Axe theif needs to be fixed

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

22 hours ago, Terrorhuz.4695 said:

3s stealth for dodging on smoke field -on the ONE CLASS with endless dodges and endless smoke fields- needs to go.

Period.

They won't stop me terrorhuz, the devs know we don't have any blocks and need to drop target to live, and I'm sure they know how smoke fields work and that dodges aren't infinite.

It's no use~

Whatever they replace it with will be worse because it will have to be active mitigation instead of pseudo mitigation. 

Axe and speen

Until it is done

Edited August 7 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Terrorhuz.4695]

1 hour ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

dodges aren't infinite

Double axe\pistol with sigil of energy on both sets, some vigor from steal, the signet with endurance. You have every dodge you need every time you need it, stop pretending you don't.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

1 hour ago, Terrorhuz.4695 said:

Double axe\pistol with sigil of energy on both sets, some vigor from steal, the signet with endurance. You have every dodge you need every time you need it, stop pretending you don't.

why would I run double axe pistol with bound, I'm not gonna be able to go anywhere. Players aren't dumb, theyll just bomb where I landed the moment they realize both my sets have no mobility. 💀

That's like running virt in conquest but worse

Not that I'm arguing with you in some bid to justify thief existing. I'm certain it's a frustrating matchup for you since you play power mes so I understand being annoyed by it.

It's just that I'm well layered in the confidence that no matter how they nerf me (on thief) I'll be back next week because the things people are mad about are frustrations that manifest when any thief build works, and their solutions always culminate in "make thief not work" which Anet won't do. 

You cannot escape, is my point

Edited August 8 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[youle.5824]

On 8/7/2024 at 8:33 PM, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

why would I run double axe pistol with bound, I'm not gonna be able to go anywhere. Players aren't dumb, theyll just bomb where I landed the moment they realize both my sets have no mobility. 💀

 

Not so, shadow art giving superspeed is still there and remedy that lack of mobility , not that axe on both set is good ofc.

[Endo.1652]

On 8/7/2024 at 9:33 PM, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

why would I run double axe pistol with bound, I'm not gonna be able to go anywhere. Players aren't dumb, theyll just bomb where I landed the moment they realize both my sets have no mobility. 💀

That's like running virt in conquest but worse

Not that I'm arguing with you in some bid to justify thief existing. I'm certain it's a frustrating matchup for you since you play power mes so I understand being annoyed by it.

It's just that I'm well layered in the confidence that no matter how they nerf me (on thief) I'll be back next week because the things people are mad about are frustrations that manifest when any thief build works, and their solutions always culminate in "make thief not work" which Anet won't do. 

You cannot escape, is my point

So if they removed the leap finisher from bound, im curious on how youd perform with any other style of thief tbh.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

1 hour ago, Endo.1652 said:

So if they removed the leap finisher from bound, im curious on how youd perform with any other style of thief tbh.

Don't get me wrong, i can play other thief styles. I was chased off of sword pistol when sindrener got it nerf brigaded, there's always something.  ❤️

Bound thief would be useless and so would pistol pistol, so once again dagger pistol, sword dagger, annd deadeye. Maybe staff here and there, as a supplement. Or Id swap to axe dagger and condibomb people harder. 

Question for you though.

what thief in their right mind would take bound if it didn't leap finish? You think players will take it just for the damage mod? When you ask for nerfs like this that aim to deal with annoying playstyles by dumpstering them, you have to think about what you'll see instead in addition to the result you hope you'll see. It's not rocket science to see pulling the leap finisher is a big sustain (no stealth) and damage loss (no stealth attacks) for thieves that use it, so they're likely not going to keep doing so (which is probably what you want)

And since the only other traitline there apart from unhindered is lotus training, the only options you'll realistically see are unhindered combatant daredevils.

What do unhindered combatant daredevils run? Things that synergize with swiftness. 

Instead of low mobility blink thieves, you'll get exclusively high mobility ones you never see unless they are hitting you with unblockables.

So now instead of being able to oneshot a thief by reflecting projectiles at the right time, or invalidate them with projectile hate, or outrun them, you get sword thieves. Those have their own problems sure, but I'm pretty sure they're harder to fight than axe ones.

I'm sure Anet knows this too, which is why Axe is so slow to set up. 

