The most important thing to address concerning Untamed?

[Wild.1705]

I thought about what easily identifiable and important things would need to be changed in order to get Untamed to a function level for all game modes. I decided to start (not finish) with pet survivability because it has the potential to get shut down in WVW, in big mid fights in pvp, and in boss encounters in PVE. Other things need to be addressed as well, but the main profession mechanic struggling to find it's footing should be the first thing looked at. Especially because the Untamed has more focus on the pet. It would be strange to have Untamed shipped out without at least considering taking a look at pet survivability across all game modes.

 

The pet running out of HP.

 

Because the pet can go into a "downed state", it makes the spec nearly unplayable in WVW and in some instances PVP and PVE as well.

The fact that the pet will get eaten by mobs in WVW means that this spec can really only preform well in 2/3 game modes at best. Is this not the most pressing issue?

 

I can see an argument that not all elite specializations need to be meta in all 3 game modes; but, I hold a stance that they should at least be functional.

 

Yeah I get it, the hammer isn't that great. The traits are not that great either, nor the new pet skills, nor the heal skill. I get it, other than theming, nothing about the Untamed is great. But, we have to recommended the most most important changes that ArenaNet needs to make. In my opinion, addressing the fact that the Untamed pet will die, (and in some cases such as WVW almost always be dead) is the most important concern that should be addressed.

 

Edited November 11, 2021 by Wild.1705
Added a proper introduction to the topic.

[Puck.3697]

im NGL.. in both SPVP and PvE I really dont see the pets dying at all realistically.. thats never been a real issue outside of WvWvW.

is it a pressing issue? No not really, a Major problem here is Simple.. its Not fixable without making untamed a Petless Specc, which is not going to be a Decision they reverse now, Pet speccs will never be amazing in WvWvW. and heres why, because you'd have to make it blatently Overpowered in the other game modes to get it to this sort of level realistically.

Its not a case of "not all elite specializations need to be meta in all 3 game modes".. its Simply a case of because of how different these game modes are to one another, they demand different elements and  its balanced in the same bubble as SPVP. its not realistically possible to make everything functional in everything.

a Pet speccs, never gonna be functional in WvWvW... espically a pet specc which increases the damage it takes with the raw mechanic that also disables your pet using its strongest abilities if left on the pet. Like we can list the issues with the specc but they wont fix the problems this Specc has in WvWvW.. which is litterally the fact its a Pet specc.

the pressing issue is, Untamed doesnt give us anything that ranger Didnt already have.

we have a Pet Based DPS (Core Ranger)

we have a Petless DPS (Soulbeast)

we have a Healer/Support (Druid)

So why have they given us another Pet based Pure DPS Specc? it fills no holes that the Specc didnt have. the Mechanic is basically a Twist on Druids but more limited and Less useful to the ranger overall.

This SPecc should have Utilised Something unique even if pet based, Something like Temporary pets: Natures Guardians effectively, where ur Kit changes based On which pet Spirit you've summoned, close to Ele Attunements but Affecting only 2 abilities and having a Dual Attack Mechanic on the 3rd.

this would have been something workable into a WvWvW specc unlike what untamed currently is.

Edited November 10, 2021 by Daddy.8125

[Wild.1705]

1 hour ago, Daddy.8125 said:

Pet speccs will never be amazing in WvWvW. and heres why, because you'd have to make it blatently Overpowered in the other game modes to get it to this sort of level realistically.

NO. I HATE WHEN PEOPLE THINK LIKE THIS.

Creative solutions can address this kind of problem easily. The problem is many players have been conditioned by ArenaNet to not look for creative solutions to problems and instead look for numerical nerf/buffs.

Let me give an example. This is not my idea in full but something I heard on the forms. I will also not claim this will solve everything, it is just a creative solution that is far more effective than just "buff pet". 

In WVW and PVP,  give the pet an additive damage reduction of  -10% total damage taken per enemy player in the vicinity. In a 5v5 the pet would have the additive damage reduction of -10x5 = 50% damage reduction (Would be the cap in sPVP because they are 5v5s). In wvw if there are 10+ players then pet takes -10x10 = 100% damage reduction (No damage taken). 

This creative solution does not power creep other game modes. In 1v1s and 2v2s, it will not have a massive impact leaving the game feeling like it does now. Creative solutions are needed, and will be better than buffs or nerfs most of the time.

