Average stats for races?

I always have a good time thinking of backstories and stats for my main, a female charr engi, but u ran into a problem recently.Age! Ive never been a lore nerd outside of playing PvE and watching WP, but i came to the understanding that despite the fact ive played the game for 5 or 6 years now i have no idea how old my charecter is and how long she has till she dies! I dont know if i missed anything or if its just an unknown but this seems like really vital information! So just for fun i thought it would be intresting if we could theroize race stats DnD/pathfinder style.For reference https://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/core-races/dwarf , heres what race stats page looks like.

So for the 5 core races what are:Ave height weight for male and femaleAve lifespan and maturity rates.For charr it'd be intresting to know if its common to have one cub or a litter of cubs.Ave iq for asura would be pretty funny

If you wanna go further racial traits wouls be super cool too!Ill probobly post later about how i theorize this works but id love to get everyones opinion.

Here is the lazy answer: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Playable_racesThe wiki is good for this type of info.

Well, as a D&D enthusiast, I'm glad someone brought the topic. I thought about this myself but I quickly came across a huge problem: races would be quite unbalanced. But let's try it. I just assume male and female have the same height and weigth (cause I'm lazy...):In age, I mention the five category of age

Charrs:stats: +2 strength, +2 dexterity, +2 constitutiontraits: +2 discretion, +2 perception, +4 climbing, 12m speed, claws (1D4, proficiency), martial formation (proficiency for a war weapon of their choice), night visionHeight: 1.8 +6D10 cm (2,13m in average), Weigth: 90 * 2D6/5 (126 kg in average)Age category: 12 - 30 - 45 - 60 - +2D10

Norns:stats: +4 strength, +2 constitution, +2 wisdomtraits: survival is alaways a class skill, shapeshifting (1/day), endurance as a bonus talentHeight: 1.9 +8D10 cm (2,34m in average), Weigth: 100 * 2D6/5 (140 kg in average)Age category: 14 - 40 - 60 - 80 - +2D20

Asuras:stats: -2 strength, +4 intelligencetraits: small size, bonus talents related to technology, night vision, +4 perceptionHeight: 0.9 +5D6 cm (1,08m in average), Weigth: 25 kg in average)Age category: 20 - 50 - 75 - 100 - +3D20

Sylvari:stats: +2 charismatraits: +1 skill point/level, +1 bonus talent atlevel 1Height: , Weigth: same as humans (not sure for weigth since it's vegetal)Age category: 0 - unknown - unknown - unknown - unknown

Officially, we don't know much about the various races in terms of the statistics that you want. Even humans might have a (slightly) longer lifespan than found on Earth, but it's safe to say that it's around 100 years at maximum. Even the sylvari have no idea what their maximum lifespan is, or even if there's a limit to it outside of being killed (which we definitely know can happen to them).

One thing we have learned with the progress of Taimi over the Living World updates is that asura seem to physically mature at around age 18, similar to humans. I believe someone said that she was 12 when we first met her back in Edge of the Mists, and it's been about 5 years since then. She had especially noticable growth over Season 3 until she's about as tall as most other asura in Path of Fire. As far as height for asura go, they'd be around 3.5-4 feet tall, with the females being 1-2 inches shorter than the males. Asura don't use IQ tests, as they have a much more refined scale to measure intelligence that is unappreciated by any non-asura.

@Lametoile.7394, those are some interesting stats but I think we should talk more about them. For one thing, which version of D&D do you imagine those for? 5th ed only gives racial bonuses, making the -2 strength on asura odd, but 3.5 usually had as many minuses as pluses to balance a race. When a race had a net bonus in racial stats, it took a penalty in experience gain.

@Rognik.2579 said:

I use 3.5 version, the only one that matters for me, though i have many problems with it but that's not the subject...

As I said, the races are unbalanced. I didn't want to balance them but to show the stats they would REALLY have. Charrs are much more powerful than humans, you just can't ignore it. They would obviously be level adjustment (like 2-3 for Norns and charrs and maybe 1 for asura) but that's odd.As a matter of fact, I created a rpg version of guild wars universe that have some racial balance but I'm not completely happy with the rules.

Lore-wise, Norns are even stronger and tougher than they look. The tale of Aesgir knocking a fang out of Jormag's maw is a literal one. As a result, they would get one helluva stat bonus and would probably need a level adjustment to rival some of the more powerful DnD races.

@Lametoile.7394 said:

@Rognik.2579 said:

Pretty sure there's at least some Pathfinder mixed in there...

I think it is possible to balance them.

For instance, I don't think asura are actually so smart as to warrant +4 Int. +2 Int is probably sufficient.

Sylvari could probably be left as flat stats - they often have endearing attitudes, but that's not really what Charisma represents.

Charr and norn would probably require a level adjustment, although it probably could be kept to +1. Both would have the Powerful Build trait.

Charr would not necessarily have +2 dex (they're agile for their size, but they're still big) and I think a -2 to Wisdom might actually be justified. Possibly even a -2 to Charisma, albeit one more than offset by a bonus to Intimidate: the mentality of the average charr tends towards threats and bluster. Olmakhan might break this mould, but then, given how many elf subraces there are in D&D, charr could probably have subraces sorted by legion, with the Olmakhan using the Flame Legion basic characteristics.

Norn could also potentially be limited to +2 strength and +2 con - there's no indication that they're wiser than the other races, and in fact there's some indication that the average norn is quite foolhardy, but since they also have a strong shamanic tradition I'm not inclined to give them a penalty there. A Charisma penalty, however, could be justified - most norn do not do well in groups, and they have many of the same traits that justify the Charisma penalty for D&D dwarves.

