The big lie

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

weaver is like a C.Bechstein D282, while ranger is like a Casio SA-76

[Ragnar.4257]

"Ranger is 200iq 4d-chess giga-brain class"

 

"My evidence? I play the cello, and, ummm, WoW references".

 

This forum just keeps on giving.

[Lucentfir.7430]

4 hours ago, Ragnar.4257 said:

"Ranger is 200iq 4d-chess giga-brain class"

 

"My evidence? I play the cello, and, ummm, WoW references".

 

This forum just keeps on giving.

Tbf the forums always provides top tier meme material and varying levels of ridiculousness. Expecting anything else is just asking for emotional disaster and a sadder outlook for the game. 😀

[RedAvenged.5217]

Anyways ranger is still b teir.

 

if your a pleb and claim it’s s teir than necro must be sss.

you’re kidding yourself at this point

[Sovarica.4368]

I feel like the rangers are usually the ones that get the most salty or toxic

[RedAvenged.5217]

20 minutes ago, Sovari.7246 said:

I feel like the rangers are usually the ones that get the most salty or toxic

That’s how I feel about cmc for catering to people that threaten people!!!

[razaelll.8324]

2 hours ago, RedAvenged.5217 said:

Anyways ranger is still b teir.

 

if your a pleb and claim it’s s teir than necro must be sss.

you’re kidding yourself at this point

 

 

No no no, its S+++++ tier, just it is sooooooooo unbelievably hard to play ranger that noone can play it well enough, thats why you feel its b tier, as you said you never seen a good ranger so far, it is just too hard 

Edited July 19, 2021 by razaelll.8324

[felix.2386]

On 7/17/2021 at 11:52 PM, razaelll.8324 said:

I think you are strongly over exaggerating here and i find it very hard to believe on that statement.

I am wondering if weaver is that easy as you claim , why some of the top players consider it having the most complex and hard skills rotations?

lol not exaggerating.

GW2 pvp now require so little skill compared to core GW2.

that if you are at least experienced in plat2, you can easily pick an class and compete at the same level as your main.

you though it takes class skill, but there's currently no class skill, gw2 is now incredibly spammy and less thought with the current design and balance of the game, just not fun anymore.

[razaelll.8324]

3 minutes ago, felix.2386 said:

lol not exaggerating.

GW2 pvp now require so little skill compared to core GW2.

that if you are at least experienced in plat2, you can easily pick an class and compete at the same level as your main.

you though it takes class skill, but there's currently no class skill, gw2 is now incredibly spammy and less thought with the current design and balance of the game, just not fun anymore.

I understand completely what you mean, i wouldnt say there is no skill because if you compare a plat 2 to gold 2 player the difference is big, but there is a bit too much aoe spam.

[felix.2386]

32 minutes ago, razaelll.8324 said:

I understand completely what you mean, i wouldnt say there is no skill because if you compare a plat 2 to gold 2 player the difference is big, but there is a bit too much aoe spam.

even in pve, its the same, stack and spam aoes and overload yourself with buffs with 100% up time, instead of saving the cds for the big hits and big moments,. this is just a joke now i finally realized.

imagine timing protection for big hits(aegis has to go). or timing 25 might for certain burn phases. that would be so much more engaging and fun.

Edited July 19, 2021 by felix.2386

[razaelll.8324]

8 minutes ago, felix.2386 said:

even in pve, its the same, stack and spam aoes and overload yourself with buffs with 100% up time, instead of saving the cds for the big hits and big moments,. this is just a joke now i finally realized.

imagine timing protection for big hits(aegis has to go). or timing 25 might for certain burn phases. that would be so much more engaging and fun.

I agree with you on that.

[Kuma.1503]

On 7/17/2021 at 1:03 PM, RedAvenged.5217 said:

I have never meant anyone through all Azeroth or shadowlands that would recommend hunter to a new player for pvp with a straight face.

 

I've had the opposite experience. Whenever our guild managed to recruit a newbie, or whenever hearing others giving advice to new players for PvE or PvP they generally recommend  hunter. 

 

I'll try to resist going into a rant about class design in WoW, so instead I'll give a brief rundown. 

 

In short, classes have been simplified substantially. Blizzard pruned a lot of skills and passives moving from MoP into Legion. Aftifacts were used to plug in holes and add depth. Then artifacts were removed in BfA, and since then classes are generally pretty barebones/simple. 

