What do you want for the next E-Spec?

[draxynnic.3719]

24 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Going for some trapper rune gameplay eh?

Converting quickness you grant into alacrity is a sneaky way to make an alacrity support since core has so much team quickness now.

It would have to be on a minor trait though.

Would it have to be a minor? Would be a big feels bad if your build didn't naturally grant quickness. Make it a major and the spec could be like chronomancer, granting one or the other depending on trait choices.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

9 minutes ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

Would it have to be a minor? Would be a big feels bad if your build didn't naturally grant quickness. Make it a major and the spec could be like chronomancer, granting one or the other depending on trait choices.

I'd view it as a more spec defining trait, which to me is more fitting on a minor. I'd also make it pulse self quickness every second for 1s while affected by alacrity, so you'd still get the self quickness, but not group quickness.

[Zbysier.3425]

condi melee DPS/support with a stick (staff) - some sort of Shaolin monk

[Kodama.6453]

Have to say, I am surprised by the votes for  mainhand pistol. I just don't believe that Anet will give the same weapon to the same class 2 times in a row. Since bladesworn already got a pistol, I don't think they will give another pistol for the next spec.

Edited December 22, 2022 by Kodama.6453

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

7 minutes ago, Kodama.6453 said:

Have to say, I am surprised by the votes for  mainhand pistol. I just don't believe that Anet will give the same weapon to the same class 2 times in a row. Since bladesworn already got a pistol, I don't think they will give another pistol for the next spec.

Possibly. It isn't their modus operandi for sure, but as far as warrior goes there is a much shallower pool of weapons left to choose from. That is part of why I listed in my post what my follow up choices would be.

They could give it to BSW as part of a rework in the future.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

@oscuro.9720, melee/ranged power dps with a shroud eh? Would the shroud be the melee part or the ranged part?

[Infusion.7149]

I have a feeling staff is probably going to be it if the 4th expansion even has new elite specs. Barrier focus with revenant staff as a remplate.

I didn't expect the melee ranged pistol meme on bladesworn.

[oscuro.9720]

3 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

@oscuro.9720, melee/ranged power dps with a shroud eh? Would the shroud be the melee part or the ranged part?

Ranged shroud w/ some PbAoE, mid range staff w/ PbAoE/midrange area of effect style skills so it functions melee to 600 range or so. PbAoE technically counts as melee 🙂 

DPS because I like DPS. Though if I’m being rational support makes more sense.

[Infusion.7149]

26 minutes ago, oscuro.9720 said:

Ranged shroud w/ some PbAoE, mid range staff w/ PbAoE/midrange area of effect style skills so it functions melee to 600 range or so. PbAoE technically counts as melee 🙂 

DPS because I like DPS. Though if I’m being rational support makes more sense.

Why do you want shroud and another DPS...
Shroud doesn't work exceptionally in instanced content, see reaper , core necro, and specter.

edit: I thought about this prior to EOD and my idea of what support would have been is more or less replacing F2 on spellbreaker/berserker with a AoE support skill to make it relevant no matter what weapon you use.

Traits could be for protection, stability, regen, and barriers (not healing since tactics has it). There could probably be a better way to distribute fury than FGJ and Banner of discipline.

Edited December 23, 2022 by Infusion.7149

[oscuro.9720]

5 hours ago, Infusion.7149 said:

Why do you want shroud and another DPS...
Shroud doesn't work exceptionally in instanced content, see reaper , core necro, and specter.

edit: I thought about this prior to EOD and my idea of what support would have been is more or less replacing F2 on spellbreaker/berserker with a AoE support skill to make it relevant no matter what weapon you use.

Traits could be for protection, stability, regen, and barriers (not healing since tactics has it). There could probably be a better way to distribute fury than FGJ and Banner of discipline.

I want DPS because I like playing DPS stuff, and really have little intention of playing a support. I want a shroud because I like shrouds. Granted, I probably will just keep playing dagger spellbreaker even if we get new especs because spell is the most enjoyable specialization in the game to me. 
This is just what I like, not necessarily what I would say is reasonably best for Warrior as a whole. 

