SAB Size Feedback

[Sobx.1758]

26 minutes ago, Malus.2184 said:

There are two choices, either you've never done the achievements or the answer is a "WhAt AcHiEvEmEnTs?"

Third choice: you're wrong and your complaints are incoherent. More on that right under:

26 minutes ago, Malus.2184 said:

Bauble Collector requires you to track the entirety of the zone. Lockpicking Daily requires you to traverse the zone. The race requires you to traverse the zone.

...bauble collector are one time achievements, meanwhile you're complaining about having to run maps daily "along with the achievements". It doesn't make sense, hence my question.
You can pick-and-choose your dailies to not require you to keep traversing the whole zones. If you want to do every daily for basically no reason, just so you then have something to complain about then you're willingfully creating your own problems. Hence the rest of my post where that's exactly what's being pointed out to you:

On 4/20/2024 at 12:53 PM, Sobx.1758 said:

Why do you need to do everything in one run and why do you need to do every daily (I assume that's what you mean by "achievements" here) all of the sudden? I thought it's about "something to do" and not about the rewards? There's no need to cut any content, just because you want to squeeze out every possible bubble out of it as fast as it would maybe be possible.

 

26 minutes ago, Malus.2184 said:

Even for a single achievement, save the glitch, you need to set off a good amount of time, and the realistic analysis is that for the vast majority of people this bites heavily into the allotted time for the game.

You need to? Why? You just wanted "something to do", so run your zone, 2, 4 or all of them if you have enough time and that's it. Why aren't you responding to the questions you're quoting, but instead just repeat/pretend you "need to do everything every single day despite not having time to play"?

Edited April 22 by Sobx.1758
typo

[nosleepdemon.1368]

2 hours ago, Malus.2184 said:

There are two choices, either you've never done the achievements or the answer is a "WhAt AcHiEvEmEnTs?"

Bauble Collector requires you to track the entirety of the zone. Lockpicking Daily requires you to traverse the zone. The race requires you to traverse the zone.

Between the last checkpoint before the pillars and the boss there's one achievement since the glitch is there.

Even for a single achievement, save the glitch, you need to set off a good amount of time, and the realistic analysis is that for the vast majority of people this bites heavily into the allotted time for the game.

A later poster makes fun of me by using the thought-terminating cliche that I just want to make the fun follow my idea of fun.

You have to understand, that anyone who posts on the forums of any game is often the vast and incredibly vocal minority.

Here's the deal, remove the sections of World 2 that are just filler. Then add a classic mode for those who want to do the classic way. Increase the rewards too as they spend more time there, if they use the shortcut in W2Z2 then default the rewards to normal. Everyone should be happy with that as those with little time have the option and those with a lot of time have the option as well.

It’s almost like you are refusing to see the obvious point that you are not supposed to be able to complete everything ASAP. SAB isn’t your personal achievement point farm. If you want to cut some content to shreds just so that it’s easier on your time and simpler to farm, go do it to something else.

[andreiblue.8231]

On 4/20/2024 at 11:26 AM, Noidea Incognito.9607 said:

So what your asking is the removal of (time-consuming/annoying) content in favor of getting the infusion/loot faster.

I think that has little chance of happening. When the worlds released; it included all that content already and alot of thinking went into design/layout.

removing that removes its reason for designing the whole thing in the 1st place.

Alot of people just sucked it up/grinded teeth to get that stuff and accepted it for what it is. You only need to complete it once on 1 account.

There is still plenty of days to get them before the festival ends and even then you can always continue next year.

I suppose its an archaic way of getting those rewards but thats the point of SAB;

a throwback on  retro-gaming with all its quirks, and a nice surprise for gamers that have never experienced Retro-gaming before.

Thats how i look at it anyway o7

At least add some portals to skip those instead of removing them for the normal mode then, w2 in normal mode only gives you 2 bauble bubbles at the end of a zone just like w1, but the zones are much longer because they are filled with filler. It takes me less time to do w1 in tribulation mode daily than w2 in normal mode and that's a problem imo.