 

The devs are well aware of this, and the general philosophy blizzard holds is that classes should be relatively easy to play (Ion has stated multiple times in interviews that he wants to avoid bloating classes back to MoP levels.) Instead, they focus on creating difficult content. Encounters in WoW can get very challenging, especially for new players. High mythic keys can be especially brutal if you miss a mechanic. 

 

Mobility options have gone down for ranged casters (Rip shaman's mobile lightning bolt) so if you want to get a cast off, you will need to plant your feet and hope either there aren't any swirlies for you to dodge or plan around them. This gets a lot of new players killed. So many that it's become a meme among the playerbase. "Don't stand in the fire"

 

Melee classes have full mobility while dpsing, but they can get screwed by swirlies and spread/stack mechanics that force them to drop all dps until the mechanic resolves. For them, the a common issue is tunnel vision/greeding. 

 

Hunters, and especially BM hunters have neither of these issues. They are ranged so they don't get screwed the same way melee do by mechanics. They have full mobility while dpsing, so you don't have to worry about whether that swirly beneath your feet will kill you before you get off that long 3 second cast. 

 

This makes doing encounters objectively easier on BM hunter than any other class. Naturally, the rotation is also simple (as are most rotations in WoW as of late) so that shouldn't consume much of your mental bandwidth. 

 

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

 

In PvP, Ranged face a different host of issues. 

 

Getting off a damned cast when you're forced to roleplay a stationary turret while doin dps. "Okay now I'll get off my 3 second arcane blast--"

 

Nope you got sapped by a rogue

 

"Ok now"

 

Nope, gouged by the rogue

 

"This time for sure" 

 

Stunned by the rogue

 

"This time--"

 

Lol interrupted. Have fun being locked out of half your spellbook.

 

And that's assuming you only have ONE melee to deal with. Imagine you're getting trained down by 2 or more. It's a common complaint among PvPers that playing a caster in a team that won't peel for you feels like hell. Healers have it especially rough because they will get trained down due to how important a target they are, and if they don't get peeled there is nothing they can do. 

 

Then, yet again, you have hunters. Even their casted spells can't be interrupted, you need to hit them with a stun or some other form of CC to stop their casting. They can kite freely while doing dps so melee can't simply train them down and lock them out of playing the game. And you don't have the fear of running thick into the heat of combat, you can pew pew safely from range. 

 

If you're new to PvP and want to guarantee that you at least have an impact in each game, BM hunter is the class for you. 

 

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

 

 

tl;dr BM Hunter is the most widely recommended class to newbies, and is considered by most to be an easy (if not the easiest) spec to play.

Edited July 19, 2021 by Kuma.1503
Added PvP relevant section

[razaelll.8324]

20 minutes ago, Kuma.1503 said:

 

I've had the opposite experience. Whenever our guild managed to recruit a newbie, or whenever hearing others giving advice to new players for PvE or PvP they generally recommend  hunter. 

 

I'll try to resist going into a rant about class design in WoW, so instead I'll give a brief rundown. 

 

In short, classes have been simplified substantially. Blizzard pruned a lot of skills and passives moving from MoP into Legion. Aftifacts were used to plug in holes and add depth. Then artifacts were removed in BfA, and since then classes are generally pretty barebones/simple. 

 

The devs are well aware of this, and the general philosophy blizzard holds is that classes should be relatively easy to play (Ion has stated multiple times in interviews that he wants to avoid bloating classes back to MoP levels.) Instead, they focus on creating difficult content. Encounters in WoW can get very challenging, especially for new players. High mythic keys can be especially brutal if you miss a mechanic. 

 

Mobility options have gone down for ranged casters (Rip shaman's mobile lightning bolt) so if you want to get a cast off, you will need to plant your feet and hope either there aren't any swirlies for you to dodge or plan around them. This gets a lot of new players killed. So many that it's become a meme among the playerbase. "Don't stand in the fire"

 

Melee classes have full mobility while dpsing, but they can get screwed by swirlies and spread/stack mechanics that force them to drop all dps until the mechanic resolves. For them, the a common issue is tunnel vision/greeding. 

 

Hunters, and especially BM hunters have neither of these issues. They are ranged so they don't get screwed the same way melee do by mechanics. They have full mobility while dpsing, so you don't have to worry about whether that swirly beneath your feet will kill you before you get off that long 3 second cast. 

 

This makes doing encounters objectively easier on BM hunter than any other class. Naturally, the rotation is also simple (as are most rotations in WoW as of late) so that shouldn't consume much of your mental bandwidth. 

