Elementalist Rework with Pictures (Arcane and Fire)

So i was bored and i decided to rework the entire Elementalist spec.

When designing this rework, i aimed to make each trait line follow the following criteria:

• Minor trait lines specialize the user in a particular field of expertise.
• Major traits are designed to fundamentally change an aspect of your build, each governing a drastic change in play style and theory craft.

The Fire trait line specializes in Power/condition damage, Area of Effects, and Fire Aura's. Each major trait either facilitates power builds, condition builds, fields and fire auras.The Arcane trait line specializes in Boon enhancement, Aura enhancement, Attunement enhancement and Utility enhancement. Each major stat facilitates builds based on boons, casting spells based on attunements, arcane abilities and auras.

I also left out things like Internal cooldowns, and other limitations like percentages. Figure i'd leave it up to the imagination as to what one would deem to have restraints.Let me know what you think so far! I will plan to make the other specs soon.

Fire Traitline

Arcane Traitline

I hate it. I like fire/arcane/weaver, but I would just delete my character with these changes. Maybe next time!

@Kulvar.1239 said:I hate it. I like fire/arcane/weaver, but I would just delete my character with these changes. Maybe next time!

Why do you hate it?

This seems powercrept too much

How to make fire good (or at least better than now):1) Roll the Sunspot minor trait into the Burning Rage trait.2) Reduce (or completely remove) the might requirement for Power Underwhelming.3) new Minor, Flash Fire: When Attuning to Fire, Burn all enemies in a radius (equal to current Sunspot), Conditions you apply deal increased damage over time

20% cooldown, on attunements, utilities AND overloads is incredibly good, and it's a minnor trait... that would cement arcane on every elementalist build/spec for all eternity

@hanabal lecter.2495 said:This seems powercrept too much

It’s kinda easy to throw around the term “powercreep” nowadays. But you can’t really talk about powercreep without knowing full details about how powerful each trait actually is, such as ICD’s, class limitations, and specifics about how much an ability scales. I left these kinds of details out on purpose so that one is free to imagine what the correct values would be for a given trait.

The only two traits I would think of as being slightly powercrept would be the swirling winds change and arcane aura. Everything else seems fine to me and the reason you might see it as powercreep is because all of the useless traits have been completely replaced with unique mechanics. It’s not really a traditional rework, but a redesign of how specs should be designed.

Give me an example of powercreep other than the two skills I’ve mentioned above and I’ll counter explain why it wouldn’t be the case.

@Knuckle Joe.7408 said:20% cooldown, on attunements, utilities AND overloads is incredibly good, and it's a minnor trait... that would cement arcane on every elementalist build/spec for all eternity

Ya that’s right, it’s a good trait. We already have this though right now, it’s just spread out in arcane in a very clunky way that bottlenecks diversity so I combined those aspects into one single minor grandmaster..

The idea generally was that if you took arcane you’d reduce cooldowns of all attunements by 20%, and then with any other traitline like fire or air, you specialize by reducing the cooldowns of a specific attunement like fire for an additional 20%. This way, play styles exist where if you don’t want to use arcane because you find yourself not using certain attunements, you can still have CD reduction on a particular attunement that you use more often.

If you are a fire/water sage, you should be able to use fire and water effectively, and not have to take arcane just to reduce the CD of your Attunements, especially if you don’t even use the other attunements in your play style.

@JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:

@hanabal lecter.2495 said:This seems powercrept too much

Fire is not as bad but the arcane line seems overturned especially the enhanced boons one trait enhancing all boons that much is broken sword weaver is already overly tanky while dealing decent dmg as it is this will give those hybrid builds way to big a push. And that quickness on fire aura gain? Even pushing that fire weaver build even further to more powercreep. That's the last boon it should be able to give itself.

Also I do main elementalist and i do want buffs for it, but this will just narrow most ellys to use that sword fire weaver build more over other builds.

@hanabal lecter.2495 said:sword weaver is already overly tanky while dealing decent dmg as it is this will give those hybrid builds way to big a push. And that quickness on fire aura gain? Even pushing that fire weaver build even further to more powercreep. That's the last boon it should be able to give itself.

They should just nerf Weaver already.Weaver really is a bane when it comes to Ele DPS variety.

@Fueki.4753 said:

@hanabal lecter.2495 said:sword weaver is already overly tanky while dealing decent dmg as it is this will give those hybrid builds way to big a push. And that quickness on fire aura gain? Even pushing that fire weaver build even further to more powercreep. That's the last boon it should be able to give itself.

