Retaliation Question

Oi Know you guys are tired of seeing me post but...help me out

According to the tooltip Retaliation is supposed to reflect damage.Does that mean that I am not supposed to receive damage while Retaliation is up?

"Retaliation is a boon that damages anyone who hits the affected target. The attacker will not be damaged if the attack fails to hit. Retaliation does not reduce or prevent damage taken."https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Retaliation

Might want to try the wikia, you can find most general information there.

Thanks Barry.

I was using axe 5 and Dolyak Stance and really scratching my head.

Retaliation (6s): Reflect incoming damage back to its source. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dolyak_Stance

By their tooltip description/definition it certainly sounds like the Player with Retaliation would NOT be damaged.

I know what Reflect means. Does ANET?

1. throw back (heat, light, or sound) without absorbing it.

@EnderzShadow.2506 said:Oi Know you guys are tired of seeing me post but...help me out

According to the tooltip Retaliation is supposed to reflect damage.Does that mean that I am not supposed to receive damage while Retaliation is up?

Oh man is the ingame tooltip for retal that misleading?

No it just deals damage to your attacker whenever you’re hit.

however one nifty trick is if damage is redirected to another source IE Guard, and both have retal the attacker will take double retal damage.

EX: you and your pet both have retaliation, you use Guard, someone attacks you, they take double retal damage.

My understanding is that in the early days retaliation used to do as you say, it used to reflect all incoming damage back to the Attacker. However it was super broken like that, especially in WvW where you used to be able to blast light fields for very good retalliation uptime on everyone. So then they made it less broken by making it is what it is now.

IMO it probably needs a balance pass, I feel like it could be a lot stronger. Especially that it was rebalanced around the power level of core specs.

@Durzlla.6295 said:

@"EnderzShadow.2506" said:Oi Know you guys are tired of seeing me post but...help me out

According to the tooltip Retaliation is supposed to reflect damage.Does that mean that I am not supposed to receive damage while Retaliation is up?

Thank you for the Guard tip. Gonna try something out!--and NOPE.No double retal damage because Guard doesn't have retal.

And onto.. "Is it that misleading?" YES

It says reflects dmg. What does reflect mean to you?

If Im playing The Witcher or Fallout or any fantasy based game and I read an ability that says it 'reflects' for 3 secs and in those 3 secs I take damage.....well shit, what's getting reflected?

When wonder woman reflects a bullet off her magical vambraces, does she get shot?

Yeah no I’m with you, whenever something says reflect I assume I’m not taking the damage lol, man it’s been forever since I’ve read the tooltip for retal.

@Zlater.6789 said:My understanding is that in the early days retaliation used to do as you say, it used to reflect all incoming damage back to the Attacker. However it was super broken like that, especially in WvW where you used to be able to blast light fields for very good retalliation uptime on everyone. So then they made it less broken by making it is what it is now.

IMO it probably needs a balance pass, I feel like it could be a lot stronger. Especially that it was rebalanced around the power level of core specs.

Passive damage does not need to be stronger, at least in competitive settings like sPvP and WvW. The last thing those game modes need is more of the game/build/gear playing for the player.

@Durzlla.6295 said:Yeah no I’m with you, whenever something says reflect I assume I’m not taking the damage lol, man it’s been forever since I’ve read the tooltip for retal.

me too, I was just fking around checking my build and trying to change some stuff out.

So you know how it goes, Im looking at changing a few utilities, looking to shore up my build and I notice that axe 5 has retal....hmm interesting. And then also Dolyak stance ALSO has STAB and retal--holy crap...this might be amazing.

I go into spvp, fight the npcs and Im getting the shit beat out of me for the 4 or 6 secs of retal (reflect) that I have up. and well...here I show up confused

@Turk.5460 said:

@Zlater.6789 said:My understanding is that in the early days retaliation used to do as you say, it used to reflect all incoming damage back to the Attacker. However it was super broken like that, especially in WvW where you used to be able to blast light fields for very good retalliation uptime on everyone. So then they made it less broken by making it is what it is now.

