about last patch?

[IAmNotMatthew.1058]

3 minutes ago, Gibson.4036 said:

This is true, but in my experience it both of those gates were reached completely organically just playing through the zones in order. YMMV

Yes, getting to the Skimmer is mandatory in PoF, thus it's easy and cheap. You can see the increase of cost and requirements with the Jackal, since it is not required for the story.

On the other hand the Siege Turtle is an optional mount, despite being one of the "advertised features of EoD".
You are not required to get it through the story and in areas where it helps the game provides you with them, for example: Aspenwood. 
Another thing to note is that the Siege Turtle's cannons aren't exactly a new concept, Remote Charges from Waystations are the same system. Except a person can supply 50 people with a Waystation and all it's utilities, while a turtle is 2 players.

When taking into account that the Siege Turtle is not required anywhere we can't compare the acquisition method to mounts that are required for story progression.

[Gibson.4036]

27 minutes ago, IAmNotMatthew.1058 said:

 

When taking into account that the Siege Turtle is not required anywhere we can't compare the acquisition method to mounts that are required for story progression.

Yes, there are just enough details that I can see why people come down on both sides of the argument regarding the turtle aquisition. Which is why I doubt the discussion will ever lead to some sort of general consensus.

At this point it's just a matter of whether these design choices have been a net positive or negative for the game, and it's impossible for any of us players to get an objective read on that.

Edited March 30, 2022 by Gibson.4036

[Mike D.3047]

1 hour ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Is the "advertise your group" button somehow invisible on your screen? Because I can see it on mine. (and I like how you intentionally had to scroll down the list to show specifically what you wanted to show 😄 )

The fact that no one is playing said strike tells quite a lot. People selling strikes should be supported why exactly? I like how you dismiss criticism with whataboutism 😄

Edited March 30, 2022 by Mike D.3047

[Mike D.3047]

1 hour ago, Howluffu.7259 said:

Are you implying that people that are fine with it should be marked as an insane person?

I guess in order to have the driving license as well I have to agree with you in this matter or else I am not qualified.

I am implying that if there's hardly ever people playing it and your only other option is to buy a carry then yes. I don't know about your driving license but mine didn't require 10 people to be there at the same time 😧

[Sobx.1758]

34 minutes ago, Mike D.3047 said:

The fact that no one is playing said strike

This claim alone is straight up false, so if that's what you base your previous post on... That reasoning still remains false.

Quote

People selling strikes should be supported why exactly?

Never said they should be supported. In fact, I think anet should explicitly forbid it, but that's not exactly what this thread or the posts above were about, right? I'm really not sure where this part came from.

Quote

I like how you dismiss criticism with whataboutism 😄

Where did you see any "whataboutism" there? You've linked a lfg window (scrolled down to go right into the empty "sell" squads btw), which -from all I understood- meant "I can't join the squad because I can't find/see it" (whether it's true or not at that point wasn't even anything I've attempted discussing in my initial response -but hey, currently I can tell it just isn't true). So the response: if you don't see a squad, you can always make your own is not anything near being "whataboutism", since it's a solution directly related to the problem you've presented. If you didn't want your screenshot to be freely interpreted (since as we can already see, it could be interpreted at least in 2 different ways), then next time specify the point you're trying to make.

So... what happened with the "advertise your group" button in your game client?

Edited March 30, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[Gorem.8104]

9 hours ago, Vayne.8563 said:

Pretty sure for your Griffon there was a bounty in there you couldn't solo.

Pretty much all bounties are soloable, and if you need help it usually just happens in open world, its still not instanced content. It still doesn't require you to do a raid. And luckily was made in the past so the mount is actually good, like extremely good. 

[Ashantara.8731]

On 3/29/2022 at 8:22 PM, Boogiepop Void.6473 said:

Still no salvage all for research kits? Still unusable by any person with hand issues.

Double-click macro. Problem bypassed, so your hand won't fall off. 😉

On 3/29/2022 at 7:01 PM, ugrakarma.9416 said:

This change what? is new modules tier for purchase?

Say what?

Edited March 30, 2022 by Ashantara.8731

[Sobx.1758]

2 minutes ago, Gorem.8104 said:

Pretty much all bounties are soloable, and if you need help it usually just happens in open world, its still not instanced content. It still doesn't require you to do a raid. And luckily was made in the past so the mount is actually good, like extremely good. 

If you can solo bounties and attempt to use that as "it's different!" argument then you know well it is nowhere near the story bosses, which is what you've proposed above. At that point you should also have 0 problems with completing strikes through lfg.

Edited March 30, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

On 3/29/2022 at 12:29 PM, Kaltyn of Torbins Deep.294 said:

If you find something that the wiki has wrong, create an account and update it.  Anet doesn't maintain the wiki, we do.  I've made a couple of updates myself, it really isn't that difficult, and might help your fellow GW2 players out a lot.

 

No need to make/have an account to edit the Wiki...or to just leave feedback on the 'talk' page and someone else will edit the article. 

[Vayne.8563]

4 hours ago, divineDerivative.5194 said:

The skyscale, griffon, and roller beetle were not advertised as being main components of a paid expansion. With the siege turtle being advertised the way it was, it was perfectly reasonable to expect that acquisition would more in line with raptor, springer, jackal, and skimmer from PoF, which only required completion of a renown heart and a small purchase from the vendor.

No it's not. Because, get this, the skyscale, griffon and roller beetle have been in the game in some cases now for years and the community itself has expectations of a mount.  Anet's biggest issue was not explaining up front it would be a challenge to get it, because in one stream they said it would be about has hard to get as the roller beetle and that's just wrong.  However, I got it as fast as I got the roller beetle.  It was just much harder.