 

1 hour ago, Daddy.8125 said:

im NGL.. in both SPVP and PvE I really dont see the pets dying at all realistically.. thats never been a real issue outside of WvWvW.

If you are not side noding in sPVP, then your pets die. Depends on the enemy team comp but with condition aoes like burn guard or scourge they go down more often than you think. It's just most ranger builds are side noder or roamer builds, somthing that Untamed seems it was trying to address.

In PVE well it depends...This Halloween season, I have been enjoying fighting the Labyrinth bosses solo. The Terror of the Labyrinth will target the pet when fighting solo and kill it in 2 hits. There is nothing you can do as core ranger (or Soulbeast unmerged) to save it from the massive "get out of the way of the big orange damage area attack". They just die. I am sure there are other areas in PVE where this happens. It's cool that I can just camp Beastmode 90% of the fight because if I couldn't, then I would have no class mechanic to use during the fight. Which isn't something any other classes have to worry about.

Going back to creative solutions, (keep in mind this is just spit-balling out ideas) they could make it so that when a pet is near a legendary foe the pet gets a 80% damage reduction and also no longer takes aggro 100% of the time (preventing ultra tank for me pets). 

 

1 hour ago, Daddy.8125 said:

the pressing issue is, Untamed doesnt give us anything that ranger Didnt already have.

we have a Pet Based DPS (Core Ranger)

we have a Petless DPS (Soulbeast)

we have a Healer/Support (Druid)

Could be wrong about this, but from what I have heard/seen it seems as if  ArenaNet was trying to make the Untamed a bruiser spec. Something that could be in the front line dealing and taking damage. So more of a dps/tank  hybrid spec. As I understand, there are no tank like frontline ranger builds that could be considered meta in any game mode. Should AreaNet's vision of the Untamed come to fruition, then it would carve out it's own unique niche. 

Edited November 10, 2021 by Wild.1705

[Puck.3697]

11 minutes ago, Wild.1705 said:

NO. I HATE WHEN PEOPLE THINK LIKE THIS.

Creative solutions can address this kind of problem easily. The problem is many players have been conditioned by ArenaNet to not look for creative solutions to problems and instead look for numerical nerf/buffs.

i'd argue your quite litterally asking Anet to do what no games managed... Pet SPeccs have always been below the average in all WvWvW. this is because If u make Pets Capable of surviving 40 people.. you make it rediculous in smaller scale fights and areas of the game.

this game would need to unbug 36 pets and then go on to fix Pet AI Pathing and more before even approaching such fixs realistically.. something thats defintly not going to come in time for EoD.

a Pet based Ranger.. without making it overpowered or unkillable (Which is Ridiculous) it wont work

11 minutes ago, Wild.1705 said:

In wvw if there are 10+ players then pet takes -10x10 = 100% damage reduction (No damage taken). 

This would be Overpowerred As all hell to realistically have. Pets MUST be killable.

11 minutes ago, Wild.1705 said:

This creative solution does not power creep other game modes. In 1v1s and 2v2s, it will not have a massive impact leaving the game feeling like it does now. Creative solutions are needed, and will be better than buffs or nerfs most of the time.

it dont matter, it'd be OP AF in WvWvW. a AI Should not be unkillable.

11 minutes ago, Wild.1705 said:

If you are not side noding in sPVP, then your pets die. Depends on the enemy team comp but with condition aoes like burn guard or scourge they go down more often than you think. It's just most ranger builds are side noder or roamer builds, somthing that Untamed seems it was trying to address.

even in team fights, people dont really focus Pets. Mainly because with pet swap, ur focusing 40K + Damage into Pets while being focused, People dont focus Pets mainly because its too easy to kite their AI.

11 minutes ago, Wild.1705 said:

As I understand, there are no tank like frontline ranger builds that could be considered meta in any game mode. Should AreaNet's vision of the Untamed come to fruition, then it would carve out it's own unique niche. 

Its a Specc that litterally takes increased Damage when using its DPS Options though.

Edited November 10, 2021 by Daddy.8125

[Wild.1705]

I Haven't failed, I've just found 10,000 that won't work. - Tomas Edison

 

1 hour ago, Wild.1705 said:

Creative solutions can address this kind of problem easily. The problem is many players have been conditioned by ArenaNet to not look for creative solutions to problems and instead look for numerical nerf/buffs.

