Bring back the Pve Reaper

[Obtena.7952]

1 hour ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

And what have you done ? as content ...

All kinds of endgame team content. Dungeons, Fractals, Raids, Strikes. Your accusations that I don't play the game content relevant to the discussion is absurd and false. It's also not related to the topic; recognize this is a bad path for you. 

I know it doesn't suit your rhetoric ... but I've also done all these things playing how I want, with people that do the same. I understand that it's very difficult for you to admit people can play how they want in team content (because it's not just this thread you have been throwing punches at me) but ignoring that FACT does not default Anet to changing the game to suit how you want it to work. 

Edited October 19, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Radina.6057]

This sounds like such a weird statement.

"I play what I want so the spec is okay."

 

Edited October 19, 2022 by Radina.6057

[Obtena.7952]

1 hour ago, Radina.6057 said:

This sounds like such a weird statement.

"I play what I want so the spec is okay."

 

True, it is a weird statement ... that's probably why no one has said anything like that. 

Edited October 19, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[zeyeti.8347]

Stay in your world playing with wheelchair spec doing a half baked job , you are just telling that and that , no actual proof of anyhthing , but you not mentioning specific content means a lot of what you have achieved , not thats a bad thing , but when you are so clear about your statement you must know every aspect of the game ... All we want is raise up some classes , who are mostly not played , and a lot of us think that dps need to do more dps (as their name included ...) and support need more support , access to aegis stab , more reliable way to provide boons , just look at the exemple: healmech provide might in a 600 area range from f3 and AA from the bot , Ele provide might with overloading fire in a 180 hitbox range , can ofc use skill 4 warhorn to extend it , but is very sensitive to damage or interrupt while doing that , mech not , the bot cant be interrupted and is almost unkillable ... So they are flaws , and one easy thing to do is increase the boon range from overloading fire from 180 to 600 , as for reaoper , the axe need more damage , so he can have good range option , and mostly damage increase , as a melee having range dps at 1200 range completely subpar your dps is not a good feeling , we play what is effective , so we can argue to have most classes near a certain dps check , thats freaking logic .

I dont know what you trying to achieve with all your logic , earning arenanet little pet points maybe , i dont know ...

[Obtena.7952]

2 minutes ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

 All we want is raise up some classes , who are mostly not played

OK ... that's fine. It just doesn't make sense to lie about the reality of the game to do that. There isn't any reason to deny that people can play how they want and get teams doing so to justify Reaper getting a DPS buff. 

Edited October 19, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[zeyeti.8347]

the way i play how i want is effectiveness , i dont care about a class doing a half job supp or dps , and i am not the only one , you are mainly opposed at all the people on this forum who still tell you thats the way they play , so what ? let the game like that ? let Elementalist , Reaper , Dragon hunter , and all the others useless classes be forgotten , cause only a minority plays it and is effective with it , Anet have a job , they have a balance team and their work is to do what all the people stated in this forum , you still maintaining that people won't care about dps , but face that mech has loosed 5% of popularity cause of the recent patch , who was only about dps , no mechanic nerf , no new interaction added or deleted . So many people care about dps at our level of play and will always take whats the more efficient , when some classes arent played it JUSTIFY an up of those classes, and sometimes it's as simple as dps increase numbers or ratio.

And last you can tell what you want about the content you did , there is no proof you did anything , so i can tell i am a special force SAS no one can trust me cause their is no proof , you make me think of some politician , talk talk talk , brew some air , talk talk...

Edited October 19, 2022 by zeyeti.8347

[Obtena.7952]

20 hours ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

the way i play how i want is effectiveness , i dont care about a class doing a half job supp or dps , and i am not the only one , you are mainly opposed at all the people on this forum who still tell you thats the way they play , so what ? let the game like that ? let Elementalist , Reaper , Dragon hunter , and all the others useless classes be forgotten , cause only a minority plays it and is effective with it , Anet have a job , they have a balance team and their work is to do what all the people stated in this forum , you still maintaining that people won't care about dps , but face that mech has loosed 5% of popularity cause of the recent patch , who was only about dps , no mechanic nerf , no new interaction added or deleted . So many people care about dps at our level of play and will always take whats the more efficient 

 

OK great ... and you can play that way and I'm not opposed to you or others playing that way at all. That makes no sense to accuse me of being opposed to people playing how they want. That's just absurd. 

What I know is that for some reason, you want to deny that people can (and do) play how they want with non-optimal builds in teams. I guess it's some weird strategy to make that way of playing the game sound illegitimate? Not sure why but no doubt it's not an effective argument to get Reaper whatever buffs you seek. 

