Sword wasn't buffed?

[Obtena.7952]

Doesn't that feel weird to anyone? I guess Anet thinks sword is good right now. I always thought it could use a touch like we are seeing in this patch. 

Edited August 13, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

Not particularly.  Invocation saw two separate buffs amounting t a 6% global increase in strike damage  Technically this buff goes to everything.

[ArthurDent.9538]

The big issue is that gs was already better than sw/sw for almost everything unless you needed a port. Currently they are close enough in dps that the optimal rotation still uses swapping between the two of them but with gs buffs, it might become better to just camp it permanently. That would make for a much more boring rotation and doesn't fit the stated design objective of gs being more cleave focused while sw/sw being more single target focused as gs simply has much better single target damage.

[Valisha.8650]

A bigger problem - Shield wasn't buffed

[Justine.6351]

4 minutes ago, Valisha.8650 said:

A bigger problem - Shield wasn't buffed

Yeah crystal hibernation needs 1 second swiftness pulses added to it.

[Nephalem.8921]

8 hours ago, Blood Red Arachnid.2493 said:

Not particularly.  Invocation saw two separate buffs amounting t a 6% global increase in strike damage  Technically this buff goes to everything.

The problem is that gs gets buffed. this will result in weapon camp being better than swap to swords. dumbing down the spec to a "press all the skills" level.

[josh.3847]

8 minutes ago, Nephalem.8921 said:

The problem is that gs gets buffed. this will result in weapon camp being better than swap to swords. dumbing down the spec to a "press all the skills" level.

Would give you room to swap your second weapon set out for staff for CC. Everyone loves Rev CC right?

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

55 minutes ago, Nephalem.8921 said:

The problem is that gs gets buffed. this will result in weapon camp being better than swap to swords. dumbing down the spec to a "press all the skills" level.

Honestly I'd be fine with that, so I could re-equip hammer and have a ranged option for Vind.  I get the feeling that swapping to swords would still have some value, though, because it synergizes better with Impossible Odds and greatsword skills do have a cooldown.  

[Zaret.1450]

10 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Doesn't that feel weird to anyone? I guess Anet thinks sword is good right now. I always thought it could use a touch like we are seeing in this patch. 

1 think that swords are a core weapon, that would mean a great dmg increase overall, what i mean is, herald is now more boon and sup based, a boon dps shoudnt get too high numbers, while vindi, being more selfish dps itself should have higher numbers, with the increase in the multiplier trait herald already got somewat decent dmg increase, and vindi got its gs number increased to balance that out a bit and get on par.

2 swords arent bad dmg wise right now, they have allwais had good dmg but the problem was we had nothing to use them with, herald relies on multipliers and IO alone, renegade has spmewat dmg skills and sb is kinda hibrid but meh, but vindi brought both archie and gs, both have decent dmg skills, while i think they need some changes in spear and scav burst they complement swords well, the big problem is still shiro, it needs some rework, maybe the heal having pasive and active, like you allwais have jade daggers and when using a shiro skill you use a dagger to hit your oponent, and daggers recarge, one each 2 secs or smth, and jade winds need a change too, maybe a direccional attac, like you select the target area and create a jade tornado that dmg the enemy, if you hit all the hits, maybe being like 5 or so to max 5 enemies, you also stun them. overpowered, a bit, but it has 50 energy drain and it would be an area pulsing dmg that needs all hits to land so it would balance out.

[Zaret.1450]

1 hour ago, Nephalem.8921 said:

The problem is that gs gets buffed. this will result in weapon camp being better than swap to swords. dumbing down the spec to a "press all the skills" level.

think that swords are better at small target dmg, also with runes like energy or such on weapon swap you can still get some interrsting gains, i think maybe even camping legend and swaping weapons might be a good choice

[Nephalem.8921]

1 hour ago, josh.3847 said:

Would give you room to swap your second weapon set out for staff for CC. Everyone loves Rev CC right?

Not when it means you have to staff aa for 10sec.

[Nephalem.8921]

10 minutes ago, zaswer.5246 said:

think that swords are better at small target dmg, also with runes like energy or such on weapon swap you can still get some interrsting gains, i think maybe even camping legend and swaping weapons might be a good choice

Sorry numbers are not a matter of "feeling". Swords have inferior single target dps than gs. Anet themselves wrote that sword are supposed to be the better single target weapons and gs cleave. Well they are wrong most likely because they never really calculate or sim the specs. It feels like they are just guessing numbers.