 

1 hour ago, Wild.1705 said:

(keep in mind this is just spit-balling out ideas)

I stand by these two quotes I made earlier.

It doesn't have to be THESE EXACT CREATIVE SOLUTIONS. Just some creative solution. Things can be done to address some of the pet's issues.

 

I don't want to pick this whole thing apart, so I will start with just with this one part. (Would be nice to have some fresh voices on this post, but I was a lurker for years so I get it.)

1 hour ago, Daddy.8125 said:

1 hour ago, Wild.1705 said:

In wvw if there are 10+ players then pet takes -10x10 = 100% damage reduction (No damage taken). 

This would be Overpowerred As all hell to realistically have. Pets MUST be killable.

1 hour ago, Wild.1705 said:

This creative solution does not power creep other game modes. In 1v1s and 2v2s, it will not have a massive impact leaving the game feeling like it does now. Creative solutions are needed, and will be better than buffs or nerfs most of the time.

it dont matter, it'd be OP AF in WvWvW. a AI Should not be unkillable.

If pet's were completely invincible, it is possible you would just see a sea of rangers in WVW letting their pets do all the work in zergs (Although I am still unsure if they would be considered a threat). So, if that is too much then implement something else. I am not claiming that this is the be all end all solution. 

Here are some more random Ideas that I came up with. None of these may be the perfect solution either, but at least we can discuss what may or may not work and why.

• Make pets still attack like normal once at 0% HP but they suffer a 80% damage loss. Even if a sea of 250 rangers in WVW came at a group, if their pets were dying quickly then there would be no real threat. But rangers still have some pet dps and all pet interactions still available.
• After the pet dies make it return to the ranger and begin to heal over time. Could start at 10 seconds or so. It would be better to pet swap if it was available, but if not at least it wouldn't be long before your pet is back out on the field and you can use your class mechanic again. 
• Make the heal skill give the pet immunity to damage for "Xseconds" Pet swap is on a 15sec cooldown but in zergs or even in PVP in big brawls, is can be tough to swap in time. And then the new pet has to last 15 seconds. If the pet dies then the swap changes to 60 seconds. Giving the pet immunity to damage on a heal skill (About a 30 or so second cooldown on average) for lets say 6 seconds, could allow the pet to survive long enough that you could get the swap more often and avoid the 60 second cool down.

Once again, I am not claiming any of these to work. But, there is something that will. Throwing out a lot of Ideas until one works is all we need.

There is a problem that we are aware of. We can find a solution through creative and critical thinking. We may fail many times, but that is ok, because you only need to succeed once.

[Puck.3697]

2 hours ago, Wild.1705 said:

pet's were completely invincible, it is possible you would just see a sea of rangers in WVW letting their pets do all the work in zergs (Although I am still unsure if they would be considered a threat). So, if that is too much then implement something else. I am not claiming that this is the be all end all solution

A major issue is simple, Anet will never whatever the majority wants effectively. If invincible pets end up being "unfun" to play against it will defintly be gutted..

playing against invincibility isn't fun and would onset a chunk of people screeching. 

pets do need to be killable and reasonably timed aswell.. you can't balance around the fact it might be smacked by 100 AoEs... Because it'd become ridiculous in smaller scaled fights realistically. 

WvWvW and Spvp are joint in balancing so the fix would have to be fine in spvp. 

 

Edited November 10, 2021 by Daddy.8125

[Swagger.1459]

19 hours ago, Wild.1705 said:

NO. I HATE WHEN PEOPLE THINK LIKE THIS.

Creative solutions can address this kind of problem easily. The problem is many players have been conditioned by ArenaNet to not look for creative solutions to problems and instead look for numerical nerf/buffs.

Let me give an example. This is not my idea in full but something I heard on the forms. I will also not claim this will solve everything, it is just a creative solution that is far more effective than just "buff pet". 

In WVW and PVP,  give the pet an additive damage reduction of  -10% total damage taken per enemy player in the vicinity. In a 5v5 the pet would have the additive damage reduction of -10x5 = 50% damage reduction (Would be the cap in sPVP because they are 5v5s). In wvw if there are 10+ players then pet takes -10x10 = 100% damage reduction (No damage taken). 