Edited August 9 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

6 hours ago, youle.5824 said:

Not so, shadow art giving superspeed is still there and remedy that lack of mobility , not that axe on both set is good ofc.

Yeah 1.5 seconds of superspeed per stealth state

I'm def going to the moon and back 💀

I'm up for it getting shaved to 1 per  if the half second is the problem though, it's not like it does anything atm 🪦

Edited August 9 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Endo.1652]

1 hour ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Question for you though.

what thief in their right mind would take bound if it didn't leap finish? You think players will take it just for the damage mod? When you ask for nerfs like this that aim to deal with annoying playstyles by dumpstering them, you have to think about what you'll see instead in addition to the result you hope you'll see. It's not rocket science to see pulling the leap finisher is a big sustain (no stealth) and damage loss (no stealth attacks) for thieves that use it, so they're likely not going to keep doing so (which is probably what you want)

Lmfao i never asked for the nerf. I am asking you how you would feel if they did nerf it. Do you think you could adapt? Do you think you would still be as strong as a thief player as you are now with it? 

And to answer your question. Current SD thief takes bound. They use it because the dmg mod does help. And it doesnt displace them as much as dash would

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

18 minutes ago, Endo.1652 said:

Lmfao i never asked for the nerf. I am asking you how you would feel if they did nerf it. Do you think you could adapt? Do you think you would still be as strong as a thief player as you are now with it? 

Mb I'm prickly, you know how it be. 

If they nerfed it I'd be mildly to moderately annoyed, because I did astralaria just to do pretty axe combos, and HOPE to do pretty pewpew gunner rp. Bound is kind of necessary for both of those weapon sets, given how they work. 

I would probably adapt. Again. I'd probably be about as effective, I'd just enjoy playing less. HOPE and Astralaria give me the good brain chemicals, and I'm tired of DP. 

If they reworked the weapon sets to not need a constant weaving of stealth for damage while providing none naturally, that would also be an option.  I'm certain that's not work Anet wants to do though. 

Edited August 9 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

Quote

Current SD thief takes bound. They use it because the dmg mod does help. And it doesnt displace them as much as dash would

Fair enough. 

[Endo.1652]

7 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Mb I'm prickly, you know how it be. 

If they nerfed it I'd be mildly to moderately annoyed, because I did astralaria just to do pretty axe combos, and HOPE to do pretty pewpew gunner rp. Bound is kind of necessary for both of those weapon sets, given how they work. 

I would probably adapt. Again. I'd probably be about as effective, I'd just enjoy playing less. HOPE and Astralaria give me the good brain chemicals, and I'm tired of DP. 

If they reworked the weapon sets to not need a constant weaving of stealth for damage while providing none naturally, that would also be an option.  I'm certain that's not work Anet wants to do though. 

Ill be honest though. I am heavily biased against axe's design on thief. It has the bladesworn syndrome where its too clunky to be good on its own but once something enables it, it becomes good in a really unhealthy way.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

24 minutes ago, Endo.1652 said:

Ill be honest though. I am heavily biased against axe's design on thief. It has the bladesworn syndrome where its too clunky to be good on its own but once something enables it, it becomes good in a really unhealthy way.

Idk about that but your yuck is yum to me when it comes to axe. Right there with you on bladesworn though. (Generally, not just because axe thief auto loses to it 🪦)

I'll say this:

I love trap playstyles, but I'm not particular about how its played, as long as it works. If there is a way they can adjust it so it's less trash UNLESS you take bound (or run whatever devilry Ambi is running), cool beans. I just wanna play axe. I'll learn whatever. 

Pistol pistol too btw. It's very obvious they designed axe to be very tightly leashed unless you take the least mobile thief options. That's probably why you kittening hate it existing near you but rarely see it in conquest/see thieves complaining about it despite it working pretty kitten well.

Edited August 9 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Endo.1652]

15 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Idk about that but your yuck is yum to me when it comes to axe. Right there with you on bladesworn though. 

I'll say this though:

I love trap playstyles, but I'm not particular about how its played, as long as it works. If there is a way they can adjust it so it's less trash UNLESS you take bound (or run whatever devilry Ambi is running), cool beans. I just wanna play axe. I'll learn whatever. 

