Game Balance

[Phoenix.4593]

I know a lot of changes that have taken place insofar as balance can be concerned is so that there is less of a threshold between newbies and veterans. As someone who has played the game for a few years, I can unequivocally confirm that a try-hard who has mastered the min-max of the game will eliminate you in less than one second in WvW. That's the real problem the developers are trying to address, and till now it has been in my opinion in the wrong way. A nube should be crushed by a vet, but it shouldn't happen in less than a second. Even worse is when this happens to someone in maxed gear. The real problem with this game is that the exponential power of the exploits of this game mean that you will be crushed unless you are conversent with every angle of the advantages available. Nerfing these advantages would do wonders for accessibility. 

[Donari.5237]

I am a bit confused.  It sounds like you are saying that there should be counters to skill so someone that knows what they are doing can't easily defeat someone who doesn't?  You use the term "exploit" so perhaps you are saying there are unintended force multipliers that someone who knows the right combos can use?

I don't pvp, and when I poke my nose into WvW I will be taking dirt naps unless comfortably encased in a zerg with a good commander preferably with voice callouts, but I don't want those who enjoy fighting other players to be shackled for my benefit.

[Vayne.8563]

This really isn't true. I'm a more casual player, as far as stuff like min-maxing goes, which I don't do. I often don't even play the most efficient build of my character. My knowledge of the game is pretty broad but I don't have specific knowledge of most combat counters. And yet, when I'm in WvW, very very very few people can take me down as quickly as you seem to. Most of the time I put up a fight. The vast majority of the time.

Sure there are REALLY good players that are really good and they'll usually beat me soundly. Because they practice all the time and put in the work. I don't. So I can't expect to have a chance against them. But I feel like you're exaagerating the issue because of either your lack of skill or just because you really want to make this point. 

My experiences as a casual are significantly different to yours.

[Phoenix.4593]

There are time's I get 1 shoted. That shouldn't exist. It's obviously an exploit. I don't mind being bested, but if it happens before I can calibrate, that's a problem.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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[Phoenix.4593]

47 minutes ago, Vayne.8563 said:

This really isn't true. I'm a more casual player, as far as stuff like min-maxing goes, which I don't do. I often don't even play the most efficient build of my character. My knowledge of the game is pretty broad but I don't have specific knowledge of most combat counters. And yet, when I'm in WvW, very very very few people can take me down as quickly as you seem to. Most of the time I put up a fight. The vast majority of the time.

Sure there are REALLY good players that are really good and they'll usually beat me soundly. Because they practice all the time and put in the work. I don't. So I can't expect to have a chance against them. But I feel like you're exaagerating the issue because of either your lack of skill or just because you really want to make this point. 

My experiences as a casual are significantly different to yours.

Bud, you're not a casual player and you know it!

[Hotride.2187]

I highly doubt that is the problem the devs are trying to address. Right now they seem to be obsessed with their pseudo raids and everything that comes with raiding (encounters, group compositions, rewards, etc.).

As for getting killed in a second by a veteran if you are a noob... I'd say its more like 10 seconds on average. OWP SB is really the only thing that can "1 shot you" (there is a topic in the spvp section about it not really being a 1 shot) consistently, and that is if you forget to stunbreak & dodge / get surprised. And if you are running mostly glass stats.

Skill makes a big difference in this game and should continue to make a big difference. If you want to not get destroyed by veteran players, invest the time and get better. Or for wvw just find a meta cele roamer build, that is the closest thing the devs have given you to what you ask for.

[Phoenix.4593]

5 minutes ago, Hotride.2187 said:

I highly doubt that is the problem the devs are trying to address. Right now they seem to be obsessed with their pseudo raids and everything that comes with raiding (encounters, group compositions, rewards, etc.).

As for getting killed in a second by a veteran if you are a noob... I'd say its more like 10 seconds on average. OWP SB is really the only thing that can "1 shot you" (there is a topic in the spvp section about it not really being a 1 shot) consistently, and that is if you forget to stunbreak & dodge / get surprised. And if you are running mostly glass stats.

Skill makes a big difference in this game and should continue to make a big difference. If you want to not get destroyed by veteran players, invest the time and get better. Or for wvw just find a meta cele roamer build, that is the closest thing the devs have given you to what you ask for.