[draxynnic.3719]

To give my own thoughts:

 

I think I'm still leaning towards a support dervish playstyle. Melee staff (the specialisation weapon is a bladed polearm of some description), wide cleaving or even PBAoE attacks, and at least the potential for substantial area healing and buffing focused on the warrior. Ideally, to avoid the druid problem, there'd also be a bruisery variant for solo and competitive that is designed to thrive when fighting multiple opponents.

 

Ranged mainhand pistol for a modernised paragon could also be fun, although I find it hard to see how support pistol would work - the support would have to come from elsewhere.

 

 

14 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

I'd view it as a more spec defining trait, which to me is more fitting on a minor. I'd also make it pulse self quickness every second for 1s while affected by alacrity, so you'd still get the self quickness, but not group quickness.

Outside of weapon proficiency and the elite specialisation mechanic, my observation has been that the spec defining traits are usually in the majors, often the GM majors, and the minors are generally supporting the core mechanic without pushing you into a specific role. Which helps to ensure that the spec can be built to fit multiple roles without feeling that there are wasted traits. There are a couple of exceptions, and those exceptions tend to end up feeling pigeonholed as a result.

Being able to pulse self-quickness when affected by alacrity also sounds like a potential major balance concern if the spec has any DPS variant. You'd have four of them with one alacheal and have permanent alacrity and quickness both on all your DPS without needing a second support.

At most, it'd have to be 'when you give yourself alacrity, also give yourself quickness' - and in both cases you're forced to bring appropriate skills to use that minor trait, especially when solo.

Honestly, I think it's more likely that Arenanet will remove quickbanners on creating a proper warrior support elite, and at some point they'll also find a way to limit ranger alacrity to druid.

Edited December 23, 2022 by draxynnic.3719

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

4 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

To give my own thoughts:

 

I think I'm still leaning towards a support dervish playstyle. Melee staff (the specialisation weapon is a bladed polearm of some description), wide cleaving or even PBAoE attacks, and at least the potential for substantial area healing and buffing focused on the warrior. Ideally, to avoid the druid problem, there'd also be a bruisery variant for solo and competitive that is designed to thrive when fighting multiple opponents.

 

Ranged mainhand pistol for a modernised paragon could also be fun, although I find it hard to see how support pistol would work - the support would have to come from elsewhere.

Hey, if my shouts can clear your conditions, then my pistol shots can also have a rallying effect. My take on Pistol support would be ground targeted persisting AoEs that hinder foes and grant boons/clears/barrier/heals to allies. Think more like the Caster guns from Outlaw Star. Put a special bullet in there. Which is how BSW technically works, just for big damage.

 

[Morokey.8534]

I would like to see another burst skill based on off hand weapon and traits in new specialization tree somehow affecting this. It means a lot of potential damage/heal/support options.

 

For greatsword for example high aoe pul.

For hammer earth eruption.

For shield aoe boons, barrier..

For longbow arrow rain similar to ranger longbow skill 5.

etc..

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

I've seen lots of mentions now for Offhand Bursts. Personally I like it, but I want more than 2 F key skills.

How about this:

F1 is normal F1.

F2 is a 'dual burst' that is a burst using both weapons.

F3 is the Offhand burst.

The Dual Burst would not be F1 and F3 at the same time but a burst using both weapons.

For 2H weapons F2 and F3 would be extra bursts but F2 would combine the theme of F1 and F3.

Limited to 10 adrenaline used per burst, all adrenaline not spent on use.

Could be a way to make a warrior/thief espec.

[draxynnic.3719]

43 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Hey, if my shouts can clear your conditions, then my pistol shots can also have a rallying effect. My take on Pistol support would be ground targeted persisting AoEs that hinder foes and grant boons/clears/barrier/heals to allies. Think more like the Caster guns from Outlaw Star. Put a special bullet in there. Which is how BSW technically works, just for big damage.

