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[Bug] Mantras not working correctly after Feb 14 2023 update

Cpt Crunch.7058

By Cpt Crunch.7058
in Mesmer

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Cpt Crunch.7058

Cpt Crunch.7058

Posted
Posted (edited)

- Quickness is not affecting the cast times of any of the mantras Edit: Working

- Mantra of Pain before the rework would grant 12 stacks of Might on initial cast, not 8 stacks (I thought this was a revert to the 2021 changes, not all the way back to 2017 -.- )

- Mantra of Pain cannot be used without a target so that the Might cannot be refreshed like it used to

- Mantra of Distraction is not reducing the cooldown of Distortion after the initial cast regardless of specialization or core mesmer  Edit: Misread tooltip, thank you for the correction!

 

 

I feel there are more but kitten this is sloppy. Only took 10 min of "quality control" to find these issues

Edited by Cpt Crunch.7058
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Jijimuge.4675

Jijimuge.4675

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26 minutes ago, Cpt Crunch.7058 said:

- Quickness is not affecting the cast times of any of the mantras

- Mantra of Pain before the rework would grant 12 stacks of Might on initial cast, not 8 stacks (I thought this was a revert to the 2021 changes, not all the way back to 2017 -.- )

- Mantra of Pain cannot be used without a target so that the Might cannot be refreshed like it used to

- Mantra of Distraction is not reducing the cooldown of Distortion after the initial cast regardless of specialization or core mesmer

 

I feel there are more but kitten this is sloppy. Only took 10 min of "quality control" to find these issues

I've just tried with quickness and without on Mantra of Resolve (in the golem test area) as an example, and quickness does seem to affect the charge time of the main charge skill

Just to be clear re Mantra of Pain;  Mantra of Pain, the charge skill, can be charged without a target (it's not a damage skill after all), but "Mind Spike" the instant cast can't be cast without a target.  And yes, I agree that this lowers the possibility to cycle the casts to refresh the might.

Re the 12 stacks rather than 8...yes, they seem not to have liked the change made 12 Dec 17 to increase the stacks from 8 to 12 and so seem to have ignored it.  That's not a bug per se, but people may well disagree with having only 8 stacks of might.

Re Mantra of distraction, I've tried this and it does lower the CD of "Diversion" (F3).  It doesn't reduce the CD of "Distortion" (the F4) as it was never meant to.

 

Edited by Jijimuge.4675
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Jijimuge.4675

Jijimuge.4675

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1 minute ago, Cpt Crunch.7058 said:

lmaoooo whoops 😄

 

So I guess it is working as intended. Still... had to go back in and check to make sure. Everything else still stands though

Sorry, I realised I had more to type, so was editing my post.  Have added some other stuff re your other points.  It's good that you're looking

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Gaiawolf.8261

Gaiawolf.8261

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Yeah that cast time has got to go, especially since it comes after a lengthy CD. It feels like double punishment for using that last charge. (One is probably fine since all classes have to deal with CD, but long CD and extra long cast?). I'm willing to give it some practice before rendering final judgment, but I think I can already tell mantras are not going to be fun to play with again.
And my other main class is FB! Punished twice for my class choices, or is it 4 times, since each feels like double? 😅

 

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godfat.2604

godfat.2604

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Tooltip for Mantra of Concentration / Power Break in WvW is wrong, and it's a joke that preparation stability (4 stacks, Mantra of Concentration) is less than spending a charge (5 stacks, Power Break. Tooltip shows 3 but it's 5).

I think they forgot they buffed Power Break in WvW, and didn't buff Mantra of Concentration accordingly, and somehow the tooltip is also wrong.

To be clear, I am expecting them to:

* Fix tooltip
* Buff Mantra of Concentration so it's at least the same as Power Break in WvW

I do not expect them to nerf Power Break based on the incorrect tooltip. I think the tooltip is incorrect because it's exactly 5 stacks before this patch.

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apharma.3741

apharma.3741

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7 hours ago, godfat.2604 said:

To be clear, I am expecting them to:

* Fix tooltip
* Buff Mantra of Concentration so it's at least the same as Power Break in WvW

I do not expect them to nerf Power Break based on the incorrect tooltip. I think the tooltip is incorrect because it's exactly 5 stacks before this patch.

Oh sweet summer child...

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Enzi.5496

Enzi.5496

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I have another issue in that Mantra of Pain has been reverted to its old state. No ammo stacking any more. It needs to be casted, you have 2 charges and then you have to charge again.

Ok, it's in the patch notes. Wasn't expecting such a drastic change back to their old model. Guess they are useless again. The charge is way too long and interrupts everything.

Edited by Enzi.5496
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godfat.2604

godfat.2604

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45 minutes ago, Mungo Zen.9364 said:

I am surprised but yeah, Restorative Mantra nerf has been reverted as well.  Shows as Healing 1640 in game same as old tooltip on Wiki.