This creative solution does not power creep other game modes. In 1v1s and 2v2s, it will not have a massive impact leaving the game feeling like it does now. Creative solutions are needed, and will be better than buffs or nerfs most of the time.

 

If you are not side noding in sPVP, then your pets die. Depends on the enemy team comp but with condition aoes like burn guard or scourge they go down more often than you think. It's just most ranger builds are side noder or roamer builds, somthing that Untamed seems it was trying to address.

In PVE well it depends...This Halloween season, I have been enjoying fighting the Labyrinth bosses solo. The Terror of the Labyrinth will target the pet when fighting solo and kill it in 2 hits. There is nothing you can do as core ranger (or Soulbeast unmerged) to save it from the massive "get out of the way of the big orange damage area attack". They just die. I am sure there are other areas in PVE where this happens. It's cool that I can just camp Beastmode 90% of the fight because if I couldn't, then I would have no class mechanic to use during the fight. Which isn't something any other classes have to worry about.

Going back to creative solutions, (keep in mind this is just spit-balling out ideas) they could make it so that when a pet is near a legendary foe the pet gets a 80% damage reduction and also no longer takes aggro 100% of the time (preventing ultra tank for me pets). 

 

Could be wrong about this, but from what I have heard/seen it seems as if  ArenaNet was trying to make the Untamed a bruiser spec. Something that could be in the front line dealing and taking damage. So more of a dps/tank  hybrid spec. As I understand, there are no tank like frontline ranger builds that could be considered meta in any game mode. Should AreaNet's vision of the Untamed come to fruition, then it would carve out it's own unique niche. 

Edit- I misread the suggestion. Regardless, pets are mostly junky mechanics that have had issues since alpha. The devs aren’t fixing them up, and slapping on this suggestion doesn’t fix all the other issues with the class.

And if you think this is the #1 issue with Untamed, then you're wrong. Pet issues are across the board, not with 1 particular spec. There is a lot to be desired, so much so, that even if they did what you suggest, this untamed spec will still be subpar from hammer on down.

Your suggestion is a gimmick bandaid, not a substantial improvement at all. 

… 

I thought for sure the thread was going to be about fixing up the cruddy hammer…
 

So your “creative solution” is to give pets a 10% global damage defense against a hundred players drooling at the keyboard tossing around thousands of AoEs? So then our little pet can get an extra 1 second to miss a moving target before it dies anyway?

 

 

You should really absorb what the other posters are trying to explain to you. 

Edited November 10, 2021 by Swagger.1459

[Beddo.1907]

Maybe let's fix pets instead of adding pointless numbers that won't do a thing?

AI, AA animations being to long to hit, Quickness being useless, the wierd movement swings that aggro everything around you, new UI having not enough keys for control, pet skills disappearing after mount which forces you to unmerge and remerge (and maybe stow finally working in battle so you can stop being a problem in zergs).

That's a few things that haunt the pet part of ranger making ranger weaker and completly stopping a pet focused espec from existing. GL fixing that with some numbers.

[InsaneQR.7412]

Just "the pet" would be enough to say tbh.

[Obtena.7952]

21 hours ago, Wild.1705 said:

NO. I HATE WHEN PEOPLE THINK LIKE THIS.

Creative solutions can address this kind of problem easily. The problem is many players ...

See, here is the problem with how you think ... 

1. This isn't a problem with players so, there is that. Just be careful how you are aiming your frustrations. How the game works is not the fault of players.

2. Creative solutions can address this problem easily? Well, that means it's a) not a problem Anet is too keen on fixing or b) not an easy problem because it still happens after 9+ years in this game. 

I don't see how the spec is any less playable if your pet had zero HP ... no more so than other specs. 

The one thing that is a major dislike ... pet's lose their identity when unleashed. 

Edited November 11, 2021 by Obtena.7952

[Wild.1705]

I used  the edit function to remove an unneeded post!

Edited November 11, 2021 by Wild.1705

[Wild.1705]

3 hours ago, InsaneQR.7412 said:

Just "the pet" would be enough to say tbh.

Agree but how? Let's talk!

4 hours ago, Beddo.1907 said:

Maybe let's fix pets instead of adding pointless numbers that won't do a thing?

AI, AA animations being to long to hit, Quickness being useless, the wierd movement swings that aggro everything around you, new UI having not enough keys for control, pet skills disappearing after mount which forces you to unmerge and remerge (and maybe stow finally working in battle so you can stop being a problem in zergs).

