A 5th attunement mechanic is the best balancing option for core ele

[Arheundel.6451]

It would be something only accessible to core ele and the lack of it with other elites would be easily explainable lore-wise say: the focus necessary to maintain this 5th attunement is disrupted when using different techniques from elite specializations :

-no additional weapon skill required-active recharge-easy to balance with numbers

I'd go and use something like this :-"15s CD charging Arcane Plane: every action charge the 5th attunement by x%"- when used the 5th attunement would give a different effect based on the current attunement

Fire = Incoming condition damage reduced by 22% for 5sWater = gain resistance for 2sAir = Applies pulsing blind in a 240 radius for 4sEarth = Incoming direct damage reduced by 33% for 5s

Regardless of the weapon set used, a core ele would gain access to the 5th attunement which would then be disabled when you equip an elite trait line, easy, simple, and clean...they just need to copy/paste something like druid or shroud mechanic that works in a similar manner ( druid mechanic specifically )

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

So, as you cast F5 charges by x%. When used it gives ABC benefit based on the current attunement. Said benefits being defensive in nature.

Not a bad idea. My 2 copper on them:Fire = Incoming condition damage reduced by 33% for 5s (not sure if you typo'd it but 33% sounds better to me).Water = gain resistance for 2s Cleanse 1 condition every second for 2sAir = Applies pulsing blind in a 240 radius for 4s :+1:Earth = Incoming direct damage reduced by 33% for 5s Make it Protection. I realize your intent here was to stack it WITH protection, but that would be too powerful.

[Arheundel.6451]

@Lan Deathrider.5910 said:So, as you cast F5 charges by x%. When used it gives ABC benefit based on the current attunement. Said benefits being defensive in nature.

Not a bad idea. My 2 copper on them:Fire = Incoming condition damage reduced by 33% for 5s (not sure if you typo'd it but 33% sounds better to me).Yeah I guess 33% would be better but in that case I'd drop to 3s, we want to avoid any nerfs to fire line cleansingWater = gain resistance for 2s Cleanse 1 condition every second for 2sI believe that would be too much, one or the otherAir = Applies pulsing blind in a 240 radius for 4s :+1:Earth = Incoming direct damage reduced by 33% for 5s Make it Protection. I realize your intent here was to stack it WITH protection, but that would be too powerful.We can change to unblockable push at 240 radius, that would be a less bulky and more useful solution

[Tseison.4659]

Haven't played as an Ele but always wondered why they didn't get a 5th attunement that was purely Arcane based? So basically keep that idea of "whenever you cast spells, it charges your, we'll say, your ARCANE form," which when activated, changes your weapon, heal, utility and elite into different (not matching the skills you chose) preset of arcane abilities? Just my opinion though, but would like to see Eles explore different elements.

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

In my experience, they nerf Elem/weaver because of small portion of players who generates the most complaints ; not because the class is broken overall.More skills available and also more spells at any time; I'm pretty sure it will enlarge the disparity between strong and low players; and so be even more criticized and hard to balance. But I agree Core elem lacks something, lacks a purpose. * Edit I didn't undestand all, bad in english, in fact I agree with most of your post.

[Emberheart.8426]

Actually the best way to balance core ele is to get rid of half of Weaver's unnecessary damage modifiers and stat boosts, while straight up buffing all the weapon skills. They could even revamp combos to make them actually useful for once. One of ele's main advantages used to be combos, and they have been mostly useless since HoT.

Ele weapon skills are too pathetic these days, and it would help a lot of they were buffed. Such a buff does help weaver and tempest, but it helps core much more. Weaver spends time using dual skills and can't access skill 3 reliably. Tempest uses 4 second overloads. So clearly, core would benefit the most by far.

[Puck.3697]

I would upvote. The problem is I'm expecting the next elite specc to not have attunement swapping. And likely be arcane based with a ranged weapon (longbow or dual pistols)

Imho. I get the issues surrounding core. But I don't think it's due to the lack of something j think it's because it's too similar to its elite counter parts.

Imho the real fix is to change the attunements each specc gets.

