Passion has gone my friends [Merged]

[csuvix.9284]

Man I usually never discuss anything just playing from the shadow and watching the state of the game but I can't hold it back anymore I must write this down.

I have been playing GW since 2005. I could feel the downfall of GW1 but in that time I knew that GW2 was in development and I was happy.

Since release I was really passionate about GW2 until the beginning of 2020  when the big layoffs were done. Since then the quality of the game has dropped significantly (from my opinion). I usually enjoying the skills reworks which were impactful and interesting before 2020. Not to mention the fact that every 3-4 month we got big reworks of skills and traits and I miss the excitement that I was  thinking about new builds and experimenting them. From 2020 we have less impactful and interesting changes and frequency of the delivery of the major changes has increased. I am Engi and Guard main (mostly engi, guard rotation is too easy for me) and when I saw the design of the shortbow I already put myself on standby state to that extent that I only log in for Jade Runestone and Antique Summoning Stone. I do longer sessions only when my wife asks me to join in WVW (which is a pain in the kitten this week with Gandara too). 

Cantha in GW1 was my favourite. I got lost in Seitung, Kaineng or Echowald for hours so when Anet announced EOD my hype was in the skies until I played it. The presentation of Cantha in EOD was so bad (again my opinion) that I just rushed trough everything to do the mandatory Masteries, story etc. I was thinking okay maybe the Living word will save Cantha with several maps and good story but instead we got 1 map a mediocre story and a new expansion was announced. Willbender was bad in the beggining so I played Mechanist. Since Mechanical Genius increases the cooldown of the mech skills I don't play that elite spec (replacing the toolbelt skill with 3 static skills which cooldowns are increased when mech is not near us is NET dumb kitten). To top that rifle buff then nerf hit me hard as well. My favourite:  28th November 2023 game update notes: "Rifle and pistol are both receiving some general improvements to make them more compelling options" And what is the first I read below it: "Net Shot: Increased the casting time from 0.24 seconds to 0.62 seconds." 

Ok SOTO came. I was like hey at least we get new weapons. What they didn't mentioned that we have to wait 6 MONTHS! for it (icing on the cake that new weapon designs are mediocre). What is this strategy that I buy something and then I have to wait almost a year for a full content? So I rushed trough story again (which is 1 hour max) and the rest is same as with EOD. I'm not a big achivement hunter so I don't find it interesting to do.

I'm starting to lose all hope and I am feeling the same downfall of GW2 as I felt it with GW1. The only problem there is no GW3 in sight and I don't want to play Throne and Liberty.

Thanks for reading this and have a nice day!

[GBEW.5947]

I'm sorry but willbender has been goated since it released. Other then that I feel the same, my passion is fading and it feels very end of the road. 

[Trejgon.9367]

50 minutes ago, csuvix.9284 said:

What they didn't mentioned that we have to wait 6 MONTHS! for it

Except they did mention it frequently?

[Assolador.3598]

pvp players: "first time?"

[soulknight.9620]

@OP the problem you are describing is basically - SOTO is a glorified payed living world season. The same structure, same type of content, same quality and quantity (although i would argue that quality was better in lw4). 

[Assolador.3598]

24 minutes ago, soulknight.9620 said:

@OP the problem you are describing is basically - SOTO is a glorified payed living world season. The same structure, same type of content, same quality and quantity (although i would argue that quality was better in lw4). 

theres no way it is the same quality of lws3 or 4

 

[Miki.3862]

Been playing since Beta Weekends, only significant gap was a month of no play at the end of Season One as I was thoroughly burnt out.

It's hard not to agree, I don't feel like this needs to be the downfall of the game by any means but just the stacking of some choices that have turned out be particularly unfortunate.

I'm struggling to feel invested in the Kryptis but did not struggle to feel invested in the Astral Ward, they were more interesting because they could share insight into the world I've been invested in for a decade, the Kryptis only have their own world and story to share that, if I'm honest, is just not fleshed out enough to feel more interesting (no pun intended) which is giving me the worst kind of, "let's get this over with" feeling.

I'm left wanting a lot more exploration of the Astral Ward themselves with maybe some small vignettes about their past conflicts that had them so tied up that they couldn't help us with the dragons, this expansion really lived and died in my mind on whether we cared about them specifically and they succeeded but then hard pivoted to Kryptis which was fine as a threat we help resolve initially but just didn't have the legs for the rest of the expansion.