Again, you tell me you just want to raise up some classes that don't get play but tell me you only care about efficiency. You do realize that those are not the same problem solved with the same changes right? I mean, Anet can buff a Reaper with DPS ... and it still might not meet your standards for efficient play (they have in fact done that in the past).

On the other hand, Anet could also buff Reaper with some amazing support features and make it highly team desirable but not touch it's DPS (as we see actually WORKS from past experience in the game). So what problem are you trying to REALLY solve? Seems to me that anyone trying to solve "playing most efficient with Reaper" and trying to solve that with "more DPS" doesn't really understand any problem they are talking about or the game environment we have been playing in for the last 10 years. 

 

Edited October 20, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[zeyeti.8347]

Mech pew pew nerfed from 3-4 k damage wise , lose 5% of popularity , brew more air plz , facts vs theory 

And a reaper , as his name let suppose , is a dps it doesnt need support tools , you think pew pew mech has support tools ? not at all , but the class is overly still played. And dont tell me that the 27% of the players are playing HAM ...

Edited October 19, 2022 by zeyeti.8347

[zeyeti.8347]

On 10/5/2022 at 5:27 PM, Obtena.7952 said:

The approach will be to look at what it does and make it work with a team.

Even you disagree with yourself .

what does a reaper does ? it reap , it damage , it take lives , it doesnt need an overall rework , not like elementalist , it just needs ratio up , lower cd , ... etc etc , it's just a dps , if you want to make it a support he will go to compete with all the others supports. 

Edited October 19, 2022 by zeyeti.8347

[Obtena.7952]

1 hour ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

Even you disagree with yourself .

what does a reaper does ? it reap , it damage , it take lives , it doesnt need an overall rework , not like elementalist , it just needs ratio up , lower cd , ... etc etc , it's just a dps , if you want to make it a support he will go to compete with all the others supports. 

That makes no sense. What did I disagree with myself about?

 

Edited October 19, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Axl.8924]

3 hours ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

the way i play how i want is effectiveness , i dont care about a class doing a half job supp or dps , and i am not the only one , you are mainly opposed at all the people on this forum who still tell you thats the way they play , so what ? let the game like that ? let Elementalist , Reaper , Dragon hunter , and all the others useless classes be forgotten , cause only a minority plays it and is effective with it , Anet have a job , they have a balance team and their work is to do what all the people stated in this forum , you still maintaining that people won't care about dps , but face that mech has loosed 5% of popularity cause of the recent patch , who was only about dps , no mechanic nerf , no new interaction added or deleted . So many people care about dps at our level of play and will always take whats the more efficient , when some classes arent played it JUSTIFY an up of those classes, and sometimes it's as simple as dps increase numbers or ratio.

And last you can tell what you want about the content you did , there is no proof you did anything , so i can tell i am a special force SAS no one can trust me cause their is no proof , you make me think of some politician , talk talk talk , brew some air , talk talk...

In truth if it was a minor dps lost say you were at 37k and down t 36.5k i'd still play iut  maybe even 35k DPS as long as i can do enough dmg in the phsae to kill now once you start getting into lets say 6-10k Difference its simply too much for a dps class to have that little unless it offers some serious support to compete like i see eles still do some DPS while they heal and do it well but if you take away their heal for instance then no.

[zeyeti.8347]

11 hours ago, Axl.8924 said:

In truth if it was a minor dps lost say you were at 37k and down t 36.5k i'd still play iut  maybe even 35k DPS as long as i can do enough dmg in the phsae to kill now once you start getting into lets say 6-10k Difference its simply too much for a dps class to have that little unless it offers some serious support to compete like i see eles still do some DPS while they heal and do it well but if you take away their heal for instance then no.

Ele is a class who can do everything , but is average in everything in hands of 95% of the players 

the dps need a terryfying rotation do be effective and is not hardly above easy dps classes 

the heal is lackluster as hell , the way you provide alacrity is horrible and the boon range is way too small on overloads .

Quickness/dps ? taking a trait that clearly say "you dealing -10% damage" no way for a dps class ...

[zeyeti.8347]

12 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

That makes no sense. What did I disagree with myself about?

 

You say reaper should not have dps increase , but support tools ... and before "look at what it does and make it work with a team"

so just tell me ? what does a reaper does actually ? or maybe i didnt get your point thats a possibility .

[Obtena.7952]

6 hours ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

You say reaper should not have dps increase , but support tools ... and before "look at what it does and make it work with a team"

No, I didn't say it should not have a DPS increase. I said that people not being able to get a team with it is not a reason to give it DPS. This isn't me disagreeing with myself. This is you misrepresenting what I'm saying to just argue with me. That's OK ... I'm just going to continue hitting you with the truth when you do this. People can and do play non-optimal builds in teams. When people decide to play in a way that they can't do that is by choice ... and that's not a reason for Anet to dump DPS on Reaper. 