What I'm saying is that this isn't the best option. Players getting insta merced despite having maxed equip isn't good. I'm just saying that adjustment to build plus consumables shouldn't equate to one-shot kills. kitten is a weakness that no one wants to talk about in this game.

[Vayne.8563]

4 hours ago, Phoenix.4593 said:

Bud, you're not a casual player and you know it!

Nor am I a hardcore player that min-maxes.  

[Obtena.7952]

8 hours ago, Phoenix.4593 said:

There are time's I get 1 shoted. That shouldn't exist. It's obviously an exploit. I don't mind being bested, but if it happens before I can calibrate, that's a problem.

Yes, being 1 shotted is a big feel bad thing that shouldn't happen but it's NOT an exploit.

Also, no ... the devs should not be 'addressing' the gap between veterans and new players in competitive modes either. That gap doesn't exist because of gear ... it's a 'git gud' issue. If you don't want to do the work to compete with veterans of competitive modes, you shouldn't be able to compete with them. 

Edited July 9, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Dreams.3128]

...This complaint is bizarre.

 

If you are playing Zerk Ranger and I'm playing shatter Mesmer and I know that particularly build very well, while you barely grasp the fact you can actually be flexible with your stats in WvW, yes I should be able to one-shot you. 

 

You don't have the knowledge and I do, but the knowledge is readily available to anyone and everyone who ask. If people don't want to put in the work to find that knowledge about their stats/class/skills whatever why should a vet not get rewarded for that?

 

You're making it sound like we somehow found a cheat code by being able to minmax when in reality we've just played for YEARS to the point that a lot of things are a muscle memory for us. That's not a cheat code, that's just knowing what to do and when to do it.

 

But back to my original point, if you're wearing glass zerk gear and I have a build specifically for dealing with people like you? You have to hold that, plain and simple. 

[Donari.5237]

17 hours ago, Phoenix.4593 said:

What I'm saying is that this isn't the best option. Players getting insta merced despite having maxed equip isn't good. I'm just saying that adjustment to build plus consumables shouldn't equate to one-shot kills. kitten is a weakness that no one wants to talk about in this game.

You keep talking about maxed gear.  Bear in mind that in GW2 gear is only part of the puzzle.  All gear of the same tier will have generally the same stat values and the difference from exotic to ascended is only a few percent.  It's just arranged differently so you can build for the stat combo you want to emphasize.  I think maybe one reason people are reacting to your concern in a bewildered fashion is that the gear part of your annoyance hasn't been highlighted in your complaint.  Someone in rares who really knows their profession is going to beat someone in ascended who hasn't figured out how to do more than mash buttons on cooldown with a random set of traits that just looked cool, and probably fairly quickly too.  So everyone's focusing on your min-max skill worries but really you're maybe upset because you're used to games where the best gear wins.

Edited July 9, 2022 by Donari.5237

[Solvar.7953]

I do wonder if there will be some attempt to make this better with the Steam release.

I've been playing since release, but would probably describe myself as a mediocre player.  So in WvW, not uncommon to get into a battle where I'm stunned & killed in <2 seconds.  I do understand there are stun breaks, but that requires that I hit them fast enough, and I know enough that there are better WvW builds, etc.

But for new players that join the game with the Steam release, I have to think that if they venture into WvW or PvP and get insta-killed, for the vast majority, their thought won't be "I need to get better", but rather "The gap is so great there is no reason trying", and they won't venture into PvP or WvW again.  Which really isn't great for the game.

But I don't really have any solution to that - even a moderate buff probably won't help that situation much - getting killed in 3 seconds vs 2 isn't going to change the opinion much.

 

[AliamRationem.5172]

2 minutes ago, Donari.5237 said:

You keep talking about maxed gear.  Bear in mind that in GW2 gear is only part of the puzzle.  All gear of the same tier will have generally the same stat values and the difference from exotic to ascended is only a few percent.  It's just arranged differently so you can build for the stat combo you want to emphasize.  I think maybe one reason people are reacting to your concern in a bewildered fashion is that the gear part of your annoyance hasn't been highlighted in your complaint.  Someone in rares who really knows their profession is going to beat someone in ascended who hasn't figured out how to do more than mash buttons on cooldown with a random set of traits that just looked cool, and probably fairly quickly too.  So everyone's focusing on your min-max skill worries but really you're maybe upset because you're used to games where the best gear wins.

Seems to be a lot of that going around lately...