New raid rewards from today's patch

[Delita Silverburg.8632]

First, I would like to thank Anet for giving us a reason to repeat CM content! This is the most excited change to raids we've had this year! (Only change, but that's beside the point. ;))

As for the trophy shipments for gaeting crystals and mag shards. Seems like a cool update, but not yet sure if it's more profitable than infusions. The only thing I want to ask about, is why not do the same for Insights and Divinations? Right now, once you finish your legendary armor sets and ring, there really isn't any use for insights/divinations. I suggest doing the same thing with them for trophy shipments and some reasonable rate as well. that way we can at the very least use the currency somehow. At 25 of them a week max, it really only takes about 24 weeks total to amass enough for 3 full sets of armor and the ring, then they are collecting dust in your bank. I have friends who have 500+ extra insights just lying around at this point due to raiding each week.

Some people might say you can get more asended armor, but 2 things on that. 1. Legendary armory and 2. if you're full clearing raids, you already have more ascended armor than you know what to do with.

[Xca.9721]

The rewards are garbage, not worth to suffer pugging 5 cms.

[Adzekul.3104]

Dear Arenanet,

Are you willing to review / consider changes to the weekly CM raid reward? Is this matter closed or open? This could be used to truly encourage people to train themselves and others, and increase the population if the rewards were more useful.

My concerns:I am a regular normal-mode raider (approaching 450 LI) who wants to learn the CMs, but nobody trains them (even on EU) and the population of capable teams and trainers is extremely small. Anyone who can do the weekly achievement has no need of the rewards you are offering (they already have the number of legendary armour sets that they want) but 10 gold is not so bad as part of a reward. The appeal of Gaeting Crystals assumes that everyone wants the chair or Dhuum's armour, and while many do, this is largely limited to people who cannot currently do CMs. And what exactly is the use of Provisioner Tokens after you have 3 sets of legendary armour? Answer: none.

So some suggestions for you to consider (presumably combinations of the below, rather than one or the other):1) Exotic Insignias & Inscriptions are not so useful for characters who wear legendary armour, but are useful for gearing alts, at least until the Legendary Armoury arrives.2) T6 and T7 mats are always useful, as are Amalgamated Gemstones and Mystic Coins and Mystic Clovers as these help people make legendary items.3) Ascended food or the cultivated mats are just inherently useful for all game content.4) 10 gold is a good addition and a sensible amount; not too much and not too little.5) Tyrian Exchange Vouchers (yes, the ones from Black Lion Chests).6) Random chance of Black Lion Keys, Primers and perhaps other non-rare Black Lion Chest loot.

Please consider.

Adzekul

[Linken.6345]

@Adzekul.3104 said:Dear Arenanet,

Are you willing to review / consider changes to the weekly CM raid reward? Is this matter closed or open? This could be used to truly encourage people to train themselves and others, and increase the population if the rewards were more useful.

My concerns:I am a regular normal-mode raider (approaching 450 LI) who wants to learn the CMs, but nobody trains them (even on EU) and the population of capable teams and trainers is extremely small. Anyone who can do the weekly achievement has no need of the rewards you are offering (they already have the number of legendary armour sets that they want) but 10 gold is not so bad as part of a reward. The appeal of Gaeting Crystals assumes that everyone wants the chair or Dhuum's armour, and while many do, this is largely limited to people who cannot currently do CMs. And what exactly is the use of Provisioner Tokens after you have 3 sets of legendary armour? Answer: none.

So some suggestions for you to consider (presumably combinations of the below, rather than one or the other):1) Exotic Insignias & Inscriptions are not so useful for characters who wear legendary armour, but are useful for gearing alts, at least until the Legendary Armoury arrives.2) T6 and T7 mats are always useful, as are Amalgamated Gemstones and Mystic Coins and Mystic Clovers as these help people make legendary items.3) Ascended food or the cultivated mats are just inherently useful for all game content.4) 10 gold is a good addition and a sensible amount; not too much and not too little.5) Tyrian Exchange Vouchers (yes, the ones from Black Lion Chests).6) Random chance of Black Lion Keys, Primers and perhaps other non-rare Black Lion Chest loot.

Please consider.

Adzekul

What do the chest offer now?

[Arcaniaxs.4519]

@Linken.6345 said:

@Adzekul.3104 said:Dear Arenanet,

Are you willing to review / consider changes to the weekly CM raid reward? Is this matter closed or open? This could be used to truly encourage people to train themselves and others, and increase the population if the rewards were more useful.

