anyone got any WvW bladesworn v mechanist?

[Fipmip.7219]

been playing bsw in wvw, i am by no means any good at the game but i get utterly shredded every time against rifle mech in 1 on 1. I'm like sheesh i thought i was supposed to be the overpowered one. i did a cursory search for some bladesworn wvw but found nothing against mechanist. share your techs/footage below

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

Just stun them several times. You can also go x/Shield in your weapon set and take Shield Mastery and let them kill themselves. If you don't want that then take Earth Runes and the automatic Magnetic Aura will do it for you.

Edited September 6, 2022 by Lan Deathrider.5910
typo

[felix.2386]

basically impossible,

why warrior has gotten so bad for me to play is that it is so limited and lacking in tools

that even being meta and clearly out skill,

it is simply hard countered by some cheap gimmick builds with no option of doing anything.

 

for example, with rifle mechanics in WvW

in pvp, you can out play by using LoS to force melee range and you need to cap point as well, which also force melee.

 

but in WvW open field, when rifle mech slotted with blink and rocket boot, you basically can never touch it outside of the 2 gunblade skill.

 

and it will outdamage you in range. you can not win by trade damage in range.

 

it can keep range from the start of the fight and you will be forced to gap close.

then it can just blink away or rocket boot away before you even get close.

 

on top of knock back and dodges.

 

shield mastery and mag aura are meh, anyone with a brain can just stall weapon and stop attacking and keep kitting.

as it can never be touched by melee skills.

 

of course this melee problem is only warrior.

rev with shiro does not have this problem.

even simply having sword 2 on guard, won't be as problematic.

thief obviously won't have this problem.

ranger won't have this problem because it is actually half melee half range also having stealth helps for engaging.

 

warrior no matter how generalize you build it, it will still have the most hard counters

most other classes can have hard counters but only few if built for universal.

but not warrior, warrior will have at least 3x more hard counters.

 

this is why i hate playing warrior now even tho i want to play warrior.

you simply die to some most cheap gimmick build with no tools to use.

even you just look at two builds on paper, there's nothing you can do.

also while other classes can actually play around the hard counter, warrior can't even run.

 

Edited September 6, 2022 by felix.2386

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

5 minutes ago, felix.2386 said:

shield mastery and mag aura are meh, anyone with a brain can just stall weapon and stop attacking and keep kitting.

You forget that the majority of WvW players are not that good. 

5 minutes ago, felix.2386 said:

 

of course this melee problem is only warrior.

On BSW though the Gunsaber at least is an effective switch hitter and can Spike a target at range with AS spam, so for BSW this is less of a problem

The rest of warrior specs this is an issue because they've made the conscious decision that Warrior shouldn't have strong ranged DPS options. They gave us a melee range pistol for crying out loud and they regularly joke on streams that LB is really a melee weapon.

From the PvE perspective this regularly becomes a problem as they roll out boss encounters where you can't melee the boss, or bosses that are so mobile that you can't DPS reliably on melee.

This is a pretty big error in design philosophy and encounter balance.

[felix.2386]

49 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

You forget that the majority of WvW players are not that good. 

 

that's not the point of the discussion tho.

your statement can literally be used to justify any injustice

 

warrior is fine in pvp too because 90% of current pvp player doesn't know how to press buttons properly.

 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

1 hour ago, felix.2386 said:

that's not the point of the discussion tho.

your statement can literally be used to justify any injustice

 

warrior is fine in pvp too because 90% of current pvp player doesn't know how to press buttons properly.

 

My point is that you are more likely to find a player who never dodges or stows weapons in general WvW play than you are in something like Ranked. Unranked is anyone's guess on the skill level of opponents you encounter.

But for general WvW? You'd be surprised how many people will nuke themselves on reflects, and is a valid recommendation for anyone who is struggling against ranged projectile classes.

[oscuro.9720]

Blade does quite well against mech imo. Most mechs are pretty bad at basic things, like dodging, so it’s pretty easy to land large bursts. What I would suggest is trying out core shout warrior for a little while, since it struggles much more vs mech. Get down the timing and nuances of the engagement, then go back to blade. Or just duel some mechs a lot. That’s should help too. 
 

