New player, a good thing for community and Gw 2 but....

[Valaraukar.7652]

Hello all.

Since gw 2 will be released on steam next week (Happy birthday Guild Wars 2 🎂), it's mean probably  new player. Some old map will be probably more lively now (s3/s4).

More player, mean more rentability (so good things for arena net). So to resume, i think that it's good things for all.

But... is it a good new for meta/group event and other ?
I mean i don't know for you, but recently i see more and more people don't doing/knowing the simple mechanic of an event/meta/situation.

I take by exemple now Dragonstorm event. I see more and more people using raptor/skyscale to break the cc bar of the shield when Braham and kitting are puching each other on the face in a group of 10 player. Making the event "more longer".  But the fact that player want to do a 10 squad, is to make the event faster. And breaking the cc bar, is a part of in my opinion (okay, it's not a lot longer, but this exemple show the simple mechanic of cc bar).

Pinata--->people rushing on pinata with their raptor/skyscale and starting attack when pinata is invicible. If in a full squad, it's not a big deal, on a map with a small group, it can be a problem since even we say "jump on your bunny", people still don't want to listen and stay with their raptor/skyscale and sometimes making the event really close to fail (specially with the other event of choya attacking the door, pinata is moving a lot suddenly in front).
More, i see often now on lfg a group with "late pinata" when they are on round 1 at the end of the full timer (20 minutes).

It's mean that people learn wrong the event. So when i saw that, i gently correct them (sometimes people say sorry and they didn't know but some don't answer or are still taging until the end of the timer).

Teq : People don't destroy finger by exemple, not protecting turrent, not destroying wormwhole etc etc

DBS/Claw of jormag : A lot of people don't know the basic mechanic of the event. If right now, it's not a big deal since jormag can be done as it's often done right ingame, for DBS it's not the case.
A lot of people don't know that Riftstalker make the health of kitten. regen and so often people are trying to dps him and sometimes/often without success (i didn't did it from a long time because well, the reward are poor and now, people aren't killing mob champion who spwan while the meta)

I'm not an eletist player and i think that there is nothing wrong to make mistake. It's not a mistake to learn from someone who learn something wrong.
I think that it's something wrong to make mistake and not wanting correcting it's mistake or to not wanting learning. And without talking of toxic player/eletist insulting or leaving a group in fractal/donjon/raid/strike mission. Or even simple in the normal maps of gw 2.

Or even more leeching people making maybe the meta a little (or a lot) longer/harder. (i take drakkar by exemple, sometimes the event is really long because you have 10 leeching player. (25 minutes) People complaing about this meta that it's long but leeching and making the event more longer is well.... stupid ? In a good dps squad(or without leech player), the meta can be done in +- 15 min).

What's your opinion about that ? Do you think that more people will likely to spread more bad learning of event mechanics ? It will bring more toxicity ? More leecher ?

By advance, sorry for my mistakes in english since it's not my first 🙂

Edited August 16, 2022 by Valaraukar.7652

[Gibson.4036]

The GW2 community has been known for its helpfulness since the beginning of the game. My hope is that an influx of new players will be met with that helpfulness, and receive it. Not only will that culture be passed along, but it would help with the problem you're anticipating.

Throw on those mentor tags!

[kharmin.7683]

2 minutes ago, Gibson.4036 said:

Throw on those mentor tags!

I expect to see more of these in the starter zones and home cities (including LA).  At least, that's my hope.

[Randulf.7614]

It will be the same as the last ten years. We aren’t magically gaining a new breed of player. Meta events will be no worse affected than before.

People who inclined to leech or inclined to turn off map chat will do so regardless, but they will remain a minority.
 

Basically, don’t worry about it

Edited August 16, 2022 by Randulf.7614

[Zanther Deathbringer.4762]

You got me as far as Piñata. An event that takes a total of 20 seconds to actually complete and requires no actual though process to actually do. An event thats been done for years and only recently started seeing "on your mounts" popping up.

I'm calling BS on your entire post. You're fear mongering because a new influx of players are about to come into the game, and you wont be special anymore I guess?

[Ashen.2907]

If I am reading your post correctly it appears that you are concerned that many new players from the steam launch will not know what they are doing when it comes to content.

If so, you are correct. They will not. But then again neither did we at first. They have an advantage over the novice versions of us though. They have us. We can offer advice, suggestions, answer questions, and generally be welcoming. Remember that someone will take our advice better if we arent attacking them for not already knowing in the process.