That's a few things that haunt the pet part of ranger making ranger weaker and completly stopping a pet focused espec from existing. GL fixing that with some numbers.

I agree with everything here, but it feels a bit unrealistic to expect such massive changes. It would be amazing to see such an overhaul but I just don't know if ArenaNet is up to the challenge at the moment.

 

1 hour ago, Obtena.7952 said:

2. Creative solutions can address this problem easily? Well, that means it's a) not a problem Anet is too keen on fixing or b) not an easy problem because it still happens after 9+ years in this game. 

So for "a)." I don't really understand ArenaNet. They really don't seem keen on fixing the problem but it's really weird that they think this way. I mean a new specialization drops with the same problem core has had for years and it doesn't seem that they care. I feel like the players care a lot more than they do about the game as a whole.

As for "b)." The problem has been in the game for 9+ years, but have they ever tried changing something? Yeah it could be that it is just to complicated to fix, but it doesn't seem that there is a whole lot of effort if any that has ever went into creating a fix. 

[Swagger.1459]

3 minutes ago, Wild.1705 said:

 

Edited November 11, 2021 by Swagger.1459

[Swagger.1459]

19 minutes ago, Wild.1705 said:

That is not what I said lol. Try reading this again please.

Also from yesterday,

 

Over this was a bad solution but it was at least a talking point. We should probably move on from it.

I already added an edit well before you quoted me…

 

 

Edit- I misread the suggestion. Regardless, pets are mostly junky mechanics that have had issues since alpha. The devs aren’t fixing them up, and slapping on this suggestion doesn’t fix all the other issues with the class.

And if you think this is the #1 issue with Untamed, then you're wrong. Pet issues are across the board, not with 1 particular spec. There is a lot to be desired, so much so, that even if they did what you suggest, this untamed spec will still be subpar from hammer on down.

 

Your suggestion is a gimmick bandaid, not a substantial improvement at all. 

Edited November 11, 2021 by Swagger.1459

[Wild.1705]

The main reason I made this post was try and get Untamed to a playable state in all game modes.

I thought the pet was the biggest problem keeping core rangers and Untamed out of 1/3 of the game modes. As such I wanted to start there. If hammer was just better would that really make people happy? Core would still have issues unaddressed it hammer just gets a fix.

 

I don't know, I just don't see how a class struggling to play in all game modes isn't the first thing that should be talked about after a beta even such as the one we had.

[Wild.1705]

12 hours ago, Swagger.1459 said:

Edit- I misread the suggestion. Regardless, pets are mostly junky mechanics that have had issues since alpha. The devs aren’t fixing them up, and slapping on this suggestion doesn’t fix all the other issues with the class.

I thought even after misreading you still came to the conclusion you did.

Doesn't edit let you remove sentences? Ima give it a try hold up.

Edited November 11, 2021 by Wild.1705
Trial to see if my sentence was removed

[Swagger.1459]

8 minutes ago, Wild.1705 said:

I thought even after misreading you still came to the conclusion you did.

Doesn't edit let you remove sentences? Ima give it a try hold up.

I edited my original post 4 hours ago. You quoted me 32 minutes ago. 

[draxynnic.3719]

As a note: sPvP and WvW are NOT the same balance environment. They're generally more similar to one another than PvE, but there are some things that are split between WvW and sPvP.

 

So it's at least plausible that some solution could be implemented only for WvW and therefore not affect sPvP.

 

Heck, something like the PvE approach could work: make pets take reduced damage from AoE unless they're actually the target of the attack, and put pets at the bottom of the targeting priority for AoE attacks. That way they can still be killed if someone decides to go for them deliberately, but they can be significantly more resistant to just being deleted through incidental AoEs.

[InsaneQR.7412]

15 hours ago, Wild.1705 said:

Agree but how? Let's talk!

 

How?

Well how about reworking everything.

 

1. Your pet dying isnt the issue. Managing your pet is part of the classes identity, you want your pupper to be alive to work properly. Trivializing that doesnt make the class better IMO just less engaging. Punishing the petswap cooldown if your peet goes down is a horrible solution though, because you HAVE to swap out your pet to remain effective when your pet goes down. So you are getting punished already.