My concerns:I am a regular normal-mode raider (approaching 450 LI) who wants to learn the CMs, but nobody trains them (even on EU) and the population of capable teams and trainers is extremely small. Anyone who can do the weekly achievement has no need of the rewards you are offering (they already have the number of legendary armour sets that they want) but 10 gold is not so bad as part of a reward. The appeal of Gaeting Crystals assumes that everyone wants the chair or Dhuum's armour, and while many do, this is largely limited to people who cannot currently do CMs. And what exactly is the use of Provisioner Tokens after you have 3 sets of legendary armour? Answer: none.

So some suggestions for you to consider (presumably combinations of the below, rather than one or the other):1) Exotic Insignias & Inscriptions are not so useful for characters who wear legendary armour, but are useful for gearing alts, at least until the Legendary Armoury arrives.2) T6 and T7 mats are always useful, as are Amalgamated Gemstones and Mystic Coins and Mystic Clovers as these help people make legendary items.3) Ascended food or the cultivated mats are just inherently useful for all game content.4) 10 gold is a good addition and a sensible amount; not too much and not too little.5) Tyrian Exchange Vouchers (yes, the ones from Black Lion Chests).6) Random chance of Black Lion Keys, Primers and perhaps other non-rare Black Lion Chest loot.

Please consider.

Adzekul

What do the chest offer now?

Skritt lvl loot

[ParadoX.3124]

Give us the same box we have when completing CM for the first time : Food and utilitiesOr increase gold's from 10 to 25 at least.At this rate donjons are more profitable than raid.Hard contents should reward with better reward.

We appreciate the added rewards but this is not enough still

[Bovan.9481]

Just to chime in my idea on how to handle all the extra insights and divinations we have. We currently have a god of fractal, PvP and WvW title but raids seem to be missing. I would happy to have a system that allows us to buy a ''God/Godess of Raiding'' title for 1000 insights and divinations. I'm a bit worried about adding more cost like magnetite shards and gaeting crystals to them simply because most people spend them on infusions and such, and I can see people getting upset who made tons of extra legendary armors. But I still think this could do the trick.

After that I'd be happy to have a sink for them like trophy shipments.

[Delita Silverburg.8632]

For anyone who doesn't know. The Treasure chest for completing the 5 CMs for the week gives the following, on top of 10 extra gold for the week.

10 Provisioner Tokens50 Gaeting Crystals

As some people have mentioned above, for anyone who is able to successfully complete 5 CMs for a week, we don't really need provisioner tokens. By the time you're even considering doing CM raids, let alone on a regular basis, you've likely got leggy armor already, and only whales will get legendary runes/sigils.

If the matter isn't already set in stone and decided, I would love for them to consider some other option of rewards than this as well.

I would also suggest using data mining metrics to look at just how many of your active raid groups are actually completing this challenge with the current reward you put out. I bet it's only a small portion of our community.

[Delita Silverburg.8632]

Also unrelated, but relevant, I did the math. Given that 2000 gaeting crystals gets you 275g for a peerless infusion after costs, having to spend 1 gold and 50 gaeting crystals for a trophy shipment is a bit of a joke. you get 40 trophy shipments for the 2k crystals, that on the high end give you 2g each. that means you spend 40g to get 80g so a 40g profit if you're lucky, vs a 275g profit. Infusions win hands down. Only putting this here for people to know not to waste their mats on the shipments.

[Phobeius.5410]

@Delita Silverburg.8632 said:For anyone who doesn't know. The Treasure chest for completing the 5 CMs for the week gives the following, on top of 10 extra gold for the week.

10 Provisioner Tokens50 Gaeting Crystals

As some people have mentioned above, for anyone who is able to successfully complete 5 CMs for a week, we don't really need provisioner tokens. By the time you're even considering doing CM raids, let alone on a regular basis, you've likely got leggy armor already, and only whales will get legendary runes/sigils.

I can complete 5 CMs a week, but I still need provisioner tokens because I want to go for a second and maybe third set of legendary armor :pStill, the amount of gold/tokens/shards for doing those weekly CMs is a nice addition (as everyone said), but the amounts could be a little better since it takes a lot of effort when you're not in a decent static.

[Linken.6345]

@Phobeius.5410 said:

@Delita Silverburg.8632 said:For anyone who doesn't know. The Treasure chest for completing the 5 CMs for the week gives the following, on top of 10 extra gold for the week.

10 Provisioner Tokens50 Gaeting Crystals

As some people have mentioned above, for anyone who is able to successfully complete 5 CMs for a week, we don't really need provisioner tokens. By the time you're even considering doing CM raids, let alone on a regular basis, you've likely got leggy armor already, and only whales will get legendary runes/sigils.

