DragonScale Defense Tooltip is likely incorrect.

[Sahne.6950]

Fix bugsworn! The healskill should go on a 3 sec Cd when interrupted, just like any other skill in gw2.

Edited August 17, 2022 by Sahne.6950

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

12 minutes ago, Sahne.6950 said:

i still dont understand where this:

"Azure, Terror, and Lan, had a respectful discussion with me in this thread and explained that there was a skill split in pvp for LRS which I was unaware of when I was trying to compare LRS to AS. That was all that needed to be said and it ended that discussion"

has anything to do with you saying that AS hits just as hard as a ranger longbowburst....

i still dont understand where exactly the "discussion" ended... and suddenly its about 4 second burstwindows, and what you said earlier doesnt matter anymore...

Try reading the flow of the posts my dude. It's not very hard to figure out.

And stop editing your posts after people respond to them in attempts to clean up something stupid you said and to reconfigure things to make people look like they aren't making sense. Good god man. What is actually wrong with you?

I just don't get the 10x sweaty try-hard north american political attempt to twist up and convolute the absolutely infailably accurate information I just gave you in that stream demo.

Are you like actually sitting at home in a chair sweating and getting anxious that other forum users might see that you were wrong? No one cares dude. And it isn't a big deal to admit when you were wrong. You seen me do it in this thread once already.

[Sahne.6950]

9 minutes ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

Try reading the flow of the posts my dude. It's not very hard to figure out.

And stop editing your posts after people respond to them in attempts to clean up something stupid you said and to reconfigure things to make people look like they aren't making sense. Good god man. What is actually wrong with you?

I just don't get the 10x sweaty try-hard north american political attempt to twist up and convolute the absolutely infailably accurate information I just gave you in that stream demo.

Are you like actually sitting at home in a chair sweating and getting anxious that other forum users might see that you were wrong? No one cares dude. And it isn't a big deal to admit when you were wrong. You seen me do it in this thread once already.

your getting pretty personal... i told you that Rapidfire is alot more damage than 3x AS. 

Thats all i am saying... and that 43% more damage is by no mean "in the same ballpark".

i also dont understand what you mean with" cleaning up something stupid"

i added this:

"i still dont understand where this:

"Azure, Terror, and Lan, had a respectful discussion with me in this thread and explained that there was a skill split in pvp for LRS which I was unaware of when I was trying to compare LRS to AS. That was all that needed to be said and it ended that discussion"

has anything to do with you saying that AS hits just as hard as a ranger longbowburst...."

 like 30 seconds after the original post.... idk how that is cleaning up.. your trippin my guy.

every one of your posts is edited aswell xD dont act like this is a foreign and impolite technique to add things...   

we should stop here... this poor thread. :C

Edited August 17, 2022 by Sahne.6950

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

12 minutes ago, Sahne.6950 said:

The margins between 75% and 84% is huge tho... this shows that the damage is NOT on par...

golem has ~79k hp. 25% from that is 19800 Damage from the rangerburst.

while 84% left means 16% from 79k which is 12700.

THAT IS ROUGHLY 43% MORE DAMAGE!!!

your demo doesnt mean anything, if you estimate 43% more damage as "in the same ballpark".

This is more of the kind of garbage I'm talking about.

You are now selectively omitting facts & events from what has transpired here.

1. It has been explained to you that we were past this and into a different discussion of comparison.
2. Even so, I went out of my way to demo for you the 3x AS in the video which lands 85% vs. a Rapid Fire that was landing 78% and 80%, which is abnormal. The Rapid Fire should be normally landing 75% and 77%.
3. I had explain to you what I meant by "on par with" and "in the same ballpark" but you are choosing to take this grey area of different interpretations of what those could mean to different people and reeeeeeeally work it for your argument, as if you didn't plainly understand what those cliche figures of speech meant. It's a rude & snarky thing to do, to use the "play dumb" "I don't understand what's going on so I can't be wrong" tactic. Get out of here with that.
4. I explained to you that the Rapid Fire deals more total damage at the end of the 1 & 1/4th second cast yes, but the AS 3/4 second cast is actually dealing the same DPS "damage per second" as the Rapid Fire, which is true, and that you can fill in 2x more attacks to make the Bladesworn burst go from 3/4 second to 1 1/4s like the Soulbeast, and it deal the same damage as the Soulbeast, but you're acting like none of this was said or shown in the demo, and still insisting that the Soulbeast Rapid Fire deals so much more damage than the Bladesworn.
5. The demo means everything. Just because you're selectively ignoring certain facts that have been presented to you, doesn't mean those facts are posted in a link in this very thread for other people to watch and see for themselves.

You're weird man. Something is wrong with your behavior here. People who try this hard to convolute someone's statements and create such misinformation should receive warn points. It shouldn't be allowed. I mean at this point you're just ignoring an actual demo of these numbers that I gave you, whilst selectively ignoring some things, with misrepresenting others, as you cycle back to some question that has already been mathematical explained and shown to you several times now.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

11 minutes ago, Sahne.6950 said:

your getting pretty personal... i told you that Rapidfire is alot more damage than 3x AS. 

