Mesmer rupts

[Senqu.8054]

You are pretty fast hurt for someone who calls everyone „crying little girls“.

 

Look, I’m more the contra in this community. Everyone who visits the Mesmer forum often enough knows my opinion about topics like clones and other stuff. I don’t need to express or better impose my opinion like you do it right now.
 

And lastly, I already said „I’m behind you“. You are asking me if I have read the thread but you didn’t. So don’t ask me why I haven’t expressed my optinion about wards when I exactly did that. 
 

I guess it is not possible with you to discuss something so this will be my last words to this. Have a sunny Sunday. 😋
 

 

[SoulGuardian.6203]

Can we go back on topic to mesmer interrupts, wards, and other skills please?

Senqu.8054

What does, you bad mouthing ANet have anything to do with mesmer?

The forums team is a different one than from ingame. 

Anyways, back to mesmer.

 

I don't think that the delayed interrupts, such as web of disruption would cause any problems to other classes at all.

It's not like it's a buff or a nerf.

It's a mere interruption. 

Sure, foe would be disabled for like 1.2 seconds at most, which is nothing major, as mesmers don't even cause that much damage to begin with.

 

I know mesmers have a Love/Hate relationship with players, depending on which end of the stick you are on.

I know myself, hated mesmers as an elementalist, especially in Jade Quary, when they persue you relentlessly. 

Then you'd had to change to Air Magic which had virtually no cast time.

But that's what made it so much fun.

You'd have to rebuild and adapt.

Making new skill sets was so much fun.

We don't have that flexibility now... the dynamics of making a skill set that would overmatch your nemesis.

I miss that. 

...and clones, with all honesty, as fun and cute as they may be, just don't do much for me.

Edited May 31, 2021 by SoulGuardian.6203

[Puck.3697]

I will say. If we get a Interupt styled elite specc and don't get hammer as it's weapon. Imma be mad AF. 

 

Give it abit of cleave while your at it and you could even make mesmer better at WvWvW... 

 

Just don't make it so insane it gets absolutely shredded in the next 5 balancing patch's after it. 

 

 

Edited June 1, 2021 by Daddy.8125

[Puck.3697]

On 5/31/2021 at 2:42 PM, SoulGuardian.6203 said:

Sure, foe would be disabled for like 1.2 seconds at most, which is nothing major, as mesmers don't even cause that much damage to begin with

 

Are we talking gw1 or gw2 here? Because gw2 mesmers 1 shotting people 🤣🤣 

 

Both builds now do Infact.. I can get my confusion ticks to hit like 4k a second and that's ignoring my torment applications and raw damage. 

 

And that's running with a side node build too so it's pretty tanky. 

[SoulGuardian.6203]

2 hours ago, Daddy.8125 said:

 

Are we talking gw1 or gw2 here? Because gw2 mesmers 1 shotting people 🤣🤣 

 

Both builds now do Infact.. I can get my confusion ticks to hit like 4k a second and that's ignoring my torment applications and raw damage. 

 

And that's running with a side node build too so it's pretty tanky. 

I thank you.

More people like you thank you please.

You state your oppinion correctly without insulting, patronising and trying to make people look thick.

 

Now back on topic.

I'll have to invest time in rebuilding my mesmer when I'm back in the game.

Mine needs much needed TLC because I hated it from the start because of every single weapon spawning clones... and being clone dependant.

That's my honest opinion. 

I would like to have a choice at any given time if to use them or not.

Another thing I agree with you is, 

If we do get interrupts, then hammer or mace would be the ideal weapon for it.

Rupts+Knockdown.

You deserve likes.

Edited June 1, 2021 by SoulGuardian.6203

[SoulGuardian.6203]

On 5/19/2021 at 8:17 PM, Justine.6351 said:

If you don't know then why comment.

Thank you.

 

What do you think mrsmer next ES is going to be?

[Puck.3697]

35 minutes ago, SoulGuardian.6203 said:

Thank you.

 

What do you think mrsmer next ES is going to be?

 

I'm hoping something simple without a mechanic that makes Anet gut us for whatever we get.

