FINALLY THE GAME IS BALANCE

[Deadmoose.6594]

13 hours ago, magickthief.6492 said:

The more confused reactions I get makes me feel happy about how many noobs are coming to the forums, because if we have that many noobs coming to pvp forums

I lolled so hard...so hard that I have to commend you and call you a real good dawg bro

[Flowki.7194]

In a way the OP is right,  if everybody from all sides of the war are dead, then ironically there is peace. In the same way, if every complicated spec is nerfed into the ground, then you can also reach balance, 5 button burst and 5 button bunker. And thats great, if you enjoy one of those specs.

Edited September 27, 2023 by Flowki.7194

[Balsa.3951]

13 hours ago, Sahne.6950 said:

Anet: *changes absolutely nothing in pvp*

Some guy in the forums: * FINALLY THE GAME IS BALANCED *

some guy in the forum makes obvious sarcasm post

some guy comes and don't gets it

[Balsa.3951]

4 hours ago, Axl.8924 said:

Perfect balance is a oxymoron nature is balanced without humans if only because it has built in systems that keep it that way 

Wolves eat deer to prevent deer from overpopulating and there are other systems we probably don't understand to keep wolves

Ranger keep necros under check thieves keep mesmers under check etc etc.A balanced system is where counters exist to prevent one from class/build taking over.

nature is not and ever was balanced. species extinction happen long before humans existed. also humans are natural as well.

unrelated but getting tired ppl think humans are some outer world event.

in about 250 million years a super continent will form and destroy alll life on the surface thats nature as well

its steady unbalance that drives evolution.

and in game in creates content for pvp

Edited September 27, 2023 by Balsa.3951

[Deadmoose.6594]

1 hour ago, Balsa.3951 said:

nature is not and ever was balanced. species extinction happen long before humans existed. also humans are natural as well.

unrelated but getting tired ppl think humans are some outer world event.

in about 250 million years a super continent will form and destroy alll life on the surface thats nature as well

its steady unbalance that drives evolution.

and in game in creates content for pvp

Sure but usually things shift very slowly so things have time to adapt. Except for sudden mass extinction events, which are actually super rare. You're not really taking into account how in balance the ecosystems all over the world actually are. There's a certain randomness and chaos to nature, but definitely a balance as well.

[JusticeRetroHunter.7684]

4 hours ago, Balsa.3951 said:

nature is not and ever was balanced. species extinction happen long before humans existed. also humans are natural as well.

unrelated but getting tired ppl think humans are some outer world event.

in about 250 million years a super continent will form and destroy alll life on the surface thats nature as well

its steady unbalance that drives evolution.

and in game in creates content for pvp

So, I studied this particular topic (Biology, Complex Systems, and fundemental physics) for 4 years (10 years total) and i just wanna shed a little light on it...cause here's the thing...

Both you and the person you replied to (Axl) are correct on what you guys said.

Nature is balanced. But it's balanced by a vastly more elegant mechanism that humans have not yet fully understood. It took me a very long time to first identify that mechanism to begin with, and then another very long period of time to truly grasp just how elegant that mechanism was.

Typically, how most people understand "human" balance, is to make two things that are not equal, to be equal. We understand this kind of logic, from looking at a balance scale...or balancing an equation. But you can ask qualitative questions about this way of looking at it that leads to surprising conclusions about what these operations (making things equal) actually does. For instance, if everything was equal, then how come we live in a world of tremendous diversity?...other side of the coin...if everything was not equal, then how can anything be balanced at all? How is it that nature is able to achieve both of these properties : tremendous diversity, and that this diversity exists in such a way where it is balanced so neatly. 

It turns out that "making things equal" is not the right way to look at the problem, and the probe is much...much deeper. in probing this topic, you find that, what nature does...how it achieves this ability to be both diverse and balanced, is that it is instantiating the existence of all possible things. With regards to evolution...evolution is the process we observe, in the instantiation of all possible life forms. Deeper then that, the fundamental physics of the world, is the instantiation of all forms (geometries). Some of those forms, happen to be life forms, but life is just a form, among many...like rocks, clouds, asteroids, stars and so on.