 

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

 

In PvP, Ranged face a different host of issues. 

 

Getting off a damned cast when you're forced to roleplay a stationary turret while doin dps. "Okay now I'll get off my 3 second arcane blast--"

 

Nope you got sapped by a rogue

 

"Ok now"

 

Nope, gouged by the rogue

 

"This time for sure" 

 

Stunned by the rogue

 

"This time--"

 

Lol interrupted. Have fun being locked out of half your spellbook.

 

And that's assuming you only have ONE melee to deal with. Imagine you're getting trained down by 2 or more. It's a common complaint among PvPers that playing a caster in a team that won't peel for you feels like hell. Healers have it especially rough because they will get trained down due to how important a target they are, and if they don't get peeled there is nothing they can do. 

 

Then, yet again, you have hunters. Even their casted spells can't be interrupted, you need to hit them with a stun or some other form of CC to stop their casting. They can kite freely while doing dps so melee can't simply train them down and lock them out of playing the game. And you don't have the fear of running thick into the heat of combat, you can pew pew safely from range. 

 

If you're new to PvP and want to guarantee that you at least have an impact in each game, BM hunter is the class for you. 

 

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

 

 

tl;dr BM Hunter is the most widely recommended class to newbies, and is considered by most to be an easy (if not the easiest) spec to play.

Exactly. As i said hunter were considered very hard back in vanilla, when you could not place your traps while in combat, you had to hardcast aimed shot and also controll your pet, but now hunter specially bm is one of the easiest if not the easiest class to play in both pve and pvp.

 

As aways very well said and explained point Kuma.

Edited July 19, 2021 by razaelll.8324

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

On 7/17/2021 at 12:16 AM, RedAvenged.5217 said:

Ranger is ez, brain dead in fact.

 

On 7/17/2021 at 11:41 PM, RedAvenged.5217 said:

weaver is insanely ez

 

I (sort of) half agree with these statements, but slightly more nuanced. (Read: "This take might be bad but I think it's still worth saying")

 

Granted, these classes are not extremely mechanically easy and require some degree of mastery.

 

However.

 

. They are flowchart easy. 

 

For most dps rangers and weavers that are not insane, like staff or dagger / dagger, they do not require significant deviation from their normal damage output rotation in order to stay alive or continue to output damage on a target that knows what they are doing. 

 

For example: a normal ranger that knows all of their buttons, has a flowchart loop that boils down to "Deal damage until stunned, then press lightning reflexes. Deal more damage." If they know how to detarget and swoop, their avenue for damage dealing doesn't really change based on who they are fighting or require much more than positioning adaptation. AI takes care of harassing people hiding around pillars, and they have the tools on hand to easily deal with close and far threats.  Not to mention they are the only class in the game that can actively pick themselves up from downstate and -completely- reset the fight while pressuring you with cc and damage from themselves and pets. 

 

For weaver, your burst revolves around primordial stance and landing sword 2. While learning your rotations is harder than ranger, it still boils down to "press stance when enemy is generally near you and chase them around. if you are low on health, do the opposite, while swapped into water." This is several  times more difficult / has more that can go wrong vs it than ranger does, but the general behavior of the builds you see the most are identical. 

 

That being said, I don't think it's fair to be so reductive, and flowchart easy is fine. 

 

Also, some other classes have builds like this too (and in some cases do it worse), like dagger dagger thief, berserker/spellbeaker, and flamethrower engie. They just usually don't have the damage output to back it up or they have a playstyle that hard counters their build. The builds noted above being mildly forgiving also can be played exceptionally skillfully, so just because they woodchipper people under Gold 2 doesn't mean they aren't deserving of respect.

 

(Ideally all classes should woodchipper people under Gold 2, but we can talk about that later.) 

 

I'd say most rangers and weavers that would blow up due to not understanding critical mechanics if they played other classes or builds that require you to predict and preemptively respond to situations (more than just react to them) are not rescued by ranger and weaver doing so -enough- to consider them "ez braindead"-

 

-but I can see how someone would arrive at that accusation, given the safety nets present on both. 

 

If I had to make a comparison, I'd say that Ranger's equivalent to playing link in Smash or Juri in SF4, and Weaver's kind of like a Zelda or Guile. Their relatively obvious tactics make it into high level play when they are refined, but that doesn't mean the classes themselves don't require skill to get there. It just means that, at high level play, it feels more like you're fighting the mechanics of the character rather than the player. 

 

 

Edited July 19, 2021 by Azure The Heartless.3261