 

I'm honestly gonna throw hammer as the weapon. I think Anet is going to really try pinpoint what mesmer lacks. 

 

Do I think we will get hammer as our weapon we will get Hex's which replace our F1-F5. They will add texts to our shatter traits to work with Hex's also. 

 

I think the trade off will be our clones.

 

I think the weapon will be focused around cleave damage. 

 

Our new utility will be traps.

[SoulGuardian.6203]

40 minutes ago, Daddy.8125 said:

 

I'm hoping something simple without a mechanic that makes Anet gut us for whatever we get.

 

I'm honestly gonna throw hammer as the weapon. I think Anet is going to really try pinpoint what mesmer lacks. 

 

Do I think we will get hammer as our weapon we will get Hex's which replace our F1-F5. They will add texts to our shatter traits to work with Hex's also. 

 

I think the trade off will be our clones.

 

I think the weapon will be focused around cleave damage. 

 

Our new utility will be traps.

I hope you are right.

I hope we finally get something as a choice to replace clones.

 

But cleave damage isn't already in the Mirage axe?

I think that Hammer, as you mentioned will most likely be their next weapon, even though I would prefer a MH pistol, or an off-hand dagger.

 

Hammer suits better knockdowns as it's blunt damage.

Wouldn't make much sense placing hexes with a hammer.

 

Mind, there are mentions... rumors, that they might be getting a bow.

 

[Puck.3697]

22 minutes ago, SoulGuardian.6203 said:

I hope you are right.

I hope we finally get something as a choice to replace clones.

 

But cleave damage isn't already in the Mirage axe?

I think that Hammer, as you mentioned will most likely be their next weapon, even though I would prefer a MH pistol, or an off-hand dagger.

 

Hammer suits better knockdowns as it's blunt damage.

Wouldn't make much sense placing hexes with a hammer.

 

Mind, there are mentions... rumors, that they might be getting a bow.

 

 

to utilise a Non-clone mesmer,  u cant use any of Mesmers current weapons as they ALL have clones.

 

which means the likelyhood is the new Specc would have to have no weapon swap.. and also likely have some form of

 

which means maybe

 

Mainhand Weapon.. and ability to conjure the second weapon using Illusion magic?

 

now, if we go back in time to GW2s beta. necromancer was orginally getting the greatsword, While Mesmer was going to get Dagger

 

So what if.

 

U get main hand Dagger with the Weapon.. then access to a Conjured offhand.. each offhand as a Different final 2.

 

the Weapon Swap acts a Swap between the Conjured offhands to utilise them.

 

like to me.. that sounds like the easiest way to hand the class a Non-clone based Elite.. without removing its ability to change weapons it uses.. it also gives it something very unique.

 

 

So..

 

Main hand Dagger

 

F1 - F5 Conjured Weapons. Offhand Dagger, Offhand Pistol, Offhand Sword, Offhand Axe, Offhand Mace

 

Utilities - Hexs.

 

No main hand Weapon Swap.

 

 

 

 

Edited June 1, 2021 by Daddy.8125

[Senqu.8054]

Okeyy

 

1.
“you will all cry again like little girls”

 

”you behave like immature children”

 

Really? In what world do you live in that this is not clearly an insult?

 

2. 
I asked “what is happening” because I already told you my opinion about everything you wrote in your thread by saying “I’m totally behind your opinion, beside the ward idea”. You literally bombarded me with questions and assumptions regards every kind of thing I have never ever mentioned or contradicted. You even went full hulk by saying the 2 things mentioned above. 

3. 
i was about to discuss the ward idea with you but I don’t know what is going on in your head by telling me:

 

”Aren't they called Seals?

As far as I'm aware of, wells belong to Necromancer!?”

 

which made any further discussion with you meaningless because as it looks like you turn words around and everything. So my confusion is more or less justified i think. 

4.

“My point is that the main topic is requesting for interrupts, and there's all this drama about balance issues and nerfs, but they... including you, can't come up with a better idea for the next Elite Spec.‘
 

If you insist in going like this don’t expect friendly behavior lol

Now thin foil hats on again

5.

