Any chance of making NPCs useful in story?

[Zera.9435]

11 years now, guys. 11 years and you still haven't addressed this issue. Story NPCs that follow you around as you do story do basically 0 damage, don't revive you, and barely behave as adequate meat shields. Aside from regurgitating badly written dialog under the guise of sounding smart, what do NPCs even do? Fights against harder enemies like Heitor just end up being a 'res until it dies' sort of fight. Meanwhile, supposedly powerful characters like Peitha just prance around doing nothing but exchange so called 'verbal barbs' with the enemy.

I have some re-requests. Allow NPCs to do actual damage in a fight, and make them prioritize reviving a downed player. Make them have actual impact in a fight. You know, like an actual character. At least then they'll serve a purpose. Heitor is a non-stop onslaught of high damage and persisting aoe bombs. If you try to keep your distance by moving around or try to avoid the persisting aoe, you get chased down by the spin-to-win attack that moves faster than you. There is no escape. Just die, rinse, repeat until it dies. I'm not asking for a Heitor nerf in story. I'm asking for NPCs to actually DO something useful for the player.

[SeTect.5918]

NPCs arent there to carry you to make you just chill while they deal all the damage.

If you die already from Heitors attacks then you just need a proper build. Story fights are not that hard.

Why so many people want to deal auto attack 40k dps and make npcs do all their job?
If you want the game to move itself while you are just watching then just watch a movie.

The job of NPCs is to be a support if you die and not to do YOUR job.

[Zera.9435]

11 minutes ago, SeTect.5918 said:

NPCs arent there to carry you to make you just chill while they deal all the damage.

If you die already from Heitors attacks then you just need a proper build. Story fights are not that hard.

Why so many people want to deal auto attack 40k dps and make npcs do all their job?
If you want the game to move itself while you are just watching then just watch a movie.

The job of NPCs is to be a support if you die and not to do YOUR job.

I was playing on one of my alt characters, and I shouldn't have to completely change my character's build just for a story fight. I do not have full legendary everything so I can't just swap all the equipment on a whim. I will be doing the story on multiple characters to do multiple map completions, and not all the characters have high-damage builds. Some fill more 'support' roles. I wasn't asking for the NPCs to do all the damage, I want them to do more than 0 damage. I also want them to SUPPORT ME by getting me back up when downed.

[Westenev.5289]

Why can't npc's deal damage and carry? How is it more skill expressive to just respawn until you win?

[kharmin.7683]

nb4 the git gud crowd shows up

[Sobx.1758]

3 hours ago, Zera.9435 said:

11 years now, guys. 11 years and you still haven't addressed this issue. Story NPCs that follow you around as you do story do basically 0 damage, don't revive you, and barely behave as adequate meat shields.

Not really an issue. You're the main character of the story and you are supposed to progress it, not your "ez meat shield facetanking, insta rezing, damage dealing mini zerg of npcs".

2 hours ago, Zera.9435 said:

I was playing on one of my alt characters, and I shouldn't have to completely change my character's build just for a story fight. I do not have full legendary everything so I can't just swap all the equipment on a whim. I will be doing the story on multiple characters to do multiple map completions, and not all the characters have high-damage builds. Some fill more 'support' roles. I wasn't asking for the NPCs to do all the damage, I want them to do more than 0 damage. I also want them to SUPPORT ME by getting me back up when downed.

You don't need to change your entire build, you just need to understand the mechanics of the game and maaaaybe have a relatively coherent build in the first place.

Edited November 15, 2023 by Sobx.1758

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

The Devs changed how NPCs act/react in Story Instances long. long ago.  They didn't want the NPCs to have so much impact.  Thus, your suggestion is unlikely to be fulfilled. 

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

a long time ago both friendly and enemy npcs used to be alot smarter, however they rewrote the engine for it because it was putting too much load on the server. this was around the time they also added 30min cooldowns on all summoning consumeables, and removed alot of stuff like permanent guardian spirit weapons.

 

after this period they started to become increasingly dumb, until the time of path of fire when they wouldn't even revive you anymore.

 

this was likely due to the game running on ncsoft's servers at the time, and after arenanet made the move to amazon web services they never adjusted the game back to how it was pre-nerfs, so its still perpetually in stress-reducing mode and given the recent changes to the summoning runes it seems they're still persuing this goal, especially since players keep doing weird stuff like most recently using the reaper's "rise!" shout by entire zergs to lag the wvw maps to unplayability on purpose.

 

i want them to make npcs smart again, but players would find some way to get the npcs to do all the work for them while they afk. all fun stuff in mmos gets exploited, causes problems for everyone else and then ends up being removed.