Mech’s strong point in wvw is the lack of restrictions on kiting (as opposed to spvp) and numbers. It might be the most frustrating +1 I’ve had to fight in this game when I’m on spell breaker. It’s significantly easier to kill them on a shout build, especially on blade, because of the added healing.

 

Some specific tips;

the ai is stupid in its positioning. Don’t let the mech block your attacks that are meant for the engineer. 

Get in melee. Don’t try to trade at range. Being in constant, high pressure melee can throw off ranged attacks for bad players (most mechs). Not to mention blade’s damage is better in melee thanks to Cyclone Trigger.

Cyclone Trigger is a projectile block. This ends up giving pretty good projectile hate, which completely shuts down mech. It also does more damage in melee, so a DS2->cyclone->artillery can give you a pretty solid burst that’s covered from mechs damage.

Dodge aim assisted rocket/orbital strike, not the auto attacks. The autos hurt, but Blade’s healing can generally keep up if you maintain pressure. The aim assisted rocket is where things start really hurting. This isn’t to say there’s not a time to dodge autos, but try to prioritize dodges for more costly things.

Know when to charge Dragon Slash and when to quick fire it. This is much more of a feel thing, but you generally shouldn’t be sticking to just a set pattern. Quick firing, charging, and extended holds all have their place and can make blade’s play style have a lot more depth when you start to figure out how to properly vary them. 

Edited September 6, 2022 by oscuro.9720

[Lucentfir.7430]

4 hours ago, felix.2386 said:

basically impossible,

why warrior has gotten so bad for me to play is that it is so limited and lacking in tools

that even being meta and clearly out skill,

it is simply hard countered by some cheap gimmick builds with no option of doing anything.

 

for example, with rifle mechanics in WvW

in pvp, you can out play by using LoS to force melee range and you need to cap point as well, which also force melee.

 

but in WvW open field, when rifle mech slotted with blink and rocket boot, you basically can never touch it outside of the 2 gunblade skill.

 

and it will outdamage you in range. you can not win by trade damage in range.

 

it can keep range from the start of the fight and you will be forced to gap close.

then it can just blink away or rocket boot away before you even get close.

 

on top of knock back and dodges.

 

shield mastery and mag aura are meh, anyone with a brain can just stall weapon and stop attacking and keep kitting.

as it can never be touched by melee skills.

 

of course this melee problem is only warrior.

rev with shiro does not have this problem.

even simply having sword 2 on guard, won't be as problematic.

thief obviously won't have this problem.

ranger won't have this problem because it is actually half melee half range also having stealth helps for engaging.

 

warrior no matter how generalize you build it, it will still have the most hard counters

most other classes can have hard counters but only few if built for universal.

but not warrior, warrior will have at least 3x more hard counters.

 

this is why i hate playing warrior now even tho i want to play warrior.

you simply die to some most cheap gimmick build with no tools to use.

even you just look at two builds on paper, there's nothing you can do.

also while other classes can actually play around the hard counter, warrior can't even run.

 

Ngl, while I've certainly had my fair share of Rifle Mechs blowing themselves up on shield reflects in WvW, the ones that don't will normally AA you to death with rifle and mech after if it's open field, not to mention when you do get into melee you're still getting outtraded a majority of the time because a lot of warrior's weapon damage is over nerfed(aside from axe), and the biggest hard hitting skill they have requires 50% below health foe(arcing slice).

You also won't catch mechanist between rocket boots, and shadow step signet at least with some variants i've encountered, I guess people that have shadowstep gap closers and what not don't have this problem and if they do it's to a much lesser extent., it's either Ranged builds have way too much power/effectiveness currently(Way more noticeable if you don't have things to counter it) for safety of ranged, or warrior lacks the dangerous damage and tools in melee to make it threatening. 

Also right about hard counters: Ranged/kiting, Stability, blocks, blinds, weakness, protection, also just render you pretty useless a majority of the time.