For context, I am thinking in PvE and WvW below.

I am not happy with this revert. I am talking about now that Restorative Mantra is back to be triggered after preparation, rather than on spending charges. I think their logic is, One preparation has 2 charges, if they remove preparation, and trigger this on spending charges, it should have 50% effectiveness so 2 charges will be the same as triggering once after preparation. In short, it's 100% effectiveness when it's after preparation, and (100% / N) effectiveness where N is the number of charges when it's on spending charges.

If we only talk about the total output, it's the same, however we lost flexibility now. I never liked the old Restorative Mantra because 2.25+ seconds delay for healing the allies (for self it's relatively ok) is just way too slow. For healing, I think we either need to have quick burst healing, or good sustain pulsing healing.

When Restorative Mantra was on spending charges, we can easily burst healing for quite a lot if we have quite some charges on hands. Now it's just impossible to burst any healing. Even if we constantly prepare Mantra of Pain, it takes 2.25 + 1 + 1 => 4.25 seconds for each cycle, and we likely can't do much else due to channeling. Plus, we now need a target to get rid of charges for Mantra of Pain! (Power Spike). It's like the nightmare that clones are fully relying on targets coming to Mantra now, except this time it's that we cannot get rid of them without a target. How do I suppose to prepare Mantra of Pain at the start of the battle if I can't get rid of it before the start of battle? I suppose I have to change the skill to get rid of it...

My proposal:

* Make Restorative Mantra triggers on spending charges, just like a patch before this. I welcome that we also trigger this after preparation, then it would be 3 times for each cycle.
* Nerf the coefficient accordingly would be fine, like, 50%, just like a patch before this.

To be fully clear, this proposal is a package, if Anet want to take the nerf, they also need to take the first buff.

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Gesbo.6420

Gesbo.6420

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9 hours ago, godfat.2604 said:

My proposal:

* Make Restorative Mantra triggers on spending charges, just like a patch before this. I welcome that we also trigger this after preparation, then it would be 3 times for each cycle.
* Nerf the coefficient accordingly would be fine, like, 50%, just like a patch before this.

To be fully clear, this proposal is a package, if Anet want to take the nerf, they also need to take the first buff.

Absolutely agree with you. When I was reading the patch notes I thought that this would be the way the restoritive mantras would work. Given that the tooltip reads "Heals allies around you when you cast a Mantra."

Tooltip, that was specifically updated in one of the patches after the changes. I would also suggest giving Giving restorative mantras an aditional charge in that case but that might be pushing it, even though historically mantras used to have 5 charges... but I digress.

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godfat.2604

godfat.2604

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18 minutes ago, Gesbo.6420 said:

When I was reading the patch notes I thought that this would be the way the restoritive mantras would work. Given that the tooltip reads "Heals allies around you when you cast a Mantra."

They likely forgot to also revert the tooltip: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Restorative_Mantras/history
It was "Heals allies around you when you finish preparing a Mantra." Or maybe they totally forgot that there's a difference and just blindly reverted to the previous code. I don't know, this kind of obvious errors should be easily spotted if one ever tries to use and see if it's working...

However I hope they don't just fix the tooltip, because it's really not very useful if it's after preparation.

19 minutes ago, Gesbo.6420 said:

I would also suggest giving Giving restorative mantras an aditional charge in that case but that might be pushing it, even though historically mantras used to have 5 charges... but I digress.

I would love to have 3 charges, if they can be generous. We can either add it to Restorative Mantra, or remove another useless traits which we have a lot, and add Harmonious Mantras back: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Harmonious_Mantras

I think that's what you're referring to? I don't think we ever had 5 charges, but this did give a damage buff which can stack up to 5 times. Honestly this won't be my priority (not something we're really missing or need right now), but I do welcome it.

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dead.7638

dead.7638

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Having to cast mantra in combat likely gets you killed.   This is not a buff!   It’s a stealth nerf as always .   I’d rather have no initial cast time than the buff it grants on cast.   Likely going to not use mantra cause they are crap now.   Not happy about this as they are essential for various builds.

Edited by dead.7638
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Gesbo.6420

Gesbo.6420

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18 minutes ago, dead.7638 said:

Having to cast mantra in combat likely gets you killed.   This is not a buff!   It’s a stealth nerf as always .   I’d rather have no initial cast time than the buff it grants on cast.   Likely going to not use mantra cause they are crap now.   Not happy about this as they are essential for various builds.

you have quite a lot of access to quickness through various traits so its not that bad. ive been seeing quite a lot of success with using Phantasmal Haste into Bladesong Dissonance into Mantra of Distraction.

 

This way I get the quickness to throw the interrupt, protect myself while charging Power Lock with agies and be able to do the same combo again not long after. I think it will take time to get used to it but I feel your pain.

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