Black Lion Chest drop - star sentinel outfit

[Omega.6801]

I mean lootboxes/gambling/gacha mechanics will end, the day laws will carpet ban them w/o leaving them even the smallest loopholes or when they stop working from a marketing perspective, i.e. when people stop buying them. From experience, laws work slow unless lives are at stake and even then, often work in favor of companies rather than people, so it would be the customers, who would have to demand/support the change away from these systems.
Again, GW2 has pretty fair lootboxes when compaired to other games and it's all just cosmetics, but in principle, they're all the same and they they won't improve let alone go away as long as people buy them. So instead of making threads about how ANet should improve the drop rates, people should make threads about how ANet should remove the BLTC chests altogether.

[Danikat.8537]

On 2/4/2024 at 6:53 PM, Omega.6801 said:

I mean lootboxes/gambling/gacha mechanics will end, the day laws will carpet ban them w/o leaving them even the smallest loopholes or when they stop working from a marketing perspective, i.e. when people stop buying them. From experience, laws work slow unless lives are at stake and even then, often work in favor of companies rather than people, so it would be the customers, who would have to demand/support the change away from these systems.
Again, GW2 has pretty fair lootboxes when compaired to other games and it's all just cosmetics, but in principle, they're all the same and they they won't improve let alone go away as long as people buy them. So instead of making threads about how ANet should improve the drop rates, people should make threads about how ANet should remove the BLTC chests altogether.

I think it's more likely legislation will make it impractical and unprofitable (or not profitable enough for the shareholders) rather than out-right illegal.

For example in the UK actual gambling is legal - you can walk into a bookmakers on any highstreet and place a bet on sports or the upcoming election or pretty much anything else they'll give you odds on. You can buy a lottery ticket in corner shops, garages and supermarkets and online casinos are spamming their advertising everywhere. But you have to be over 18 to do those things, and the people running it have to be licenced and comply with a bunch of reporting and other regulations. In theory anyone can run a lottery or casino or whatever, but in practice it's not worth the hassle unless you're sure you're going to bring in significant profits. It's even more complicated to do it internationally because then you have to comply with the legislation in multiple countries and each one will be slightly different.

It can be done, but a lot of companies will decide it's not worth the trouble for the money it's predicted to bring in, especially if they have to do time-consuming and unpopular things like ID check all their players.

Edited February 6 by Danikat.8537

[Jumpin Lumpix.6108]

On 2/3/2024 at 4:31 AM, Tiamat.8254 said:

When people realise that black lion chests are loot boxes and opening then equates to gambling.

actually its more akin to a gumball machine at a super market. You get something either way (it might not be the color gumball you wanted but you still get something) and like a gumball machine you cant sell it back and get money (or more money than you put in) for it in return (which is what legally constitutes a gamble in most cases).  So not really true.

Edited February 6 by Jumpin Lumpix.6108

[Sobx.1758]

13 hours ago, Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:

actually its more akin to a gumball machine at a super market. You get something either way (it might not be the color gumball you wanted but you still get something) and like a gumball machine you cant sell it back and get money (or more money than you put in) for it in return (which is what legally constitutes a gamble in most cases).  So not really true.

You can get a key as a drop, by completing a map or some of the story steps, you can get drops of higher value (which is not comparable "a different color of a gumball") and there are jackpots/main prizes in the form of super-rare drops where you get insane value out of a key. This is gambling, you're wrong.

[KerryTT.4792]

Spent my normal 25 black lion keys whenever a new box comes out and was lucky enough to get the Star Sentinel Outfit. As a rule, use 25 each time and am happy with what I get.

[Jumpin Lumpix.6108]

8 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

You can get a key as a drop, by completing a map or some of the story steps, you can get drops of higher value (which is not comparable "a different color of a gumball") and there are jackpots/main prizes in the form of super-rare drops where you get insane value out of a key. This is gambling, you're wrong.

its actually not, as i read extensively on what the US constitutes as a gamble.  SO it just isnt.  Anymore than you watiitng around for a rare mob to drop the loot that you want, while paying a monthly fee for an mmo.  You cannot exchange what you receive for USD ($) so its for entertainment only, you also legally do not own your account, so you're technically not personally receiving anything of value.

