Presence of keep only when outnumbered

[Brutal Augus.5917]

What would be the pros and cons of having things like presence of keep or the final tactic slot of objectives in general only becoming active/available for use when outnumbered.

[Bristingr.5034]

Presence of the Keep is mostly for the +10 Supply. The small stat boost given by the tactic won't really help the small amount of defenders against a zerg.

[TheGrimm.5624]

No thank you. It is fine as it is. Defending has been nerfed enough already to the point that when swords show odds are good the fight is already over. Not to mention how would you return all the resources the the guilds that built up that buff spent in time and materials to be able to get those buffs in place. No if you want to buff outnumbered, do it in some other way. 

[XenesisII.1540]

Not a bad idea, it becomes more of a last stand buff instead.

The good: Sides that are rolling maps won't have this advantage for their keeps.

The bad: But when you're outnumbered it's pretty much an empty map anyways so you're also not taking those keeps from them lol, and you'll gonna get rolled by the incoming zerg/blob anyways.

So /shrug

 

Presence of the keep only affects the keeps, I don't know why people think keeps should be something easy to attack and capture in 5 mins. There's already plenty of scenarios where keeps are swapped all day with or without defenses present, where you have zergs break in to camp lord rooms for "fights", and three desert keeps which a lot of players half heartedly bother to defend.

 

Don't see a reason to remove it, siege was already nerfed to the ground, and boon balls can go wherever they want and do whatever they want. Nothing wrong with a little "home field advantage" for an important objective. Get creative in scenarios to pull/delay the enemy off the keeps, which sometimes requires you to get some help from the "other enemy", this already happens a lot for smc.

[Brutal Augus.5917]

5 hours ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

No thank you. It is fine as it is. Defending has been nerfed enough already to the point that when swords show odds are good the fight is already over. Not to mention how would you return all the resources the the guilds that built up that buff spent in time and materials to be able to get those buffs in place. No if you want to buff outnumbered, do it in some other way. 

Thanks for input but you've taken the post a little bit out of context. The idea was not that they would lose the buff after scribing them etc. The idea was that when placing the tactic on an objective it only becomes active upon outnumbered buff also becoming active.

 

So pretty much just conditional activation.

 

I'll take the rest of the post to be cons against the idea.

Edited June 29, 2021 by Brutal Augus.5917

[Brutal Augus.5917]

3 hours ago, XenesisII.1540 said:

Not a bad idea, it becomes more of a last stand buff instead.

The good: Sides that are rolling maps won't have this advantage for their keeps.

The bad: But when you're outnumbered it's pretty much an empty map anyways so you're also not taking those keeps from them lol, and you'll gonna get rolled by the incoming zerg/blob anyways.

So /shrug

 

Presence of the keep only affects the keeps, I don't know why people think keeps should be something easy to attack and capture in 5 mins. There's already plenty of scenarios where keeps are swapped all day with or without defenses present, where you have zergs break in to camp lord rooms for "fights", and three desert keeps which a lot of players half heartedly bother to defend.

 

Don't see a reason to remove it, siege was already nerfed to the ground, and boon balls can go wherever they want and do whatever they want. Nothing wrong with a little "home field advantage" for an important objective. Get creative in scenarios to pull/delay the enemy off the keeps, which sometimes requires you to get some help from the "other enemy", this already happens a lot for smc.

Thank you for your input Xen.

I will probably make a section listing posted pros and cons eventually. 

[Brutal Augus.5917]

6 hours ago, Bristingr.5034 said:

Presence of the Keep is mostly for the +10 Supply. The small stat boost given by the tactic won't really help the small amount of defenders against a zerg.

That's a good point. Do you think the amount of extra stats provided should scale depending on how outnumbered? Not so high that the smaller group can win effortlessly but enough to be more signifigant?

[MedievalThings.5417]

This seems like an ok idea, but then you end up with issues like we have on TC.  15 alts running into walls, 18 hours a day, to prevent us from fielding a normal response.  I wish this was a random, once a month thing, but this happens several days out of every week.  Both regular players who don't want to log out, and tons of alts who just want to troll, watch chat, or player cap us.

[kamikharzeeh.8016]

12 hours ago, Brutal Augus.5917 said:

What would be the pros and cons of having things like presence of keep or the final tactic slot of objectives in general only becoming active/available for use when outnumbered.

would be still bad. the outnumbered buff is overall a pretty bad thing, since it only triggers and vanishes at the end of one 5min-cycle.

 

it would need to be a variable system, that gives stats in amounts of the enemy players : your players ratio.

[allshallperish.4620]

i heard riverside players stopped claiming keeps as they know they will lose it when faced vs FoW

[Amrothian.3721]

10 hours ago, allshallperish.4620 said:

i heard riverside players stopped claiming keeps as they know they will lose it when faced vs FoW

Everyone knows big castello is the only worthy objective to defend

 

[TheGrimm.5624]

On 6/29/2021 at 6:06 PM, Brutal Augus.5917 said:

Thanks for input but you've taken the post a little bit out of context. The idea was not that they would lose the buff after scribing them etc. The idea was that when placing the tactic on an objective it only becomes active upon outnumbered buff also becoming active.

 

So pretty much just conditional activation.

 

I'll take the rest of the post to be cons against the idea.

Sorry if it seems out of context, but making it something that is only active for 1 of three sides is, to me, pretty much the same as eliminating the buff. Again I would recommend further (non-stat) bolsters to outnumbered first.  Good hunting!

[phreeak.1023]

On 6/30/2021 at 8:25 AM, allshallperish.4620 said:

i heard riverside players stopped claiming keeps as they know they will lose it when faced vs FoW

Funny because u loose your keeps on homeborder all the time 😄

 

[SweetPotato.7456]

It is not applicable because there are multiple maps to consider.  And many guild that work and move in sync  on different maps , can be easily exploited.

Edited July 2, 2021 by SweetPotato.7456