Leonidrex.5649 Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 @Arheundel.6451 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:just make barrier decay after like 2-3s, its all it takes. If you do that you might actually be able to buff core ele without making weaver broken for exampleWe can buff core ele by nerfing all other core professions , claiming that nerfs to weaver would benefit core ele at all...I don't know who you are trying to convince....im claiming that buffing core ele would make weaver overpowered, so by nerfing barrier ( weaver ) we make space for core buffsIt won't work and you even wrote why, but still belive that nerfing barrier would make a space for core buffs, which still would be a buff Weaver indirectly(even Tempest).The real problem here is that most e-speces are built on top of core classes, which include Elementalist.Look at Necromancer and it's Reaper and Scourge, do you see how it really do change how you play your class? Compare it to Eles Tempest or Weaver:Tempest: whirly stuff, added just few skills ON TOP of Core mechanic and that's it.Weaver: added few skills, copy-paste of teef and that's it.Nothing is "different" in playstyle, you do the same kitten with few more button presses and effects.In Necromancers case, you can buff it's Unique skills, which won't affect it's e-spec counterparts.Elementalist doesn't have anything Unique to buff that it wouldn't affect e-speces, none, which is the real problem with this class(and many others).I was thinking about "locking-out" specific traitlines for e-speces, e.g.:If you pick Tempest, you lose access to Water and losing as well traitable skills (Cantrips);If you pick Weaver, you lose access to Arcane and losing as well traitable skills (Arcane);Core of course would be able to pick both Water and Arcane.This way you could buff traitlines which mostly core could take advantage of them fully, but I'm pretty sure it would create it own balance problems...Too lazy to think about solutions~1) if you pick Deadeye or daredevil you lose access to Shadow art2) if you pick druid, you lose access to beastmaster, if you pick soulbeast you lose access to Markmanship3) if you pick Herald you lose access to Invocation, if you pick Renegade you lose access to Retribution4) if you pick Spellbreaker you lose access to Strength, if you pick Berseker you lose access to Discipline5) if you pick Scrapper you lose access to Explosive, if you pick Holosmith you lose access to Alchemy....Too lazy to type other professions if you take mirage you lose access to honor and dignity of a human being Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrollingDemigod.3041 Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 @Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:just make barrier decay after like 2-3s, its all it takes. If you do that you might actually be able to buff core ele without making weaver broken for exampleWe can buff core ele by nerfing all other core professions , claiming that nerfs to weaver would benefit core ele at all...I don't know who you are trying to convince....im claiming that buffing core ele would make weaver overpowered, so by nerfing barrier ( weaver ) we make space for core buffsIt won't work and you even wrote why, but still belive that nerfing barrier would make a space for core buffs, which still would be a buff Weaver indirectly(even Tempest).The real problem here is that most e-speces are built on top of core classes, which include Elementalist.Look at Necromancer and it's Reaper and Scourge, do you see how it really do change how you play your class? Compare it to Eles Tempest or Weaver:Tempest: whirly stuff, added just few skills ON TOP of Core mechanic and that's it.Weaver: added few skills, copy-paste of teef and that's it.Nothing is "different" in playstyle, you do the same kitten with few more button presses and effects.In Necromancers case, you can buff it's Unique skills, which won't affect it's e-spec counterparts.Elementalist doesn't have anything Unique to buff that it wouldn't affect e-speces, none, which is the real problem with this class(and many others).I was thinking about "locking-out" specific traitlines for e-speces, e.g.:If you pick Tempest, you lose access to Water and losing as well traitable skills (Cantrips);If you pick Weaver, you lose access to Arcane and losing as well traitable skills (Arcane);Core of course would be able to pick both Water and Arcane.This way you could buff traitlines which mostly core could take advantage of them fully, but I'm pretty sure it would create it own balance problems...Too lazy to think about solutions~1) if you pick Deadeye or daredevil you lose access to Shadow art2) if you pick druid, you lose access to beastmaster, if you pick soulbeast you lose access to Markmanship3) if you pick Herald you lose access to Invocation, if you pick Renegade you lose access to Retribution4) if you pick Spellbreaker you lose access to Strength, if you pick Berseker you lose access to Discipline5) if you pick Scrapper you lose access to Explosive, if you pick Holosmith you lose access to Alchemy....Too lazy to type other professions if you take mirage you lose access to honor and dignity of a human beingNo no, that happens when you decide to run condies on any class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonidrex.5649 Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 @TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:just make barrier decay after like 2-3s, its all it takes. If you do that you might actually be able to buff core ele without making weaver broken for exampleWe can buff core ele by nerfing all other core professions , claiming that nerfs to weaver would benefit core ele at all...I don't know who you are trying to convince....im claiming that buffing core ele would make weaver overpowered, so by nerfing barrier ( weaver ) we make space for core buffsIt won't work and you even wrote why, but still belive that nerfing barrier would make a space for core buffs, which still would be a buff Weaver indirectly(even Tempest).The real problem here is that most e-speces are built on top of core classes, which include Elementalist.Look at Necromancer and it's Reaper and Scourge, do you see how it really do change how you play your class? Compare it to Eles Tempest or Weaver:Tempest: whirly stuff, added just few skills ON TOP of Core mechanic and that's it.Weaver: added few skills, copy-paste of teef and that's it.Nothing is "different" in playstyle, you do the same kitten with few more button presses and effects.In Necromancers case, you can buff it's Unique skills, which won't affect it's e-spec counterparts.Elementalist doesn't have anything Unique to buff that it wouldn't affect e-speces, none, which is the real problem with this class(and many others).I was thinking about "locking-out" specific traitlines for e-speces, e.g.:If you pick Tempest, you lose access to Water and losing as well traitable skills (Cantrips);If you pick Weaver, you lose access to Arcane and losing as well traitable skills (Arcane);Core of course would be able to pick both Water and Arcane.This way you could buff traitlines which mostly core could take advantage of them fully, but I'm pretty sure it would create it own balance problems...Too lazy to think about solutions~1) if you pick Deadeye or daredevil you lose access to Shadow art2) if you pick druid, you lose access to beastmaster, if you pick soulbeast you lose access to Markmanship3) if you pick Herald you lose access to Invocation, if you pick Renegade you lose access to Retribution4) if you pick Spellbreaker you lose access to Strength, if you pick Berseker you lose access to Discipline5) if you pick Scrapper you lose access to Explosive, if you pick Holosmith you lose access to Alchemy....Too lazy to type other professions if you take mirage you lose access to honor and dignity of a human beingNo no, that happens when you decide to run condies on any class.I find it interesting that loads of people complain about 1shots and bursts, yet are 100% fine with power builds and absolutely hate condis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrollingDemigod.3041 Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 @Leonidrex.5649 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:just make barrier decay after like 2-3s, its all it takes. If you do that you might actually be able to buff core ele without making weaver broken for exampleWe can buff core ele by nerfing all other core professions , claiming that nerfs to weaver would benefit core ele at all...I don't know who you are trying to convince....im claiming that buffing core ele would make weaver overpowered, so by nerfing barrier ( weaver ) we make space for core buffsIt won't work and you even wrote why, but still belive that nerfing barrier would make a space for core buffs, which still would be a buff Weaver indirectly(even Tempest).The real problem here is that most e-speces are built on top of core classes, which include Elementalist.Look at Necromancer and it's Reaper and Scourge, do you see how it really do change how you play your class? Compare it to Eles Tempest or Weaver:Tempest: whirly stuff, added just few skills ON TOP of Core mechanic and that's it.Weaver: added few skills, copy-paste of teef and that's it.Nothing is "different" in playstyle, you do the same kitten with few more button presses and effects.In Necromancers case, you can buff it's Unique skills, which won't affect it's e-spec counterparts.Elementalist doesn't have anything Unique to buff that it wouldn't affect e-speces, none, which is the real problem with this class(and many others).I was thinking about "locking-out" specific traitlines for e-speces, e.g.:If you pick Tempest, you lose access to Water and losing as well traitable skills (Cantrips);If you pick Weaver, you lose access to Arcane and losing as well traitable skills (Arcane);Core of course would be able to pick both Water and Arcane.This way you could buff traitlines which mostly core could take advantage of them fully, but I'm pretty sure it would create it own balance problems...Too lazy to think about solutions~1) if you pick Deadeye or daredevil you lose access to Shadow art2) if you pick druid, you lose access to beastmaster, if you pick soulbeast you lose access to Markmanship3) if you pick Herald you lose access to Invocation, if you pick Renegade you lose access to Retribution4) if you pick Spellbreaker you lose access to Strength, if you pick Berseker you lose access to Discipline5) if you pick Scrapper you lose access to Explosive, if you pick Holosmith you lose access to Alchemy....Too lazy to type other professions if you take mirage you lose access to honor and dignity of a human beingNo no, that happens when you decide to run condies on any class.I find it interesting that loads of people complain about 1shots and bursts, yet are 100% fine with power builds and absolutely hate condisRNG, boring, annoying, uninteractive, passive, unbalanced and many others things that could describe condi in GW2. I'll probably never understand people that enjoy condies, it's one of the worst and most boring gameplays I've ever seen. Tried it few times and I feel like falling asleep by using them, 0 fun or entertainment.They should stay as "support" mechanic, but instead they were changed into this abomination because PvE complained about bosses.Giving so much freedom by A-net was a curse, which in long run took away that "freedom". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kodama.6453 Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 @"TrollingDemigod.3041" said:RNG,Applies to power as well, because of crit.boring, annoyingHighly subjective, other people might say the same for power builds.uninteractive, passiveDepends on the builds you are running, but the fact that you can cleanse conditions unlike power damage adds interactivity in my opinion.I personally use power builds 90% of the time myself, but I think many of your statements are not really fair for the archetype.They should stay as "support" mechanic, but instead they were changed into this abomination because PvE complained about bosses.Problem is they were never truly designed as "support" mechanic to begin with.Bleed always did nothing but ticking damage, so how is that supportive? Same for burning.And if you have a weapon like engineer's pistol, which was always condition focused with very little power damage, how is that weapon supposed to function with conditions not being usable as a main damage source? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonidrex.5649 Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 @TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:just make barrier decay after like 2-3s, its all it takes. If you do that you might actually be able to buff core ele without making weaver broken for exampleWe can buff core ele by nerfing all other core professions , claiming that nerfs to weaver would benefit core ele at all...I don't know who you are trying to convince....im claiming that buffing core ele would make weaver overpowered, so by nerfing barrier ( weaver ) we make space for core buffsIt won't work and you even wrote why, but still belive that nerfing barrier would make a space for core buffs, which still would be a buff Weaver indirectly(even Tempest).The real problem here is that most e-speces are built on top of core classes, which include Elementalist.Look at Necromancer and it's Reaper and Scourge, do you see how it really do change how you play your class? Compare it to Eles Tempest or Weaver:Tempest: whirly stuff, added just few skills ON TOP of Core mechanic and that's it.Weaver: added few skills, copy-paste of teef and that's it.Nothing is "different" in playstyle, you do the same kitten with few more button presses and effects.In Necromancers case, you can buff it's Unique skills, which won't affect it's e-spec counterparts.Elementalist doesn't have anything Unique to buff that it wouldn't affect e-speces, none, which is the real problem with this class(and many others).I was thinking about "locking-out" specific traitlines for e-speces, e.g.:If you pick Tempest, you lose access to Water and losing as well traitable skills (Cantrips);If you pick Weaver, you lose access to Arcane and losing as well traitable skills (Arcane);Core of course would be able to pick both Water and Arcane.This way you could buff traitlines which mostly core could take advantage of them fully, but I'm pretty sure it would create it own balance problems...Too lazy to think about solutions~1) if you pick Deadeye or daredevil you lose access to Shadow art2) if you pick druid, you lose access to beastmaster, if you pick soulbeast you lose access to Markmanship3) if you pick Herald you lose access to Invocation, if you pick Renegade you lose access to Retribution4) if you pick Spellbreaker you lose access to Strength, if you pick Berseker you lose access to Discipline5) if you pick Scrapper you lose access to Explosive, if you pick Holosmith you lose access to Alchemy....Too lazy to type other professions if you take mirage you lose access to honor and dignity of a human beingNo no, that happens when you decide to run condies on any class.I find it interesting that loads of people complain about 1shots and bursts, yet are 100% fine with power builds and absolutely hate condisRNG, boring, annoying, uninteractive, passive, unbalanced and many others things that could describe condi in GW2. I'll probably never understand people that enjoy condies, it's one of the worst and most boring gameplays I've ever seen. Tried it few times and I feel like falling asleep by using them, 0 fun or entertainment.They should stay as "support" mechanic, but instead they were changed into this abomination because PvE complained about bosses.Giving so much freedom by A-net was a curse, which in long run took away that "freedom".RNG? how is condi rng? it has set damage and it deals this damage, its the power that is rng with crit chance and weakness glancing, making hits jump between 2k and 8k from the same skillBalanced? almost every meta is power metaPassive? depends on the build reallyannoying and boring is subjective, I like condis as they