IMO it probably needs a balance pass, I feel like it could be a lot stronger. Especially that it was rebalanced around the power level of core specs.

I kind of agree/disagree.

Using retal with a utility is slightly passive.It's not like there is a retaliation trait that allows you to walk to mid and not take any dmg for said amount of seconds.

The only way I think retal (like Im expecting) would work is IF Retal worked like it should (unless they change the tooltip)

and IF there was a easy visual tell that the person was reflecting dmg.

Personally, I'd be happy if I TOOK NO DAMAGE like a reflect should work-- and a percentage of the attackers dmg was done back to them.

But since there is no easy visual tell, players can mindlessly go ham on you anytime they want to and why would we want pvp to be more cerebral than the button mashing shit that it is?

There are way too many reflects and invulns in the game as is, making retal a proper reflect would be terrible, no matter how visible it is. Especially considering the huge amount of retal in the game. Guardians would be literally unkillable.

Things could always be adjusted. They have been before.Don't worry Fluff, nothings going to change even though at the very least the tooltip needs to be edited, that wont be done either.

So messing with those 2 abilities again, Dolyak Stance and Whirling Defense, they both have the same tooltip for Retaliation and Reflecting Dmg.

Whirling defense will reflect projectiles.Dolyak stance won't reflect anything.

Again, same description-- take a look at them yourself.They behave differently.

@Zlater.6789 said:My understanding is that in the early days retaliation used to do as you say, it used to reflect all incoming damage back to the Attacker. However it was super broken like that, especially in WvW where you used to be able to blast light fields for very good retalliation uptime on everyone. So then they made it less broken by making it is what it is now.

IMO it probably needs a balance pass, I feel like it could be a lot stronger. Especially that it was rebalanced around the power level of core specs.

No, i know it hasn't behaved that way since the preorder betas unless it did in an alpha version or a closed beta (they reworked a lot of things a lot of times. Originally healing was meant to be with a potion as an example), and looking at history of the boon I don't see that.

It's just a bad tooltip statement that doesn't really have a better explanation of the boon.

Lol enderz no man. Retal is already dumb, remember it has been nerfed too (have someone attack you when you have retal on you in the guild hall shit is OP as it is) and what your suggesting hell no, you trying to Nerf yourself? As ranger might as well be deleted from the game

@EnderzShadow.2506 said:So messing with those 2 abilities again, Dolyak Stance and Whirling Defense, they both have the same tooltip for Retaliation and Reflecting Dmg.

Whirling defense will reflect projectiles.Dolyak stance won't reflect anything.

Again, same description-- take a look at them yourself.They behave differently.

Um, that they both apply Retaliation to you, the caster, is the only thing they have in common. Everything else is specific to the skill, not to Retal.

@Chrury.4627 said:

@"EnderzShadow.2506" said:So messing with those 2 abilities again, Dolyak Stance and Whirling Defense, they both have the same tooltip for Retaliation and Reflecting Dmg.

Whirling defense will reflect projectiles.Dolyak stance won't reflect anything.

Again, same description-- take a look at them yourself.They behave differently.

When I read the tooltip "Reflect Incoming Damage" on two different abilities, I expect a reflect. There is no reflect.What is so hard to understand about that? One partially reflects projectiles, one doesn't.

Don't bother to respond. I don't care anymore. There are so many bugs with this class that haven't even been touched.I briefly played around with the other pets we have and tinkering with their abilities and wow.....it's terrible.

Try one of those 1200 range Bird Leaps---if you are moving while using it, well it takes that movement away from the leap. Regardless, it's embarrassing.

Whirling defense specifically states it blocks projectiles, so returning damage is a separate action than preventing damage.Dolyak- reflect.Whirling defense- reflect and block.

But yeah, the word 'reflect' is a little misleading.