[felix.2386]

On 9/6/2022 at 4:58 PM, Lucentfir.7430 said:

Ngl, while I've certainly had my fair share of Rifle Mechs blowing themselves up on shield reflects in WvW, the ones that don't will normally AA you to death with rifle and mech after if it's open field, not to mention when you do get into melee you're still getting outtraded a majority of the time because a lot of warrior's weapon damage is over nerfed(aside from axe), and the biggest hard hitting skill they have requires 50% below health foe(arcing slice).

You also won't catch mechanist between rocket boots, and shadow step signet at least with some variants i've encountered, I guess people that have shadowstep gap closers and what not don't have this problem and if they do it's to a much lesser extent., it's either Ranged builds have way too much power/effectiveness currently(Way more noticeable if you don't have things to counter it) for safety of ranged, or warrior lacks the dangerous damage and tools in melee to make it threatening. 

Also right about hard counters: Ranged/kiting, Stability, blocks, blinds, weakness, protection, also just render you pretty useless a majority of the time.

 

 

yea if you do like Lan suggested you go shield mastery and even slots in earth runes

that means, you have to go hard in to counter build in order to have a chance to fight these hard counters, while those hard counters are naturally hard counters to warrior without the intention to hard counter one specific warrior build.

but once you go hard into counter build with warrior, you become hard countered by more other things, with no way of out playing simply through skills.

 

and it is frustrating, you seem to only be able to win a lot of thing by counter building, with no way of out play-ing even on paper skill trades.

 

it's like if you want to counter condi you will get deleted by power build, if you counter power build you get deleted by condi build, unlike other classes, which basically you can simply build sustain that works on both damage, like invuln, blocks, evades

or if you build to sustain condi and power, then you will lack stab and you get CC'ed all over the place, etc. while other classes will also avoid CCs

 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

8 minutes ago, felix.2386 said:

 

 

yea if you do like Lan suggested you go shield mastery and even slots in earth runes

that means, you have to go hard in to counter build in order to have a chance to fight these hard counters, while those hard counters are naturally hard counters to warrior without the intention to hard counter one specific warrior build.

but once you go hard into counter build with warrior, you become hard countered by more other things, with no way of out playing simply through skills.

 

and it is frustrating, you seem to only be able to win a lot of thing by counter building, with no way of out play-ing even on paper skill trades.

 

it's like if you want to counter condi you will get deleted by power build, if you counter power build you get deleted by condi build, unlike other classes, which basically you can simply build sustain that works on both damage, like invuln, blocks, evades

or if you build to sustain condi and power, then you will lack stab and you get CC'ed all over the place, etc. while other classes will also avoid CCs

 

They built warrior so that it's "counter" to everything was supposed to be to leverage it's higher effective health and re-sustain options (MMR+Heal Sig+AH) to stay in the fight long enough to out last other class's cooldowns. But then in Feb2020 they gutted all three of those key abilities. Then with EoD they reintroduced the ability to re-sustain with TR's ability to recharge ammo skills.

So for the OP, take reflects and lol at the mechanist (and any noob soulbeasts at the same time), or you go all in on TR + VS + Zealots stats and just heal back the damage you take.

[thaniretouni.4762]

I hadn't played guild wars for about 13 months and when I came back last week I tried my old builds in the few classes that I like a lot. Granted, warrior seems to be only a ghost of its old self after numerous nerfs and still has bad weapons like mace but in general in wvw it all comes down to knowledge and muscle memory. After some practice i managed to beat a lot of mechanics with my spellbreaker build. ofc i was destroyed by a couple of them who obviously were better than my rusty self. i dont have footage to share and i dont want to give my exact build either as people tend to be copycats who deliberately use exploit the strengths of certain classes against noobs who go to forums and demand for nerfs. this is what nerfed my sword pistol thief. Anyway, all i can say is u need to go full offense against them and dont leave them space to breath. That type of build only works in 1v1s though and maybe small gvg. In big fights or really organised gvg this build is heavily punished showing the weaknesses of warrior atm. If u really need the build i can share more but only in private message ingame

 

Edited September 10, 2022 by thaniretouni.4762

[Lucentfir.7430]

5 hours ago, felix.2386 said:

 

 

yea if you do like Lan suggested you go shield mastery and even slots in earth runes

that means, you have to go hard in to counter build in order to have a chance to fight these hard counters, while those hard counters are naturally hard counters to warrior without the intention to hard counter one specific warrior build.

but once you go hard into counter build with warrior, you become hard countered by more other things, with no way of out playing simply through skills.

