Bots and Win Traders... And this YouTube upload by Teapot...

[KittyKaboom.8760]

 

I recently returned to Gw2 after almost 2 years away. I couldn't believe how much I missed the game and was so happy to be back. I am a PvP/WvW main, and it didn't take long to see and find out the state of the game. While Win Trading had always been an issue that I had hoped Anet would work on - especially with the existence of Win Trading discords and content creators/streamers making the information so public about who is doing it - things have gotten so out of hand. The other day, I noticed someone in my guild botting 7 accounts in ranked PvP (yes, all accounts were booted from the guild on this discovery). Then I was told that this has become the "new normal" and I am just incredibly disappointed. These accounts are being reported but NO ACTION is being taken. I know of several bot accounts that have been reported by upwards of a dozen individuals - they are currently logged in and bottin' away in different PvP maps at this very moment as I post. Why do the reports go unanswered? Why are these accounts still active? Think about that - that just 1 botter can be in several different matches at the same time. Now add TONS of botters to that equation. You cannot tell me this is "okay". I know there have been recent actions at the top of the ladder, but the average player is not in Legend rank, has not earned Gizmos, etc. Right now your average player is bombarded by bots, even more than win traders (they are more active during ATs lately). People are doing "bot checks" at the start of a match to find out if they even have a human team or not - this has become extremely regular in all my ranked matches since returning. Show some respect to your players, your staff who work on PvP, and to your game itself and start banning these accounts. Trust me, if you were worried about losing out on money from banning them, you are not! They aren't spending money in the gemstore like your actual players are. I've seen too many beloved games fall and die due to this exact circumstance, botting, cheating, trading. I understand investigating win-trading and ATs can be slow, but the bots are so brazen it doesn't take a genius to find out that 6 people in 6 different PvP maps with 6 almost identical acct names that never dodge or cap a point need to be banned. So sick of watching my block list in hopes of a "safe time to queue". It's a really, really bad look and turning the game mode into a joke. Many players were already hesitant to join in PvP in the first place, what is the incentive if it's a total joke run by scripters?? There is no longer even pride in earning a high rank...

 

MightyTeapot recently uploaded a video to Youtube about this horrible problem and the state of the game. He adds that he knows the company is busy with the expansion but quote, with this issue, "We are in the 11th hour" and "Anet needs to get a separate team on this NOW". We understand you are working hard on the expansion but this is so out of hand it's ludicrous. The botting is just insane. I remember when my bf and I started that it was extremely difficult to buy 2 copies of the game and play together - we had to go through support and an "investigation" just to play the game. Now we have guys running around with 12 accounts, scripting PvP. I thought it was bad enough seeing that ranger at the Pinata meta with 20 accts using AHK scripts (I reported him, too, back in the day - Anet response was basically "but he bought so many copies of PoF, though!" and they did nothing). But now it's ruining an entire game mode. I have lists of bots on my block list and wait to queue until they are in a game. Why should I have to wait 10 minutes or more to "safely" queue into a game mode? Why are the reports of bot accounts with nearly identical names botting in PvP going ingored? Can you PLEASE get someone, anyone, on this? Teapot is right, something must be done and NOW. I had high praise when you guys hired sPvP/WvW balance teams, but that's all pointless if nearly every match has a bot or wintader in it. Show some respect to your players/customers, your PvP team, and the game mode itself before it's too late.

 

[KittyKaboom.8760]

11 hours ago, Tayga.3192 said:

Add captcha to queue for players who get reported frequently, if they are a bot they will be out of the queue. 

In another thread, this is the most eloquent solution I've seen presented thus far. Sad we've gotten to this point. I'd rather see all those accounts banned but apparently we need to come to these forums with more ideas, because the bans just aren't happening. This is a good one. Thoughts?