[Valaraukar.7652]

No, you haven't understand me. It's normal that people don't know what they are doing when they discover the game. We are here to helping them etc. I say it in my first post.

 

My concern is about the processus of learning correctly since recently (or i'm not lucky) i fall often on toxic people (not on me, but insulting other people or eletist in map/group/squad) mechanic of meta not doing correctly etc.
By exemple, i fall recently on a toxic one/eletist in a strike mission who left the squad with saying in the squad chat two skill of a class of another player which were probably not to his taste.
Some commander lead without knowing the mechanic of the meta or sometimes don't want to give instructions to newbie player, some aren't leading and just want put a commander tag. (well in pve, tag is often a taxi).

I could take an exemple,( i'm not doing a lot anymore too), but the chak gerent of nuhoch lane now is often/always cc and this one with the scar lane should not be cc to avoid that chack go a lot away from the player or in the water for the nuhoch lane. Specially  the stomp phase 2 at nuhoch could bring a fail.

 

So to resume, all these new player as i was saying is a good things, but could be bring this more a lot of toxic people ingame (by the comportement of eletist player or immature player), more fail of event meta since as i was saying some mechanic aren't doing correctly because people don't know them correctly ?

Edited August 17, 2022 by Valaraukar.7652

[Linken.6345]

3 minutes ago, Valaraukar.7652 said:

No, you haven't understand me. It's normal that people don't know what they are doing when they discover the game. We are here to helping them etc. I say it in my first post.

 

My concern is about the processus of learning correctly since recently (or i'm not lucky) i fall often on toxic people (not on me, but insulting other people or eletist in map/group/squad) mechanic of meta not doing correctly etc.
By exemple, i fall recently on a toxic one/eletist in a strike mission who left the squad with saying in the squad chat two skill of a class of another player which were probably not to his taste.
Some commander lead without knowing the mechanic of the meta or sometimes don't want to give instructions to newbie player, some aren't leading and just want put a commander tag. (well in pve, tag is often a taxi).

I could take an exemple,( i'm not doing a lot anymore too), but the chak gerent of nuhoch lane now is often/always cc and this one with the scar lane should not be cc to avoid that chack go a lot away from the player or in the water for the nuhoch lane. Specially  the stomp phase 2 at nuhoch could bring a fail.

 

So to resume, all these new player as i was saying is a good things, but could be bring this more a lot of toxic people ingame (by the comportement of eletist player or immature player), more fail of event meta since as i was saying some mechanic aren't doing correctly because people don't know them correctly ?

So so-won all over again.

Dont worry mate it will go over in afew months people will learn.

[Labjax.2465]

12 minutes ago, Valaraukar.7652 said:

I could take an exemple,( i'm not doing a lot anymore too), but the chak gerent of nuhoch lane now is often/always cc and this one with the scar lane should not be cc to avoid that chack go a lot away from the player or in the water for the nuhoch lane. Specially  the stomp phase 2 at nuhoch could bring a fail.

The "to cc or not to cc" is an ongoing debate from what I've seen and I'm not sure anybody has authoritatively done numbers on it, nor would they care to since most groups can kill the gerents in 2 burns max, regardless of who does or doesn't cc (I find more often now groups will get them all done in the 1st burn). The most fail-likely part of that meta is people knowing how to pass the pre phase and having the numbers to do it, and so I started explaining the mechanics for it just about every time I do the meta. Hard to say if it makes a difference because I rarely saw fails regardless, but so far I've yet to see a fail on a map where I explained mechanics.

Which brings me to a more general point and that is: explain mechanics.

It's really that simple. I can't say with confidence people always listen, sometimes you get groups in one meta or another who are determined to do their own thing, but for the most part, I find explaining the mechanics is the difference between people smoothly doing what you hope they'd do and people being all over the place (figuratively, hopefully not literally).

You never know who is or isn't new to a specific meta or has been a while, regardless of whether they're new to the game.

So: explain mechanics.

If you are a commander and it's a lane-based meta and others aren't explaining and it's chronically causing problems, consider doing an overview explanation for the whole map. It's what guilds like [LEG] or [FROG] do that I occasionally run into doing meta trains. They have both map-wide explanations and squad explanations. Never seen them struggle to complete a meta.