bring something new to the game and add a new layer to combat, instead off current brainded I landed 3 skills so you die Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arheundel.6451 Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 @Leonidrex.5649 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:just make barrier decay after like 2-3s, its all it takes. If you do that you might actually be able to buff core ele without making weaver broken for exampleWe can buff core ele by nerfing all other core professions , claiming that nerfs to weaver would benefit core ele at all...I don't know who you are trying to convince....im claiming that buffing core ele would make weaver overpowered, so by nerfing barrier ( weaver ) we make space for core buffsIt won't work and you even wrote why, but still belive that nerfing barrier would make a space for core buffs, which still would be a buff Weaver indirectly(even Tempest).The real problem here is that most e-speces are built on top of core classes, which include Elementalist.Look at Necromancer and it's Reaper and Scourge, do you see how it really do change how you play your class? Compare it to Eles Tempest or Weaver:Tempest: whirly stuff, added just few skills ON TOP of Core mechanic and that's it.Weaver: added few skills, copy-paste of teef and that's it.Nothing is "different" in playstyle, you do the same kitten with few more button presses and effects.In Necromancers case, you can buff it's Unique skills, which won't affect it's e-spec counterparts.Elementalist doesn't have anything Unique to buff that it wouldn't affect e-speces, none, which is the real problem with this class(and many others).I was thinking about "locking-out" specific traitlines for e-speces, e.g.:If you pick Tempest, you lose access to Water and losing as well traitable skills (Cantrips);If you pick Weaver, you lose access to Arcane and losing as well traitable skills (Arcane);Core of course would be able to pick both Water and Arcane.This way you could buff traitlines which mostly core could take advantage of them fully, but I'm pretty sure it would create it own balance problems...Too lazy to think about solutions~1) if you pick Deadeye or daredevil you lose access to Shadow art2) if you pick druid, you lose access to beastmaster, if you pick soulbeast you lose access to Markmanship3) if you pick Herald you lose access to Invocation, if you pick Renegade you lose access to Retribution4) if you pick Spellbreaker you lose access to Strength, if you pick Berseker you lose access to Discipline5) if you pick Scrapper you lose access to Explosive, if you pick Holosmith you lose access to Alchemy....Too lazy to type other professions if you take mirage you lose access to honor and dignity of a human beingNo no, that happens when you decide to run condies on any class.I find it interesting that loads of people complain about 1shots and bursts, yet are 100% fine with power builds and absolutely hate condisRNG, boring, annoying, uninteractive, passive, unbalanced and many others things that could describe condi in GW2. I'll probably never understand people that enjoy condies, it's one of the worst and most boring gameplays I've ever seen. Tried it few times and I feel like falling asleep by using them, 0 fun or entertainment.They should stay as "support" mechanic, but instead they were changed into this abomination because PvE complained about bosses.Giving so much freedom by A-net was a curse, which in long run took away that "freedom".RNG? how is condi rng? it has set damage and it deals this damage, its the power that is rng with crit chance and weakness glancing, making hits jump between 2k and 8k from the same skillBalanced? almost every meta is power metaPassive? depends on the build reallyannoying and boring is subjective, I like condis as they bring something new to the game and add a new layer to combat, instead off current brainded I landed 3 skills so you dieThe reason why people prefer power is because those 3 hit kill requires mostly a glassy set up that can be either dodged or blocked way easily than condi attacks, which tend to be AoE on short CD( necro wells, scepter, focus - mesmer shatter, clone bounces etc etc etc) and condi burst still requires a single stats investment and doesn't require the player to pay any particular attention to the enemy....just unload everything you have and doesn't matter whether he dodges or not.Realistically speaking the meta is power only at the top where people can coordinate well enough to bring down condi bunkers, from there all the way down is full condi spam and that cannot be negated given the huge presence of necros, burning build and others.In WvW smallscale is dominated by condi builds too and the only reason condi doesn't dominate zerg fight is due to Purity of Purpose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonidrex.5649 Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 @Arheundel.6451 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:just make barrier decay after like 2-3s, its all it takes. If you do that you might actually be able to buff core ele without making weaver broken for exampleWe can buff core ele by nerfing all other core professions , claiming that nerfs to weaver would benefit core ele at all...I don't know who you are trying to convince....im claiming that buffing core ele would make weaver overpowered, so by nerfing barrier ( weaver ) we make space for core buffsIt won't work and you even wrote why, but still belive that nerfing barrier would make a space for core buffs, which still would be a buff Weaver indirectly(even Tempest).The real problem here is that most e-speces are built on top of core classes, which include Elementalist.Look at Necromancer and it's Reaper and Scourge, do you see how it really do change how you play your class? Compare it to Eles Tempest or Weaver:Tempest: whirly stuff, added just few skills ON TOP of Core mechanic and that's it.Weaver: added few skills, copy-paste of teef and that's it.Nothing is "different" in playstyle, you do the same kitten with few more button presses and effects.In Necromancers case, you can buff it's Unique skills, which won't affect it's e-spec counterparts.Elementalist doesn't have anything Unique to buff that it wouldn't affect e-speces, none, which is the real problem with this class(and many others).I was thinking about "locking-out" specific traitlines for e-speces, e.g.:If you pick Tempest, you lose access to Water and losing as well traitable skills (Cantrips);If you pick Weaver, you lose access to Arcane and losing as well traitable skills (Arcane);Core of course would be able to pick both Water and Arcane.This way you could buff traitlines which mostly core could take advantage of them fully, but I'm pretty sure it would create it own balance problems...Too lazy to think about solutions~1) if you pick Deadeye or daredevil you lose access to Shadow art2) if you pick druid, you lose access to beastmaster, if you pick soulbeast you lose access to Markmanship3) if you pick Herald you lose access to Invocation, if you pick Renegade you lose access to Retribution4) if you pick Spellbreaker you lose access to Strength, if you pick Berseker you lose access to Discipline5) if you pick Scrapper you lose access to Explosive, if you pick Holosmith you lose access to Alchemy....Too lazy to type other professions if you take mirage you lose access to honor and dignity of a human beingNo no, that happens when you decide to run condies on any class.I find it interesting that loads of people complain about 1shots and bursts, yet are 100% fine with power builds and absolutely hate condisRNG, boring, annoying, uninteractive, passive, unbalanced and many others things that could describe condi in GW2. I'll probably never understand people that enjoy condies, it's one of the worst and most boring gameplays I've ever seen. Tried it few times and I feel like falling asleep by using them, 0 fun or entertainment.They should stay as "support" mechanic, but instead they were changed into this abomination because PvE complained about bosses.Giving so much freedom by A-net was a curse, which in long run took away that "freedom".RNG? how is condi rng? it has set damage and it deals this damage, its the power that is rng with crit chance and weakness glancing, making hits jump between 2k and 8k from the same skillBalanced? almost every meta is power metaPassive? depends on the build reallyannoying and boring is subjective, I like condis as they bring something new to the game and add a new layer to combat, instead off current brainded I landed 3 skills so you dieThe reason why people prefer power is because those 3 hit kill requires mostly a glassy set up that can be either dodged or blocked way easily than condi attacks, which tend to be AoE on short CD( necro wells, scepter, focus - mesmer shatter, clone bounces etc etc etc) and condi burst still requires a single stats investment and doesn't require the player to pay any particular attention to the enemy....just unload everything you have and doesn't matter whether he dodges or not.Realistically speaking the meta is power only at the top where people can coordinate well enough to bring down condi bunkers, from there all the way down is full condi spam and that cannot be negated given the huge presence of necros, burning build and others.In WvW smallscale is dominated by condi builds too and the only reason condi doesn't dominate zerg fight is due to Purity of Purposeexept power shatter has like half the CD off condi one and most classes dont get pulsing aoe condi bullshit and those that do dont even do all that much damage and are easy to cleansein fact most power builds are more degenerate then condi, cough thief perma-stealthing, rev teleporting through walls with quickness and unblockable.And meta is power since power kills you NOW, and condi kills you MAYBE in the next X secounds, giving time for people to heal, cleanse, escape, invuln or get healed by teammates. Mechanically power is superior and has LESS counterplay so its played more often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arheundel.6451 Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 @Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:just make barrier decay after like 2-3s, its all it takes. If you do that you might actually be able to buff core ele without making weaver broken for exampleWe can buff core ele by nerfing all other core professions , claiming that nerfs to weaver would benefit core ele at all...I don't know who you are trying to convince....im claiming that buffing core ele would make weaver overpowered, so by nerfing barrier ( weaver ) we make space for core buffsIt won't work and you even wrote why, but still belive that nerfing barrier would make a space for core buffs, which