Forum Moderator.6104
 

SoulGuardian.6203
 

Same profile picture and how odd that the numbers are so close together. I could bet 100.000€ that I will not have this luck ever again…

 

6.
how odd that FIRST the moderator and after that you visited my profile in the same hour. Now someone could make this crazy assumption that after you got hurt  you deleted my “what is happening” comment in addition to the insult
 

just a dude with a thin foil hat thinking but since you are also great in assumptions xD

 

7.

And even if you guys are not the same person, how is someone supposed to discuss something with you, when you report the first comment you do not understand? 

8.

Some moments after you visited my profile, I got 4 dislikes on comments that have been here for some days. So you visited now old comments I wrote and disliked them?

 

And now to your “main topic” interrupts.. because I fear the reporting of you

 

The problem about a gw1 style rupter is that every single mechanic that was implemented in gw1 is already or most of it implemented in gw2. Look at the skills:

 

Power Spike	Spell. Interrupts a spell or chant. Interruption effect: deals 30...102...120 damage

 

Complicate	Spell. Interrupt a skill. Interruption effect: disables interrupted skill (+5...11...12 seconds) for target foe and all foes in the area.

= PB

 

Frustration	Hex Spell. (5...17...20 seconds.) Causes 50% slower spell casting. Target foe takes 5...41...50damage whenever interrupted. Deals double damage on skill interrupt.

 

= Delayed Rections

Or just not doable:

Elite Spell. Interrupts an action. Interruption effect: If a skill was interrupted, that skill is disabled and Simple Thievery becomes that skill (5...17...20 seconds).

 

Power Drain	Spell. Interrupts a spell or chant. Interruption effect: you gain 1...25...31 Energy

If you look at all the Mesmer interrupt skills in gw1 you will see that also the effects do not really change after the ones I listed above. Ok maybe the one where every time you use a signet you rupt automatically but in the end it’s still just rupting. A whole espec dedicated to rupting would be definitely to much for this.
 

In the end a huge factor are hexes. They should be implemented in this game because the condition and boon system doesn’t offer effects like “if the target enemy uses a spell then XY” beside the regular confusion but this suggestion is also made since I don’t know, the release of gw2?

 

 

[SoulGuardian.6203]

7 minutes ago, Daddy.8125 said:

 

to utilise a Non-clone mesmer,  u cant use any of Mesmers current weapons as they ALL have clones.

 

which means the likelyhood is the new Specc would have to have no weapon swap.. and also likely have some form of

 

which means maybe

 

Mainhand Weapon.. and ability to conjure the second weapon using Illusion magic?

That makes sense.

Very well thought.

Unless we get double daggers.

Remind me, do shields summon clones?

[SoulGuardian.6203]

9 minutes ago, Senqu.8054 said:

Okeyy

 

1.
“you will all cry again like little girls”

 

”you behave like immature children”

 

Really? In what world do you live in that this is not clearly an insult?

 

2. 
I asked “what is happening” because I already told you my opinion about everything you wrote in your thread by saying “I’m totally behind your opinion, beside the ward idea”. You literally bombarded me with questions and assumptions regards every kind of thing I have never ever mentioned or contradicted. You even went full hulk by saying the 2 things mentioned above. 

3. 
i was about to discuss the ward idea with you but I don’t know what is going on in your head by telling me:

 

”Aren't they called Seals?

As far as I'm aware of, wells belong to Necromancer!?”

 

which made any further discussion with you meaningless because as it looks like you turn words around and everything. So my confusion is more or less justified i think. 

4.

“My point is that the main topic is requesting for interrupts, and there's all this drama about balance issues and nerfs, but they... including you, can't come up with a better idea for the next Elite Spec.‘
 

If you insist in going like this don’t expect friendly behavior lol

Now thin foil hats on again

5.