[andreiblue.8231]

On 4/22/2024 at 6:42 PM, nosleepdemon.1368 said:

It’s almost like you are refusing to see the obvious point that you are not supposed to be able to complete everything ASAP. SAB isn’t your personal achievement point farm. If you want to cut some content to shreds just so that it’s easier on your time and simpler to farm, go do it to something else.

As someone who completed that achievement on 2 different accounts: it is stupid that you need infantile or now called exploration mode to do it.

[Noidea Incognito.9607]

@andreiblue.8231Unfortunantly we cant confirm if it was intentional by the original creator since SAB is missing the last worlds/pieces for the complete picture.

But its not impossible to think W2 is suppose to be larger then W1; wich merely served as an introduction/starter/tutorial world. W3 would be even bigger in scope and W4 the final cherry on top the biggest.

Personally I wouldnt call those sections filler either as their quality is consistent and well embedded within the rest of the overal zones. i'd even as so far to say it would make sense to have the long bridge/raft scene for instance. Its basicly serves as an introduction/a taste of things to come into the next zone. Also defending against hordes of foes on a small platform speaks to the imagination of adventure/heroics. as is climbing icy mountains while carved out rockfaces that try to blow you off with menthos breath.

But i get it; from a pragmatic/time efficient perspective it seems unfavorable... but idk about adding more portals, the zones already have checkpoints at key locations.W3 test zone is experimenting with coin checkpoints rather then the Old Era SAB button checkpoint.

We just have to see what next year will bring.

[Malus.2184]

On 4/22/2024 at 5:42 PM, nosleepdemon.1368 said:

It’s almost like you are refusing to see the obvious point that you are not supposed to be able to complete everything ASAP. SAB isn’t your personal achievement point farm. If you want to cut some content to shreds just so that it’s easier on your time and simpler to farm, go do it to something else.

You're correct about that and that changes nothing about the fact that with the length of W2 then SAB will be longer to complete than the average amount of playing games per day.

[Malus.2184]

On 4/22/2024 at 3:07 PM, Sobx.1758 said:

You need to? Why? You just wanted "something to do", so run your zone, 2, 4 or all of them if you have enough time and that's it. Why aren't you responding to the questions you're quoting, but instead just repeat/pretend you "need to do everything every single day despite not having time to play"?

You need to set aside a lot of time, probably the same amount or more than the average person has per day to do it. So, you're oaky with a lot of the dailies for two zones being essentially dead? Seem a bit gatekeepy.

[Malus.2184]

1 hour ago, Noidea Incognito.9607 said:

Personally I wouldnt call those sections filler either as their quality is consistent and well embedded within the rest of the overal zones. i'd even as so far to say it would make sense to have the long bridge/raft scene for instance. Its basicly serves as an introduction/a taste of things to come into the next zone. Also defending against hordes of foes on a small platform speaks to the imagination of adventure/heroics. as is climbing icy mountains while carved out rockfaces that try to blow you off with menthos breath.

When are the sections repeated then? If something is an introduction it'll be shown again. Like the easy light-button thing in W2Z3, that's the introduction that informs you what you need to do when it appears again.

When in the game does it ever show another long bridge or raft section again?

[Sobx.1758]

2 hours ago, Malus.2184 said:

You need to set aside a lot of time, probably the same amount or more than the average person has per day to do it. So, you're oaky with a lot of the dailies for two zones being essentially dead? Seem a bit gatekeepy.

No, you don't. Nothing makes any two zones "dead" based on what is being said in this thread. Nothing is also "gatekeepy" in any way, make sure you understand the terms you're trying to use.
Although I find it extremely telling that you quoted the post pointing out you keep avoiding the questions you quote and... you dodged what was being said/asked in this post as well. Does that mean at this point you know you're wrong and just need to keep making up new nonsense (like the current mention of anything here being "gatekeepy") while dropping the previous notions you and I made in this comment chain? Because that's how it looks like. If that's not what you're doing then go back to the previous questions and start answering. Otherwise... well, keep showing you understand you're wrong here 🤷‍♂️

Edited April 24 by Sobx.1758

[Noidea Incognito.9607]

@Malus.2184

I wasnt talking about repeating mechanics. SAB is telling an adventure story. The inspiration for it came from other adventure games like Zelda and Castlevania.