still would be a buff Weaver indirectly(even Tempest).The real problem here is that most e-speces are built on top of core classes, which include Elementalist.Look at Necromancer and it's Reaper and Scourge, do you see how it really do change how you play your class? Compare it to Eles Tempest or Weaver:Tempest: whirly stuff, added just few skills ON TOP of Core mechanic and that's it.Weaver: added few skills, copy-paste of teef and that's it.Nothing is "different" in playstyle, you do the same kitten with few more button presses and effects.In Necromancers case, you can buff it's Unique skills, which won't affect it's e-spec counterparts.Elementalist doesn't have anything Unique to buff that it wouldn't affect e-speces, none, which is the real problem with this class(and many others).I was thinking about "locking-out" specific traitlines for e-speces, e.g.:If you pick Tempest, you lose access to Water and losing as well traitable skills (Cantrips);If you pick Weaver, you lose access to Arcane and losing as well traitable skills (Arcane);Core of course would be able to pick both Water and Arcane.This way you could buff traitlines which mostly core could take advantage of them fully, but I'm pretty sure it would create it own balance problems...Too lazy to think about solutions~1) if you pick Deadeye or daredevil you lose access to Shadow art2) if you pick druid, you lose access to beastmaster, if you pick soulbeast you lose access to Markmanship3) if you pick Herald you lose access to Invocation, if you pick Renegade you lose access to Retribution4) if you pick Spellbreaker you lose access to Strength, if you pick Berseker you lose access to Discipline5) if you pick Scrapper you lose access to Explosive, if you pick Holosmith you lose access to Alchemy....Too lazy to type other professions if you take mirage you lose access to honor and dignity of a human beingNo no, that happens when you decide to run condies on any class.I find it interesting that loads of people complain about 1shots and bursts, yet are 100% fine with power builds and absolutely hate condisRNG, boring, annoying, uninteractive, passive, unbalanced and many others things that could describe condi in GW2. I'll probably never understand people that enjoy condies, it's one of the worst and most boring gameplays I've ever seen. Tried it few times and I feel like falling asleep by using them, 0 fun or entertainment.They should stay as "support" mechanic, but instead they were changed into this abomination because PvE complained about bosses.Giving so much freedom by A-net was a curse, which in long run took away that "freedom".RNG? how is condi rng? it has set damage and it deals this damage, its the power that is rng with crit chance and weakness glancing, making hits jump between 2k and 8k from the same skillBalanced? almost every meta is power metaPassive? depends on the build reallyannoying and boring is subjective, I like condis as they bring something new to the game and add a new layer to combat, instead off current brainded I landed 3 skills so you dieThe reason why people prefer power is because those 3 hit kill requires mostly a glassy set up that can be either dodged or blocked way easily than condi attacks, which tend to be AoE on short CD( necro wells, scepter, focus - mesmer shatter, clone bounces etc etc etc) and condi burst still requires a single stats investment and doesn't require the player to pay any particular attention to the enemy....just unload everything you have and doesn't matter whether he dodges or not.Realistically speaking the meta is power only at the top where people can coordinate well enough to bring down condi bunkers, from there all the way down is full condi spam and that cannot be negated given the huge presence of necros, burning build and others.In WvW smallscale is dominated by condi builds too and the only reason condi doesn't dominate zerg fight is due to Purity of Purposeexept power shatter has like half the CD off condi one and most classes dont get pulsing aoe condi kitten and those that do dont even do all that much damage and are easy to cleansein fact most power builds are more degenerate then condi, cough thief perma-stealthing, rev teleporting through walls with quickness and unblockable.And meta is power since power kills you NOW, and condi kills you MAYBE in the next X secounds, giving time for people to heal, cleanse, escape, invuln or get healed by teammates. Mechanically power is superior and has LESS counterplay so its played more often.Power doesn't kill you now unless you're both glass and you get caught by surprise with no CD left, condi kills you regardless of what stats you are running as it depends all on how many condi cleanse have you got left, we had this discussion on this forum countless times already , power is all about mind games where condis is all about using skills off CD to overwhelm opponent condi cleanse , all the while you're tanky as hell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonidrex.5649 Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 @Arheundel.6451 lol you say that power doesnt kill you unless you have no CD left and then say condi kills you when you run out of cleanse.isnt this the same shit ?Same way power build tries to overwhelm your defences and take you down, condi build does the same exept you also have to go through cleanse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kodama.6453 Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 @Leonidrex.5649 said:RNG? how is condi rng? it has set damage and it deals this damage, its the power that is rng with crit chance and weakness glancing, making hits jump between 2k and 8k from the same skillI guess he is referencing the fact that many classes have traits with a chance to inflict conditions on enemies.Examples:sharpshooter (engi firearms minor), double RNG components, since it requires you to crit and then has 33% chance to inflict bleed on that critsharpened edges (ranger skirmishing major), same like sharpshooterbarbed precision (necromancer curses minor), same like sharpshooterincendiary powder (engi firearms major), the RNG component here is crit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arheundel.6451 Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 @Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 lol you say that power doesnt kill you unless you have no CD left and then say condi kills you when you run out of cleanse.isnt this the same kitten ?Same way power build tries to overwhelm your defences and take you down, condi build does the same exept you also have to go through cleanseYou can try all you want in convincing yourself that condi build are equal to power builds in terms of effort requirements....that won't change the actual facts : to play condi builds you need a single stats...rest goes all in defense , easier than trying to juggle between dmg, sustain, crit dmg and precision that must reach a certain threshold to be actually useful: crit chance 40%+ and crit dmg 185%+ to be worth the investment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonidrex.5649 Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 @Arheundel.6451 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 lol you say that power doesnt kill you unless you have no CD left and then say condi kills you when you run out of cleanse.isnt this the same kitten ?Same way power build tries to overwhelm your defences and take you down, condi build does the same exept you also have to go through cleanseYou can try all you want in convincing yourself that condi build are equal to power builds in terms of effort requirements....that won't change the actual facts : to play condi builds you need a single stats...rest goes all in defense , easier than trying to juggle between dmg, sustain, crit dmg and precision that must reach a certain threshold to be actually useful: crit chance 40%+ and crit dmg 185%+ to be worth the investmentshow me that magical amulet that gives only condition damage and survival stats.oh wait, the only 100% effective stat amulets are power, cough cough berk/maruder/demolisher, everything condi is forced to take power/precision@Kodama.6453this is also what I suspected, but thos traits usually suck or are REALLY small portion of the damage, expecially after feb where you dont even get much if any crit chance on condi builds, meanwhile every single power build will juggle RNG damage, even running 95% crit chance soulbeast I still have times where maul-> WI just doesnt crit and enemy runs away # praise rng Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayce.5632 Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 @Arheundel.6451 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 lol you say that power doesnt kill you unless you have no CD left and then say condi kills you when you run out of cleanse.isnt this the same kitten ?Same way power build tries to overwhelm your defences and take you down, condi build does the same exept you also have to go through cleanseYou can try all you want in convincing yourself that condi build are equal to power builds in terms of effort requirements....that won't change the actual facts : to play condi builds you need a single stats...rest goes all in defense , easier than trying to juggle between dmg, sustain, crit dmg and precision that must reach a certain threshold to be actually useful: crit chance 40%+ and crit dmg 185%+ to be worth the investmentSo what we need is either:1) A true one stat Condition Damage Amulet. Since we don't need those defensive stats or Power mucking up the point allocation, let's just put those numbers to good use and add them to the one we do need. 3000 Condition Damage primary with no secondaries Amulet should work here.2) Condition Damage has been uncoupled from Power Damage and is now affected by Precision, Ferocity, Weakness, Armor, and Protection. Bleeding, Burning, Confusion, Poison, and Torment can no longer be removed. Damaging Conditions from a single source will no longer stack in intensity, only in duration.But hey, why stop there. I'm generally curious now to see what a critical heal looks like against light and heavy armored allies under various condition effects such as vulnerability for the ally and/or weakness for the caster. Thank you for this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trevor Boyer.6524 Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 @Leonidrex.5649 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@TrollingDemigod.3041 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:just make barrier decay after like 2-3s, its all it takes. If you do that you might actually be able to buff core ele without making weaver broken for exampleWe can buff core ele by nerfing all other core professions , claiming that nerfs to weaver