You understand that this is a true fact of the world even intuitively; you have the elementary particles...which are then permuted with each other to yield the table of elements, which are again permuted with each other to give you the very long list of possible molecules...molecules are then permuted to form all possible permutations of cells (or other forms like crystals or gases)...and cells permute themselves into larger macro organisms and so on...

The reason balance comes about through this mechanism of instantiation, is that in the space of all possible forms...there will be other forms (counters if you will) that will exist to oppose it. In fact, in the space of all possible forms, these forms don't necessarily need to "counter" each other all of the time...they simple exist in complex relationships. some relationships are mutual, some are exclusive, some are counter, some are dualistic and so on.

It goes like this:

If you have 1 build that is incredibly strong...in the space of 100 possible builds, you are likely to find only maybe 1 build that will exist to counter this incredibly strong build.

If you have 1 build that is incredibly strong, in the space of 10,000,000 (10 million) possible builds...you are likely find 100,000 builds out in the space of possible builds that can exist to counter it.

So as the number of "things that exists" grows, outliers will tend towards a higher likelihood, of have something out there that will exist to equalize it...and this simple fact of "lots of things existing" is a balancing mechanism...so, this makes "removals" counter to the balancing mechanism that nature's goal is oriented toward. You can ask the question that if removals was it's purpose, then nothing should exist at all... so existence itself is the proof of nature's true intention. Mathematically, you also find this to be the case, and that shouldn't surprise you under the logic.

You can make similiar statements about "equalization" as well...which is that if natures goal was to equalize or homogenize everything, then why do we exist in a world of massive diversity, and not just a uniform ocean of nothingness. This is a more complex thing to talk about, but it's for a similiar reason : equalization/homogenization is not nature's true goal. Skipping details: homogenization and diversity are one in the same construct (they are deeply unified), under this mechanism of instantiating all possible things.

TLDR: So anyway I came here to say, that both of you guys are correct, and providing the right lens as to why. Nature is "unbalanced" in the way we humans typically understood balance (equalization) but equalization is not the only balancing mechanism to exist, and not the balancing mechanism of nature. Nature uses a way more elegant mechanism, (the instantiation of all possible forms)...and unfortunately there exists no proper language to address this balancing mechanism. If you want to learn more about this on your own, study Complex Systems, and watching this book series: New Kind of Science, by Stephan Wolfram, who is largely responsible for unifying complex systems. In that book he goes over the nature of homogeneity, heterogeneity, complexity, natural and computational systems...all that good stuff, and then goes through how they are deeply related to each other. You will find the end of the book very surprising as did I if you are actually interested in this kind of thing.

Edited September 28, 2023 by JusticeRetroHunter.7684

[Burnfall.9573]

Guild Wars 2 11 Years+ Balance Track Recycle Record "Yesterday Trash Is Today Trash. Today Trash Is Tomorrow Trash. Tomorrow Trash Is Yesterday Trash"

Different Patch, Same Old Kitten

 

But I almost forgot; a new Trash was added to a Toxic Broken Profession

"Blood Reaction: Increased the power to condition damage conversion from 10% to 15% in PvE only."

Oh yeah! I am still 1 shotting on my Ranger Profession lol 

Why continue with patches when you intentionally leave the same old trash behind to continue rot the game play experience?

This patch did Obsoletely Nothing! to remove the trash that was already there

Why continue to waste resources and waste The Community Time of releasing patches by yet again; continuing playing Favorites and Bias towards, and against same Professions whom you kept on the pedestal and Scapegoating?

Ranger Profession takes the blame while Toxic Trash Design-Thief Profession still 1 shotting with having the same Toxic Trash Perma Stealth, Elementalsit Profession, Guardian Profession-Flying Monkey-Willbender; another Toxic Trash Design Profession are, Immune Gods to Everything while 2 shotting....

My server lost 3 Guilds with 219 active players with 8 active Commanders

 

What A Complete Waste of Time and Resource, Everything

The State of the Game is Depriving and Disgraceful!! 

