The Warrior Spear Advantage

[Lighter.5631]

15 hours ago, Aaron.1294 said:

@draxynnic.3719Absolutely not, warrior staff is broken because it is bloated with literally EVERYTHING, and one thing in particular - heal because you use a skill...

broken yet still trash

[Aaron.1294]

@Lighter.5631what do you mean? It's yet the best weapon warrior got (in pvp especcially)

@draxynnic.3719Symbol follows your target.  :I. 

But if we're taking about which one is better are we taking into consideration just effects (boons, healing, damage) or effects and design because frankly spear and Staff are clunky af.

[draxynnic.3719]

2 hours ago, Aaron.1294 said:

@Lighter.5631what do you mean? It's yet the best weapon warrior got (in pvp especcially)

@draxynnic.3719Symbol follows your target.  :I. 

But if we're taking about which one is better are we taking into consideration just effects (boons, healing, damage) or effects and design because frankly spear and Staff are clunky af.

Guardian symbols absolutely do not follow your target. Projectiles fired through the pistol symbol do get the buff, but you're still missing out on the symbol damage, and on the burning stacks you get for hitting the enemy while they're in the symbol.

[Purple Effects.2503]

On 6/21/2024 at 5:43 AM, Vepa.6073 said:

hese are the type of ppl on GW2 development for warrior team probably...clearly empty in the head

I don’t think oscuros post is susposed to be taken that seriously, calm down lol, Anet aren’t making weapons for anyone specifically, their following their vision of what a warrior is. 

And while I can agree the absence of a real mechanic is very obvious, I don’t think everything about the spear is bad, but sure it isn’t flashy like the other options, but I get the impression that’s intentional. 

i do think if there was a separate benefit to being more ranged. Which drifted into each side the further/closer you were the mechanic could have been deeper 

aswell as something maybe more active about the shattering of spears could have been nice. 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

I think the 90 radius on the hits on Spear 5 is objectively BAD. Those attacks will miss anyone running with Swiftness, much less Relic of Speed users, anyone with +25% movement speed, or superspeed.

[Aaron.1294]

@draxynnic.3719Are we talking about guardian spear or what? Because rn I genuienly am lost. + If we really need to talk about guardian symbols aren't for damage only what is this argument even....

[Kitty.4806]

On 6/20/2024 at 9:03 PM, DanAlcedo.3281 said:

It has to out dps either:

- Greatsword

- Axe/Axe

- Dagger/Axe

- Hammer

To see any play on the golem. 

Let's see what they gonna replace. 

I have high hopes for the (2)>burst>BR>burst>2,5,1,Burst potential to replace GS

[DanAlcedo.3281]

4 hours ago, Kitty.4806 said:

I have high hopes for the (2)>burst>BR>burst>2,5,1,Burst potential to replace GS

Would be nice. 

RIP GS then. 

[Vepa.6073]

4 hours ago, Kitty.4806 said:

I have high hopes for the (2)>burst>BR>burst>2,5,1,Burst potential to replace GS

Copium...is anet dev team sending you guys over to post this in forums?

[Jzaku.9765]

5 hours ago, Kitty.4806 said:

I have high hopes for the (2)>burst>BR>burst>2,5,1,Burst potential to replace GS

Even if this ends up being the case (which i doubt because of it's cast time), wow a mild dps increase over GS on my otherwise melee build because the other set has to be a/a, I'm really hyped for the expansion now.

[draxynnic.3719]

8 hours ago, Aaron.1294 said:

@draxynnic.3719Are we talking about guardian spear or what? Because rn I genuienly am lost. + If we really need to talk about guardian symbols aren't for damage only what is this argument even....

I was comparing warrior staff to other SotO weapons to demonstrate how not having some complex mechanic can actually make a weapon more functional overall. Since you can just... use whichever skill is suitable for the circumstances rather than having to weave them into some kind of combo.

Warrior staff is a support weapon, so it's not expected to win any DPS races, but not having a mechanic means that each skill can be used independently without losing a lot of your effectiveness, and furthermore, each of those five skills is intended to be used independently rather than existing to power up some other skill.

[ApaWanka.2698]

On 6/21/2024 at 2:40 PM, DanAlcedo.3281 said:

Thats why i said "on the golem". Because there, only dps matters.

 

I have the feeling that Spears are more PvP WvW oriented than PvE in general. An between them warrior spear is one of the best examples.

 

All the spears have defensive skills. On warrior spear we have 2 evades, so most likely 3 will have low damage and F1 probably will have damage but due to the evade during casting most likely will not be a game breaking blow to keep it balance.
 

According the stream, Looks like spear will have a good consistent damage but I don’t see it outDPSing sets as axe/axe were every single skill is DPS oriented.

[Aaron.1294]

@draxynnic.3719Have you seen other spears and their things, thief for example? Do you realize they DON'T have to use empowered skills every single time they're empowered. If you are talking purely about pve, why would staff having 0 combos built-in be a better thing than other weapons...The fact is, again, it is a stupidly overpowered weapon that heals with every single skill for no reason so it is usable. It's not a good or interesting design...