I can complete 5 CMs a week, but I still need provisioner tokens because I want to go for a second and maybe third set of legendary armor :pStill, the amount of gold/tokens/shards for doing those weekly CMs is a nice addition (as everyone said), but the amounts could be a little better since it takes a lot of effort when you're not in a decent static.

What 5 would you say is easiest?My guess isCairnMODeimosQadim v2....

[Astralporing.1957]

@Linken.6345 said:What 5 would you say is easiest?My guess isCairnMODeimosQadim v2....Desmina CM is actually very close to the normal difficulty, so by the time you have her on farm mode, doing CM should be no problem whatsoever. Conjured Amalgamate's CM should also be put in the easy category.

[Sugar Min.5834]

But those rewards are only for the elitists. Raids are for the know-all-BiS veterans, as one of my guild officers so discreetly try to explain it. But still not discreet enough...

What about us casual players? We probably pay more real money to buy your gem store stuff than those 'elitists' who always use gold conversion and never have to spend a single cents.

[Delita Silverburg.8632]

@"Mil.3562" said:But those rewards are only for the elitists. Raids are for the know-all-BiS veterans, as one of my guild officers so discreetly try to explain it. But still not discreet enough...

What about us casual players? We probably pay more real money to buy your gem store stuff than those 'elitists' who always use gold conversion and never have to spend a single cents.

You're making a few very bad assumptions here.

1. The idea that raiders are elitists is a false statement. Just like with any community, there are bad apples, but just as many good ones. There wouldn't be raid training discords and guilds if everyone was as "elitist" as you think. Some of us actually want to grow our community to get our game mode new content, since that's what Anet told us it would take to get Wing 8 and beyond.
2. I, a person who is in your "elitist" category of raiders, spend a significant amount of real world money in the gem store to support the game I love. Presuming that you spend more than X player and also thinking that entitles you to anything is just a wasted effort of your time.
3. You can actually earn more gold from just farming open world content like Silverwastes and Drizzlewood Coast than you get from raiding. It's just a matter of what you want to spend your game time on. 30g/hr from SW that you can do any hour of any day, but us raiders can only do each raid once a week. Still think it's unfair? I can tell you it is, but not from the direction you think.

[Astralporing.1957]

@"Delita Silverburg.8632" said:30g/hr from SW that you can do any hour of any day, but us raiders can only do each raid once a week. Still think it's unfair? I can tell you it is, but not from the direction you think.Have you actually tried doing SW? 30g/hr is a meme, most people i know can at best get like 10-15g/h, and not on consistent basis. Very few players can keep up farming mindlessly too long, day after day. While there are people in SW everyday, most of them are there only for relatively short visits. The actual "pro" SW farmers, the ones getting those mythical good incomes from that place (and not getting burned out after a week or two) are probably a group more elite and much smaller than the raiding community.

[Shadowmoon.7986]

I would trade out the 10 gold for a guarantee reward unlock. I think many in the top of raid community would want more skins than more gold.

[Delita Silverburg.8632]

@Astralporing.1957 said:

@"Delita Silverburg.8632" said:30g/hr from SW that you can do any hour of any day, but us raiders can only do each raid once a week. Still think it's unfair? I can tell you it is, but not from the direction you think.Have you actually tried doing SW? 30g/hr is a meme, most people i know can at best get like 10-15g/h, and not on consistent basis. Very few players can keep up farming mindlessly too long, day after day. While there are people in SW everyday, most of them are there only for relatively short visits. The actual "pro" SW farmers, the ones getting those mythical good incomes from that place (and not getting burned out after a week or two) are probably a group more elite and much smaller than the raiding community.

That's a completely fair point, but the other person was arguing that they had a barrier of access to making gold in a reliable way. Farming may not be fun for everyone, but it is certainly available to anyone who wants to put in the effort, which in that case, is nothing but time and auto-attacking for credit.

Raids on the other hand do require some initial investment to participate. It's not exclusionary, but if you don't have boons, heals and dps, you will suffer to get kills. Each kill nets you an average of 2.5g, and some bosses are significantly harder than others with unique mechanics where you need specific professions. Which means you have to spend time learning how to complete them before you would have them "on farm". Given that there are 25 total bosses, and most static groups can complete that in 5-6hrs, for a total of about 64g from kills, you are averaging around 13g/hr. from kills on the high end, plus whatever from lucky drops. Not to mention you have to kill each and every boss to be close to this projection. Also again, as a reminder, you can only do that till you kill all bosses for the week. So you can't continuously farm raids like say, fractals or open world, since raid currency is even capped at less than killing every boss.