Pistol pistol too btw. It's very obvious they designed axe to be very tightly leashed unless you take the least mobile thief options though. That's probably why you kittening hate it existing near you but rarely see it in conquest/see thieves complaining about it despite it working pretty kitten well.

See im different. I like brawler playstyles with different combos, or very snappy active/reactive styles. I don't really like playing things where it involves me spamming the same 3 buttons or doing the same rotation of skills over and over, while feeling safe the entire time. Axe kind of influences that. You are just pressing 1 and 2 for the sake of using your 3, while using stealth and your stealth attack to refill initative. Thats just boring.

Ironically, somehow axe on specter actually is kind of fun because of how it all works together

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

12 minutes ago, Endo.1652 said:

See im different. I like brawler playstyles with different combos, or very snappy active/reactive styles. I don't really like playing things where it involves me spamming the same 3 buttons or doing the same rotation of skills over and over, while feeling safe the entire time. Axe kind of influences that. You are just pressing 1 and 2 for the sake of using your 3, while using stealth and your stealth attack to refill initative. Thats just boring.

 

I play axe as an unsafe reactive brawler, my second set is often d/d for closeout. 

When I say I like trap playstyles, I never said I like playing passively.

I play it about as aggressively as my warrior when I'm not fighting projectile hate. It needs bound to work though. 

Edited August 9 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Shagie.7612]

better bring back the old classic

remember, thief is terrible at everything and actually thief players are just more skilled than everyone and that's why they win, they'd be rank 1 on any other class

[Yerlock.4678]

On 8/5/2024 at 3:05 PM, renwewed.7268 said:

Being hit from stealth for ridiculous amounts of Condie/power damage is giga kitten for the game. Ask any high level player if this is healthy for the pvp scene and they will say it is not, unless they play it

Yeah this has needed a nerf for a while.

[Terrorhuz.4695]

1 hour ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

I play axe as an unsafe reactive brawler

There is no way you'll ever make me believe any form of daredevil is "unsafe". Daredevil is, by design, one of the safest specs ever designed.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

14 minutes ago, Terrorhuz.4695 said:

There is no way you'll ever make me believe any form of daredevil is "unsafe". Daredevil is, by design, one of the safest specs ever designed.

I wasn't planning on it, though, we've argued enough, and thief hard counters you so that is a perfectly reasonable place to arrive.

At this point it's like people debating over whether to stab the lich the 78th time, I'm just gonna come back in 7 days get on with it and make it funny this time 💀🪑

1 hour ago, Shagie.7612 said:

better bring back the old classic

remember, thief is terrible at everything and actually thief players are just more skilled than everyone and that's why they win, they'd be rank 1 on any other class

Aint nobody said none of that 💀🍷

Edited August 9 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Shagie.7612]

19 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Aint nobody said none of that 💀🍷

u right, u right
implication is not the same as explicit statements my bad

hope thieves can forgive me like they're consistently forgiven for being the criminal class

Edited August 9 by Shagie.7612

[Waffles.5632]

There was a time when Mirage only had one dodge and Daredevil had three.

I will never get why DD gets to have three dodges. Make it two like everyone else.

[Voodoo.3201]

Ppl struggling into axe thied has to be a fkn meme 

[Lion.6590]

Stealth itself is one of the worst mechanics in this game, it removes your target preventing you from using certain skills that require targets and also puts you under the constant pressure of not knowing where your enemy is, there are ways to work around this, but not every class can deal with stealth that well.

Stealth should be used exclusively as a defensive tool and attempting to execute any offensive action should immediately put you under a 3s revealed status regardless if you hit or not your target. 
 

[Kuya.6495]

Just had a match with an Axe thief and a one shot virt build. Wow what a miserable match. There wasn't even a point in pressing the condi cleanse button cause you were already at 1/4 your health by the time it registered in your brain that you got hit.

Edit: I'm gonna make an Axe thief and a one shot virt now

Edited August 10 by Kuya.6495

[Last Crab.6054]

couple of DE axe users are also beefing up their "skill" with 3rd party software 🤓

 

[EnderzShadow.2506]

On 8/9/2024 at 12:25 PM, Endo.1652 said:

So if they removed the leap finisher from bound, im curious on how youd perform with any other style of thief tbh.

dmn endo, you cry a lot 😞  QQ IT UP BUDDY!!