Beta test underwhelming

[Xanadrine.4352]

I really dont understand why beta is not given access to at the very least ascended gear weapons, and high level AR infusions trinks runes sigils. You cant test or balance properly without them. This is why there will be op and up specs and balance wont be right, because you are not testing the top gear and stats against the content.

[ReaverKane.7598]

Just now, Zuldari.3940 said:

I really dont understand why beta is not given access to at the very least ascended gear weapons, and high level AR infusions trinks runes sigils. You cant test or balance properly without them. This is why there will be op and up specs and balance wont be right, because you are not testing the top gear and stats against the content.

Legendary armoury wasn't a thing in the previous betas, so they probably just used the same systems as in those betas and didn't remember this could be used to improve on data.

[Xanadrine.4352]

6 minutes ago, ReaverKane.7598 said:

Legendary armoury wasn't a thing in the previous betas, so they probably just used the same systems as in those betas and didn't remember this could be used to improve on data.

Im not talking leggy though, beta testing should be done on top gear characters in order to see what needs improvement or what needs to be adjusted. You are not going to get the same performance out of exotic test characters you will from ascended with full infusion slots trinkets ect, everything will be off. Damage healing sustain timing health pools, and it matters a lot. it matters in spvp it matters in wvw and it matters in raids and fracts. If you dont get the numbers right you will have a hot balance mess in all forms of endgame.

 

I have to say it because this is how the formula works. You dont build balance across classes by going off open world and casual play. Balance is compilated by going off the top players with the best gear in w/e mode. You balance around how the class does in the hands of a good player, because the endgame modes are where it counts. You cant have balance numbers and tweaking based on people like me that just play willy nilly because then you have a mess on your hands. It all trickles down from the top when balanced right, the top players play the spec to its best performance, and people like me who are not great get the benefit of playing the spec well balanced. 

Edited August 21, 2021 by Zuldari.3940

[ReaverKane.7598]

26 minutes ago, Zuldari.3940 said:

Im not talking leggy though, beta testing should be done on top gear characters in order to see what needs improvement or what needs to be adjusted. You are not going to get the same performance out of exotic test characters you will from ascended with full infusion slots trinkets ect, everything will be off. Damage healing sustain timing health pools, and it matters a lot. it matters in spvp it matters in wvw and it matters in raids and fracts. If you dont get the numbers right you will have a hot balance mess in all forms of endgame.

You're not wrong, this has been more or less like this since HoT, and back then the game was much different in how PvE was approached, the roles weren't as stratified since difficulty wasn't as high, and every one was a DPS, but now we have more reason to ask for a better solution, not only cause Legendary Armory exists, but because there's a lot more "end game" content, from Fractals to raids, with strikes in the middle.
I confess that in PoF i really didn't think on this too much, since i focused my testing on sPvP and open world content, for which exotics is more than enough.
 

19 minutes ago, Rod.6581 said:

Glad you finally understand.

Now stop editing your posts after replies 🙂

My intention is not to feel smart. My attention is for you to get into your head that you are requesting too much for the minimum effort you are giving. If you really cared to test things out you would find a way without crying here in forum.

My intention is also for you and others similar to you to realize you sound like a whiny spoiled crybabies. You didn't put an effort to obtain legendary items on your account and yet you feel you have the "right" to request them. Why would they give you legendary items? Why should you be awarded with something others put the effort to obtain even if it's temporary. They've worked for it. They earned it. You didn't. Want to have access to legendary for testing - go and make it. They've already devalued the legendary gear enough.

Well, here's the problem, you're assuming too much.
I have all 3 classes fully geared in legendary and ascended gear and T4/CM ready. Except for the Harbinger which needed Tormenting runes, and because i didn't have any on my bank prior to the beta, i can't access in any way. I've tested 2 out of 3 in T4 fractals and open world. Didn't spend more time on it, cause family obligations, and i don't like Virtuoso for stuff outside open world.

Again, i do have legendaries in my account, don't have legendary runes, because its a wayy too laborious process of obtaining, since its based on RNG to get the rune crafting materials.

I'm not asking for them to give me legendary items, i'm asking for them to allow us access to either blank legendary items in the beta characters because those allow flexibility in the testing. You're so intelligent you fail to understand that those would be restricted to the 3 beta slots and unavailable after.

But i'm sorry that our reasonable suggestion is infringing on your self-value, and i'm even more sorry that its so tiny that it feels threatened by the possibility that everyone might temporarily have legendary gear in all slots for beta testing...

Edited August 21, 2021 by ReaverKane.7598

[Xanadrine.4352]

Just now, ReaverKane.7598 said:

You're not wrong, this has been more or less like this since HoT, and back then the game was much different in how PvE was approached, the roles weren't as stratified since difficulty wasn't as high, and every one was a DPS, but now we have more reason to ask for a better solution, not only cause Legendary Armory exists, but because there's a lot more "end game" content, from Fractals to raids, with strikes in the middle.
I confess that in PoF i really didn't think on this too much, since i focused my testing on sPvP and open world content, for which exotics is more than enough.