The dream of course is that this expansion had to suffer to give them the buffer needed for the later ones to have more meat on the bone, but that's a concept that's been bounced around one too many times for those that have been playing long enough.

 

[Zera.9435]

20 years can have that effect on something. Marriages stagnate too. It's natural.

[Seon.8402]

Yeah maybe its just time to take an extended break. I played RuneScape for 12 years and there were times during that I thought I would never quit but eventually I moved to other things. There are a lot of other really great games out there, or even other fun things to do with free time besides games.

6 hours ago, csuvix.9284 said:

I miss the excitement that I was  thinking about new builds and experimenting them.

I like GW2 first and foremost for the varied gameplay loops of different classes and will play it even with no updates or rewards, but I do feel this. Part of the fun is getting new tools and puzzle pieces to make different builds with, however I think eventually any game will start to run out of design space to keep adding "newness" there, even if it takes decades. Strangely I have sort of scratched that itch by getting into making music the past couple years; there is so much to learn about with music theory, production, instrumentation, etc. and using all of that in interesting ways to make something cool. It may sound a bit silly but I get that same sort of feeling as playing a new MMO; there's so much to discover and master if you really want to dive deep. When I have Ableton open, hours can go by without me realizing 😆

I've now played GW2 for about 10 years, and I will sometimes take weeks or months break. The nice part about GW2 is it's easy to come back to later when they do add more 🙂

[Zera.9435]

Just now, Seon.8402 said:

Yeah maybe its just time to take an extended break. I played RuneScape for 12 years and there were times during that I thought I would never quit but eventually I moved to other things. There are a lot of other really great games out there, or even other fun things to do with free time besides games.

I like GW2 first and foremost for the varied gameplay loops of different classes and will play it even with no updates or rewards, but I do feel this. Part of the fun is getting new tools and puzzle pieces to make different builds with, however I think eventually any game will start to run out of design space to keep adding "newness" there, even if it takes decades. Strangely I have sort of scratched that itch by getting into making music the past couple years; there is so much to learn about with music theory, production, instrumentation, etc. and using all of that in interesting ways to make something cool. It may sound a bit silly but I get that same sort of feeling as playing a new MMO; there's so much to discover and master if you really want to dive deep. When I have Ableton open, hours can go by without me realizing 😆

I've now played GW2 for about 10 years, and I will sometimes take weeks or months break. The nice part about GW2 is it's easy to come back to later when they do add more 🙂

 Well said. It's very unrealistic to expect an 11 year old game to keep feeling 'new'. For players like me who have been here since the beginning, we're no longer the target demographic but are at least taken into consideration. The purpose of them making new content is to attract new players while simultaneously trying to keep older players engaged. It's not easy to do. Lots of players have already expressed disinterest in continuing to play due to SotO's current direction, and that's ok. Not everything is a winner nor a sure thing. All we can do is let ArenaNet use the feedback we give to try to make the next expansion better.

[soulknight.9620]

3 hours ago, Assolador.3598 said:

theres no way it is the same quality of lws3 or 4

There is a "update" tag on wiki. You can go there and see for urself. Just a quick compare to lw4:
LW4 had: 
1) 6 maps (vs 3 in SOTO)

2) 2 new mounts (beetle and skyscale) (vs 0 in SOTO)

3) 3 raid wings (although you may argue its a expac content, but it was released during lw4) (vs 0 in SOTO, but we got 2 Strikes)

4) 6 legendary weapons with unique look and effects, 1 legendary raid ring, 1 legendary accesory (vision), legendary runes and sigils. (vs legendary armor and sigil in SOTO with questionable models)

5) 3 fractals (vs 1 in SOTO)

6) Unique armor skins for each armor type (elegy+ requiem, mist shard+blossoming mist shard+ corsair pieces) (vs 3 identical sets for all armor types - thats 3 models compared to 6-12 models if you count in upgraded versions separetly)

7) 2 spvp maps (vs 0 in SOTO)

8 ) New masteries (cant actually count how much there is since im not ingame atm) 

 

Thats just major features, it would be too much for me to list every single addition here. But you can check it urself. https://wiki-en.guildwars2.com/wiki/Release

Sure you can argue that there are rifts, but its just a glorified on demand map event. Convergences are a bit unique in that aspect. And new weapons, but that was tied to elite specs and expacs, so you cant directly compare them, but just saying designing a weapon is far less work than a full elite spec. Relics are kinda "removed and reintroduced" 6th rune piece bonuses. Weaponmaster training isnt even a proper feature (well you know they could have removed the elite spec limitation any time if they wanted to). 