What i meant was; those sections introduce new foes send by the big boss to stop the Hero(es) with ambushes and it sets the tone for what the hero(es) will discover in the next zone.

Its pretty classic in alot of RPG's. In both sections the Hero(es) is/are cornered/limited and must overcome the Big Boss minions; again it speaks to the imagination of a grand adventure with danger and excitement.  Your looking at it only from a pragmatic/time efficient manner... wich is fine ofcourse, but all those sections have a reason to be there from an rpg/story perspective.  

Its just how it is. You have to make the choice for yourself if you wanna continue playing SAB or skip it.   

Edited April 24 by Noidea Incognito.9607

[andreiblue.8231]

7 hours ago, Noidea Incognito.9607 said:

@andreiblue.8231Unfortunantly we cant confirm if it was intentional by the original creator since SAB is missing the last worlds/pieces for the complete picture.

But its not impossible to think W2 is suppose to be larger then W1; wich merely served as an introduction/starter/tutorial world. W3 would be even bigger in scope and W4 the final cherry on top the biggest.

Personally I wouldnt call those sections filler either as their quality is consistent and well embedded within the rest of the overal zones. i'd even as so far to say it would make sense to have the long bridge/raft scene for instance. Its basicly serves as an introduction/a taste of things to come into the next zone. Also defending against hordes of foes on a small platform speaks to the imagination of adventure/heroics. as is climbing icy mountains while carved out rockfaces that try to blow you off with menthos breath.

But i get it; from a pragmatic/time efficient perspective it seems unfavorable... but idk about adding more portals, the zones already have checkpoints at key locations.W3 test zone is experimenting with coin checkpoints rather then the Old Era SAB button checkpoint.

We just have to see what next year will bring.

Maybe add some sort of unlockable portals then that would take some effort to get to use then.

[Sobx.1758]

1 hour ago, andreiblue.8231 said:

Maybe add some sort of unlockable portals then that would take some effort to get to use then.

I don't see the need for any additional portals though.

[Malus.2184]

12 hours ago, Noidea Incognito.9607 said:

@Malus.2184

I wasnt talking about repeating mechanics. SAB is telling an adventure story. The inspiration for it came from other adventure games like Zelda and Castlevania.

What i meant was; those sections introduce new foes send by the big boss to stop the Hero(es) with ambushes and it sets the tone for what the hero(es) will discover in the next zone.

Its pretty classic in alot of RPG's. In both sections the Hero(es) is/are cornered/limited and must overcome the Big Boss minions; again it speaks to the imagination of a grand adventure with danger and excitement.  Your looking at it only from a pragmatic/time efficient manner... wich is fine ofcourse, but all those sections have a reason to be there from an rpg/story perspective.  

Its just how it is. You have to make the choice for yourself if you wanna continue playing SAB or skip it.   

Zelda and Castlevania are both games with different gameplays. Narratively they both tell an interconnected story. The actual gameplay is more Super Mario 64 with the upgrade system of Zelda with the exception that you're fully on-rails in that you're unable to deviate from the path unless the deviation is intentionally placed there.  In Super Mario, the zones are either relatively short or constantly challenge you. There's no challenge in a bridge that's there for no reason, there's no challenge in a raft that's players like a s section from an on-rail, arcade shooter. The enemies are also straight-up cut-and-pasted from W2Z2, saying it's an introduction is also incorrect as an introduction is supposed to be easier than the thing it introduces as it's just a straight copy with the same attack pattern, same health, and same damage.

I find it pretty galling that you have the tenacity to try and mansplain the classic games that inspired SAB to me without mentioning anything about the OG inspiration, Super Mario,, even the naming conventions are the same in that we play Wolds and Zones. Makes me think that you're just mindlessly parroting what someone else has told you.

[Malus.2184]

14 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

No, you don't. Nothing makes any two zones "dead" based on what is being said in this thread. Nothing is also "gatekeepy" in any way, make sure you understand the terms you're trying to use.
Although I find it extremely telling that you quoted the post pointing out you keep avoiding the questions you quote and... you dodged what was being said/asked in this post as well. Does that mean at this point you know you're wrong and just need to keep making up new nonsense (like the current mention of anything here being "gatekeepy") while dropping the previous notions you and I made in this comment chain? Because that's how it looks like. If that's not what you're doing then go back to the previous questions and start answering. Otherwise... well, keep showing you understand you're wrong here 🤷‍♂️

"Essentially being dead " and "being dead" are two different things. The former means that a minority engages with the content and the latter that only a vast, cast minority engages with the content.