Some people tag just to taxi because we have a wonky map system where taxiing people in is pretty important. Don't hold it against them. Some of them may not even know mechanics well themselves, they're just trying to help by getting people into the map and that is a help.

And yes, in summary, sometimes people will not listen when you explain mechanics. That's fine. It's not your game or my game, it's a shared experience. And just because you or I thinks a meta should be done a particular way doesn't obligate anyone else to listen. When I tag up, I don't think of myself as a commander. I think of myself as more like a tour guide. My job is to make sure people know what's happening and what to do. Beyond that, they are free to screw around if they want to and there's nothing I can do about it. And as long as enough listen to get us through the meta successfully and have a good time, that's what matters.

Final thought: I'm gonna guess you may be EU server since english is not your first language. It's possible that some of the time, there's just straight up a language barrier when trying to explain things. You may be encountering some people who literally don't know what they're being told. Just something to consider. I don't know how to approach that as a problem.

[Valaraukar.7652]

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Don't hold it against them.

 

Of course and i never say that. But just some put a tag to show "look i'm a commander, i'm better than mentor tag or people and that in fact, they don't know ". It's in this case  where these commander are arrogant over the people that i don't like that. I see in the past some people joking about the mentor tag. It's so childish. Some mentor tag are better than commander tag because they lead better people. They just don't want to spend gold about the commander tag so it's for that that they use the mentor tag.
And yes, some people are just taxi and some say that they don't know the meta. I love the honesty. 
Some people with commander tag are arrogant  and it's bad. If they think that they can do someone alone, they should do it in that case.

 

Quote

And yes, in summary, sometimes people will not listen when you explain mechanics. That's fine. It's not your game or my game, it's a shared experience. And just because you or I thinks a meta should be done a particular way doesn't obligate anyone else to listen.

 

As you say, it's a shared experience. So what's the point if people want to play on their side ? Let's take auric meta at south. It can be an exemple where instruction can be important since it's one of the rare meta when each line must be coordinate betwen them. If people in south lane specially or even  other lane want play on their side, it can be really a pain to succeed the meta while when people know what they do, the meta is one in less than fine minute and they can join an other meta.

I don't think that giving the explanation about the meta is something bad. 
Giving order and insulting people because they don't listen yes, it's something bad. But often it's eletist player who think that they are better than anyone else.

Just to be clear, i don't command (or extremly rarely) because well, i don't care about that ^^.
I love when a meta or a squad have good vibes. Not when people are complaining, insulting, trolling or even put the fault of themself on other. (exemple on teq one day, i see people complaining about turrets not doing their job but guess what ? No one (or almost) was protecting them.....)

 

The only thing that i'm concern with player from steam is about how people can be so toxic with other one while they don't know how to do correctly something an event/meta and when people are gently correcting them, still refuse the explanations and spread bad instructions. These new players must be welcomed. I remember that in the past a new player was trolled by toxic people and he was saying that Gw 2 had a good reputation with people helping each other. And well that was right, but i see more and more toxicity, trolling, leeching, bot/multi-account leech. I just don't want to see these kind of comportement more.

But yes you right, i play on eu server and yes you have absolutly right, often the language barrier is a problem. I see often people joking or insulting even people from an another language.

 

Sad :(

[Ashen.2907]

Yes, an overall population increase will mean an increase of toxic players, but it will also mean an increase of non toxic players as well. We already have both and if we have more players it stands to reason that we will have more of both. I expect that the proportions will remain the same. So, hopefully, if we set a good example other veterans might do the same and so will new players. I expect, also, that some events will possibly see more failure while people learn.

[Valaraukar.7652]

Well about toxic comportement, today in fracal someone was asking if he/she was the only dps. Someone say "i'm a dps too", guess what he/she say ? "Only Xk dps? Okay....."

[Farohna.6247]

21 hours ago, Gibson.4036 said:

The GW2 community has been known for its helpfulness since the beginning of the game. My hope is that an influx of new players will be met with that helpfulness, and receive it. Not only will that culture be passed along, but it would help with the problem you're anticipating.

Throw on those mentor tags!

Absolutely, and I hope that more experienced players will take a couple of minutes before a boss to give a quick run down or remind players to use skills/appropriate mounts for breakbars, or the water balloons at the effigy at the festival.  Sometimes people don't know, sometimes they forget, even the non-Steam players 😉