Even IBS had similar content if you look it up. 

Edited March 1 by soulknight.9620

[illuminati.8453]

Agree with OP.  GW2 has run its course but will be kept online as long as it makes enough money to maintain. 

As others have pointed out, taking extended breaks can help rejuvenate one's appreciation for GW2. Personally, I've adopted a method akin to treating the quarterly patches as seasons in other games. I return, delve into the vault for treasures, tackle a couple of achievements, bump up my mastery score, and then take a breather for a month or two.

While GW2 may not be as captivating as it once was when the entire studio was fully devoted to it, I still manage to extract value from the game.

[Vavume.8065]

8 hours ago, csuvix.9284 said:

What is this strategy that I buy something and then I have to wait almost a year for a full content?

It's the houseplant strategy, you buy it then watch it grow, and it's about as fun.

[Assolador.3598]

3 hours ago, soulknight.9620 said:

There is a "update" tag on wiki. You can go there and see for urself. Just a quick compare to lw4:
LW4 had: 
1) 6 maps (vs 3 in SOTO)

2) 2 new mounts (beetle and skyscale) (vs 0 in SOTO)

3) 3 raid wings (although you may argue its a expac content, but it was released during lw4) (vs 0 in SOTO, but we got 2 Strikes)

4) 6 legendary weapons with unique look and effects, 1 legendary raid ring, 1 legendary accesory (vision), legendary runes and sigils. (vs legendary armor and sigil in SOTO with questionable models)

5) 3 fractals (vs 1 in SOTO)

6) Unique armor skins for each armor type (elegy+ requiem, mist shard+blossoming mist shard+ corsair pieces) (vs 3 identical sets for all armor types - thats 3 models compared to 6-12 models if you count in upgraded versions separetly)

7) 2 spvp maps (vs 0 in SOTO)

8 ) New masteries (cant actually count how much there is since im not ingame atm) 

 

Thats just major features, it would be too much for me to list every single addition here. But you can check it urself. https://wiki-en.guildwars2.com/wiki/Release

Sure you can argue that there are rifts, but its just a glorified on demand map event. Convergences are a bit unique in that aspect. And new weapons, but that was tied to elite specs and expacs, so you cant directly compare them, but just saying designing a weapon is far less work than a full elite spec. Relics are kinda "removed and reintroduced" 6th rune piece bonuses. Weaponmaster training isnt even a proper feature (well you know they could have removed the elite spec limitation any time if they wanted to). 

Even IBS had similar content if you look it up. 

thats why I said its not the same quality bruh

[Yttris.2945]

To OP:

 

 

[Holmindeboks.3490]

I already left. My goal is to only play games that dont make me angry. Also quit call of duty and battlefield 2042. And hearthstone. Much more fun playing an arpg game. Were loot atleast drops for time spend. Instead of doing multiple bosses and meta’s and getting nothing but junk loot. I feel i am forced to spend cash to buy the loot (skins) from gemstore. Skins that would DROP from mobs in other games. This game and the forum community (most of them, not all, with their emoticons and always defending) made me angry. And this endless grind for legendary armor is insane. My idea was to play with stats and make my own builds. But i now do this in the arpg game. 

[YAMBE.8104]

4 hours ago, soulknight.9620 said:

There is a "update" tag on wiki. You can go there and see for urself. Just a quick compare to lw4:
LW4 had: 
1) 6 maps (vs 3 in SOTO)

2) 2 new mounts (beetle and skyscale) (vs 0 in SOTO)

3) 3 raid wings (although you may argue its a expac content, but it was released during lw4) (vs 0 in SOTO, but we got 2 Strikes)

4) 6 legendary weapons with unique look and effects, 1 legendary raid ring, 1 legendary accesory (vision), legendary runes and sigils. (vs legendary armor and sigil in SOTO with questionable models)

5) 3 fractals (vs 1 in SOTO)