 

and it is frustrating, you seem to only be able to win a lot of thing by counter building, with no way of out play-ing even on paper skill trades.

 

it's like if you want to counter condi you will get deleted by power build, if you counter power build you get deleted by condi build, unlike other classes, which basically you can simply build sustain that works on both damage, like invuln, blocks, evades

or if you build to sustain condi and power, then you will lack stab and you get CC'ed all over the place, etc. while other classes will also avoid CCs

 

The thing I've found too is unless you're playing core, you're going to have to drop discipline if you're going to want to take defense for things like Shield mastery, and restructure your whole build. Taking defense and disc you have no kill potential, since it feels like damage on a majority of weapons were nerfed with Strength line in mind and having big might stacks all the time, if you plan on running a roaming DPS warrior build strength is a permanent in-slot. Without it you're hitting for pool noodle damage. 

 

5 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

They built warrior so that it's "counter" to everything was supposed to be to leverage it's higher effective health and re-sustain options (MMR+Heal Sig+AH) to stay in the fight long enough to out last other class's cooldowns. But then in Feb2020 they gutted all three of those key abilities. Then with EoD they reintroduced the ability to re-sustain with TR's ability to recharge ammo skills.
 

Funny enough you can get old healing signet back somewhat if you slap a mango pie food on but at that point you're still too overnerfed on all the other fronts. Rn the only place where warrior will feel durable is in the large scale, because you'll have ample support from ye meta supports giving you all the boons, barrier and heals, and you have a damage inversion button(Defiant Stance) to actually do your thing and brawl frontline when you get into it.  There were just too many deathblows to warrior since 2020.  damage nerfs, CC damage gone, the resistance change screwed condition management and things affected weren't even compensated with resolution, 300s icd for traits that were designed for large scale skirmishing in mind.  

[felix.2386]

6 hours ago, Lucentfir.7430 said:

Rn the only place where warrior will feel durable is in the large scale, because you'll have ample support from ye meta supports giving you all the boons, barrier and heals, and you have a damage inversion button(Defiant Stance) to actually do your thing and brawl frontline when you get into it.  

yea, because large scale basically everyone getting the same heal boons and mobility means nothing because everybody stack together and walk, and evade does matter little as there's so many skills hitting.

so health and toughness gives an edge. when everthing is shared lol

that's all.

Edited September 9, 2022 by felix.2386

[Verdict is Vengence.6912]

On 9/6/2022 at 6:33 AM, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Just stun them several times

Pretty much key to kill as warrior. All you have to do is know the timing of each CC and apply each appropriately and on time. Warrior has the nastiest stun locks.

Just make sure to dodge or break out engi's long knockdown as soon as it happens.

Personally, I don't like stun locking because it's unfulfilling for me. I just killed a mechanist in wvw with a diviner/commanders spellbreaker . I made a quickness focus build with greatsword/axe and shield, relying on the quickness and boons from spellbreaker to help me.

[AlphaReborn.1567]

On 9/9/2022 at 1:45 AM, Verdict is Vengence.6912 said:

Pretty much key to kill as warrior. All you have to do is know the timing of each CC and apply each appropriately and on time. Warrior has the nastiest stun locks.

Just make sure to dodge or break out engi's long knockdown as soon as it happens.

Personally, I don't like stun locking because it's unfulfilling for me. I just killed a mechanist in wvw with a diviner/commanders spellbreaker . I made a quickness focus build with greatsword/axe and shield, relying on the quickness and boons from spellbreaker to help me.

Sounds interesting, care to share that build?

