Problems with the New Berserker??

[CalmTheStorm.2364]

I posted this in the main feedback thread but I wanted to put it here as well to get your guys' input:

 

 Thoughts/concerns on Berserker:

 

Berserk Mode as a Rage Skill:

Berserk mode is now a rage skill and not a burst, but still appears (based on the live stream) to require 30 adrenaline to activate. It then consumes/replaces that adrenaline with the primal burst bar and grants 10 adrenaline initially so you can activate a primal burst.

 

It is unclear if you "get credit" for the  30 adrenaline it took to activate Berserk Mode for the purposes of Berserker's Power and Adrenal Healing.  It's a pretty big flaw if Berserker needs to produce 30 adrenaline and not get any benefit from its burst-related traits just to enter Berserk mode.

 

Similarly, since Berserk Mode is no longer a burst skill, it presumably does not benefit from the CD reduction of burst skills from the Discipline traitline.  This is less of a problem since Berserker now has access to core burst skills when not in Berserk Mode, but still...it doesn't feel good to be locked out of your main mechanic for that long with no way to reduce it.

 

A few thoughts:

1) Berserk mode should  "count as a burst skill" (even if it actually doesn't attack/dmg anything) for the purposes of proccing Adrenal Healing/Berserker's Power.  It could also gain the benefit of CD reduction by taking Discipline (this is probably a significant consideration on the PvE side of things).

 

2) Alternatively, just make Berserk Mode a Rage skill that does not depend on adrenaline (no other Rage skill requires adrenaline to activate, so why should this one?).  This means that Berserk mode just has a CD like any other skill.  I'd still suggest reducing the CD to 10-12s (rather than 15s); this brings it more in line with things like Soulbeast's Beast Mode or Necro Shroud in terms of CD.

 

This allows you to use your burst skills as you want (and proccing the related AH/BP traits) without worrying about needing to save adrenaline for Berserk Mode.

 

Blood Reckoning/Dead or Alive Interaction:

This isn't a problem per se, but I could foresee a bugged interaction between these two things and wanted to bring it up for testing.

 

Blood Reckoning now provides 30 adrenaline on use (awesome change, btw).  What happens if I use BR to gain 30 adrenaline and immediately enter Berserk Mode with the Dead or Alive trait selected? I should have 5s of BR from my skill use; will the additional 2 seconds from DoA be added to the duration of my heal skill for a total of 7s?  Will DoA override my heal skill, meaning I only get 2s?  Will my heal skill cancel out DoA so it doesn't actually activate?  Will the Universe explode?🤯

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

What they are doing is reverting the 2018 tradeoff rework on Berserk Mode. It will not count as a T3 burst, but will be instant cast. If you want all stacks of BP before going into berserk you'll need to precast your F1, use another adrenaline gaining skill, and then go into berserk. OR, you can leverage the fact that you gain half of BP upfront when you use the Primal Bursts the first time as it will be on use rather than on hit after the 4th. Just do your first primal then BR or Headbutt into the next primal.

I think making Berserk Mode not require adrenaline is the most logical choice tbh, as well as the 10s CD.

As to your last point DorA will cast the Lesser version of BR, so it depends on how they coded up the Lesser BR. I do not know how their durations will stack. It could be that they overlap and you have two sources of healing at the same time, it could also be that they do not overlap and that doing that so close together causes a loss of functionality.

@Cal Cohen.2358, CalmTheStorm brought up a good point about Blood Reckoning and Lesser Blood Reckoning. How will these two interact? 

@Double Tap, pinging you just to make sure Cal gets the question above. Also, would Lesser Blood Reckoning count as using a heal skill?

Edited September 20, 2022 by Lan Deathrider.5910

[CalmTheStorm.2364]

19 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

 

I think making Berserk Mode not require adrenaline is the most logical choice tbh, as well as the 10s CD.

I agree. Just double down on it being a rage skill--with no adrenaline requirement. It would be so much cleaner and would eliminate many problems with adrenaline management.

 

The 15s CD wouldn't even be that big of a deal then, esp since it would (presumably) be available immediately on entering a fight. 

[anbujackson.9564]

The stuff I am curious about: 

- Not having a T3 proc from entering berserk mode will decrease your (burst) dps. It's small but it weakens an already underperforming build. Especially since burst damage will effect your final dps greatly. 

- Still no manual exit. At least we get core bursts back.

- From a PvE POV: Since headbutt no longer stuns you when you have stability, this might become a small problem for your rotation because you rely on that stunbreak with outrage. Again, core bursts adress this issue a bit.

 

I think its funny that spellbreaker now performs better than power berserker. Almost as amusing as core engi being the best power option when mech gets nerfed.

[eXruina.4956]

Or.. hear this out, remove Adrenaline decay and allow us to regenarate Adrenaline as a resource, ah? ah? 😉😁

 

This allows us to go into combat with our full arsenal, much like Necro with their Life Force or Thief with their Initiative.