6) Unique armor skins for each armor type (elegy+ requiem, mist shard+blossoming mist shard+ corsair pieces) (vs 3 identical sets for all armor types - thats 3 models compared to 6-12 models if you count in upgraded versions separetly)

7) 2 spvp maps (vs 0 in SOTO)

8 ) New masteries (cant actually count how much there is since im not ingame atm) 

 

Thats just major features, it would be too much for me to list every single addition here. But you can check it urself. https://wiki-en.guildwars2.com/wiki/Release

Sure you can argue that there are rifts, but its just a glorified on demand map event. Convergences are a bit unique in that aspect. And new weapons, but that was tied to elite specs and expacs, so you cant directly compare them, but just saying designing a weapon is far less work than a full elite spec. Relics are kinda "removed and reintroduced" 6th rune piece bonuses. Weaponmaster training isnt even a proper feature (well you know they could have removed the elite spec limitation any time if they wanted to). 

Even IBS had similar content if you look it up. 

If you look at the wiki you will see that they take nearly 2 years to fully release LW4. They launched the first chapter at november of 2017 and finish the story wih the release of war eternal at may of 2019, they also had more people working on LW4 than when SOTO was launched (they have been hiring people throughout last year).

My prediction for the next expansion is that they will add a new skill tree to support the new weapons added in SOTO,  new legendaries (probably legendary weapons based on the weapons added on SOTO), a new raid (they said in a interview that they have a big surprise for the next expansion), probably new masteries with improvements over an existing mount and 3 new maps. The thematic and story of the expansion will be totally different or could continue in some way the plot of SOTO.  in fact, people often forget that LW4's story had 2 plots, with 3 maps for each of them. The first focused on Palawa joko and the second on Kralkatorrik. 

They could have divided LW4 into 2 expansions and we would have a situation similar to the current one

[Royal Grand Majesty.9852]

On the contrary, WoW [Retail] released content and new features consistently as OP wishes GW2 to, how-ever watch any WoW [Retail] content creator today or go read the WoW reddit or forums and be witness to the complaints made by the masses on how WoW has become too complicated and cluttered with all of its overlapping systems.

Do you really want a new mount every expansion? Do you really want another method of traversing the Maps such as Gliders and Jade Bot Protocols?

There comes a point where less is better. WoW [Retail] for example has long past this point many expansions ago.

Edited March 1 by Royal Grand Majesty.9852

[Batalix.2873]

20 hours ago, Royal Grand Majesty.9852 said:

On the contrary, WoW [Retail] released content and new features consistently as OP wishes GW2 to, how-ever watch any content creator today or go read the WoW reddit or Forums and be witness to the complaints made by the masses on how WoW has become too complicated and cluttered with all of its systems.

Do you really want a new mount every expansion? Do you really want another method of traversing the Maps such as Gliders and Jade Bot Protocols?

There comes a point where less is better. WoW [Retail] for example has long past this point many expansions ago.

I would agree with this, if the game still focused more on iterating and adding to the game's edifice, rather than eroding and demolishing it.

The current dev team does not seem to have the foresight/interest in preserving a lot of GW2's stronger systems. Nearly everything has been cannibalized or obviated in order to fit these "new" ideas they think they are introducing. I can't even enjoy HoT/PoF expansion content separate from the newer kittenry because the especs don't play the same anymore, everything is so overtuned, the masteries matter less and less, and even a lot of other subsystems now have had easier equivalencies introduced.

I haven't substantively played this game in over a year, other than a brief half hour to try the new weapons in beta. If the devs had just left the design of core/HoT/PoF well enough alone, even if it meant even less "new" content, I would still be playing this game. I would rather have just received new maps and story--no masteries, no kittening around with especs and weapons, no abominable reimagining of runes--than what we have received under the guise of "content."

The EoD/SotO development team is embarrassingly inept. They would rather totally break down every strong, marketable aspect GW2 had, than admit that they just don't have the ingenuity or resources to meaningfully build on the game. Instead of allowing GW2 to wrap-up and age gracefully, they are necroing it into oblivion, where it will have virtually no long-term/niche/nostalgic appeal by the time GW3 comes out.

Edited March 2 by Batalix.2873

[Padrion.7382]

14 hours ago, csuvix.9284 said:

I'm starting to lose all hope and I am feeling the same downfall of GW2 as I felt it with GW1

Well, the game is 10 years old and never really took off, so it is no surprise that they aren't throwing the same amount of money at it as they did after launch. Eventually all things come to an end. I appreciate that it is still around and gets updated.