Edited February 6 by Jumpin Lumpix.6108

[Sobx.1758]

31 minutes ago, Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:

its actually not, as i read extensively on what the US constitutes as a gamble.  SO it just isnt.  Anymore than you watiitng around for a rare mob to drop the loot that you want, while paying a monthly fee for an mmo.  You cannot exchange what you receive for USD ($) so its for entertainment only, you also legally do not own your account, so you're technically not personally receiving anything of value.

So you consider "ecto gambling" to be "gambling" but blchests aren't gambling "because it doesn't have rl$ value" (which is technically wrong too btw)? How does that work exactly? 🤔

Not everything (far from it, actually) revolves around "US" laws 🤷‍♂️

Edited February 6 by Sobx.1758

[DarcShriek.5829]

Keep your statues, eventually you'll be able to use them to buy the outfit.

[DarcShriek.5829]

22 hours ago, Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:

actually its more akin to a gumball machine at a super market. You get something either way (it might not be the color gumball you wanted but you still get something) and like a gumball machine you cant sell it back and get money (or more money than you put in) for it in return (which is what legally constitutes a gamble in most cases).  So not really true.

Not quite correct.  The chests are not gambling in the US because in the US, you have to be able to exchange the prize for money.  You can't legally exchange any thing from the chest for money.  Therefore in the US, it's not considered gambling.  I know this because for 20 years, I've been creating gambling devices.

[Sobx.1758]

26 minutes ago, Jumpin Lumpix.6108 said:

ecto gamble is not a "gamble." none of them are a "gamble" (in the sense of US law on gambling).  If you want to talk about metaphorically what is a gamble.  Everything is a gamble.  Living is a gamble, crossing the street is a gamble, driving in a car is a gamble.  Eating food at a restaurant is a gamble.  SO yes i go for the legal definition of a gamble, and you cannot get money back from your "winnings" since its for fun and not the legal definition of a  gamble.

 

Playing an mmo and wanting a precursor to drop from a mob is just as much of a "gamble" as ecto gambling is as is black lion keys.  But none of them meet the threshold of "legal/illegal gambling" in the US.

No, "everything" isn't a "gamble". But definitely let everyone know why -in the very context of this thread- you decided to go with "US laws!!!1" take on the gamble while you had no issue talking about ecto gambling in other threads 🙃 BTLCs are gambling, you're expected to lose and there's nothing "metaphorical" about it.

Edited February 7 by Sobx.1758

[leila.7962]

The drop rate is messed up for some people I suppose... there was a time that they added a fat black dragon skin for jade bots that I reeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaallly wanted.. it took me 100 + keys to get, while some people said they got it with 5.. go figure.

[RoseofGilead.8907]

1 hour ago, leila.7962 said:

The drop rate is messed up for some people I suppose... there was a time that they added a fat black dragon skin for jade bots that I reeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaallly wanted.. it took me 100 + keys to get, while some people said they got it with 5.. go figure.

That's just RNG, not anyone's drop rate being any more messed up than someone else's.

[Eloc Freidon.5692]

I'm glad I got the backpack glider with 5 keys. I'll try for the outfit in the next rotation if the new item is any good.

Edited February 7 by Eloc Freidon.5692

[Danikat.8537]

7 hours ago, leila.7962 said:

The drop rate is messed up for some people I suppose... there was a time that they added a fat black dragon skin for jade bots that I reeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaallly wanted.. it took me 100 + keys to get, while some people said they got it with 5.. go figure.

That's what random means - it will take different people different numbers of attempts to get the same result.

We know Black Lion Chests don't have any mechanism to make desirable items more likely if you use more keys, the drop rates are the same each time. There's never been any evidence (in spite of plenty of speculation) that certain accounts are luckier than others. Someone might get lucky once but another time they won't. Or their criteria for 'lucky' will be different, maybe if they get it within 60 keys they think they got lucky, whereas someone else will be wondering what's wrong that they didn't get it using 5.

I used to know someone who claimed to have a lucky account that got loads of precursors (back when they were extremely valuable) and speculated it might be tied to the fact that they bought gems regularly. It turned out they were sort of right - they'd just neglected to mention that they converted all those gems to gold, used them to buy exotic weapons and threw them in the Mystic Forge, meaning they got many more chances at a precursor and once you factored that in their drop rate was actually about average.