Forum Moderator.6104
 

SoulGuardian.6203
 

Same profile picture and how odd that the numbers are so close together. I could bet 100.000€ that I will not have this luck ever again…

 

6.
how odd that FIRST the moderator and after that you visited my profile in the same hour. Now someone could make this crazy assumption that after you got hurt  you deleted my “what is happening” comment in addition to the insult
 

just a dude with a thin foil hat thinking but since you are also great in assumptions xD

 

7.

And even if you guys are not the same person, how is someone supposed to discuss something with you, when you report the first comment you do not understand? 

8.

Some moments after you visited my profile, I got 4 dislikes on comments that have been here for some days. So you visited now old comments I wrote and disliked them?

 

And now to your “main topic” interrupts.. because I fear the reporting of you

 

The problem about a gw1 style rupter is that every single mechanic that was implemented in gw1 is already or most of it implemented in gw2. Look at the skills:

 

Power Spike	Spell. Interrupts a spell or chant. Interruption effect: deals 30...102...120 damage

 

Complicate	Spell. Interrupt a skill. Interruption effect: disables interrupted skill (+5...11...12 seconds) for target foe and all foes in the area.

= PB

 

Frustration	Hex Spell. (5...17...20 seconds.) Causes 50% slower spell casting. Target foe takes 5...41...50damage whenever interrupted. Deals double damage on skill interrupt.

 

= Delayed Rections

Or just not doable:

Elite Spell. Interrupts an action. Interruption effect: If a skill was interrupted, that skill is disabled and Simple Thievery becomes that skill (5...17...20 seconds).

 

Power Drain	Spell. Interrupts a spell or chant. Interruption effect: you gain 1...25...31 Energy

If you look at all the Mesmer interrupt skills in gw1 you will see that also the effects do not really change after the ones I listed above. Ok maybe the one where every time you use a signet you rupt automatically but in the end it’s still just rupting. A whole espec dedicated to rupting would be definitely to much for this.
 

In the end a huge factor are hexes. They should be implemented in this game because the condition and boon system doesn’t offer effects like “if the target enemy uses a spell then XY” beside the regular confusion but this suggestion is also made since I don’t know, the release of gw2?

 

 

Friend. Chill out.

I like reading your replies.

We're all on the same boat.

Thanks for the information on the skills.

Don't get so worked out.

 

I'd like to read about your opinion on Wards.

Since interrupts seem inconceivable. 

What do you think about hexes and Wards?

[Puck.3697]

22 minutes ago, SoulGuardian.6203 said:

That makes sense.

Very well thought.

Unless we get double daggers.

Remind me, do shields summon clones?

 

it does 4 - Echoes of Memory summons a Clone.

 

Unless the work around is to have Phantasms Existing but dont create clones... although it wont feel as detached working that way.

 

giving us dual daggers may feel very restrictive in our class choice.

 

Ofcourse. they may suprise us..  another work around would be, Convert the Phantasms/Clone abilities, with Hex Applications, Maybe thats the real way to implement Hexs?. so instead of being a F1-F5 or a utilities.. override the clone/phantasm abilities to every weapon with Hex Applications. so Effectively they Create 1 new ability for every 1handed and 2 new abilities for every 2handed weapon

 

This would also mean all Our current utilities which summon clones would actually also apply hexs.

 

so through this we would have ALOT of hexs already built in. but then ofcourse we'd need another Mechanic to override Our f1-f5 Skills.

 

What if our F1-F5 were Weapon Illusions.

 

So for example.

 

Summon A bunch of Daggers around urself and Fire them at your target.

Summon A Pillar which Impacts a Line infront of the Mesmer stunning and knocking downtargets.

Summon Swords which Pierce the Floor in a pattern Crippling targets it Hits

Summon a Flock of Birds Blinding Enemies in the area.

Summon a Scarecrow which Fears Targets in the Area.

 

 

Keep the illusionist theme. Without the clones.. by Creating Weapons.

 

Simplistic options. which give you utility and additional abilities, Then our Hexs can Add different effects From anything from Comboing with attacks for Additional Damage, Utilitises, Stuns and boon strips.