I agree those changes here going to far but in what world is weaver tanky ? I mean only condi weaver can be called that maybe.The rest lives and dies with evade and have only one stunbreak in the built in compare e.g warrior which can have up to 30 k live and multiply stun breaks including passive ones or can be top DPS as berserker warrior .

If a swordweaver takes you apart in pvp its mostly because of the difference in skill not because the built is good.

@hanabal lecter.2495 said:Also I do main elementalist and i do want buffs for it, but this will just narrow most ellys to use that sword fire weaver build more over other builds.

Quickness on Fire Aura seems perfectly plausible if you have to slot grandmaster into it. Fire auras aren’t exactly plentiful and to receive fire auras you have to be mainly in fire attunement, which means the weaver is vulnerable to damage. The condi traits are designed to transform boons that are applied to them into conditions, so if your dealing with a condi weaver they sacrifice their boons to do so. Most of the passive burning traits that weaver relies on in Fire traitline were removed, so if you are dealing with a condi weaver they are fated to be squishy in this rework.

@hanabal lecter.2495 said:the arcane line seems overturned especially the enhanced boons one trait enhancing all boons that much is broken.

Okay so about Arcane Aura. I did already mention that this aura is powerful. Keep in mind that in order to make use of it, you sacrifice stability, which makes you vulnerable to interrupts.

The scaling of those enhancements are definitely up for re balancing, but I felt like those values are just right given the sacrifice you need to make for those enhancements.

Also to clear up any misconceptions about those values, 100% increase in movement speed is 66% swiftness (equivalent to the speed given by Rune of speed)

100% increase to vigor is 80% endurance regeneration

Regeneration is 100% more healing, which I sort of misworded. It would actually make regeneration tick twice as fast rather than double it’s total healing. So a regeneration stack will tick for 1600 instead of 800, but will last only 4 seconds instead of 8 seconds for example

+60 power on might is the new value that might gives you, so instead of +30 power it’s +60 power...not 30+60.

Really like the the presentation, and you do have some cool ideas, but if something like this will be implemented ele will get simply OP.

Too much powercreep in arcane, gaining acess to self quickness in fire is also dangerous, with +25% dmg from might and charging adept trait weaver's dps will be through the roof and weaver already has pretty good dps. Some of the new traits can be made balanced tho but that will require giving them ridicuolus cooldowns which these traits clunky and unreliable.

@GeorgeHaldane.9453 said:Really like the the presentation, and you do have some cool ideas, but if something like this will be implemented ele will get simply OP.

Too much powercreep in arcane, gaining acess to self quickness in fire is also dangerous, with +25% dmg from might and charging adept trait weaver's dps will be through the roof and weaver already has pretty good dps. Some of the new traits can be made balanced tho but that will require giving them ridicuolus cooldowns which these traits clunky and unreliable.

Thanks for the input. What would you change about arcane exactly? I’m already aware that arcane aura and the swirling winds change is a bit too strong, but other than those two, what would you change?

@JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:

@GeorgeHaldane.9453 said:Really like the the presentation, and you do have some cool ideas, but if something like this will be implemented ele will get simply OP.

Too much powercreep in arcane, gaining acess to self quickness in fire is also dangerous, with +25% dmg from might and charging adept trait weaver's dps will be through the roof and weaver already has pretty good dps. Some of the new traits can be made balanced tho but that will require giving them ridicuolus cooldowns which these traits clunky and unreliable.

Tbh just the auras s what's too broken in arcana and the quickness in fire. The blind does damage sounds interesting and fun though

@hanabal lecter.2495 said:

@JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:

@GeorgeHaldane.9453 said:Really like the the presentation, and you do have some cool ideas, but if something like this will be implemented ele will get simply OP.

Too much powercreep in arcane, gaining acess to self quickness in fire is also dangerous, with +25% dmg from might and charging adept trait weaver's dps will be through the roof and weaver already has pretty good dps. Some of the new traits can be made balanced tho but that will require giving them ridicuolus cooldowns which these traits clunky and unreliable.

So the auras as in all the aura traits? Like the detonation of auras and detonating auras on allies healing them?

Also ya if quickness on Fire Aura seems too strong it can be changed to something more like “Fire auras grant 10% more damage for its duration” that way it doesn’t effect condi.

Edit: I was thinking that for arcane aura, instead of providing enhanced boons, it would just provide double the boons you apply. So if you use a skill that grants 5 might, the skill would grant 10 might. If a skill grants 5 seconds of swiftness, it will grant 10 seconds. This kinda takes away from building into concentration which is why I decided against that idea.