 

Eh, if you're making the pistol that magical (or sufficiently advanced technological), might as well make it a scepter and save the mainhand pistol for a ranged DPS in the future. While warrior has a touch of the superhuman to it, I think it'd be better for warrior to use a weapon at least somewhat similarly to how it would be used in real life rather than having it behave like an elixir gun/mortar kit in pistol form. Warrior probably should not be doing funkier things with a pistol than an engineer or a caster profession does.

(Yeah, I know, bladesworn... but that's basically early modern pistols that were so inaccurate that pike blocks with long enough pikes could form a decent defence.)

[Fueki.4753]

At this point, I'd like to see Shortbow, preferably on a condition/Support Hybrid specialization.

It uses 30 Adrenaline, as well as stage 1,2,3 Bursts. And it should have a 1200 Shadowstep with a 0.1 damage modifier as its F2 ability that triggers Burst traits.

Given that current hyper-mobility in the game, such a Shadowstep on F2 wouldn't be too strong. The pitiful damage is just there so it can properly trigger Burst traits that require an attack connected with an enemy.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

39 minutes ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

Eh, if you're making the pistol that magical (or sufficiently advanced technological), might as well make it a scepter and save the mainhand pistol for a ranged DPS in the future. While warrior has a touch of the superhuman to it, I think it'd be better for warrior to use a weapon at least somewhat similarly to how it would be used in real life rather than having it behave like an elixir gun/mortar kit in pistol form. Warrior probably should not be doing funkier things with a pistol than an engineer or a caster profession does.

(Yeah, I know, bladesworn... but that's basically early modern pistols that were so inaccurate that pike blocks with long enough pikes could form a decent defence.)

The warrior wouldn't be magical, the bullets would be, so it fits.

Though honestly so long as it isn't another melee weapon I'll be happy, even if it is staff.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

21 minutes ago, Fueki.4753 said:

At this point, I'd like to see Shortbow, preferably on a condition/Support Hybrid specialization.

It uses 30 Adrenaline, as well as stage 1,2,3 Bursts. And it should have a 1200 Shadowstep with a 0.1 damage modifier as its F2 ability that triggers Burst traits.

Given that current hyper-mobility in the game, such a Shadowstep on F2 wouldn't be too strong. The pitiful damage is just there so it can properly trigger Burst traits that require an attack connected with an enemy.

Running with the idea I had above. If shortbow were to be the weapon the F2 could be that shadow step. F1 could be a heavy condition burst, and F3 could be some Venom type Burst.

[Dadnir.5038]

29 minutes ago, Fueki.4753 said:

At this point, I'd like to see Shortbow, preferably on a condition/Support Hybrid specialization.

It uses 30 Adrenaline, as well as stage 1,2,3 Bursts. And it should have a 1200 Shadowstep with a 0.1 damage modifier as its F2 ability that triggers Burst traits.

To be fair, that's pretty close to what I suggested with the idea of a "wildrager".

[draxynnic.3719]

17 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

The warrior wouldn't be magical, the bullets would be, so it fits.

Though honestly so long as it isn't another melee weapon I'll be happy, even if it is staff.

Eh, loading funky ammunition types is more engineer's jam, or a caster prefession that can enchant their own. Warrior should be more about having exceptional skill with the weapon they're using than making exceptional modifications to it. Obviously they can dabble a bit in technology and magic, but pistol-caliber buff grenades is just a step too far for me.

[Fueki.4753]

53 minutes ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

To be fair, that's pretty close to what I suggested with the idea of a "wildrager".

I don't think there's any similarity, other than both using Shortbow.

Your idea loses all kinds of normal Bursts, my idea retains not only the T1 Bursts (like Berserker and Spellbreaker), but all stages.

Your idea is a pet specialization, mine is not.

Your idea gets a variant of Stances, while mine has a Shadowstep on F2 and no type of Utilities (yet).

1 hour ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

The warrior wouldn't be magical, the bullets would be, so it fits.

Warrior always is magical. Even core and Junksworn are.

Edited December 23, 2022 by Fueki.4753

[draxynnic.3719]

Okay, shower thoughts time:

Concept: Modernised, religion-independent paragon.