[Wolfofdivinity.6251]

Gw2 devs are doing an excellent job! Give them some slack! They are working really hard to deliver you the best content available. If you don't like it. Take a break or move on. Guild wars was here before you....and it will be here after.

Edited March 2 by Wolfofdivinity.6251

[revolucion.7518]

On 3/2/2024 at 12:43 AM, Wolfofdivinity.6251 said:

Gw2 devs are doing an excellent job! Give them some slack! They are working really hard to deliver you the best content available. If you don't like it. Take a break or move on. Guild wars was here before you....and it will be here after.

 

Edited March 3 by revolucion.7518
NOYFB

[illuminati.8453]

35 minutes ago, Wolfofdivinity.6251 said:

Gw2 devs are doing an excellent job! Give them some slack! They are working really hard to deliver you the best content available. If you don't like it. Take a break or move on. Guild wars was here before you....and it will be here after.

Completely disagree.  They are not working really hard on GW2 and this is not the 'best' content available.   They are doing the bare minimum.   And spreading it out over an entire year to boot.   

[QueenKeriti.5176]

2 hours ago, YAMBE.8104 said:

If you look at the wiki you will see that they take nearly 2 years to fully release LW4. They launched the first chapter at november of 2017 and finish the story wih the release of war eternal at may of 2019, they also had more people working on LW4 than when SOTO was launched (they have been hiring people throughout last year).

...in fact, people often forget that LW4's story had 2 plots, with 3 maps for each of them. The first focused on Palawa joko and the second on Kralkatorrik. 

They could have divided LW4 into 2 expansions and we would have a situation similar to the current one

^ pretty much this. People forget (or weren't here for) how long it took to get the different LWS episodes + no predictable release schedule within those LWS.

------

Taking a break from the game is perfectly fine. GW2 is a game you can take a break from and come back even years later with little to no punishment for your absence. Maybe you've "outgrown" GW2 entirely, and that's fine. There are lots of games out there to play, and you don't have to limit yourself to MMOs (imo, the MMO market in general is a bit of a mess right now, so not marrying yourself to any one MMO is probably a wise idea). Take some time off and do something else. That's okay. Maybe you'll come back to GW2, maybe you won't, and that's okay.

[Mukizo.1269]

I think the main issue is between the relationship with Anet and NCSOFT. Failed expectations and fundamentally different approaches and ideas on how to reach them.
The MMO and live service genre in general is a flawed model, nothing can stay relevant forever. Passion and care fades out, both for the consumer and the developer.

Imagine having to do the same thing over and over and over for 12 years, most people can’t do that. Thus we get different devs and different players over the course of time, values and expectations get shifted. 

The core game was about breaking the boundaries and limitations of traditional mmos, while expanding upon with what they tried to achieve in guild wars 1, Utopia which proved to be too difficult. Thereof they made a completely new game called guild wars 2, which was all about having choices that mattered in the collective (living world). This failed eventually because of many reasons and was significantly changed. Already here early on a conflict was established.

HoT was all about filling out the spaces where the game lacked. More ways to play, more ways to explore and traverse the environment. End game content. There were a lot of issues when this expansion first launched, however, most of these issues were ironed out over time and resulted in an excellent high quality experience all around.

PoF was amazing. You could see the excitement, care and passion the developers had in the various trailers centered around each aspect of the expansion. Mounts with the most innovating and ground breaking mount system we have ever seen in any mmo till this date. Vast maps bigger than ever before with various different environments to traverse, each balanced around its mounts. Elite specs carefully crafted to synergize with its environment and fill in different roles (some argued they were overtuned) but I overall enjoyed them a lot.

Season 4 was great and perfectly summarized by the various posters above me.

Then we had Ibs, EoD and SoTo and we all know the story from there….

Ibs started out great, but some conflict within the studio and publisher appeared which resulted in a second horrible rushed part. EoD was a prime example of quantity over quality in all kind of forms.
 

SoTo is a new approach, while at first promising it ended up rather starving the current player-base out, delivering far too little content in terms of both quality and quantity. Everything is reused and piled together in a huge dung of confusion. Hopefully they will learn from this new format and experience, and improve upon it in the next mini “expansion”.