Camping a legend is never a good choice because you get 50 free energy on swap...

You gain 5 energy per second. Legend swap is 10sec cd so camping a legend will never be worth it for dps. Energy sigil is a waste in pve on vindicator since the jump its so bad that its a dps loss over aa. Useful in pvp but this is pve.

Vindicator isnt the best desgined spec and it feels like they want to turn it into melee rifle mech where you just press all the buttons. I hate the direction of the game. 

[Zaret.1450]

9 hours ago, Nephalem.8921 said:

Sorry numbers are not a matter of "feeling". Swords have inferior single target dps than gs. Anet themselves wrote that sword are supposed to be the better single target weapons and gs cleave. Well they are wrong most likely because they never really calculate or sim the specs. It feels like they are just guessing numbers.

Camping a legend is never a good choice because you get 50 free energy on swap...

You gain 5 energy per second. Legend swap is 10sec cd so camping a legend will never be worth it for dps. Energy sigil is a waste in pve on vindicator since the jump its so bad that its a dps loss over aa. Useful in pvp but this is pve.

Vindicator isnt the best desgined spec and it feels like they want to turn it into melee rifle mech where you just press all the buttons. I hate the direction of the game. 

well firat of all, gs dmg comes mainly from gs5, yes all gs skills do dmg but gs5 is the big gun, and gs5, unless in huge hitbox, looses a lot of dmg, while swords are realy more single target, i didnt do the benches but id say in small hitbox swords are better than gs if im mistaken well i am no prob.

as for legend swap,  first remember that vindi doesnt have any crit chance trait, and also vindi skills and gs dont consume that much energy, and archie doesnt have an upkeep, so using the energy replenishing trait isnt worth that much when you have a trait that gives you 50% crit chance, fury giving now 25% and doubling that, that means you can prob fit some dragon or some kind of armor, you get to 50% crit chance and fury gets you to cap, while energy... well shiro just camps IO and archie is spamming skills, no need for energy traits there.

Lastly, yeah maybe camping archie isnt the best, but think about it, what skills are good in archie? spear and advance are the 2 best, and their cost isnt too high, also both sword and gs have low costs, evade, wich is a base mecanic for dmg also locks you in place for a lot of time, i mean maybe you dont have that much dmg camping legend but i dont think it would hurt that much, is vindi a bad design, id say badly implemented or incomplete, archie has conditions it doesnt need, gs3 is pretty much half assed, and vicky needs more love and boons, also the evade needs tunning, it needs work, but i dont see the similarity with mech, mostly because mech abuse comes from the fact that the mech does half its work passively, its like, if a rev just camped shiro IO and used sword skills off cd, archie has more buttons, thus more options and versatility but in a way it doesnt realy have dead skills, shiro pve is only IO, in wvw IO is mostly dead, and i still need to find some situation where jade winds is even remotely worth using, and shiro is a core legend from hot release.

Lastly if you hate the game or smth, well sry to say but right now the direction of the game is the best it has been in years, no alacrene forced everywere and no other class competing for alac spot, hfb and mec get nerfed so they leave the spot if someone else want it, power builds that are dead right now finaly getting buffed and some condi ones nerfed to balance apropiately, just think about it, fb and mec, thw 2 most braindead overpowered specs nerfed, while power ones, mostly ele, rev, etc, buffed, wvw finaly gets another beta and it works decently fine, yeah maybe swords need a bit of a buff but lets just see how the patch goes, theres one more on october, a big one suposedly, what do you hate about it?

[Nephalem.8921]

6 minutes ago, zaswer.5246 said:

well firat of all, gs dmg comes mainly from gs5, yes all gs skills do dmg but gs5 is the big gun, and gs5, unless in huge hitbox, looses a lot of dmg, while swords are realy more single target, i didnt do the benches but id say in small hitbox swords are better than gs if im mistaken well i am no prob.

as for legend swap,  first remember that vindi doesnt have any crit chance trait, and also vindi skills and gs dont consume that much energy, and archie doesnt have an upkeep, so using the energy replenishing trait isnt worth that much when you have a trait that gives you 50% crit chance, fury giving now 25% and doubling that, that means you can prob fit some dragon or some kind of armor, you get to 50% crit chance and fury gets you to cap, while energy... well shiro just camps IO and archie is spamming skills, no need for energy traits there.