Edited October 15, 2021 by MakeItFit.7062

[TheDarkness.6947]

51 minutes ago, MakeItFit.7062 said:

In another thread, this is the most eloquent solution I've seen presented thus far. Sad we've gotten to this point. I'd rather see all those accounts banned but apparently we need to come to these forums with more ideas, because the bans just aren't happening. This is a good one. Thoughts?

I think it’s a decent idea. It could help.  Here’s the thing though.  It’s obvious Anet has many gifted people in their employ.  I feel like they could tap just one of them on the shoulder and say “hey, stop what you’re working on for one week, and go figure out how to  fix the bots and other problems caused by alt accounts in PvP.”  And if they did that, most of these problems would be get significantly better if not be solved completely.  Seems like the only thing worth brainstorming about here is how to get Anet to care about PvP.

[Bazsi.2734]

PvP is underpopulated. When a gamemode gets no engagement, investing work hours on that part of the game is an investment that will get no return, so it gets none. This accelerates exodus of the remaining population.
This is simply the reason why A-net left PvP rotting for years. Until it bites into the general profits of A-net by making it into the general sentiment about the game, noone cares if some of the few leftovers in PvP exploit/cheat/bot. They are trying to find the sweetspot between not investing work hours and not having to deal with too much complaints/negativity/bad press. 
Up until recently I thought I might be overly cynical and pessimistic with my take, but the recent banning of 83 wintrader accounts following a loud wave of complaining from the community made me sure that I'm right about this. I wish they would pick up PvP and treat it as an actual gamemode...

Edited October 15, 2021 by Bazsi.2734

[Obtena.7952]

3 hours ago, TheDarkness.6947 said:

I think it’s a decent idea. It could help.  Here’s the thing though.  It’s obvious Anet has many gifted people in their employ.  I feel like they could tap just one of them on the shoulder and say “hey, stop what you’re working on for one week, and go figure out how to  fix the bots and other problems caused by alt accounts in PvP.”  And if they did that, most of these problems would be get significantly better if not be solved completely.  Seems like the only thing worth brainstorming about here is how to get Anet to care about PvP.

I feel like this is a significant under estimation of the scope of the problem, just to conclude Anet doesn't care about the game. 

One week? I would bet that a system to stop PVP bots will take way more people and way more time than one guy working a week on it. 

Also, if there isn't much care, it's because PVP was a ill-fated game mode in the game to begin with. Sure, it took years, but it was inevitable. The game was simply not designed around competitive game modes, so it's clear the most competitive game mode struggles the most with the game design. 

Edited October 15, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[TheDarkness.6947]

1 hour ago, Obtena.7952 said:

I feel like this is a significant under estimation of the scope of the problem, just to conclude Anet doesn't care about the game. 

One week? I would bet that a system to stop PVP bots will take way more people and way more time than one guy working a week on it. 

Also, if there isn't much care, it's because PVP was a ill-fated game mode in the game to begin with. Sure, it took years, but it was inevitable. The game was simply not designed around competitive game modes, so it's clear the most competitive game mode struggles the most with the game design. 

It’s possible I underestimate the effort.  I wouldn’t think a simple captcha system like suggested would take a lot of programming effort, and it would at least stop AFK botting by requiring someone to babysit their bots so they can’t run on autopilot 24/7.  Requiring the purchase of an expansion to play ranked PvP would at least put some cost and risk into setting up alt accounts for bots since they could be banned.  Those both seem like they’d be pretty straightforward, and they are just player suggestions I’ve seen here.  The actual game developers might have even better ideas.

 

To me, it looks like the competitive modes were the actual intended end game, at least initially.  The excellent active combat system.  Skills that don’t really have very much impact in PvE but feel essential in PvP/WvW.  Separate skill definitions per mode.  Granted, competitive modes don’t seem to be so much the end game focus today based on where we see development dollars being spent.  But it does seem to me the game was very much designed for competitive modes.

[RedAvenged.5217]

Idk why you expected more than wintrading when all these people who mysteriously run the scene besides being well known as terribad and already multiple times banned are the ones you are probably watching.