 

2. Core pets are an underpowered, underdevelooed Bugfest that need fixes at several places. Fix the quickness bug, fix the stat calculatiosn or even better remove the pet stats entirely and let them scale by pet family and archetype from your own stats.

 

3. Give us the breakbar in PvE for our Pet

 

4. Change the F skills so that F1 marks a target for attack (triggers CC skill of the pet), F2 is a groundmtargeted positioning command, F3 toggles Guard/Lurk (Guard aggressive mode - attacks anything that attacks it or the ranger, Lurk passive mode - attack only on command and stowed out of combat). F4 Pet skill. F5 petswap. Any e-spec builds on that.

[Dadnir.5038]

15 hours ago, Wild.1705 said:

The problem has been in the game for 9+ years, but have they ever tried changing something? Yeah it could be that it is just to complicated to fix, but it doesn't seem that there is a whole lot of effort if any that has ever went into creating a fix. 

They tried. They gave more health to the pet at the cost of their overall damage in 2014 or 2015 (I'll confess that I liked the pet more before this change... Ok mainly my Jaguar and my lynx...). They also made some efforts on the radius of the pet's attack to allow them to connect more easily. Not to forget that the "AI" was "improved" a few time along the years. Then they made PvE aoe deal less damage on untargeted pets. And the overall reduction of damage in competitive mode also indirectly increased the pet survivability there.

 

[Wild.1705]

I think this thread has loads of good ideas on pet management.

I think this is alot of work and I can't imagine this being ready for EOD. Maby sometime it the future these ideas cna be realized.

 

[Wild.1705]

3 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

They tried. They gave more health to the pet at the cost of their overall damage in 2014 or 2015 (I'll confess that I liked the pet more before this change... Ok mainly my Jaguar and my lynx...). They also made some efforts on the radius of the pet's attack to allow them to connect more easily. Not to forget that the "AI" was "improved" a few time along the years. Then they made PvE aoe deal less damage on untargeted pets. And the overall reduction of damage in competitive mode also indirectly increased the pet survivability there.

It is cool to have someone who has been around for a long time that has seen some changes that have been made. Which do you think were most/least effective? Why?

Any idea what the AI "improvements" were? This is just me being curious.

 

I think raw numerical value changes can be useful at times, but other than hitbox changes and "improved AI", it seems that ArenaNet has only ever considered number changes rather than tackling the problem from a different direction.

[Wild.1705]

I would love to see the pet AI improve. However, I still don't think that will be enough to save it in WVW zergs, 5v5 sPVP node battles(specifically big group fights 4v4/5v5), or select PVE bosses.

I would LOVE to see the AI be updated, but I can't with confidence say that is the first thing that should be focused on. If the pet can't survive, then it's AI does not matter too much.

[Puck.3697]

9 hours ago, Wild.1705 said:

I would love to see the pet AI improve. However, I still don't think that will be enough to save it in WVW zergs, 5v5 sPVP node battles(specifically big group fights 4v4/5v5), or select PVE bosses.

I would LOVE to see the AI be updated, but I can't with confidence say that is the first thing that should be focused on. If the pet can't survive, then it's AI does not matter too much.

Tbh In any mmorpg regardless of updates or size pets have a issue. I don't think the techs good enough to ever get AI good enough effectively 

I think lots want pets to get rly good but sadly currently none of them rly are pets will always be alittle annoying in areas and will defintly have their hold backs. 

[Gotejjeken.1267]

They firstly need to match soulbeast in terms of pet management.  Essentially, 10s max swap CD no matter if pet is alive or not, no more 60s penalty. 

Then, they need to get rid of the damage received increase, as that's an awful idea all around.  Unleashed state should only power up and have no tradeoff in terms of lowering defenses as its already underpowered to begin with.  

Next, Untamed NEEDs and identity other than 'slightly better core', because core ranger is about the worst spec they could have picked to expand upon.  Even then, with the damage taken increase and overall blandness I'd rather just stick with core because it at least gives a third traitline that's better than anything Untamed has.

Finally, yeah they need to fix the hammer.  Just get rid of the idea of a secondary skillset with shared CDs--its pretty much unusable.  You aren't beating Druid at the CC game, and again that's a bad thing for a new spec that is being promoted as some 'frontliner'.  

Edited November 12, 2021 by Gotejjeken.1267