Lastly, yeah maybe camping archie isnt the best, but think about it, what skills are good in archie? spear and advance are the 2 best, and their cost isnt too high, also both sword and gs have low costs, evade, wich is a base mecanic for dmg also locks you in place for a lot of time, i mean maybe you dont have that much dmg camping legend but i dont think it would hurt that much, is vindi a bad design, id say badly implemented or incomplete, archie has conditions it doesnt need, gs3 is pretty much half assed, and vicky needs more love and boons, also the evade needs tunning, it needs work, but i dont see the similarity with mech, mostly because mech abuse comes from the fact that the mech does half its work passively, its like, if a rev just camped shiro IO and used sword skills off cd, archie has more buttons, thus more options and versatility but in a way it doesnt realy have dead skills, shiro pve is only IO, in wvw IO is mostly dead, and i still need to find some situation where jade winds is even remotely worth using, and shiro is a core legend from hot release.

Lastly if you hate the game or smth, well sry to say but right now the direction of the game is the best it has been in years, no alacrene forced everywere and no other class competing for alac spot, hfb and mec get nerfed so they leave the spot if someone else want it, power builds that are dead right now finaly getting buffed and some condi ones nerfed to balance apropiately, just think about it, fb and mec, thw 2 most braindead overpowered specs nerfed, while power ones, mostly ele, rev, etc, buffed, wvw finaly gets another beta and it works decently fine, yeah maybe swords need a bit of a buff but lets just see how the patch goes, theres one more on october, a big one suposedly, what do you hate about it?

Yes you are mistaken. gs >sword even on small hitbox but both are very close there and sword proccs more io so its still worth like 500dps. But they buff gs by 5-10% so this might change.

sword 4 hits for 30k fully buffed. 15sec cd + energy cost + single target. why is it so bad?

Edited August 14, 2022 by Nephalem.8921

[otto.5684]

14 hours ago, Nephalem.8921 said:

The problem is that gs gets buffed. this will result in weapon camp being better than swap to swords. dumbing down the spec to a "press all the skills" level.

To be fair, your still managing stamina and 3 legends. I think camping GS is fine.

Edited August 14, 2022 by otto.5684

[Nephalem.8921]

2 minutes ago, otto.5684 said:

To be fair, your still managing stamina and 3 legends. I think camping GS is fine.

You are not managing stamina. You dodge on cd in pve and your are not managing 3 legends either. Camping gs is very boring after you spend more than 2h with it. The spec has no depth.

[otto.5684]

25 minutes ago, Nephalem.8921 said:

You are not managing stamina. You dodge on cd in pve and your are not managing 3 legends either. Camping gs is very boring after you spend more than 2h with it. The spec has no depth.

I disagree. Buffing sword will create balance issues with renegade. The closer in damage power renegade is, the less likely Vindicator will be viable, since renegade offers much more than damage. In addition, using dodge blindly off CD could lead for you to easily be downed. You have to notice your surroundings and note the CD of GS4. It is not “intensive,” but still important. And no other build has to do this. 

[Nephalem.8921]

3 minutes ago, otto.5684 said:

I disagree. Buffing sword will create balance issues with renegade. The closer in damage power renegade is, the less likely Vindicator will be viable, since renegade offers much more than damage. In addition, using dodge blindly off CD could lead for you to easily be downed. You have to notice your surroundings and note the CD of GS4. It is not “intensive,” but still important. And no other build has to do this. 

You do realize that power revenant. this includes herald and ren, need help too right? both are weak right now.

[Zaret.1450]

4 hours ago, Nephalem.8921 said:

You do realize that power revenant. this includes herald and ren, need help too right? both are weak right now.

but herald is a suport and renegade is a condi based dps, i know some people want every elite to be hibrid and do everything, but that only leads to things like hfb, the past alacrene, and those stupidly overpowered elites, either that or the elite ends up dead because it does nothing good at all like herald did till they gave it quickness, we have 3 elites, herald for sup, rene for condi and vindi for power, let them be that way, take condis out from vindi and buff its power numbers, tahe herald numbers to just 30k or so while it boons, and leave rene full condi, simple, easy and effective

[Obtena.7952]

1 hour ago, zaswer.5246 said:

but herald is a suport and renegade is a condi based dps, i know some people want every elite to be hibrid and do everything, but that only leads to things like hfb, the past alacrene, and those stupidly overpowered elites, either that or the elite ends up dead because it does nothing good at all like herald did till they gave it quickness, we have 3 elites, herald for sup, rene for condi and vindi for power, let them be that way, take condis out from vindi and buff its power numbers, tahe herald numbers to just 30k or so while it boons, and leave rene full condi, simple, easy and effective

Well hold on ... this isn't about people wanting every spec to do everything. The patch is a pure, across the field, power DPS increase. The purpose is to maintain relevant options in the game which doesn't happen when options are left out. 