Edited November 16, 2023 by SoftFootpaws.9134

[Omega.6801]

More NPCs revive you that 11 years ago, However, the behavior is a bit erratic, i.e. sometimes they do, sometimes they don't. They do most of the time, just not always and it's hard to tell whyt makes the difference.

[Zok.4956]

16 hours ago, Zera.9435 said:

11 years now, guys. 11 years and you still haven't addressed this issue.

That is not completly correct. At least they let the useless Trahearne die in the story. 😉

[DanAlcedo.3281]

No amount of "tickles" could get me to say publicly that I died to heitor.

 

[Zera.9435]

On 11/15/2023 at 12:11 PM, Westenev.5289 said:

Why can't npc's deal damage and carry? How is it more skill expressive to just respawn until you win?

It's not, it's a matter of convenience. The NPCs are THERE. The least they can do is rub my butt so I can get back up and do some more damage so the fight ends faster.

[Zera.9435]

On 11/16/2023 at 1:26 AM, Zok.4956 said:

That is not completly correct. At least they let the useless Trahearne die in the story. 😉

Can only hope Peitha, and all NPCs for that matter, follow suit.

[Sobx.1758]

10 hours ago, Zera.9435 said:

It's not, it's a matter of convenience. The NPCs are THERE. The least they can do is rub my butt so I can get back up and do some more damage so the fight ends faster.

Or maybe you could try undersstanding the mechanics of the game you're playing instead of blindly rushing headfirst at anything you see?

Edited November 18, 2023 by Sobx.1758

[Zera.9435]

11 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Or maybe you could try undersstanding the mechanics of the game you're playing instead of blindly rushing headfirst at anything you see?

It's story. There are no mechanics. It's literally a dps race.

[Sobx.1758]

2 minutes ago, Zera.9435 said:

It's story. There are no mechanics. It's literally a dps race.

Your complaint -where you keep dying in story instances- proves otherwise. If you treat everything as "dps race" and you keep dying then you're just confirming what I said -and no, there's no need for npcs to provide more means for the players to keep hitting their virtual heads against the wall until the wall crumbles. You think the issue here is that you're not getting picked up [fast enough or at all], but the actual issue is that you keep dying because you just want to "dps race" for no reason.

[Zera.9435]

2 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Your complaint -where you keep dying in story instances- proves otherwise. If you treat everything as "dps race" and you keep dying then you're just confirming what I said -and no, there's no need for npcs to provide more means for the players to keep hitting their virtual heads against the wall until the wall crumbles. You think the issue here is that you're not getting picked up [fast enough or at all], but the actual issue is that you keep dying because you just want to "dps race" for no reason.

Well yeah, you gotta dps to kill it. There are no mechanics like hitting switches or breaking invulnerability bubbles. Have to damage and try to survive. A dodge here, a heal here, dps as much as you can, keep moving. The problem is that even after the first heal, you take so much damage that you go down before you heal is off cooldown. Naturally, you get downed. Then, of course you try to get back up but your healing is interrupted because Heitor is still attacking you non-stop, you can't get back up. You respawn, rinse and repeat. Meanwhile the NPCs aren't supporting you at all, which goes back to my point: they should revive you.

[Sobx.1758]

8 minutes ago, Zera.9435 said:

Well yeah, you gotta dps to kill it.

Of course you need to deal damage in order for the mob/boss to die, never said anything else. That still doesn't make it "a dps race" and even moreso in light of your compalint in this thread. If you keep going down in story instances, it's on you and your lack of understanding -or care- of game's mechanics.

8 minutes ago, Zera.9435 said:

There are no mechanics like hitting switches or breaking invulnerability bubbles

Game mechanics are everything you're using during fights, not just some encounter-specific "switch flipping".

8 minutes ago, Zera.9435 said:

Have to damage and try to survive. Have to damage and try to survive. A dodge here, a heal here, dps as much as you can, keep moving. The problem is that even after the first heal, you take so much damage that you go down before you heal is off cooldown.

Yup -and surviving the boss you're complaining about in this thread wasn't hard at all. No, there's no problem with surviving in that encounter, it's a "you" issue and it's based on your lack of understanding of the game's mechanics or the specific encounter itself. It really wasn't hard fight, not sure what else to tell you -maybe you're spamming out your heals/dodges off cd because you panic, maybe it's something else. Hard to know without seeing it.

8 minutes ago, Zera.9435 said:

Naturally, you get downed.

No, not naturally -I didn't have any issue in that fight and as mentioned above by other players I wasn't alone with that experience. How do you think that's possible?

No, the npcs shouldn't revive you because the goal shouldn't be to forcefully push you through encounters no matter what, the goal should be to stop getting constantly downed. Which is achieved by understanding the game and its specific encounters.