Core elementalist gets bunkerish stuff. So they keep the current elements. Maybe give em some condi buffs and have them be able to bunker.

Tempest replace some of the attunements with other things so it's primarily support. So maybe swap out lightning with Life and change earth to nature/plant.

Weaver change fire to Wind and earth to Arcane

Then you have the symmetry of

Tempest has more support for his Allies but loses access to bleeds and self invunerability from earth.

Weaver is more damage focused, but loses access to conditional damage and the invunerability of earth.

You need to vary the elements each specc gets. Because the problem is ele is built to do everything with each attunement i.e fire is always burn earth is always defense/bleed

Your idea fixs core ele. But doesn't stop following elites outclassing other elites.

[Vancho.8750]

@Arheundel.6451Here is another idea, core ele gets special action key like core rev got one, the key will lets you swap weapons , of course it will be way way higher in combat swap cd since ele has so many skills already. It might be overkill and it might be broken, but people can kind of already do that in WvW by leaving combat, only in pvp you are stuck on one weapon set all the time. Also arenanet has done most of the job already by adding the weapon slots and the swap button on ele.Best part is that elites actually lose out something when taken, retroactive fake nerf but it is ok.

[Puck.3697]

@Vancho.8750 said:@Arheundel.6451Here is another idea, core ele gets special action key like core rev got one, the key will lets you swap weapons , of course it will be way way higher in combat swap cd since ele has so many skills already. It might be overkill and it might be broken, but people can kind of already do that in WvW by leaving combat, only in pvp you are stuck on one weapon set all the time. Also arenanet has done most of the job already by adding the weapon slots and the swap button on ele.Best part is that elites actually lose out something when taken, retroactive fake nerf but it is ok.

The issue is due to how different weapon builds are for ele. U wouldn't be able to take all the traits you need to utilise weapon swapping.

You would get something the elite speccs don't have sure but you would also not use it because it would likely be worse.

Eles elites are too fundmentally similar to core for both to exist. Mesmer also has that problem aswell

Neither elite changed eles mechanic. Just gave it a extra thing in the mechanic.

[Vancho.8750]

@Daddy.8125 said:

@Vancho.8750 said:@Arheundel.6451Here is another idea, core ele gets special action key like core rev got one, the key will lets you swap weapons , of course it will be way way higher in combat swap cd since ele has so many skills already. It might be overkill and it might be broken, but people can kind of already do that in WvW by leaving combat, only in pvp you are stuck on one weapon set all the time. Also arenanet has done most of the job already by adding the weapon slots and the swap button on ele.Best part is that elites actually lose out something when taken, retroactive fake nerf but it is ok.

The issue is due to how different weapon builds are for ele. U wouldn't be able to take all the traits you need to utilise weapon swapping.

You would get something the elite speccs don't have sure but you would also not use it because it would likely be worse.

Eles elites are too fundmentally similar to core for both to exist. Mesmer also has that problem aswell

Neither elite changed eles mechanic. Just gave it a extra thing in the mechanic.This is valid concern, and general issue with the Core+ design on some classes, those need full on base reworks since they rely on a gimmick to add something to the elite over changing how its played. There is no valid reason to play core ele over the elites since they do the same but are have extra stuff, a design like Necromancer would have went way better where the mechanic is changed fundamentally from core to elites.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

Or just have a special F5 that resets all attunement CDs, but itself has a 10s cd per attunement refreshed in that way.

[HappyHubris.1096]

@"Arheundel.6451" said:It would be something only accessible to core ele and the lack of it with other elites would be easily explainable lore-wise say: the focus necessary to maintain this 5th attunement is disrupted when using different techniques from elite specializations :

-no additional weapon skill required-active recharge-easy to balance with numbers

I'd go and use something like this :-"15s CD charging Arcane Plane: every action charge the 5th attunement by x%"- when used the 5th attunement would give a different effect based on the current attunement

Fire = Incoming condition damage reduced by 22% for 5sWater = gain resistance for 2sAir = Applies pulsing blind in a 240 radius for 4sEarth = Incoming direct damage reduced by 33% for 5s

Regardless of the weapon set used, a core ele would gain access to the 5th attunement which would then be disabled when you equip an elite trait line, easy, simple, and clean...they just need to copy/paste something like druid or shroud mechanic that works in a similar manner ( druid mechanic specifically )

I just don't see this ever happening:

• It's a PvP-only core class mechanic.
• It heavily increases the complexity of what already is one of the more complex core classes for FTP players.
• It involves a UI change that will necessitate rewriting documentation, performing testing, etc.