We have a patch that is recognizing power weapons are falling behind. Yet we have a power weapon that is default for many builds falling behind in this patch by the very act of Anet not buffing it a similar amount we see with others. Is that because sword DPS is far ahead or because sword offers unique features that would entice people to use it? The answer is NO in both cases and it's going to become double NO once the patch is introduced. 

I mean, unless Anet intends for Hammer to supplant the use of a sword in a DPS role for ALL non-vindicator specs for whatever reason that I don't understand, the lack of a sword buff seems inappropriate, misguided, forgotten. The only other option I can think of ... there is a plan for stronger team support for Herald, which we don't know about. That seems plausible, given the offensive way Anet requires Herald to blow its facets for team quickness, but I'm not holding my breathe here. 

Edited August 14, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Zaret.1450]

no hold on anywere,  he started talking about herald and renegade power dps, and so i said that neither of them needed a buff in power dps, i brought up the people that want everything everywere because HE brought up the topic and looked like HE  wanted that.

now explain how the hell im defending something changing topics.

As for SWORDS i ALREADY said that i dont know the exact numbers but sword was never bad, if we change weapons is because we need to do it because of cooldowns, but rev doesnt realy have cds on weapons out of 3-4 skills, that is a problem with the energy + cd mecanic, maybe sword isnt even that bad nor need that many changes, the patch hasnt even come dammit.

[otto.5684]

8 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Well hold on ... this isn't about people wanting every spec to do everything. The patch is a pure, across the field, power DPS increase. The purpose is to maintain relevant options in the game which doesn't happen when options are left out. 

We have a patch that is recognizing power weapons are falling behind. Yet we have a power weapon that is default for many builds falling behind in this patch by the very act of Anet not buffing it a similar amount we see with others. Is that because sword DPS is far ahead or because sword offers unique features that would entice people to use it? The answer is NO in both cases and it's going to become double NO once the patch is introduced. 

I mean, unless Anet intends for Hammer to supplant the use of a sword in a DPS role for ALL non-vindicator specs for whatever reason that I don't understand, the lack of a sword buff seems inappropriate, misguided, forgotten. The only other option I can think of ... there is a plan for stronger team support for Herald, which we don't know about. That seems plausible, given the offensive way Anet requires Herald to blow its facets for team quickness, but I'm not holding my breathe here. 

I agree that herald damage needs a buff. However, this should be done through its traits, not through buffing sword. Power renegade is already viable and it got a slight buff. It does not need more.

[Nephalem.8921]

11 hours ago, otto.5684 said:

I agree that herald damage needs a buff. However, this should be done through its traits, not through buffing sword. Power renegade is already viable and it got a slight buff. It does not need more.

Power renegade is barely viable. its a bad build. why are swords so weak? energy + high cds + single target. and they hit lower than most other weapons.

[Aeolus.3615]

On 8/13/2022 at 10:02 PM, Justine.6351 said:

Yeah crystal hibernation needs 1 second swiftness pulses added to it.

Aplied to the caster only  huehuehuehue

On a serious note heral and ventari heal outputs for me decreased with all changes Anet have been doing, (even ventari "fake buff" was a nerf for me) so its a nerf and was kind of a big impact, making shield when traited pulse its heals and condi cleanse to alies would be a nice help.

Edited August 15, 2022 by Aeolus.3615

[Zaret.1450]

On 8/15/2022 at 4:54 PM, Nephalem.8921 said:

Power renegade is barely viable. its a bad build. why are swords so weak? energy + high cds + single target. and they hit lower than most other weapons.

again, we already have vindi for power, i know some people want every spec to do power but thats simply not viable, well end up again with 3 hibrid specs that work like kitten, rene works fine as condi, and herald already hits very good considering it is a support and thus shouldnt get even close to a pure dps elite, herald being 29k with sup stats, rene doing good with condi and vindi being good with power, can we please just be fine if we get to that point? because im completely sure noone wants rev power to be like it was before the expansion.