Edited November 18, 2023 by Sobx.1758

[Zera.9435]

3 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Of course you need to deal damage in order for the mob/boss to die, never said anything else. That still doesn't make it "a dps race" and even moreso in light of your compalint in this thread. If you keep going down in story instances, it's on you and your lack of understanding -or care- of game's mechanics.

Game mechanics are everything you're using during fights, not just some encounter-specific "switch flipping".

Yup -and surviving the boss you're complaining about in this thread wasn't hard at all. No, there's no problem with surviving in that encounter, it's a "you" issue and it's based on your lack of understanding of the game's mechanics or the specific encounter itself. It really wasn't hard fight, not sure what else to tell you -maybe you're spamming out your heals/dodges off cd because you panic, maybe it's something else. Hard to know without seeing it.

No, not naturally -I didn't have any issue in that fight and as mentioned above by other players I wasn't alone with that experience. How do you think that's possible?

My guess is minions/pets to help tank Heitor. But again, this entire thread is NOT about me sucking at the game. It's about my annoyance with the NPCs not helping to revive you or contributing anything. Even kitten players like me deserve NPC support to get back up, because let's face it other players (even if they were in instance with me) are not much help either.

[Sobx.1758]

1 minute ago, Zera.9435 said:

My guess is minions/pets to help tank Heitor. But again, this entire thread is NOT about me sucking at the game. It's about my annoyance with the NPCs not helping to revive you or contributing anything. Even kitten players like me deserve NPC support to get back up, because let's face it other players (even if they were in instance with me) are not much help either.

I didn't play with any minions or pets and I've played in full berk gear. I'm taking a blind guess that DanAlcedo played warrior, but who knows. Either way: no, it is not about minions tanking it or cheesing it in any way. It's a rather straightforward fight.
I know it's about NPCs not helping and as I wrote: there's no need for that because the goal shouldn't be to forcefully push the player through the encounters ASAP no matter what they do, because they think everything's a "dps race".

[Zera.9435]

Just now, Sobx.1758 said:

I didn't play with any minions or pets and I've played in full berk gear. I'm taking a blind guess that DanAlcedo played warrior, but who knows. Either way: no, it is not about minions tanking it or cheesing it in any way. It's a rather straightforward fight.
I know it's about NPCs not helping and as I wrote: there's no need for that because the goal shouldn't be to forcefully push the player through the encounters ASAP no matter what they do, because they think everything's a "dps race".

I don't know what this DanAlcedo is, but it sounds like Raditz. Even if you don't think there is a need for it, I want it.

[Sobx.1758]

8 minutes ago, Zera.9435 said:

I don't know what this DanAlcedo is, but it sounds like Raditz. Even if you don't think there is a need for it, I want it.

😅 That's another forum user that wrote a post in this thread about not dying to heitor or w/e.

Ok -and in similar manner, even if you want it, there's no need for it for the reasons stated above.

Edited November 18, 2023 by Sobx.1758

[Zera.9435]

1 minute ago, Sobx.1758 said:

😅 That's another forum user that wrote a post in this thread about not dying to heitor or w/e.

Ok -and in similar manner, even if you want it, there's no need for it for the reasons stated above.

Meh, I don't remember people's usernames. I'll just take your word for it. It's not about need, or lack thereof. It's about complaints regarding a nice feature that used to be in the game and I want it back.

[Killthehealersffs.8940]

https://www.mmo-champion.com/content/11856-Seeds-of-Renewal-PTR-Development-Notes-November-16-2023?page=1

 

FOLLOWER DUNGEONS

• Follower Dungeons are available for all 8 of the original Dragonflight dungeons on Normal difficulty. Queue solo or partner up with up to four players in your party and queue into any follower dungeon. Once entering the dungeon, a follower NPC will join your party and fill any role that wasn’t filled by one of your pre-existing party members.
• Rewards given will be the same to that of running Normal dungeons with a full party of players.

 

Well if people wont start liking any instance content , we can go back in the GW1 era .

And we can improve by the system constantly searches people to replace the bots

 

The OW and WvW , is something  huge that bring together the community and   you cannot exlude other  people  . Its is the thing that counts to survive :P

 

 

Edited November 18, 2023 by Killthehealersffs.8940

[Teknomancer.4895]

On 11/15/2023 at 8:03 PM, Omega.6801 said:

More NPCs revive you that 11 years ago, However, the behavior is a bit erratic, i.e. sometimes they do, sometimes they don't. They do most of the time, just not always and it's hard to tell whyt makes the difference.

This is the real problem. It's not consistent, and there's no apparent reason why NPCs will rez you in one story instance, but not in another. It should simply be "yes they do this" or "no they do not do this" across the board.

If they're going to be of no use and end up just getting in the way and blocking my view, just remove them. Pipe their voiceovers into the annoying comms device and be done with them.