[Verdict is Vengence.6912]

@AlphaReborn.1567 Sorry dude. I've since deleted it. But it was something like Discipline, traits: middle, bottom, bottom. Tactics, traits: middle, top and top. Spellbreaker, traits: middle, top, middle.

Weapons: GS, Axe/Shield

Utility: Mending, bulls charge, shake it off and balanced stance.

Armor: Diviners with durability runes, trinkets and back: Commanders

 

I think that was it but not too sure. The runes and traits I'm iffy on. 

 

[eXruina.4956]

bladesworn is strong in pvp, where people are forced to fight you directly for objectives, the terrain is also much to your advantage where you can los frequently.

 

wvw roaming is a completely different game mode, people don't have to fight you directly, they can kite, disengage and reset on you indefinitely, either burst you down from range or do you in slow. the terrain is also a wide open area and there are actually few instances where you can los.

 

thats not counting other disadvantages in wvw roaming.

 

my advice for wvw for any warrior having trouble with their roaming and iso is to play to your strengths and pick your fights. 

Edited September 12, 2022 by eXruina.4956

[Kuma.1503]

Note: These are just my experiences, I am by no means "pro" at this game, so take this with a grain of salt.

 

As an engi main who plays a good amount of every elite spec (including core), Engi  gives warrior a hard time in WvW.  

In PvP, we're forced to stand on node vs warrior and they can overwhelm our CDs, stunlock us, and eventually kill us or force us to kite off node. In WvW, you can more or less permakite warrior for a variety of reasons. 

Engi gets naturally high vigor uptime from various sourses. And in WvW we have access to boon duration so we can maintain it with greater ease than in PvP. This makes it a lot easier to deal with the warrior cycling through CC skills to eventually land that one stunlock that gets them the kill. 

We don't have to fight in a confined area, so we are free to kite the warrior to our heart's content. We can throw nades and mortars behind us to keep the warrior pressured as they chase and we have several sources of blind in the event that they close the gap. 

Both scrapper and Holo have superspeed to maintain distance and good melee pressure to fight back or secure the kill when needed. 

I most commonly die to warriors when I and eat a CC I should have dodged and get sent on the stunlock train to hell, or greed for a kill when they get low only to eat a burst skill for half my HP when I should have respected their CDs. Or get baited into chasing down a warrior, burn my mobility skills only to get turned on ran down when my CDs are gone. 

I can see this being very frustrating from the warrior's perspective tbh. 

 

 

Edited September 14, 2022 by Kuma.1503

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

6 minutes ago, Kuma.1503 said:

As an engi main who plays a good amount of every elite spec (including core), Engi naturally gives warrior a hard time in WvW. 

In PvP, we're forced to stand on node vs warrior and they can overwhelm our CDs, stunlock us, and eventually kill us or force us to kite off node. In WvW, you can more or less permakite warrior for a variety of reasons. 

Engi gets naturally high vigor uptime from various sourses. And in WvW we have access to boon duration so we can maintain it with greater ease than in PvP. This makes it a lot easier to deal with the warrior cycling through CC skills to eventually land that one stunlock that gets them the kill. 

We don't have to fight in a confined area, so we are free to kite the warrior to our heart's content. We can throw nades and mortars behind us to keep the warrior pressured as they chase and we have several sources of blind in the event that they close the gap. 

Both scrapper and Holo have superspeed to maintain distance and good melee pressure to fight back or secure the kill when needed. 

I most commonly die to warriors when I and eat a CC I should have dodged and get sent on the stunlock train to hell, or greed for a kill when they get low only to eat a burst skill for half my HP when I should have respected their CDs. Or get baited into chasing down a warrior, burn my mobility skills only to get turned on ran down when my CDs are gone. 

I can see this being very frustrating from the warrior's perspective tbh. 

 

 

I can attest to all that from the warrior end and point at that it's the same issue with any class that has decent mobility/superspeed access/teleports.

Warrior doesn't really have the range game to pressure kiting opponents. Artillery Slash gives some pressure, but Breakstep doesn't offer enough mobility in one use make use of the pressure.