 

[Kitty.4806]

On 6/23/2024 at 9:36 PM, Jzaku.9765 said:

Even if this ends up being the case (which i doubt because of it's cast time), wow a mild dps increase over GS on my otherwise melee build because the other set has to be a/a, I'm really hyped for the expansion now.

Yep. super pumped especially now that they implemented 0 of the changes they had planned for warrior this patch 😄

[draxynnic.3719]

On 6/24/2024 at 9:06 PM, Aaron.1294 said:

@draxynnic.3719Have you seen other spears and their things, thief for example? Do you realize they DON'T have to use empowered skills every single time they're empowered. If you are talking purely about pve, why would staff having 0 combos built-in be a better thing than other weapons...The fact is, again, it is a stupidly overpowered weapon that heals with every single skill for no reason so it is usable. It's not a good or interesting design...

 

Sure, the skill isn't exactly being greyed out if you don't have the empower mechanic, but you can bet that their balancing is going to assume that you're making proper use of their mechanic, even if it's something like a ranged weapon that requires the enemy being in a symbol that's dropped at your feet or the complexity layered on poor signalling layered on complexity of elementalist pistol (let alone the utter ridiculousness of engineer shortbow first draft or rev sceptre even now). The spear mechanics seem to be better planned out (with the exception of rev which looks terrible to play), but there are absolutely benefits to having skills that just good when used at any time rather than needing to use skill X and maybe Y before them in order to power them up for the full benefit.

[Aaron.1294]

@draxynnic.3719But you're talking about rotations, which is on every single weapon. Same thing with simpliest weapon you can use every single skill, but in order to get most value out of it you just need to do same rotations... That doesn't mean it's better planned out for me.

 

[draxynnic.3719]

17 hours ago, Aaron.1294 said:

@draxynnic.3719But you're talking about rotations, which is on every single weapon. Same thing with simpliest weapon you can use every single skill, but in order to get most value out of it you just need to do same rotations... That doesn't mean it's better planned out for me.

 

There's a big difference between "if you use these weapons in this particular order the individual effects will synergise in a beneficial way, such as using a skill that gives you a buff before a big damage skill" and "you HAVE to use these skills in a particular order or they're actually weaker".

Not every weapon has a rotation beyond 'use attacks on recharge'. Some have a priority order. Some have specific pairs of skills that you want to use together, such as using a powerful skill and then resetting the cooldown so it can be used again. Some have a basic rotation, but it's not a big deal if you get something a bit off.

And then there's elementalist kittening pistol, where making one mistake and not noticing it can mean that the part of your rotation in that attunement could be messed up for the rest of the fight.

These are not the same.

Elepistol is the extreme example, but look at, for instance, revenant spear. It's built around using skill 5 to charge up skill 5. Other skills are there to shorten the recharge for skill 5 so you can keep skill 5 charged. Don't even think about weaponswapping, because then you'll lose your charge for skill 5. Guardian pistol symbol forces a supposedly ranged weapon to be in melee and to use a specific skill combination or you're losing a large chunk of your potential, far more than warrior spear appears to lose by remaining at a distance, and don't even get me started on the clustercat that is guardian pistol skill 5. And that's just off the top of my head.

Personally, I'm glad that they're keeping warrior spear straightforward rather than chaining it down with a mechanic that makes it actively less practical to use.

[Aaron.1294]

@draxynnic.3719"I love to throw spears so I can throw spears and then I throw a spear". Hey, lemme tell you a secret, you know that if a mechanic built around weapon doesn't really matter much, guess what - THERE IS NO MECHANIC. Nothing fun, nothing cool. Just spam your skills and then spam them again - LET'S GO.

Edited Thursday at 10:19 AM by Aaron.1294

[Blood.7254]

On 6/21/2024 at 9:46 PM, BadSanta.6527 said:

my heart is with you  warriors main just by to see the ele animation comper to yours its sad 

 

I actually prefer the warrir spear animations. Elementalist is like an explosive puke all over the screen.

[Arewn.2368]

They really messed up on the design direction for this weapon with this whole "am I melee, or am I ranged?" thing.

The weapon is, for all intents and purposes, a melee weapon. You need to be in melee for the skills to be effective, you are heavily punished if used at a range, and your likely pairing it with another melee weapon anyways (given the available options).

I think the design intent here is that they want spear to be used in melee, but since warrior already struggles with a lack of range options when off-target, they made it so that all the skills can be used at a range. But this was the wrong way to achieve that.

Either stick to your guns and make it a proper range weapon. Let it be fully effective at all ranges.

Or make it a melee weapon, but have several of the skills/burst be ranged. That way you can still do some damage at ranged, but you don't have to mess around with these weird and unintuitive mechanics were the skills scale differently based on distance.

Honestly spear should have just been two-handed melee condi weapon. It's one of the few niches we still need filled, and it would have left design space open for a future main hand pistol.

[Funky.4861]

Warrior spear has an identity crisis- it doesn't want to be melee, yet nerfs skills based on distance to the target. It has no buffs, i think one condi (vuln) and one backwards mobility sklill/evade. It's damage is not great and it's visually very dull- it doesn't look or feel like a fun weapon to use. To me it's vying to replace rifle in the ranged power dps slot, but it fails badly. Back to the drawing board and rework skills 2-5 to actually create some synergy or sense of cohesion within the weapon skills.