There was no dodging of questions, I just found them pointless to answer as I had already given the answers in other posts and I loathe repeating myself. If you want the answers to your questions then go back and actually read the other posts properly rather than the one which triggered you to make that overly emotional response.

[Noidea Incognito.9607]

@Malus.2184

I can respect your opinion, but i dont agree with it. You keep trying to find reasons to justify the removal of ingame segments wich excisted in sab for like.... forever?

Its good to know its not up to YOU to decide for everyone how SAB should be envisioned. Its in Anet's hands. Deal with it or move on. 

Since you wont be getting what you want and find my opinion annoying; i shall allow you to vent the frustration at me... for i am kind and benevolent o7

[nosleepdemon.1368]

OP, with your use of cultural warfare words I can only assume this entire thread has been a troll. Well done, I think you got most of us - I award you 8/10. You’d get 10/10 but you never actually made me laugh.

[nosleepdemon.1368]

22 hours ago, andreiblue.8231 said:

At least add some portals to skip those instead of removing them for the normal mode then, w2 in normal mode only gives you 2 bauble bubbles at the end of a zone just like w1, but the zones are much longer because they are filled with filler. It takes me less time to do w1 in tribulation mode daily than w2 in normal mode and that's a problem imo.

You can skip almost all of zone 2 with the shortcut eagle…

[Ashantara.8731]

On 4/19/2024 at 7:04 PM, Malus.2184 said:

[...]

World 2 Zone 3

- Remove both pressure puzzles. The second one with the jumping sheep is padding and without that one, the first one serves no purpose either.

- Remove the bridge before the Yeti sub-boss. The blowing mouths serve no purpose other than stalling for time.

[...]

You obviously want everything removed that makes SAB so much fun. Congrats on not getting what SAB is about. 👎

Please stop playing SAB instead of asking to have it reduced to a mere shadow of itself, namely a boring walk-straight-through jumping puzzle.

[nosleepdemon.1368]

24 minutes ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

You obviously want everything removed that makes SAB so much fun. Congrats on not getting what SAB is about. 👎

Please stop playing SAB instead of asking to have it reduced to a mere shadow of itself, namely a boring walk-straight-through jumping puzzle.

I almost executed a no death run of w1z3 yesterday (my usual path requires one death to respawn at the top of the forest for the final section before the boss). I have found a wall that allows double jumping to skip some of the spikes on the lower level. This is why I love SAB - It’s made to be experimented with and glitched. It should never change!

[Sobx.1758]

7 hours ago, Malus.2184 said:

"Essentially being dead " and "being dead" are two different things. The former means that a minority engages with the content and the latter that only a vast, cast minority engages with the content.

How are they "essencially dead"? They're not. The players do them and they are popping up in lfg as well. So as much as  "essencially dead" and "actually dead" aren't the same, that doesn't change anything about you being wrong on that as far as I'm aware. And considering I'm SABing fairly often, I'd say I am aware.

7 hours ago, Malus.2184 said:

There was no dodging of questions, I just found them pointless to answer as I had already given the answers in other posts and I loathe repeating myself

Yes, you did dodge them. And no, there were no answers to them earlier. Nothing here is "gatekeepy" in any way. And your claims about "it not being about rewards" are clearly false when your whole motivation is trying to spam every achievement posible in one run every single day, while claiming you "have to" do it. Your previous claims in the thread (which I questioned) are false and so is what you just wrote above.

 

6 hours ago, andreiblue.8231 said:

You literally dont even play the game mode and havent completed it in tribulation mode so why would you?

Another completely baseless claim. Stop being so glaringly wrong while making up this nonsense.