Please! Remove PvP and WvW

Edited September 28, 2023 by Burnfall.9573

[magickthief.6492]

4 hours ago, Deadmoose.6594 said:

Sure but usually things shift very slowly so things have time to adapt. Except for sudden mass extinction events, which are actually super rare. You're not really taking into account how in balance the ecosystems all over the world actually are. There's a certain randomness and chaos to nature, but definitely a balance as well.

evolution is fake news

[magickthief.6492]

1 hour ago, Burnfall.9573 said:

Guild Wars 2 11 Years+ Balance Track Recycle Record "Yesterday Trash Is Today Trash. Today Trash Is Tomorrow Trash. Tomorrow Trash Is Yesterday Trash"

Different Patch, Same Old Kitten

 

But I almost forgot; a new Trash was added to a Toxic Broken Profession

"Blood Reaction: Increased the power to condition damage conversion from 10% to 15% in PvE only."

Oh yeah! I am still 1 shotting on my Ranger Profession lol 

Why continue with patches when you intentionally leave the same old trash behind to continue rot the game play experience?

This patch did Obsoletely Nothing! to remove the trash that was already there

Why continue to waste resources and waste The Community Time of releasing patches by yet again; continuing playing Favorites and Bias towards, and against same Professions whom you kept on the pedestal and Scapegoating?

Ranger Profession takes the blame while Toxic Trash Design-Thief Profession still 1 shotting with having the same Toxic Trash Perma Stealth, Elementalsit Profession, Guardian Profession-Flying Monkey-Willbender; another Toxic Trash Design Profession are, Immune Gods to Everything while 2 shotting....

My server lost 3 Guilds with 219 active players with 8 active Commanders

 

What A Complete Waste of Time and Resource, Everything

The State of the Game is Depriving and Disgraceful!! 

Please! Remove PvP and WvW

You want ranger removed?

[Burnfall.9573]

11 minutes ago, magickthief.6492 said:

You want ranger removed?

No no. Ranger Profession is not a Bad Design Profession. Anet has a 11 years+ Bad Reputation of using non-Bad Design Profession as Scapegoat for Toxic Balancing and Ranger Profession already has a history of being used a Scapegoat by Anet.

Ranger Profession still being able to 1 shot even after another failed Balance, is more than laughable than wanting it to be removed. 

I always advocate Ranger Profession to be the only long range Profession(as its Identity and Role),  to attack with exceeding high damage. 

 

[Myror.7521]

@Burnfall.9573 the best part on this is. The class oneshots in melee range not just Long distance. It also got super effective melee Defence utility and weapon skills. Its just litterly a warr 2.0 with longbow and a pet for ranged pressure right now xD

[Burnfall.9573]

1 minute ago, Myror.7521 said:

@Burnfall.9573 the best part on this is. The class oneshots in melee range not just Long distance. It also got super effective melee Defence utility and weapon skills. Its just litterly a warr 2.0 with longbow and a pet for ranged pressure right now xD

After the patch, I am noticing Guardian Profession traps once again, are 1 shotting. Have you experience the same after the patch?

[magickthief.6492]

1 minute ago, Burnfall.9573 said:

After the patch, I am noticing Guardian Profession traps once again, are 1 shotting. Have you experience the same after the patch?

if they remove all stealth and smoke fields from ranger and its pets, it will be balanced. nothing else is required

[Burnfall.9573]

4 minutes ago, magickthief.6492 said:

if they remove all stealth and smoke fields from ranger and its pets, it will be balanced. nothing else is required

I am 100% against 1 shot because it is not healthy in a tab target MMO game like this game. As for Stealth Mechanic; I advocate for it to be completely removed from all Professions and to either have a new rework of it to be exclusively available to Thief Profession or removed it entirely from all Professions.

 

 

Edited September 28, 2023 by Burnfall.9573

[deathdealer.2197]

Am I the only one who thinks thief isnt half as bad as people make it out to be?

[Burnfall.9573]

16 minutes ago, deathdealer.2197 said:

Am I the only one who thinks thief isnt half as bad as people make it out to be?

 

[magickthief.6492]

30 minutes ago, Burnfall.9573 said:

I am 100% against 1 shot because it is not healthy in a tab target MMO game like this game. As for Stealth Mechanic; I advocate for it to be completely removed from all Professions and to either have a new rework of it to be exclusively available to Thief Profession or removed it entirely from all Professions.

 

 

i want it removed from other professions, but have the unique mech for thief. i made a forum suggestion.