@draxynnic.3719 said:Norn could also potentially be limited to +2 strength and +2 con - there's no indication that they're wiser than the other races, and in fact there's some indication that the average norn is quite foolhardy, but since they also have a strong shamanic tradition I'm not inclined to give them a penalty there. A Charisma penalty, however, could be justified - most norn do not do well in groups, and they have many of the same traits that justify the Charisma penalty for D&D dwarves.

2 STR/CON á la DnD is far too little for Norns.

That’s the Half-Orc stat adjustments (at least according to the latest edition I remember) and Norns would definitely be stronger than one of those. They’d be on the levels of Ogre or even Giant and would definitely be hit with a higher level adjustment than the other races since you’d have to pack the stat bonuses of those large monsters into a humanoid-ish sized package (ie while a Giant cannot wear armour or wield none but their monster/specific weapons a Norn would be able to use anything a human character could - but with the stats of an Ogre or Giant to boot which is quite an advantage deserving of the level adjustment!).

Again, the in-game Norn is a severely nerfed version of their lore counterpart. They possess a strength of such a magnitude it makes them disproportionately stronger than their already ample frames imply. Think of Aesgir holding Jornag’s maw open with one arm and swinging his weapon with the other to knock that tooth out. Every Norn is basically Thor from Norse myth except for the thunder aspect.

I do want to give you a slight correction here. Aesgir isn't just a Norn that is powerful enough to go around knocking the teeth out of Elder dragons, he had a Jotun scroll similar to what Braham had which empowered him to be able to hurt the dragon. Think about it, if one Norn could knock out Jormag's tooth, how come the thousands of them that fought it couldn't kill it?

As Narcemus says. We can't base the entire race on what the most impressive member of their kind did. What stat boosts and special abilities would we be giving to humans if we used Jennah or the GW1 PC as the baseline?

Half-orcs, incidentally, are +2Str, -2Int, -2Cha in 3.5. More recent editions might be different, but you did say you were using a 3.5 basis.

Another couple of things to consider:

First, the Powerful Build trait also grants additional benefits normally associated with a higher Strength - it basically makes members of the race treated as being Large for many things in which being Large is an advantage. I don't think norn are necessarily as strong as goliaths, so +2 and the Powerful Build trait is probably reasonable.

Second, when looking at things in D&D terms, one thing to consider is average level. Norn culture is such that pretty much every adult norn likely has at least a few PC class levels under their belt. Some of their power comes not from being inherently better, but because the typical norn is probably something like a level 4 ranger where the typical charr is a level 1 soldier. The stories of things like one norn taking on a whole charr warband and so on probably comes from this more than it comes from direct physical attributes.

While all Norns may not be Aesgir Jr. they do, as a race, possess mythological strength beyond what you’d expect from their already impressive physique when it comes to the lore. Giant may be a bit too far, but definitely on par with Ogre stat adjustments. Or perhaps Half-Ogre if that is a thing in DnD (I mean the implications of the sheer existence of Half-Orcs is disturbing enough already).

All-in-all a “puny” 2 bonus to STR seems, well, too puny.

Powerful Build does seem appropriate/interesting though, I agree. Also, I cannot believe I got the Half-Orc stat adjustment wrong. My Baldur’s Gate II-fu ain’t what it used to be... :/

Well, I don't think the D&D framework is perfectly suited to represent the races in GW2, since character upkeep is basically free. If you were to take food into account, your humans can live on white bread and potato soup, while your charr are pretty much carnivores and the norn may or may not require alcohol in addition to a large appetite.That's the thing, GW2 equalized the characters to avoid the optimal race problem, but if you were to simulate the races in a more accurate manner, a format like the old dungeon master games may be more fitting?

As for the norn, they are a race of giants, who don't have to shy away from physical combat with a jotun. Also, their transformations are more powerful in lore than in game.

As for the races and their body mass, charr has been compared to an african lion.Norn height and mass are modest estimates. They may end up heavier.Asura weight is taken from human childen, but adjusted for bulkier appearance.Sylvari are adjusted for some common wood densities. Oak is the upper end while aspen wood is the lower end.Heights are measured for upright posture, even for charr (/crossarms), otherwise they hunch at 2.1 ~ 2.2 metres. They are very bulky, though.The lifespan is the general consensus on longest lifespan. (Not confirmed by writers.) Magic may increase the lifespan even further.Keep in mind, that most individuals do not reach their natural lifespan due to war (charr, human), work accidents (human, charr, asura), unhealthy lifestyle (norn, charr human), duels to the death (human, charr, norn), hunting accidents (norn, human, charr), and their race being only around 30 years old (sylvari 1302 a.E.-?)

Part of me wonders if Sylvari are biologically immortal. That is to say, while perfectly killable through violent means like the rest, they don’t “suffer” from aging and live for ever.

Plus Charr are taller then Norn when they do stand upright.

@starhunter.6015 said:Plus Charr are taller then Norn when they do stand upright.

No, no they’re not.

@Oglaf.1074 said:

@starhunter.6015 said:Plus Charr are taller then Norn when they do stand upright.

They certainly are. I have compared max height charr and norn personally. You need to use /crossarms emote.

@Cerioth.7062 said:

@Oglaf.1074 said:

@starhunter.6015 said:Plus Charr are taller then Norn when they do stand upright.

In-game character heights vary.

The average Norn in the lore is definitely taller than the average Charr - regardless of posture.

Norn in game are much, much smaller than the ones in the books and even some descriptions in game.