 

The expectations for how hard it is to get mounts was set by Anet and this mount was harder to get.  One you have harder to get mounts in the game, the expectations change. But there's one other difference. The optional mounts (and the turtle is optional because it's required for exactly zero content) is in fact not easy to get. The raptor you need to get around HoT. The bunny too. You need the skimmer to get to at least one story and the jackal to get through jackal portals, but you can live in this game without a griffon, roller beetle and skyscale. You can also live quite easily without a turtle. I have one and I don't use it as often as any other mount.

[Vayne.8563]

3 hours ago, Gibson.4036 said:

Whether right or wrong, people see a difference between two sets of mounts. In one set we have raptor/springer/skimmer/jackal and in the other set we have skyscale/roller beetle/griffon. Various things lead some to expect the the turtle would fit in the first set, not the second.

I'm not arguing either way in this post. I can think of arguments both for and against. But that is how some came to think the turle would be close to just handed out.

Anet said, wrongly btw, that the turtle would be about as hard to get as the roller beetle in a stream before launch. Thus were my expectations set. It took me about as long to get the roller beetle, but obviously the turtle was much harder. That said, the turtle is the least useful mount of all and it's required for nothing.  I'm not saying Anet didn't make a mistake in how they handled the turtle. But I am saying no one should have expected it to be handed out, unless they're completely new to the game.

[Vayne.8563]

2 hours ago, Gorem.8104 said:

Pretty much all bounties are soloable, and if you need help it usually just happens in open world, its still not instanced content. It still doesn't require you to do a raid. And luckily was made in the past so the mount is actually good, like extremely good. 

I haven't seen anyone solo the bounty required for the griffon, but you'd have to be so hard core to do it you could do the strike as well. The people complaining about having to do a strike are not the people who could solo that bounty. Particularly early on, even with groups of people that bounty failed fairly often. 

The point was the guy said you could solo it and I"m pretty sure that guy couldn't. I know I couldn't. The combination of the number of ads that spawn in the area, the bounty itself, and it's built in skill to summon these towers that have to be taken down or you take damage would prevent it.  It's a hard bounty.  

I'm not saying the strike mission was a great idea, but I am saying that you can't just rock up and do everything by yourself to get a griffon.  I think the strike mission and the harder meta were a mistake and have pretty much all along.

[divineDerivative.5194]

4 hours ago, Vayne.8563 said:

No it's not. Because, get this, the skyscale, griffon and roller beetle have been in the game in some cases now for years and the community itself has expectations of a mount.  Anet's biggest issue was not explaining up front it would be a challenge to get it, because in one stream they said it would be about has hard to get as the roller beetle and that's just wrong.  However, I got it as fast as I got the roller beetle.  It was just much harder.

The expectations for how hard it is to get mounts was set by Anet and this mount was harder to get.  One you have harder to get mounts in the game, the expectations change. But there's one other difference. The optional mounts (and the turtle is optional because it's required for exactly zero content) is in fact not easy to get. The raptor you need to get around HoT. The bunny too. You need the skimmer to get to at least one story and the jackal to get through jackal portals, but you can live in this game without a griffon, roller beetle and skyscale. You can also live quite easily without a turtle. I have one and I don't use it as often as any other mount.

The point you're missing is that the optional mounts either come from LW episodes, which is optional content, or in the case of the griffon, were secret until the expansion came out. The way the siege turtle was advertised, I fully expected to get an egg early in the story and have the mount unlocked towards the middle/end, where it might be required to progress the story. I just watched the feature video for the turtles again and all it says about getting one is, "Now, you can raise your own turtle from an adorable hatchling, to a cannon carrying mount." If they had just added, "But be warned, outfitting your turtle for battle won't be easy," or something along those lines, that would have completely changed the expectations.

Anet failed to set expectations appropriately, via their advertising, so some people are rightfully upset that they didn't get what they expected. Personally, I don't think the siege turtle is all that hard to get. If you look at it from the dev's point of view, it is very similar to the roller beetle. They obviously want everyone to be doing strike missions regularly, and while they have been making changes to the Dragon's End meta, they clearly think that even casual players should be able to complete it. They are wrong about both of those things, which also adds to the frustration from certain players.

Ultimately the frustration comes from expectations versus reality, not whether the reality of the turtle is justified or comparable to other mounts.

[Vayne.8563]

25 minutes ago, divineDerivative.5194 said:

The point you're missing is that the optional mounts either come from LW episodes, which is optional content, or in the case of the griffon, were secret until the expansion came out. The way the siege turtle was advertised, I fully expected to get an egg early in the story and have the mount unlocked towards the middle/end, where it might be required to progress the story. I just watched the feature video for the turtles again and all it says about getting one is, "Now, you can raise your own turtle from an adorable hatchling, to a cannon carrying mount." If they had just added, "But be warned, outfitting your turtle for battle won't be easy," or something along those lines, that would have completely changed the expectations.

Anet failed to set expectations appropriately, via their advertising, so some people are rightfully upset that they didn't get what they expected. Personally, I don't think the siege turtle is all that hard to get. If you look at it from the dev's point of view, it is very similar to the roller beetle. They obviously want everyone to be doing strike missions regularly, and while they have been making changes to the Dragon's End meta, they clearly think that even casual players should be able to complete it. They are wrong about both of those things, which also adds to the frustration from certain players.

Ultimately the frustration comes from expectations versus reality, not whether the reality of the turtle is justified or comparable to other mounts.

Some people paid for the optional content and the turtle itself isn't required for anything.

The ONLY point I'm arguing about here is people expecting to do nothing. That doesn't make sense to me. But...I do think what was required was too much and shouldn't have existed at all. It would have been okay  and we'd have seen no complaint if it really was like the beetle collection.