Edited April 25 by Sobx.1758

[andreiblue.8231]

On 4/25/2024 at 2:54 PM, nosleepdemon.1368 said:

You can skip almost all of zone 2 with the shortcut eagle…

Even with the shortcut it takes me longer than w1z3 in tribulation mode

[Malus.2184]

22 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

How are they "essencially dead"? They're not. The players do them and they are popping up in lfg as well. So as much as  "essencially dead" and "actually dead" aren't the same, that doesn't change anything about you being wrong on that as far as I'm aware. And considering I'm SABing fairly often, I'd say I am aware.

Yes, you did dodge them. And no, there were no answers to them earlier. Nothing here is "gatekeepy" in any way. And your claims about "it not being about rewards" are clearly false when your whole motivation is trying to spam every achievement posible in one run every single day, while claiming you "have to" do it. Your previous claims in the thread (which I questioned) are false and so is what you just wrote above.

 

Another completely baseless claim. Stop being so glaringly wrong while making up this nonsense.

There are also still players doing raids. It has nothing to do with people doing something, it has to do with percentages of people engaging with the content. The sentiment, "I did it this way so you have to do it that way as well.," is gatekeeping. There are many ways to gatekeep beyond the obvious one shown in pop culture.

On 4/25/2024 at 3:21 PM, Ashantara.8731 said:

You obviously want everything removed that makes SAB so much fun. Congrats on not getting what SAB is about. 👎

Please stop playing SAB instead of asking to have it reduced to a mere shadow of itself, namely a boring walk-straight-through jumping puzzle.

How is the bridge or the raft fun? Please, do explain to me what I'm missing. The bridge is the essence of the "walk-straight jumping puzzle," and the raft is the essence of just standing there while the game moves for you."

On 4/25/2024 at 12:04 PM, Noidea Incognito.9607 said:

@Malus.2184

I can respect your opinion, but i dont agree with it. You keep trying to find reasons to justify the removal of ingame segments wich excisted in sab for like.... forever?

Its good to know its not up to YOU to decide for everyone how SAB should be envisioned. Its in Anet's hands. Deal with it or move on. 

Since you wont be getting what you want and find my opinion annoying; i shall allow you to vent the frustration at me... for i am kind and benevolent o7

There are many things in all walks of life that have "existed forever" that have been removed or altered because things were better without them. How come video games are an exception to that?

Edited April 26 by Malus.2184

[Ashantara.8731]

1 minute ago, Malus.2184 said:

How is the bridge or the raft fun?

It takes coordination to kill all the assassins there on the narrow bridge without being hit by them. It's fun! Plus, you are being rewarded +5 baubles.

It takes less than a minute to get across, so what's the whining all about?

[Malus.2184]

1 minute ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

It takes coordination to kill all the assassins there on the narrow bridge without being hit by them. It's fun! Plus, you are being rewarded +5 baubles.

It takes less than a minute to get across, so what's the whining all about?

Cutting a minute here and a minute there adds up to a lot of accumulative time removed that can then be inserted as time spent on the other worlds

Removing the things I've listed should do nothing to remove the feel of the zone it was removed from and removing a given section is just trimming the fat of a zone to allow for the time to be spent elsewhere.

If you compare W2 to the test zone the test zone is incredibly lean. There is no filler content between the start and the boss and yet you can easily go off the beaten path to find something extra. W2Z1 is the same since you do have some detours that lead to hidden content and then you also have the raft and the bridge which adds nothing to the feel of the zone.

W2Z2 also has detours to hidden content and then it also has tons of filler before you can even get to those detours. W2z3 has both time sinks as well as filler content that I can only see existing to make the shortcuts worth it. Since I got the flute and the song and can use those two detours I know there's a lot more of the zone that I never see because doing, and that's jus there to make the shortcuts feel like shortcuts rather than the intended way to do the zone in a reasonable amount of time. The reasonable amount of time will end up being unreasonable once more zones are added though.

On that note, what purpose does the Yeti before the Storm Wizazrd serve? If it was a "dragon-type" miniboss then King Toad would also have something similar before you fought him.

[RoseofGilead.8907]

22 minutes ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

It takes coordination to kill all the assassins there on the narrow bridge without being hit by them. It's fun! Plus, you are being rewarded +5 baubles.

It takes less than a minute to get across, so what's the whining all about?

Wait, people actually kill them? I just always run straight across without stopping.