The most likely outcome is that core elementalist will be untouched, though maybe it could get some sort of simple buff like reduced attunement swapping cooldowns or a stacking damage buff every time you swap elements.

[HappyHubris.1096]

@Lan Deathrider.5910 said:Or just have a special F5 that resets all attunement CDs, but itself has a 10s cd per attunement refreshed in that way.

This is simple enough to happen, and would also help new players that find themselves stranded outside of the element they need.

[HappyHubris.1096]

@Daddy.8125 said:I would upvote. The problem is I'm expecting the next elite specc to not have attunement swapping. And likely be arcane based with a ranged weapon (longbow or dual pistols)

Imho. I get the issues surrounding core. But I don't think it's due to the lack of something j think it's because it's too similar to its elite counter parts.

Imho the real fix is to change the attunements each specc gets.

Core elementalist gets bunkerish stuff. So they keep the current elements. Maybe give em some condi buffs and have them be able to bunker.

Tempest replace some of the attunements with other things so it's primarily support. So maybe swap out lightning with Life and change earth to nature/plant.

Weaver change fire to Wind and earth to Arcane

Then you have the symmetry of

Tempest has more support for his Allies but loses access to bleeds and self invunerability from earth.

Weaver is more damage focused, but loses access to conditional damage and the invunerability of earth.

You need to vary the elements each specc gets. Because the problem is ele is built to do everything with each attunement i.e fire is always burn earth is always defense/bleed

Your idea fixs core ele. But doesn't stop following elites outclassing other elites.

There's no way that ANet reworks two prior elite specs this much in 2021.

[Puck.3697]

@HappyHubris.1096 said:

@Daddy.8125 said:I would upvote. The problem is I'm expecting the next elite specc to not have attunement swapping. And likely be arcane based with a ranged weapon (longbow or dual pistols)

Imho. I get the issues surrounding core. But I don't think it's due to the lack of something j think it's because it's too similar to its elite counter parts.

Imho the real fix is to change the attunements each specc gets.

Core elementalist gets bunkerish stuff. So they keep the current elements. Maybe give em some condi buffs and have them be able to bunker.

Tempest replace some of the attunements with other things so it's primarily support. So maybe swap out lightning with Life and change earth to nature/plant.

Weaver change fire to Wind and earth to Arcane

Then you have the symmetry of

Tempest has more support for his Allies but loses access to bleeds and self invunerability from earth.

Weaver is more damage focused, but loses access to conditional damage and the invunerability of earth.

You need to vary the elements each specc gets. Because the problem is ele is built to do everything with each attunement i.e fire is always burn earth is always defense/bleed

Your idea fixs core ele. But doesn't stop following elites outclassing other elites.

There's no way that ANet reworks two prior elite specs this much in 2021.

Your correct. It's also very unlikely we see a fifth element introduced to the class which the brand new elite specc can't use too.

Their selling hype attached to a new elite then gonna give you a new playstyle at core. It's not realistically going to happen.

And in terms it's the truth.

Your selling a mechanic which is highly anticipated to be the new elites mechanic for a lead on the core elementalist.

Alot of people are speculating it's very likely elementalist is going get longbow or dual pistols with the arcane element introduced as a spellslinger. Giving the fact the specc lacks a ranged alternative. It's prolly likely.

Introducing a baseline feature and playstyle change would appease core ele. But it would also discourage people investing in the brand new elite..

[HappyHubris.1096]

It's really frustrating that "elemental spellcaster" and "ranged alternative" need to share a sentence.Screw new specs just make staff and scepter viable (preferably without fresh air).