 

with the trade off of, Losing Illusions and Losing Weapon Swap

 

they could build off of it. by When u use a Summon.. it Imbues you.. giving u a Different Skillset for your Next attack... giving u access to Ranged Abilities that u can Fire, so u weave these extra things in for additional burst. so u'd get this

 

Melee Fast paced Attacker with access to utility and CC , which has this access to Casting abilities giving it that Ranged v Melee hybridization.

 

Edited June 1, 2021 by Daddy.8125

[SoulGuardian.6203]

51 minutes ago, Daddy.8125 said:

 

it does 4 - Echoes of Memory summons a Clone.

 

Unless the work around is to have Phantasms Existing but dont create clones... although it wont feel as detached working that way.

 

giving us dual daggers may feel very restrictive in our class choice.

 

Ofcourse. they may suprise us..  another work around would be, Convert the Phantasms/Clone abilities, with Hex Applications, Maybe thats the real way to implement Hexs?. so instead of being a F1-F5 or a utilities.. override the clone/phantasm abilities to every weapon with Hex Applications. so Effectively they Create 1 new ability for every 1handed and 2 new abilities for every 2handed weapon

 

This would also mean all Our current utilities which summon clones would actually also apply hexs.

 

so through this we would have ALOT of hexs already built in. but then ofcourse we'd need another Mechanic to override Our f1-f5 Skills.

 

What if our F1-F5 were Weapon Illusions.

 

So for example.

 

Summon A bunch of Daggers around urself and Fire them at your target.

Summon A Pillar which Impacts a Line infront of the Mesmer stunning and knocking downtargets.

Summon Swords which Pierce the Floor in a pattern Crippling targets it Hits

Summon a Flock of Birds Blinding Enemies in the area.

Summon a Scarecrow which Fears Targets in the Area.

 

 

Keep the illusionist theme. Without the clones.. by Creating Weapons.

 

Simplistic options. which give you utility and additional abilities, Then our Hexs can Add different effects From anything from Comboing with attacks for Additional Damage, Utilitises, Stuns and boon strips.

 

with the trade off of, Losing Illusions and Losing Weapon Swap

 

they could build off of it. by When u use a Summon.. it Imbues you.. giving u a Different Skillset for your Next attack... giving u access to Ranged Abilities that u can Fire, so u weave these extra things in for additional burst. so u'd get this

 

Melee Fast paced Attacker with access to utility and CC , which has this access to Casting abilities giving it that Ranged v Melee hybridization.

 

Summoning weapons... or illusions of other creatures.

I like that...

That sounds good to me.

Could even be the spirits of the wild?

It's an option.

[Puck.3697]

1 minute ago, SoulGuardian.6203 said:

Summoning weapons... or illusions of other creatures.

I like that...

That sounds good to me.

Could even be the spirits of the wild?

It's an option.

 

my question would be would it step on Rangers toes with those sorts of Conjures. but yes could be a option.

Edited June 1, 2021 by Daddy.8125

[Salt Mode.3780]

So people complain about AI yet they want to "summon other creatures." The whole clone mechanic is to confuse your enemies with exact copies of yourself which what does summoning creatures do...? Spirits of the wild closely associates to what ranger is suppose to do IE Druid or their summoned spirits. Just stop with adding new stuff to Mesmer and fix current issues:

 

1. Mantra changes was horrid not only do you not get the bonus but it takes longer then before to use.

 

2. Alacrity on mirage staff is a bad idea as well as the changes on chaos trait.

 

3.Chrono has no true identity with multiple classes and its counterpart being able to pump alacrity better then the "ORIGINAL" user of alacrity,

 

4. Many of our traits are outdated and needs buff or tweak compared to other classes that have extremely loaded minor and master traits. (I'm not even going as far as GM traits.) IE: Blinding Dissipation, Evasive Mirror, Fencer's Finesse 

Again talking strictly PvP modes, causes many Mesmer builds to be very streamlined as well as the need of deceptive evasion but is now a GM trait which causes most builds to HAVE to pick up Dueling traitline.

 

5. For a class that uses clones, clones are too weak and gets killed before shatter reaches to intended target, as well as Mesmers having to blow utilities and CD to get kills and if failed will get killed.