Otherwise arcane aura can do something totally different and I’m down to discuss ideas about what an arcane aura should do.

@JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:

@hanabal lecter.2495 said:

@JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:

@GeorgeHaldane.9453 said:Really like the the presentation, and you do have some cool ideas, but if something like this will be implemented ele will get simply OP.

Too much powercreep in arcane, gaining acess to self quickness in fire is also dangerous, with +25% dmg from might and charging adept trait weaver's dps will be through the roof and weaver already has pretty good dps. Some of the new traits can be made balanced tho but that will require giving them ridicuolus cooldowns which these traits clunky and unreliable.

The arcane aura trait. The improved boons seem very strong even with stab trade off and would that swiftness stack with weaver buffed swiftness and speed runes?

@hanabal lecter.2495 said:

@JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:

@hanabal lecter.2495 said:

@JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:

@GeorgeHaldane.9453 said:Really like the the presentation, and you do have some cool ideas, but if something like this will be implemented ele will get simply OP.

Too much powercreep in arcane, gaining acess to self quickness in fire is also dangerous, with +25% dmg from might and charging adept trait weaver's dps will be through the roof and weaver already has pretty good dps. Some of the new traits can be made balanced tho but that will require giving them ridicuolus cooldowns which these traits clunky and unreliable.

For stacking no. The swiftness improvement would be the same speed that speed runes give you (66% movement) which is an 100% increase over swiftness (33%)

And effects like those overwrite effects that are lower so they don’t stack. That’s how it currently works in game.

Likewise with other buffs, they don’t stack and maintain their same limitation, so you can’t go over 100% endurance regen, which is the current endurance cap, and the arcane buff only goes to 80%.

@hanabal lecter.2495 said:

@JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:

@hanabal lecter.2495 said:

@JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:

@GeorgeHaldane.9453 said:Really like the the presentation, and you do have some cool ideas, but if something like this will be implemented ele will get simply OP.

Too much powercreep in arcane, gaining acess to self quickness in fire is also dangerous, with +25% dmg from might and charging adept trait weaver's dps will be through the roof and weaver already has pretty good dps. Some of the new traits can be made balanced tho but that will require giving them ridicuolus cooldowns which these traits clunky and unreliable.

Okay so how about this for Arcane Aura:

Arcane Aura-Instability effect has been removed.Functionality changed:-Boons that are striped, corrupted or stolen from you, heal you and deal damage to nearby foes, while under the effect of Arcane Aura.

Or arcane aura : boons on you or applied to you have duration increased ( 1 or 2sec) and can't be removed or corrupted.

Good concept to make it unique, but terrible at numbers. Just adept might trait with arcane instability can let ele hit 50k no problem. And likely 55-60k+ if you combine other obscure powercreeps like 20% utility CD reductions, 50% longer aura, 300 concentration, 40% fury, damage on blind, attunement damages etc etc.

@"NICENIKESHOE.7128" said:Good concept to make it unique, but terrible at numbers. Just adept might trait with arcane instability can let ele hit 50k no problem. And likely 55-60k+ if you combine other obscure powercreeps like 20% utility CD reductions, 50% longer aura, 300 concentration, 40% fury, damage on blind, attunement damages etc etc.

It’s not really powercreep. We have 20% cd reductions on utilities already. It’s just spread out (we have 20% on arcane, signets, glyphs and cantraps) all of which are spread out over all the specs. What I did was just put all those cd reductions into arcane and basically remove them from everything else.

50% longer auras sounds like big numbers, but almost all auras are 4 seconds long. 50% would make it 6 seconds long.

300 concentration is just a standard stat assignment based on the previous fire stats, which give 150 power and 150 condition (for a total of +300 stats) which many classes already have a 300 stat change (mostly in the form of converting one stat to another, like Vigourous Shouts for example; https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Vigorous_Shouts

You’ll also notice that on Fire, there is only one damage modifier and that is the one on might, and most of the sources of the damage actually come from might, which give it a very pronounced weakness; strip might and boons = noodle ele.

So ya even though I left out many numbers on purpose it’s not like I threw numbers around like I want to make ele OP. The numbers I did put make some sense and have to be though of in terms of the grand scheme of the class...

@JusticeRetroHunter.7684 said:

@"NICENIKESHOE.7128" said:Good concept to make it unique, but terrible at numbers. Just adept might trait with arcane instability can let ele hit 50k no problem. And likely 55-60k+ if you combine other obscure powercreeps like 20% utility CD reductions, 50% longer aura, 300 concentration, 40% fury, damage on blind, attunement damages etc etc.