arcane thievery. Its not useless thoughUNOwen said "core mes" so I was answering on that.

all condi mirages? i'm surprised in a topic about condi thief, arcane thievery is deemed void - while it very much counters condi thief.completely mandatory if you ask me, unless you run inspiration variants but i don't see them as the better option anywaythe amount of mes players is kinda low, but i've seen pretty much all mes' using this while playing in high platthe guy behind godsofpvp isn't a mes player btw

AT counters bad thiefs, good thief will realize you run it and not allow you to land it, and you will melt to conditions due to trying to make it work.you see thief, go inspiration, grab midnight with 5 cleanse on it, and just use it every time they steal, and they cant hurt you when alone.

repeater is more than a sec, you should land arcane thievery 100% of the time vs condi thieves. it's the reverse here, good mes' will always land thisi already mentioned mes' in high plat use AT mostly, i mean, there really isn't anything to debate - if you don't see it in lower tiers it's their/your loss

From about 200games I played in plat1/plat2 I Dont think I have seen a single AT use. From all the mesmer streams that I have watch, helseth is the only one that used AT.If you go AT and not inspiration thief doesnt need to land repeater to kill you, or he can just dodge slightly after combo to deny you the AT, its mind game, thief vs mes. exept mesmer is on a rope poisoned to death and its mesmer that has to act not the thief.

im eager to know mesmer streams, but in any way they don't stream in higher tiers (i know only 1 decent inspi steamer)but like i said, mes' in lower tiers not using AT is their loss - I see differently in higher plat (and vs you i also used AT)