YEAH DUDE I SAID THAT LIKE 4X NOW! I totally agreed with you brooooo did you see it? Go reread.

But I also stated that Rapidfire only deals more damage because it is a 1 1/4th second cast, and that 3x AS spam is actually dealing the same DPS "damage per second" as Rapid Fire is but it is a 3/4th second cast and ends early. I then explained and showed in the video that if you chain two more 1/4th second attacks into the 3x AS spam, it will deal the same exact damage output as the Rapid Fire in 1 1/4 to 1 1/2 seconds, and it does. You can go watch it in that link right now.

14 minutes ago, Sahne.6950 said:

Thats all i am saying... and that 43% more damage is by no mean "in the same ballpark".

Yeah it is, for the reason I just explained, about DPS "damage per second" vs. total damage over time. Let me say it again because you seem to forget things that are said to you very quickly.

Rapidfire only deals more damage because it is a 1 1/4th second cast, and that 3x AS spam is actually dealing the same DPS "damage per second" as Rapid Fire is but it is a 3/4th second cast and ends early. I then explained and showed in the video that if you chain two more 1/4th second attacks into the 3x AS spam, it will deal the same exact damage output as the Rapid Fire in 1 1/4 to 1 1/2 seconds, and it does. You can go watch it in that link right now.

16 minutes ago, Sahne.6950 said:

every one of your posts is edited aswell xD dont act like this is a foreign and impolite technique to add things...

Yeah but my edits are actual edits, where I notice that there are grammar/punctuation errors.

18 minutes ago, Sahne.6950 said:

we should stop here... this poor thread. :C

Hey man, you've stated about 3x or 4x time now that you "didn't understand" several things that were happening in this discussion. I'm just here to clear it up for you.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

Guys, chill out.

AS is strong. It needs it's CD between uses increased to 1s. That would spread the combo out and allow counter play as well as curb some of the spaminess of the spec.

The other skills on gunsaber though however need positive adjustments, but AS, Unyielding Dragon, Tactical Reload, and all the bugs are obfuscating all of that.

Blooming Fire is not a damage positive skill, nor does it have any defensive value. It needs either a larger coefficient and 240 range (on the explosions), or it needs an evade on it, maybe even both.

Cyclone Trigger could also hit a bit harder, or be a full block.

Breakstep... only has value because it has ammo counts and is a movement skill. Putting some movement condi cleanses on it would help it out a lot.

Dragon Scale Defense and the other bugs need to be fixed. Tactical Reload needs to only work on Explosion skills. UD may or may not need to be nerfed after all though.

[Terrorhuz.4695]

18 hours ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

stuff

The main problems with bladesworn, for me, are 2

• With an interesting combination of bugs and intended behaviors, DT is able to ignore almost all of the defensive mechanics in the game. DT ignores blocks, but it also ignores blind, but it also ignores stealth (thanks to being a channel, it tracks people), but it also partially ignores range (since it's a 750 range leap with 240 radius, it's effectively able to hit people up to 1k range), but it also partially ignores LoS (the huge hitbox allows the bs to hit a lot of places where it reasonbly shouldn't hit, even when warrior mains cry "you can jump over it!"; you can't), but it also ignores evade (long animation + huge hitbox = more often than not, you'll find yourself evading right into the lingering AoE), but it also ignores rupts (thanks to bugged stab). You're only left with invulnerability, protection, barrier and weakness. Many of those mechanics aren't available to most classes, except weakness which get cleansed anyway by the good amount of cleanse a bladesworn has.
• Being able to consistely self provide 25 stacks of might. All the classes that had such an ability or currently have it (flamethrower scrapper, but also old holosmith, but also current catalyst and what not) are problematic.

The first point has already been expanded further in other threads, the second not so much. Artillery slash is a medium hitter: with 25 stacks of might + 10 stacks of vuln from On My Mark, it becomes a powerhouse. Doesn't help how those modifiers are basically impossible to interact with (they are shouts, ERGO instacasts) and the burst itself being very easy to set up with the stun from a singe dragon slash; a bs is able to ignore every defensive mechanic to just stun you with dragon slash-boost into artillery slash barrage. It's acceptable if there's a penalty for failing (like other oneshot classes -OWP soulbeast, gs mesmer- have); bladesworn doesn't have any, and can try again in a very short amount of time. The problem is, again, the 25 stacks of might  Those stacks of might become even more problematic if you take into account warrior's singularities, like having improved might and every stack of might also providing heal + endurance. The might spam needs to go.