6 hours ago, zeyeti.8347 said:

so just tell me ? what does a reaper does actually ? or maybe i didnt get your point thats a possibility .

What does a Reaper do? Whatever Anet decides it does; whatever it's doing now. My personal opinion here though is what reaper does is a bit of a mess and that's partially why we are seeing these threads. As I've already said; the fix here is either to make a Reaper toolset that is appealing in team or rework content to make the existing toolset have value. 

 

Edited October 20, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Radina.6057]

12 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

and that's not a reason for Anet to dump DPS on Reaper. 

I guess the Soulbeast rework was just a fever dream.

They didnt just dump damage on a damage spec. It was all just a lie. It must be.

Edited October 21, 2022 by Radina.6057

[Obtena.7952]

2 hours ago, Radina.6057 said:

I guess the Soulbeast rework was just a fever dream.

They didnt just dump damage on a damage spec. It was all just a lie. It must be.

The funny part is that you seem to believe giving more DPS specs like Reaper the Soulbeast treatment makes them more desirable for teams ... along with all the other specs that are already competing for those DPS spots.

That's OK though ... when Anet dumps the DPS on Reaper you are asking for (or as long as Anet stays wise to the ruse) and you still can't get an optimal PUG team ... you still have the option to join teams that don't care if you don't play optimal specs, just like you do now. 

 

 

Edited October 21, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Axl.8924]

5 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

The funny part is that you seem to believe giving more DPS specs like Reaper the Soulbeast treatment makes them more desirable for teams ... along with all the other specs that are already competing for those DPS spots.

That's OK though ... when Anet dumps the DPS on Reaper you are asking for (or as long as Anet stays wise to the ruse) and you still can't get an optimal PUG team ... you still have the option to join teams that don't care if you don't play optimal specs, just like you do now. 

 

 

 

True that there is more than 1 way to be desired good support/DPS and heals etc buffs but Reaper offers nothing of the sort and falls short in the DPS range its way below everyone so because of that nobody is going to pick reaper when its a liabilitty.

Also in my opinion about the mech nerfs:

Instead of nerfing mech DPS down to subpar levels they should have just buffed reaper to 37k left mech at that level in pve or 1-2k DPS nerf at most.

Its the newest spec and not sure if it has a place now.

 

Edited October 21, 2022 by Axl.8924

[Nephalem.8921]

12 minutes ago, Axl.8924 said:

 

True that there is more than 1 way to be desired good support/DPS and heals etc buffs but Reaper offers nothing of the sort and falls short in the DPS range its way below everyone so because of that nobody is going to pick reaper when its a liabilitty.

Also in my opinion about the mech nerfs:

Instead of nerfing mech DPS down to subpar levels they should have just buffed reaper to 37k left mech at that level in pve or 1-2k DPS nerf at most.

Its the newest spec and not sure if it has a place now.

 

Mech is still the best healer and one of the best condi dps. Rifle dps mech is still very strong. It was just scourge level broken before.

[Obtena.7952]

4 hours ago, Axl.8924 said:

 

True that there is more than 1 way to be desired good support/DPS and heals etc buffs but Reaper offers nothing of the sort and falls short in the DPS range its way below everyone so because of that nobody is going to pick reaper when its a liabilitty.

Yes ... Reaper is deficient in any of the things a optimal team wants ... yet people are pushing for the worst way to make them desirable to those teams because DPS is fickle and the spots in a team have high competition. Again, that's going to lead to two results; people continuing to scream at the wall that they DPS (even if they have it)... or learning to play their non-optimal builds with non-optimal teams. 

Unless of course all this "can't get teams" rhetoric is just a ruse to get more DPS. 

4 hours ago, Axl.8924 said:

Also in my opinion about the mech nerfs:

Instead of nerfing mech DPS down to subpar levels they should have just buffed reaper to 37k left mech at that level in pve or 1-2k DPS nerf at most.

Its the newest spec and not sure if it has a place now.

If you distill down all the value a spec has to a team to how much DPS it does, you show you really don't understand the issues with team composition dynamics in this game. What do you think your suggestion here would accomplish?

I'm not against Reaper doing more DPS here, but I think it's a terrible way to make Reaper desirable to optimal teams. Frankly, I think there isn't much appeasement Anet can do here because it's unrealistic to think they can simply 'balance' their way into a situation where all specs are desirable with the game design they have created. They are even having trouble imposing their 'roles' system to create spaces where more specs can exist in the "optimal PUG" teamspace. Thankfully, there are alternatives to that cesspool; people just have to CHOOSE those alternatives.  