Uses pistol as replacement for javelins, allowing ranged damage while keeping the offhand free for a supportive warhorn or defensive shield. Or a melee offhand to punish anyone who gets too close.

Problem: If pistol is DPS, lack supportive weapon skills. Warhorn alone won't really cut it.

Thought: Old-style banners would plug this gap - have a banner that can heal allies through waving it around.

Problem: Current banners have established functions that are making it into builds even without them granting quickness. A rework to banners so that they act like kits might not be welcome, and it might be confusing to have one set of banners that behave like planted wards and another that behaves like kits.

Thought: Kits... What other kind of kit-like object might fit the inspirational paragon-like theme?

Well, paragons were basically Arenanet's unique take on the bard concept. However, all of their inspiration comes from their voice - shouts, chants, arias, and so on. Instruments, however, have a long history of battlefield use. What if instruments could serve as a set of kit-like utilities? Gwen healed with a flute back in presearing, they could fire up their allies with war drums, frighten their enemies with bagpipes, guitars weren't really used on the battlefield historically AFAIK but I could see a charr rocking up with an electric guitar if they could get a portable power source...

 

WE ARE METAL LEGION!!!

[Kodama.6453]

4 minutes ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

Okay, shower thoughts time:

Concept: Modernised, religion-independent paragon.

Uses pistol as replacement for javelins, allowing ranged damage while keeping the offhand free for a supportive warhorn or defensive shield. Or a melee offhand to punish anyone who gets too close.

Problem: If pistol is DPS, lack supportive weapon skills. Warhorn alone won't really cut it.

Thought: Old-style banners would plug this gap - have a banner that can heal allies through waving it around.

Problem: Current banners have established functions that are making it into builds even without them granting quickness. A rework to banners so that they act like kits might not be welcome, and it might be confusing to have one set of banners that behave like planted wards and another that behaves like kits.

Thought: Kits... What other kind of kit-like object might fit the inspirational paragon-like theme?

Well, paragons were basically Arenanet's unique take on the bard concept. However, all of their inspiration comes from their voice - shouts, chants, arias, and so on. Instruments, however, have a long history of battlefield use. What if instruments could serve as a set of kit-like utilities? Gwen healed with a flute back in presearing, they could fire up their allies with war drums, frighten their enemies with bagpipes, guitars weren't really used on the battlefield historically AFAIK but I could see a charr rocking up with an electric guitar if they could get a portable power source...

 

WE ARE METAL LEGION!!!

I feel like a battle bard theme would be more appropriate for mesmer, considering that they are the class which is the most associated with music and arts.

Would like to see something bard-like in the game, but I don't think warrior is the right class for that.

[Dadnir.5038]

17 minutes ago, Fueki.4753 said:

I don't think there's any similarity, other than both using Shortbow.

Your idea loses all kinds of normal Bursts, my idea retains not only the T1 Bursts (like Berserker and Spellbreaker), but all stages.

Your idea is a pet specialization, mine is not.

Your idea gets a variant of Stances, while mine has a Shadowstep on F2 and no type of Utilities (yet).

Most of the bursts of my idea are 1200 range gap closer (not all, mind you).

There is no accompagning pet in my idea. It isn't a pet spec. If there was an accompagning pet you'd have the ranger community yelling all around.

The only difference between our ideas is that you retain a 1st tier weapon burst. You didn't talk about utility skills why would one even try to compare your F2 to the utility skills that I suggest? Also, the F1/F2 setup is starting to be boring/overused.

[Fueki.4753]

13 minutes ago, Kodama.6453 said:

I feel like a battle bard theme would be more appropriate for mesmer, considering that they are the class which is the most associated with music and arts.

Would like to see something bard-like in the game, but I don't think warrior is the right class for that.

But then you also have Paragons in GW1, who are closer to Warrior (both mechanically and thematically) than any other profession.

Paragons had multiple ability types referring to singing.

So while a Bard (with Instruments and everything) would be more fitting for Mesmer, something like a Battlesinger (which would basically be a modernized Paragon) would fit for Warrior.