Edited August 17, 2022 by Terrorhuz.4695

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

1 hour ago, Terrorhuz.4695 said:

The main problems with bladesworn, for me, are 2

• With an interesting combination of bugs and intended behaviors, DT is able to ignore almost all of the defensive mechanics in the game. DT ignores blocks, but it also ignores blind, but it also ignores stealth (thanks to being a channel, it tracks people), but it also partially ignores range (since it's a 750 range leap with 240 radius, it's effectively able to hit people up to 1k range), but it also partially ignores LoS (the huge hitbox allows the bs to hit a lot of places where it reasonbly shouldn't hit, even when warrior mains cry "you can jump over it!"; you can't), but it also ignores evade (long animation + huge hitbox = more often than not, you'll find yourself evading right into the lingering AoE), but it also ignores rupts (thanks to bugged stab). You're only left with invulnerability, protection, barrier and weakness. Many of those mechanics aren't available to most classes, except weakness which get cleansed anyway by the good amount of cleanse a bladesworn has.
• Being able to consistely self provide 25 stacks of might. All the classes that had such an ability or currently have it (flamethrower scrapper, but also old holosmith, but also current catalyst and what not) are problematic.

The first point has already been expanded further in other threads, the second not so much. Artillery slash is a medium hitter: with 25 stacks of might + 10 stacks of vuln from On My Mark, it becomes a powerhouse. Doesn't help how those modifiers are basically impossible to interact with (they are shouts, ERGO instacasts) and the burst itself being very easy to set up with the stun from a singe dragon slash; a bs is able to ignore every defensive mechanic to just stun you with dragon slash-boost into artillery slash barrage. It's acceptable if there's a penalty for failing (like other oneshot classes -OWP soulbeast, gs mesmer- have); bladesworn doesn't have any, and can try again in a very short amount of time. The problem is, again, the 25 stacks of might  Those stacks of might become even more problematic if you take into account warrior's singularities, like having improved might and every stack of might also providing heal + endurance. The might spam needs to go.

To your second point, it's Tactical Reload that is driving the might and vuln uptime. The might and vuln stacking isn't a problem on the other warrior specs, just the one with bugs that the Devs have conveniently not fixed along with an Elite that should never have been put into the live game.

Fix the bugs, make TR work only on Explosion skills, then address the rest as needed. I guarantee you though that if the bugs and TR are addressed that the rest of the problems will go away on their own.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

Triple post, scroll down

Edited August 17, 2022 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

Sorry, scuse me, pardon me~

Edited August 17, 2022 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

10 hours ago, CalmTheStorm.2364 said:

Solutions:

1) add 1s CD to artillery slash. This stops the spamming/ death combos

 

2) buff blooming fire (should have a total coeff of 2.0 like Dragons Roar with 6 charges). Also boost its range to 240. This shifts the focus of BS's damage to a highly telegraphed melee attack, which is a lot easier to play around. 

 

I think both of these are fine and would fix the issue. A one second cooldown is the same downtime as whiffed sneak attack, thats plenty. Also. I would still shave Artillery slash if buffing Blooming Fire. Would also probably lower the cd of the dash, so you have a bit more wiggle room to get in range to land blooming.

Edited August 17, 2022 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Terrorhuz.4695]

18 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

 

I think both of these are fine and would fix the issue. A one second cooldown is the same downtime as whiffed sneak attack, thats plenty. Also. I would still shave Artillery slash if buffing Blooming Fire. Would also probably lower the cd of the dash, so you have a bit more wiggle room to get in range to land blooming.

Blooming fire should be VERY slightly faster, VERY slightly more damaging and have a very wide AoE (in the 180-ish range, compared to the current 130) to be the the tool you use to just cleave tf out of downed bodies imho. Maybe even deal bonus damage per stack of vulnerability on the target.

Edited August 17, 2022 by Terrorhuz.4695

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

I double checked some things and was incorrect. @CalmTheStorm.2364 brought it to my attention that the  cooldown is not being reset on DT, but is every 8 seconds, matching PVE. It could just be that the tooltip is incorrect. Adjusting topic title to match. Apologies. 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

1 hour ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

I double checked some things and was incorrect. @CalmTheStorm.2364 brought it to my attention that the  cooldown is not being reset on DT, but is every 8 seconds, matching PVE. It could just be that the tooltip is incorrect. Adjusting topic title to match. Apologies. 

I mean, if the PvP/WvW tool tip is incorrect, then that should be changed. But if the intent is for it to be so egregiously long to begin with then that needs to be split properly.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

10 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

I mean, if the PvP/WvW tool tip is incorrect, then that should be changed. But if the intent is for it to be so egregiously long to begin with then that needs to be split properly.

 

I really doubt they intend for it to be a minute long. If so that needs to be adjusted to like...16 seconds or something. It should be longer than it is, but not 60 seconds long. 

Edited August 17, 2022 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

39 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

 

I really doubt they intend for it to be a minute long. If so that needs to be adjusted to like...16 seconds or something. It should be longer than it is, but not 60 seconds long. 

60s would be a bad joke.