 

Its one of those things that are outdated in Warrior, in this modern, fast paced iteration of GW2, it needs to be done.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

2 hours ago, anbujackson.9564 said:

The stuff I am curious about: 

- Not having a T3 proc from entering berserk mode will decrease your (burst) dps. It's small but it weakens an already underperforming build. Especially since burst damage will effect your final dps greatly. 

- Still no manual exit. At least we get core bursts back.

- From a PvE POV: Since headbutt no longer stuns you when you have stability, this might become a small problem for your rotation because you rely on that stunbreak with outrage. Again, core bursts adress this issue a bit.

 

I think its funny that spellbreaker now performs better than power berserker. Almost as amusing as core engi being the best power option when mech gets nerfed.

If PvE power Berserker does indeed fall behind Spellbreaker then I think they would address that. Berserker was a mechanical mess in Competitive play and they needed to address that. I'm sure they'll be keeping tabs on how that changes things in PvE.

[Axl.8924]

I got a question to all of you then: Is this still a decent buff? do you guys think this will be enought o give a role to zerker?

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

17 minutes ago, Axl.8924 said:

I got a question to all of you then: Is this still a decent buff? do you guys think this will be enought o give a role to zerker?

Paired with the new Defense and Aggressive Onslaught, yes. The Resistance added onto Bloody Roar alone will help Berserker greatly. Too many people are looking at each of the changes on their own without looking at how the whole of the changes are going to boost Berserker and to a lesser extent Core and the other Especs.

[felix.2386]

1 hour ago, Axl.8924 said:

I got a question to all of you then: Is this still a decent buff? do you guys think this will be enought o give a role to zerker?

possibly with bladesworn deleted, but it will just be another side noder like all other warrior specs.

and will compete with power spellbreaker

[Kayberz.5346]

Power spellbreaker overtaking power berserker shouldn't be considered a problem that needs addressing 

Berserker is warriors definitive condition focused spec, power berserker SHOULD be less effective than the condi variant considering warrior has 2 purely power focused elite specs to work with already

[Axl.8924]

1 hour ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Paired with the new Defense and Aggressive Onslaught, yes. The Resistance added onto Bloody Roar alone will help Berserker greatly. Too many people are looking at each of the changes on their own without looking at how the whole of the changes are going to boost Berserker and to a lesser extent Core and the other Especs.

Is felix right will it be a sidenoder? and what about in pve  i'm guessing just power DPS role? whats all that about its rage thing regeneration and undoing nerfs?

 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

Just now, Axl.8924 said:

Is felix right will it be a sidenoder? and what about in pve  i'm guessing just power DPS role? whats all that about its rage thing regeneration and undoing nerfs?

 

We'll see how it all plays out in practice. There are some open questions on trait interactions that are unanswered that could influence that answer. It could very well be sidenoder, but we'll see.

All the changes from a PvE perspective seemed more power or utility focused.

In 2018 they took away core bursts when outside of Berserk Mode, changed the traitline drastically, and put the -300 toughness in as a tradeoff. They also changed the rage skills to extend the duration of rage rather than give adrenaline. It was fine and workable then because of how powerful they made some of the revamped primal bursts, but they did this also during a No Downstate weekend in WvW which resulted in Berserkers (myself included) wholesale deleting people on mass with Arc Divider -> BR -> Arc Divider. So nerfs came quickly, and then even harder in Feb2020.

What they've done is roll back the loss of core bursts outside of Berserk Mode, changed Berserk back into an instant cast skill, took away the toughness penalty, and then changed a few traits to give it survivability. What this means is that when out of Berserk Mode you are no longer 2/3rds of a warrior, but Berserk Mode will no longer count as a Burst for traits. You'll also be less glassy. The PvE opener will have to change to incorporate a T3 burst before going into Berserk Mode, as well as a second max adrenaline gain skill. They may also have to swap out outrage for a different berserk extending skill.

[eXruina.4956]

3 hours ago, Axl.8924 said:

I got a question to all of you then: Is this still a decent buff? do you guys think this will be enought o give a role to zerker?

This is a decent buff for competitive.

 

As for PvE. i think it will benefit from having normal bursts available and having added Adrenaline gain from Rage skills.

 

Berserker in PvE is a filler. it will never be first option, since its not the best at its roles (Quick DPS/DPS), but you will at the very least find a spot to fill in most groups, so its not dead 🤔🤣 

 

Also its not the best at anything, but it is very beginner friendly, very simple to play and has great aesthetic. I think among all warrior specs Berserker may well be the most popular to new players. 😁🔥

[Myror.7521]

Over all in pvp/wvw its just a straigth up buff. In PvE it is a slight nerf to Power Berserker but might be a buff to its condi Version cause of how its core bursts work. How ever i love Berserker in both PvE and PvP. I will finaly be able to play this build again without hard feed 😆