[SoulGuardian.6203]

26 minutes ago, Salt Mode.3780 said:

 

 

5. For a class that uses clones, clones are too weak and gets killed before shatter reaches to intended target, as well as Mesmers having to blow utilities and CD to get kills and if failed will get killed.

This one very reason I hate clones with a passion and requested interrupts back.

 

I have tried clones countless times and they don't fool anyone.

Not AI nor other players. Both know which one I am.

Because clones aren't very well scripted.

They don't really copy you once manifested.

They just do the same one single attack in a very slow motion without hardly ever moving from the spot.

That does not fool anyone. 

Precisely what you said that I find them useless and really want interrupts back the old fashion way, or hexes or wards as a second alternative to clones.

 

When or if they are tweaked so that they really copy all your moves and become an actual illusion, then I'll shut up about improving mesmer and will never criticise clones again, but until then... clones will always just be an interference to me at best, that are only holding mesmers back from its full potential.

[Senqu.8054]

One thing for sure is the point we meet. Clones are also in my opinion by far the worst thing that holds Mesmer as a whole back. And sadly it’s the only thing left that has this “mind play” and this isn’t even working as intended. We had high hp clones, low hp clones, clones with a lot of passive damage, clones with little to non passive damage. And everything at this hinders to perform well as soon as 2 or more players are on the field. On top of that it’s the reason why every kitten power Mesmer plays like a one shot executer. As soon as you summon a clone, it needs to be shattered because it is not worth to let it live. 

[SoulGuardian.6203]

11 hours ago, Senqu.8054 said:

One thing for sure is the point we meet. Clones are also in my opinion by far the worst thing that holds Mesmer as a whole back. And sadly it’s the only thing left that has this “mind play” and this isn’t even working as intended. We had high hp clones, low hp clones, clones with a lot of passive damage, clones with little to non passive damage. And everything at this hinders to perform well as soon as 2 or more players are on the field. On top of that it’s the reason why every kitten power Mesmer plays like a one shot executer. As soon as you summon a clone, it needs to be shattered because it is not worth to let it live. 

Thank you.

Very well said.

 

Might as well would have been better to have 3 cups appear and foes would have to guess in which one is the mesmer hidding in.

[Salt Mode.3780]

The biggest problem with clones these days were the introduction of WvW masteries + Food and Utility. The best way for them to have clones be more useful is if they copied the food and utility icon as well as WvW masteries/bloodlust onto the clones without giving the the effects of it. There is a reason why they introduced de-targeting for mirage because they knew that clones were no longer "deceptive" as intended.

 

[SoulGuardian.6203]

Besides, the copy/steal skill should have gone to mesmers.

Thieves are meant to steal objects not skills.

Mesmer should have the 3 or 4 skills that they used to have.

 

1- Disable a random foe skill. This skill becomes that skill.

2 - The next skill that foe uses fails and this skill becomes that skill.

3 - The next skill that foe uses is interrupted. Foe loses #X Health and this skill becomes that skill.

 

Why oh why did that go to thieves? ( A variant of... )

They should steal gold/silver/copper, food items, boosters including tomes of knowledge; armour and weapon renmants, etc...

That's not a thief, that's a copycat at best.

A copycat with a mask.

 

Mesmers have been stripped of everything that made them mesmers and slapped on useless clones.

 

[Mik.3401]

14 hours ago, SoulGuardian.6203 said:

Besides, the copy/steal skill should have gone to mesmers.

Thieves are meant to steal objects not skills.

Mesmer should have the 3 or 4 skills that they used to have.

 

1- Disable a random foe skill. This skill becomes that skill.

2 - The next skill that foe uses fails and this skill becomes that skill.

3 - The next skill that foe uses is interrupted. Foe loses #X Health and this skill becomes that skill.

 

Why oh why did that go to thieves? ( A variant of... )

They should steal gold/silver/copper, food items, boosters including tomes of knowledge; armour and weapon renmants, etc...

That's not a thief, that's a copycat at best.

A copycat with a mask.