There will always optimal team comps and optimal PUG created to reduce their risk of failure will always make spec choices based on that. That always results in lots of exclusion if there are limited spots and simple encounter interactions. 

Edited October 21, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Axl.8924]

2 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

Yes ... Reaper is deficient in any of the things a optimal team wants ... yet people are pushing for the worst way to make them desirable to those teams because DPS is fickle and the spots in a team have high competition. Again, that's going to lead to two results; people continuing to scream at the wall that they DPS (even if they have it)... or learning to play their non-optimal builds with non-optimal teams. 

Unless of course all this "can't get teams" rhetoric is just a ruse to get more DPS. 

If you distill down all the value a spec has to a team to how much DPS it does, you show you really don't understand the issues with team composition dynamics in this game. What do you think your suggestion here would accomplish?

I'm not against Reaper doing more DPS here, but I think it's a terrible way to make Reaper desirable to optimal teams. Frankly, I think there isn't much appeasement Anet can do here because it's unrealistic to think they can simply 'balance' their way into a situation where all specs are desirable with the game design they have created. They are even having trouble imposing their 'roles' system to create spaces where more specs can exist in the "optimal PUG" teamspace. Thankfully, there are alternatives to that cesspool; people just have to CHOOSE those alternatives.  

There will always optimal team comps and optimal PUG created to reduce their risk of failure will always make spec choices based on that. That always results in lots of exclusion if there are limited spots and simple encounter interactions. 

 

Your other option "DO NOTHING" will continue to kill this game off and any desire for people to play the game.

You keep saying reaper is fine its as is intended and keep talking about support yet reaper doesn't even succeed at anything what is it supposed to do then?

 

Edited October 21, 2022 by Axl.8924

[Obtena.7952]

2 hours ago, Axl.8924 said:

 

Your other option "DO NOTHING" will continue to kill this game off and any desire for people to play the game.

You keep saying reaper is fine its as is intended and keep talking about support yet reaper doesn't even succeed at anything what is it supposed to do then?

 

None of that is accurate. Those generalizations do not represent my view of this situation. No wonder you can't follow what I'm saying. 

The fact is that the problem here isn't the spec, it's how the game is designed. There just isn't enough mechanical layers to have the bandwidth to make everything desirable for a optimal team comp. That can't be forced with balancing either because make one thing 'balanced' ... something else falls out of favour for those optimal comps. Again ... what problem are you trying to solve here because it's pretty hypocritical to claim Reaper needs top DPS to join optimal teams ... in the name of 'good balance' when that would mean something else gets kicked down the ladder. I'm sure you don't care about that ... but it's true. 

I do like that doomsaying touch to your post though ...yes the game will 'continue' to be killed off, yet it  still continues to be developed after 10 years after release. You realize that these claims of how this kills the game is nonsense right? Like games that die from not having class balance don't last 10 years with  inbalanced classes right? 

Anyone have any DED GAEM memes I can borrow? 

Edited October 21, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Animism.7530]

14 hours ago, Obtena.7952 said:

The funny part is that you seem to believe giving more DPS specs like Reaper the Soulbeast treatment makes them more desirable for teams ... along with all the other specs that are already competing for those DPS spots.

 

 

Yes, it literally would. It's an easy rotation, it has loads of self sustain and great AOE alongside blinds. It only needs more DPS. 

 

[Obtena.7952]

11 minutes ago, Animism.7530 said:

 

Yes, it literally would. It's an easy rotation, it has loads of self sustain and great AOE alongside blinds. It only needs more DPS. 

 

So to be clear so I understand:

Your prediction (which matches your desired change ... but only as a coincidence right?) is that the only thing missing for Reaper is DPS to make them desirable to optimal teams.

Let's see how that works out. I'm sure it's top of Anet's list ... for the last 8 years. 

 

Edited October 21, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[Josiah.2967]

Please buff Reaper. Either give us a lot of support so we can compete with support DPS or allow us to do more DPS to compete with full DPS builds that do more damage than Support/DPS to justify the build.

 

Thank you!

 

[Animism.7530]

40 minutes ago, Obtena.7952 said:

So to be clear so I understand:

Your prediction (which matches your desired change ... but only as a coincidence right?) is that the only thing missing for Reaper is DPS to make them desirable to optimal teams.

Let's see how that works out. I'm sure it's top of Anet's list ... for the last 8 years. 

 

You can keep calling it a prediction all you want, though there are people here saying they'd play it more often; but not only that.

 

Why don't you look at Engineer and Mechanist instead? As if people didn't suddenly start playing Mech? Was it because it had the highest benched DPS, or because they liked it for a variety of reasons, such as ease or visuals?