would benefit core ele at all...I don't know who you are trying to convince....im claiming that buffing core ele would make weaver overpowered, so by nerfing barrier ( weaver ) we make space for core buffsIt won't work and you even wrote why, but still belive that nerfing barrier would make a space for core buffs, which still would be a buff Weaver indirectly(even Tempest).The real problem here is that most e-speces are built on top of core classes, which include Elementalist.Look at Necromancer and it's Reaper and Scourge, do you see how it really do change how you play your class? Compare it to Eles Tempest or Weaver:Tempest: whirly stuff, added just few skills ON TOP of Core mechanic and that's it.Weaver: added few skills, copy-paste of teef and that's it.Nothing is "different" in playstyle, you do the same kitten with few more button presses and effects.In Necromancers case, you can buff it's Unique skills, which won't affect it's e-spec counterparts.Elementalist doesn't have anything Unique to buff that it wouldn't affect e-speces, none, which is the real problem with this class(and many others).I was thinking about "locking-out" specific traitlines for e-speces, e.g.:If you pick Tempest, you lose access to Water and losing as well traitable skills (Cantrips);If you pick Weaver, you lose access to Arcane and losing as well traitable skills (Arcane);Core of course would be able to pick both Water and Arcane.This way you could buff traitlines which mostly core could take advantage of them fully, but I'm pretty sure it would create it own balance problems...Too lazy to think about solutions~1) if you pick Deadeye or daredevil you lose access to Shadow art2) if you pick druid, you lose access to beastmaster, if you pick soulbeast you lose access to Markmanship3) if you pick Herald you lose access to Invocation, if you pick Renegade you lose access to Retribution4) if you pick Spellbreaker you lose access to Strength, if you pick Berseker you lose access to Discipline5) if you pick Scrapper you lose access to Explosive, if you pick Holosmith you lose access to Alchemy....Too lazy to type other professions if you take mirage you lose access to honor and dignity of a human beingNo no, that happens when you decide to run condies on any class.I find it interesting that loads of people complain about 1shots and bursts, yet are 100% fine with power builds and absolutely hate condisRNG, boring, annoying, uninteractive, passive, unbalanced and many others things that could describe condi in GW2. I'll probably never understand people that enjoy condies, it's one of the worst and most boring gameplays I've ever seen. Tried it few times and I feel like falling asleep by using them, 0 fun or entertainment.They should stay as "support" mechanic, but instead they were changed into this abomination because PvE complained about bosses.Giving so much freedom by A-net was a curse, which in long run took away that "freedom".I like condis You need to go wash your mouth out with soap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonidrex.5649 Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 @Arheundel.6451 said:@Leonidrex.5649 said:@Arheundel.6451 lol you say that power doesnt kill you unless you have no CD left and then say condi kills you when you run out of cleanse.isnt this the same kitten ?Same way power build tries to overwhelm your defences and take you down, condi build does the same exept you also have to go through cleanseYou can try all you want in convincing yourself that condi build are equal to power builds in terms of effort requirements....that won't change the actual facts : to play condi builds you need a single stats...rest goes all in defense , easier than trying to juggle between dmg, sustain, crit dmg and precision that must reach a certain threshold to be actually useful: crit chance 40%+ and crit dmg 185%+ to be worth the investmentno, condi builds require MORE effort to play optimaly then power builds, in power builds you have X,Y,Z nukes and you toss them together and fill with other skills.with condi you need to actually know how much and when your enemy cleanses, and sometimes even NOT attack them to not put your damaging condition on top of the cleansing list, meanwhile power is hurr durr me do dmg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nimon.7840 Posted April 8, 2021 Share Posted April 8, 2021 @AliamRationem.5172 said:@Lan Deathrider.5910 said:@Yasai.3549 said:What we need is more Barrier pierce or Barrier breaking traits.And didn't they nerf warrior's trait for that almost as soon as they released it? Shame, would be helpful now wouldn't it?If they want to hand out barrier-busting traits I request they rework minor traits which apply barrier passively. It's really not fair, for instance, to have glass weavers taking massively increased damage from warriors just because every dual attack applies a small amount of barrier. That sort of trait is meant to punish builds that invest heavily into barrier with trait selections and utility, but as usual we'll cause the problem for other builds instead!Would not be fair for a single trait to counter a whole class/spec as well.If you still insist on that idea I want a trait for necro that just ignores all blocks and invulns of enemies it hits. Seems pretty busted right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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