[Sahne.6950]

9 hours ago, Balsa.3951 said:

some guy in the forum makes obvious sarcasm post

some guy comes and don't gets it

this guy was NOT sarcastic......   

[Sahne.6950]

11 hours ago, Myror.7521 said:

Why is this build still beaten by:

1. Ranged pressure Builds

2. Just another warrior build called Bladesworn.

it simply is not beaten by this, atleast not when you are perfoming on the same skillevel.

 

mind hopping ingame and show me how you want to kill my Condizerker?   i am curious.

I can only speak about myself, so take this with a grain of salt....  but the only thing thats realistically able to get me on this build, is a shatterchrono that gets the jump on me, while i am lacking defensive cooldowns....   or a 2v1.

Edited September 28, 2023 by Sahne.6950

[Sahne.6950]

13 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Just remove a stack of confusion from Skullgrinder and swap in a stack of bleeding.

That might appear as a good idea at first....

but then you realize that Condizerker is essentially the only build running akeem relic currently.

That change would prevent akeem relic from proccing on a condizerker build entirely, thus completly removing akeem relic from pvp.  resulting in yet again more dead content.  

The idea of the relic is GREAT! and i think me need more relics like this, rather than yet another flavor of +10% damagebuff.    But the sheer ammount of conditions applied needs to be looked at, or it needs a ICD.

 just my 2ct tho.

Edited September 28, 2023 by Sahne.6950

[Myror.7521]

@Sahne.6950nah condi Berserker is just hard countered by bsw simply cause the build relies on hit 2 burst skills while Bladesworn is just Aegis Spam. When it comes to ranged builds this might not be that true but well thats only cause of how the gamemode funktions. In Open field IT would more be like ranged build < Condi Zerker but on conquest its more like Condi Zerker < ranged Build since you want to Cap the Point fast ^^

[Sahne.6950]

1 hour ago, Myror.7521 said:

@Sahne.6950nah condi Berserker is just hard countered by bsw simply cause the build relies on hit 2 burst skills while Bladesworn is just Aegis Spam. When it comes to ranged builds this might not be that true but well thats only cause of how the gamemode funktions. In Open field IT would more be like ranged build < Condi Zerker but on conquest its more like Condi Zerker < ranged Build since you want to Cap the Point fast ^^

again, its hard to disagree with your experiences...

So I kindly invite you to change my mind.  

ive been killing boyce´s bsw with my condizerker........ soo... yeah....     thats my personal experience/opinion about this matchup.

Aslong as you dont have a big hickup, it either ends in a stalemate, or the bsw slowly but surely dies to the condivomit.

 

...maybe you know something we dont... 😄 but from my experience, the Czerker wins that matchup.

Edited September 28, 2023 by Sahne.6950

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

4 hours ago, Sahne.6950 said:

That might appear as a good idea at first....

but then you realize that Condizerker is essentially the only build running akeem relic currently.

That change would prevent akeem relic from proccing on a condizerker build entirely, thus completly removing akeem relic from pvp.  resulting in yet again more dead content.  

The idea of the relic is GREAT! and i think me need more relics like this, rather than yet another flavor of +10% damagebuff.    But the sheer ammount of conditions applied needs to be looked at, or it needs a ICD.

 just my 2ct tho.

No, Akeem could still be used, it would just require using Blood Reckoning or for a partner with torment or confusion in their build focusing the same target. The theme of the relic is great I agree, but if the issue with cZerk is too much damage then that is what I would do. If it is sustain, then I would reduce the healing conversion ratio on BR and LBR on the condition side.

[Sahne.6950]

13 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

No, Akeem could still be used, it would just require using Blood Reckoning or for a partner with torment or confusion in their build focusing the same target. The theme of the relic is great I agree, but if the issue with cZerk is too much damage then that is what I would do. If it is sustain, then I would reduce the healing conversion ratio on BR and LBR on the condition side.

i know your right with what your saying.

Its the PERFECT solution kind of....    but at the same time, Czerkers will just switch to another relic and call it a day.  

And you know that XD

Edited September 28, 2023 by Sahne.6950

[Burnfall.9573]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38bhiR7fRY4

"Poor Desighn an Balance hiccups **AGAIN** [GW2]"

 

Edited September 28, 2023 by Burnfall.9573