 

any educated player in the scene worth a kitten and I quote could not stand 30 seconds in a convo with these guys. They are not only rotten to the center but have some serious problems, probably sociopathic or drug problems.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

15 hours ago, MakeItFit.7062 said:

In another thread, this is the most eloquent solution I've seen presented thus far. Sad we've gotten to this point. I'd rather see all those accounts banned but apparently we need to come to these forums with more ideas, because the bans just aren't happening. This is a good one. Thoughts?

This won't make a difference at all, unfortunately. The people running bots aren't turning on bots and then walking away to let them farm gold. People run bots in multi-windows for pvp so they can have the bots throw games for them, for easy wins. This means that the people running bots are generally paying attention to the multi-box windows and would just manually enter captcha by hand.

Bots in pvp are used as method to essentially win trade by yourself without anyone knowing about it.

This problem is so deep after they introduced f2p accounts, which it wouldn't matter how many you banned, because people would just make more. Then the problem becomes exasperated with solo/duo only queue, which is the entire reason why synch queueing to plant throws on the other team can work to begin with.

As much as some completely blind players want to avoid this fact, the only way to fix this problem is to allow 5man queues again. This way players can invite only players they know are humans that they trust to play the game and try hard. 5man queue won't eliminate win trading and bot play, but it would allow YOUR team to block itself from being effected by win trading.

And I don't think any of this is going to happen. It is quite clear 10 years in, that Arenanet is allowing all of this to happen for several reasons. There is a lot of money to be made from the garbage they are allowing, which I am not going to get too deep into here.

All I can say is that Arenanet has gained themselves a sleazy company reputation for what they have allowed here. I don't think a single player who has been involved in this pvp community would ever trust an Arenanet product ever again with a competitive scene. The level of corruption here is the deepest I've ever seen in any gaming environment.

Edited October 16, 2021 by Trevor Boyer.6524

[Lacdanon.1483]

Playing in Aus prime time is pretty sad, 7 out of 10 games have 1 or more bots, the other 3 games you are up against plat2+ duo que with a team made up of anything from silver to gold 3.

[JTGuevara.9018]

God...it's gotten even worse since I quit for good last year...

 

Y'all are doing "bot checks" now? Oof...yeah...I already recommended to new players a couple of years to "play at your own risk", now I'm just going to tell them...STAY OUT. It's a cheater's paradise. And yes. I'm with the others on this thread over broadcasting on social media. Social pressure and public accountability works. Especially in the case of institutions.

 

[Leonidrex.5649]

On 10/15/2021 at 9:52 PM, Bazsi.2734 said:

PvP is underpopulated. When a gamemode gets no engagement, investing work hours on that part of the game is an investment that will get no return, so it gets none. This accelerates exodus of the remaining population.
This is simply the reason why A-net left PvP rotting for years. Until it bites into the general profits of A-net by making it into the general sentiment about the game, noone cares if some of the few leftovers in PvP exploit/cheat/bot. They are trying to find the sweetspot between not investing work hours and not having to deal with too much complaints/negativity/bad press. 
Up until recently I thought I might be overly cynical and pessimistic with my take, but the recent banning of 83 wintrader accounts following a loud wave of complaining from the community made me sure that I'm right about this. I wish they would pick up PvP and treat it as an actual gamemode...

And their reasoning is somewhat correct. but such practices spill over to other content.
and honestly, if there is only 1 mode everyone plays and its pve, people will quit, pvp/wvw/achivements/events is amazing way for people to get refreshed and ready to go back into the main game-mode. And if they keep pvp/wvw dying left and right it WILL affect the game as a whole much more then just those pvp players leaving.
I used to pvp a lot, and my friend would always convince me to do a t4+cm fractal, or goof around in some meta-event.
Now that I stopped pvp I just cant be bothered to even do a 10min of playtime in gw2.
I stopped playing so he plays less, since I stopped my another friend stopped and the ball rolls.