 

Mesmers have been stripped of everything that made them mesmers and slapped on useless clones.

 

This is a little bit over dramatic in my opinion. Here is why:

 

- the vast majority of skills with confusion condition come from the Mesmer. Confusion condition is a direct successor of GW1 Mesmer spells applying penalty per attack

- Mesmer has a lot of interrupts and an ok amount of blinds - again to me it resembles GW1 Mesmer directly

- Mesmer shares the spot with Necro as two main torment appliers- just like GW1 Mes and Necro had loads of hexes making them kind of close in that regard. if I remember well movement-related hexes were present in GW1 for these two classes

- a lot of Mesmer skills in GW1 had phantasm or illusion in their name. And the class was working with wasting the opponents energy bar. Now in GW2 there is no energy, but your foes waste their skills on clones (or at least they should on paper)

 

if I researched this more I probably could find more examples.

 

I think the ideas mentioned in this topic are not  realistic, because things like instant interrupts are super powerful already on Mesmer. Giving more would break the game. Also stealing skills or applying hexes penalising/rupting on skill use would be just too much given the existing condition system.

Imagine an opponent with stacks of confusion, stacks of torment, stacks of bleeding and hexes on like interrupting next elite skill and having an utility skill disabled and stolen by the Mesmer. That would be a total overkill.

 

the only scenario in which it could happen would be if Mesmer had damage reduced by like 50% and this is not happening I am sure of that

 

Edited June 7, 2021 by Mik.3401

[SoulGuardian.6203]

On 6/7/2021 at 12:16 PM, Mik.3401 said:

This is a little bit over dramatic in my opinion. Here is why:

 

- the vast majority of skills with confusion condition come from the Mesmer. Confusion condition is a direct successor of GW1 Mesmer spells applying penalty per attack

- Mesmer has a lot of interrupts and an ok amount of blinds - again to me it resembles GW1 Mesmer directly

- Mesmer shares the spot with Necro as two main torment appliers- just like GW1 Mes and Necro had loads of hexes making them kind of close in that regard. if I remember well movement-related hexes were present in GW1 for these two classes

- a lot of Mesmer skills in GW1 had phantasm or illusion in their name. And the class was working with wasting the opponents energy bar. Now in GW2 there is no energy, but your foes waste their skills on clones (or at least they should on paper)

 

if I researched this more I probably could find more examples.

 

I think the ideas mentioned in this topic are not  realistic, because things like instant interrupts are super powerful already on Mesmer. Giving more would break the game. Also stealing skills or applying hexes penalising/rupting on skill use would be just too much given the existing condition system.

Imagine an opponent with stacks of confusion, stacks of torment, stacks of bleeding and hexes on like interrupting next elite skill and having an utility skill disabled and stolen by the Mesmer. That would be a total overkill.

 

the only scenario in which it could happen would be if Mesmer had damage reduced by like 50% and this is not happening I am sure of that

 

Ok. Right.

But why are mesmers applying bleeding, unless using slash damage with a sword? 

 

GS uses magic, so it's neither slashing nor piercing.

What does axe damage do?

I know this is just me... I'm sure a few... err... fewer, people like mesmers the way they are; but I would remove some unrelated conditions in order to add skill copy and hexes.

... and what on earth happened to "Deep Wound" and "Cracked Armour" ?

 

Here's my rework oppinion.

 

Increase armour, decrease damage while using sword or axe. 

Use Illusion or Dueling if using offhand pistol.

Illusions work better here, meaning clones.

Close quarters combat with melee weps and the use of clones that actually copy your moves/skills.

Conditions: Bleeding.

 

Long distance combat.

Remove clones. Use Domination or chaos.

Staff or scepter. 

Decrease armour, increase damage dealing.

Use hexes and rupts.

Conditions: Confusion, Dazzing, slow.

 

I'm just trying to give mesmers a bit more of the essence that makes them mesmers on the first place.

The name itself implies dazzling or "mesmerising" a foe; by means of using magics that create illusions of advantage, not suggesting clones in any way, shape, or form.