This is prob why you hear balance complaints in end game modes so much. Open world is whatever all you need there is to make sure the mobs and environment are balanced against players for that level difficulty. So you dont have unstoppable mobs running amok one shotting everyone. But where its end game and competitive and really matters you need to be extra careful about balancing classes not only in boss fights, but against each other in pvp wvw.

[ReaverKane.7598]

3 minutes ago, Zuldari.3940 said:

This is prob why you hear balance complaints in end game modes so much. Open world is whatever all you need there is to make sure the mobs and environment are balanced against players for that level difficulty. So you dont have unstoppable mobs running amok one shotting everyone. But where its end game and competitive and really matters you need to be extra careful about balancing classes not only in boss fights, but against each other in pvp wvw.

Indeed. And you're right, although the balance issue is more complex than just lack of feedback, its also how the feedback was used and how the balance was/is handled. There's always people that will take the extra effort and have the resources to get it done, but that's a small minority, and then, Arena Net will look at the bulk data, and that minority gets drowned in that feedback.

[Xanadrine.4352]

3 minutes ago, ReaverKane.7598 said:

Indeed. And you're right, although the balance issue is more complex than just lack of feedback, its also how the feedback was used and how the balance was/is handled. There's always people that will take the extra effort and have the resources to get it done, but that's a small minority, and then, Arena Net will look at the bulk data, and that minority gets drowned in that feedback.

this is whats so strange to me about their beta. In other games there are beta servers i have tested on. these servers are monitored intensely by the developers all number parsing is run through and they can see what x is doing against y.  It makes it clear what needs to be tweaked, if x if one shotting y with one ability then they can see that, and adjust.

Edited August 21, 2021 by Zuldari.3940

[ReaverKane.7598]

1 minute ago, Zuldari.3940 said:

this is whats so strange to me about their beta. In other games there are beta servers i have tested on. these servers are monitored intensely by the developers all number parsing is run through and they can see what x is doing against y.  It makes it clear what needs to be tweaked, if x if one shotting y with one ability then they can see that, and adjust.

They do that here as well. Which is also a big reason why there might be "surprises" on the data.
For example, without tormenting runes my Harbinger was just under Scourge in DPS, so it might give the impression that its working well, but then if you add the right runes (tormenting in this case) the damage will jump significantly.
This is kind of what happened in HoT. Those betas were more restricted and gave a lot of focus on testing open world, since we got to hang out in Verdant Brink, and i'm not sure we had access to the elite specs in spvp, but still most people were having fun gliding and exploring and playing Rev. And forgot that sPvP was a thing. So what happened? Tempest and Chrono would become litterally immortal with a specific rune and stat combo. This ended up being an incredible embarrassment, since the game ended up in that state during the World Championship which was a thing at the time.

[miraude.2107]

I hear your complaints about this though I feel like this whole event thing was worded poorly. This isn't a beta test, it's a data collection wrapped up as a preview. See what specs are coming in, get a slight feel for how it works, etc while anet gets all this data to fiddle with. If I'm going for data collection, it'd be a poor test line for all beta characters to be decked out in legendaries when some of us don't have them. I don't have any legendaries and still got a feel for the 3 elites (passing on them, waiting for the next batch because I don't like the play style) and prolly gave anet some good data as I'm not some min/maxer that has to dial it in.

 

Overall I'm treating this as it feels. This was basically a way for them to test out the elites and see if they can cut down on nerf/buff patches and get the complaints of each one in so they can play with the dial better. From my standpoint, I honestly see some of the skills being changed, nerfed, buffed or dropped before the expacs release. It made me feel like they want to fine tune these elites before expac to try and avoid problems.

[ChronoPinoyX.7923]

2 hours ago, miraude.2107 said:

I hear your complaints about this though I feel like this whole event thing was worded poorly. This isn't a beta test, it's a data collection wrapped up as a preview. See what specs are coming in, get a slight feel for how it works, etc while anet gets all this data to fiddle with

That's literally what a beta is, preview for the players, data feedback for the devs. Whether it's a good or bad kind of beta testing doesn't really matter so long as the results come in and players get to experience upcoming content.

2 hours ago, miraude.2107 said:

Overall I'm treating this as it feels. This was basically a way for them to test out the elites and see if they can cut down on nerf/buff patches and get the complaints of each one in so they can play with the dial better. From my standpoint, I honestly see some of the skills being changed, nerfed, buffed or dropped before the expacs release. It made me feel like they want to fine tune these elites before expac to try and avoid problems.

I doubt they would drop any of the existing skills before expac, I would say they'd do it after. From a developer standpoint, if they drop any of the skills now, it would only cause further problems with meeting the deadline of release, forcing them into a serious crunch time. They'll defo balance and tweak numbers like you said, but we still got 6 more E-Specs to go through and any massive changes in skills and abilities would just be too much effort now when they still need to use the time they have to develop other parts of the expansion.