An illusion could be an oasis in the middle of the desert, in this case making foe belive they have an advantage in battle when the "thirst" hits and is too much to cope. 

 

In this case, mesmers could give foe more health in return of more damage dealing to mesmers, and after 60 seconds causing foe to lose 50% more health of the boroughed health they never had on the first place.

THAT'S a mesmer!

 

[JazzXman.7018]

On 5/19/2021 at 4:48 AM, Infusion.7149 said:

CC is an interrupt, not sure about the point of this thread.

 

On 5/20/2021 at 3:30 PM, Mik.3401 said:

Lack of cc is not a thing at all, especially mirage is full of cc:

 

sword ambush

mantra of distraction

F3 shatter

active signet (the one granting condi damage)

Pistol 5

staff 5

GS 5

torch 5

not every cc is interrupt cc. mesmer actually has only mantra with currently overnerfed cd and f3. everything else is either hard lock down cc (different main purpose and high impact on simple hit/ no interupt needed and for that has a reactive casttime and for that can on purpose rupt only unreliable on guess/ expectation on predictable playing targets by precasting) or is only a short daze but with too much delay between cast and hit to be able to interrupt reactive.

 

 

[Mik.3401]

9 minutes ago, JazzXman.7018 said:

 

not every cc is interrupt cc. mesmer actually has only mantra with currently overnerfed cd and f3. everything else is either hard lock down cc (different main purpose and high impact on simple hit/ no interupt needed and for that has a reactive casttime and for that can on purpose rupt only unreliable on guess/ expectation on predictable playing targets by precasting) or is only a short daze but with too much delay between cast and hit to be able to interrupt reactive.

 

 

It’s true that only few can safely secure rupt, but for others you just need to play strategically. In my experience Sword ambush is nice against necros who have long skill channeling times. Or against almost any healing skill in general.

Ones like pistol 5 or chaos storm seem close enough in practice as well but yes it depends.

 

22 hours ago, SoulGuardian.6203 said:

Ok. Right.

But why are mesmers applying bleeding, unless using slash damage with a sword? 

 

GS uses magic, so it's neither slashing nor piercing.

What does axe damage do?

I know this is just me... I'm sure a few... err... fewer, people like mesmers the way they are; but I would remove some unrelated conditions in order to add skill copy and hexes.

... and what on earth happened to "Deep Wound" and "Cracked Armour" ?

 

Here's my rework oppinion.

 

Increase armour, decrease damage while using sword or axe. 

Use Illusion or Dueling if using offhand pistol.

Illusions work better here, meaning clones.

Close quarters combat with melee weps and the use of clones that actually copy your moves/skills.

Conditions: Bleeding.

 

Long distance combat.

Remove clones. Use Domination or chaos.

Staff or scepter. 

Decrease armour, increase damage dealing.

Use hexes and rupts.

Conditions: Confusion, Dazzing, slow.

 

I'm just trying to give mesmers a bit more of the essence that makes them mesmers on the first place.

The name itself implies dazzling or "mesmerising" a foe; by means of using magics that create illusions of advantage, not suggesting clones in any way, shape, or form.

An illusion could be an oasis in the middle of the desert, in this case making foe belive they have an advantage in battle when the "thirst" hits and is too much to cope. 

 

In this case, mesmers could give foe more health in return of more damage dealing to mesmers, and after 60 seconds causing foe to lose 50% more health of the boroughed health they never had on the first place.

THAT'S a mesmer!

 

I can see you, but still I’d say in many cases it is still a GW1 - inspired mesmer which as explained by Anet simply could not be introduced in this engine. If I’m not mistaken it’s because playing the og mesmer puts players with lower ping into disadvantaged position.

 

clones using your skills is an interesting idea: maybe if they used random weapon skills animation just with no effects it would be better. I think though it could be hard to implement as 1) infinite horizon 2) unpredictable auto-attack condi application leading to a random dps benchmarks 3) maybe the engine would simply not bear it.

i agree different types of illusions apart from clones should be introduced, hopefully they do it in EoD. The class rework you proposed is interesting but it goes kind of against the gear/stat system in place